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How to make halo infinite FUN like halo 3

OP Ryan lfc 92

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I finally come to the conclusion that sprint isnt the main problem, it's weapon balance. The Battle Rifle in halo 3 was a medium range weapon and the assault rifle in halo 3 was a close range weapon. Theyre not like halo 5 where they both act like long range precision weapons that can compete each other. Halo 3 AR was only effective when chained with a melee or a smartly placed grenade which was often at close range. The only reason this gameplay was allowed was because the br was trash at long range so it forced the br users to get closer and enter AR territory where you had to watch out for melees and smartly placed grenades.

This was actually the magic of halo 3. It was because the starting weapons encouraged players to gravitate towards each other for excellent close quarter combat. Also because the starting weapons took so much creativity to kill with, it gave a lot of incentive to fight for "easy" power weapons.

I know people love the halo 5 BR for being long range so for halo infinite, the pistol should be the new halo 3 br. The long range BR should just be a pick up on the map. the AR should never out perform the pistol unless you chain the ar with a grenade or melee. So to sum up up, the AR should be trash at medium range and the pistol(halo 3 br) should be trash at long range so that the AR still has the chance to get close to the player and chain melee and grenades. That was always the gameplay loop of halo 3.
Sprint was never the problem. Weapon balance isn't either. It's the fact alot of people are too closed off and trapped in their nostalgia bubbles that they cannot appreciate something unique. This is something 343 Industries has taken note of and are using to capitalize on with Halo Infinite.
Ken Static wrote:
Sprint was never the problem. Weapon balance isn't either. It's the fact alot of people are too closed off and trapped in their nostalgia bubbles that they cannot appreciate something unique. This is something 343 Industries has taken note of and are using to capitalize on with Halo Infinite.
ok i forgot, halo 5 is perfect game and millions of people are playing it right now. nevermind
Ken Static wrote:
Sprint was never the problem. Weapon balance isn't either. It