Flood in Halo: Infinite

WerepyreND wrote:

I would certainly be disappointed if we never saw a fight between the Flood and the Prometheans who were specifically meant to fight the Flood. Just leaving that potential of those encounters on the table would be a shame.

That being said, I really hope if/when the Flood ever return that they don't work like they do in Halo 3. Making the Flood vulnerable to "headshots" and normal melee attacks removes a lot of what makes them interesting to fight. Fighting the Flood should be all about crowd control rather than precision headshots.

My ideal Flood
*No "headshot" hitbox
*Melee is mostly useless unless it is a sword. hammer, or have big bayonets ala the Brute shot, spiker, mauler, etc.
*Relatively fragile, relies on numbers
*Infection form can still resurrect intact combat forms/biological enemies
*Combat forms can only be fully destroyed by fire based weapons, explosions, certain melee weapons(see: above), and Promethean disintegration.
*Weak to projectile weapons, resistant to plasma/energy weapons, normal damage against hardlight.
*Can still use vehicles ala Halo 2
*More varied pure forms that are a bit less tanky, same weaknesses as other Flood forms.
*Larger forms for vehicle oriented levels.

Broadly speaking although I am not against adding more variety to the Flood at the same time I want them to remain faction based around swarming rather than trying to give them the same depth as the Covenant. I want to fight the Flood, not a Flood themed Covenant, which I think is part of the problem with the Prometheans.

Not a bad setup, however I do hope that a playable flood combat form (be it infection or some sort of spinoff campaign) comes and this is my idea for a playable flood combat form.

• Headshot is moved to front of chest (where infection form would be).
• Health Bar would be like having Black eye Skull turned on (melee regenerates health)
• Abilities which would be more like inventory would be flood leap flood charge and flood swipe.
• Can still use vehicles
• Can use weapons but would be more of a disadvantage as they have drastic bloom and cannot dual wield.

Marinealver wrote:

WerepyreND wrote:

I would certainly be disappointed if we never saw a fight between the Flood and the Prometheans who were specifically meant to fight the Flood. Just leaving that potential of those encounters on the table would be a shame.

That being said, I really hope if/when the Flood ever return that they don't work like they do in Halo 3. Making the Flood vulnerable to "headshots" and normal melee attacks removes a lot of what makes them interesting to fight. Fighting the Flood should be all about crowd control rather than precision headshots.

My ideal Flood
*No "headshot" hitbox
*Melee is mostly useless unless it is a sword. hammer, or have big bayonets ala the Brute shot, spiker, mauler, etc.
*Relatively fragile, relies on numbers
*Infection form can still resurrect intact combat forms/biological enemies
*Combat forms can only be fully destroyed by fire based weapons, explosions, certain melee weapons(see: above), and Promethean disintegration.
*Weak to projectile weapons, resistant to plasma/energy weapons, normal damage against hardlight.
*Can still use vehicles ala Halo 2
*More varied pure forms that are a bit less tanky, same weaknesses as other Flood forms.
*Larger forms for vehicle oriented levels.

Broadly speaking although I am not against adding more variety to the Flood at the same time I want them to remain faction based around swarming rather than trying to give them the same depth as the Covenant. I want to fight the Flood, not a Flood themed Covenant, which I think is part of the problem with the Prometheans.

Not a bad setup, however I do hope that a playable flood combat form (be it infection or some sort of spinoff campaign) comes and this is my idea for a playable flood combat form.

• Headshot is moved to front of chest (where infection form would be).
• Health Bar would be like having Black eye Skull turned on (melee regenerates health)
• Abilities which would be more like inventory would be flood leap flood charge and flood swipe.
• Can still use vehicles
• Can use weapons but would be more of a disadvantage as they have drastic bloom and cannot dual wield.

Yes to playable flood. Would be cool to customize them too.

I wonder if for the campaign/fire fight you can burn bodies preventing flood from getting them. Though I'm sure this will lead to ai friendly fire. "We should have brought something to burn these bodies"

Catten Hart wrote:

WerepyreND wrote:

Marinealver wrote:

WerepyreND wrote:

<Things>

<Stuff>

I just can't agree with giving the Flood a headshot in any context outside of literally just being a model for infection. Moreover again outside of the infection context I am just not a fan of multiple playable races/characters in core Halo games, but I digress as this particular thread isn't really the place for that.

Well, good thing you aren't headshotting them at all, but actually killing the thing animating the inert pile of flesh. Like, that's why and how Combat Forms do anything, and that's why they can get what you are calling 'headshot' in any context. You're killing the only thing moving that pile of pus and biomass around.

I mean, honestly, most of your reasons just sound unreasonable (Especially the Plasma being less effective, but having the flood get hurt more by flame weapons... When Plasma is literally just superheated matter, and way hotter, and actually effective in Halo 3 for that exact reason?), but the 'headshot' one's just a killer.

I don't really like getting into lore arguments because they are irrelevant as the reasoning can be changed on a dime, but this just isn't how the Flood works. The Infection form isn't just piloting it like a flesh mecha when there are cases when folks have transformed into combat forms from a scratch or spores. See Also: Pure Forms. The only game where they treated the infection form as the "brain" in both form and function is Halo 3, and that could easily change with 5 words: "The Flood, it has evolved." I find the Flood in halo 3 hideously boring to fight because they are weak to absolutely everything and it makes dealing with them trivial compared to CE where being swarmed is a real threat and you can't easily down them at range with a single "headshot."

Moreover there is a big difference between immolated by a Flamethrower and hit with a single smaller high energy bolt that dissipates and cauterizes almost instantly, but honestly that doesn't really matter. I'm trying to bring back some of the gameplay depth that has been lost over the years. It used to be a fairly simple prospect: Projectile weapons were weak against shields and armored targets like Sentienels but strong against unshielded targets. Plasma/Energy weapons were the opposite, strong vs shields/armor, weaker vs unshielded targets. Seeing as the Flood were generally unarmored targets, plasma weapons were less efficient for dealing with them. This dynamic has practically vanished outside of the Plasma pistol, I would like to see that change.

Catten Hart wrote:

WerepyreND wrote:

Catten Hart wrote:

WerepyreND wrote:

Marinealver wrote:

WerepyreND wrote:

<Things>

<Stuff>

I just can't agree with giving the Flood a headshot in any context outside of literally just being a model for infection. Moreover again outside of the infection context I am just not a fan of multiple playable races/characters in core Halo games, but I digress as this particular thread isn't really the place for that.

Well, good thing you aren't headshotting them at all, but actually killing the thing animating the inert pile of flesh. Like, that's why and how Combat Forms do anything, and that's why they can get what you are calling 'headshot' in any context. You're killing the only thing moving that pile of pus and biomass around.

I mean, honestly, most of your reasons just sound unreasonable (Especially the Plasma being less effective, but having the flood get hurt more by flame weapons... When Plasma is literally just superheated matter, and way hotter, and actually effective in Halo 3 for that exact reason?), but the 'headshot' one's just a killer.

I don't really like getting into lore arguments because they are irrelevant as the reasoning can be changed on a dime, but this just isn't how the Flood works. The Infection form isn't just piloting it like a flesh mecha when there are cases when folks have transformed into combat forms from a scratch or spores. See Also: Pure Forms. The only game where they treated the infection form as the "brain" in both form and function is Halo 3, and that could easily change with 5 words: "The Flood, it has evolved." I find the Flood in halo 3 hideously boring to fight because they are weak to absolutely everything and it makes dealing with them trivial compared to CE where being swarmed is a real threat and you can't easily down them at range with a single "headshot."

Moreover there is a big difference between immolated by a Flamethrower and hit with a single smaller high energy bolt that dissipates and cauterizes almost instantly, but honestly that doesn't really matter. I'm trying to bring back some of the gameplay depth that has been lost over the years. It used to be a fairly simple prospect: Projectile weapons were weak against shields and armored targets like Sentienels but strong against unshielded targets. Plasma/Energy weapons were the opposite, strong vs shields/armor, weaker vs unshielded targets. Seeing as the Flood were generally unarmored targets, plasma weapons were less efficient for dealing with them. This dynamic has practically vanished outside of the Plasma pistol, I would like to see that change.

Edited hostility out.

It's not that I disagree with your point on making them tougher-I just disagree with the majority of your methods of doing so. ("Flood evolving" is a cop out excuse, but considering Halo 5's plot, I guess I can't disagree with that being the method they'd choose).

I'm not doing anything that hasn't already been done before, only rolling back a few changes that I think make fighting the Flood less interesting, while keeping a lot of the newer additions that add a few more wrinkles to Flood encounters. I just don't see the value in Flood encounters like Halo 3's where all the same tactics you use against the Covenant are just as valid against the Flood only the Flood don't have the same interesting AI behavior as said Covenant. This just leaves us with dumb, easily dispatched opponents that are more of a nuisance rather than a threat which makes levels featuring them a chore to get through.

I theorize that we will see Flood in Halo Infinite along with Prometheans due to both popular demand, and the nature that both factions bring to Halo to gameplay and story.

In my personal opinion, the Flood should be be done like this:

• Require different tactics to fight (Incendiary, plasma, crushing, and explosive bases).
• All species, save for Prometheans and Lek'Golo (Hunters), should be susceptible to Flood infection. This also includes wildlife and vehicle infection like in Halo Wars.
• The High Charity Gravemind on the Ark should NOT appear, but a new one on Zeta Halo. Wouldn't be against the idea of the two communicating to one another.
• HW & HW2 combat forms should appear (same should be for the Banished)
• The Juggernaut be included, among some new variants.
• New Human and Covenant weapons designed for Flood specifically should appear.
• (STRICTLY MY OPINION) A Precurssor should appear and take command of the Flood.
• A DLC should come around, based off the Mona Lisa story.

Quote:

I would be enlightened to see the flood again. Plus, the "Awakening The Nightmare" would make sense.

Installation 07 has some pretty extensive history with the flood. Would be ridiculous to not have them in Halo Infinite.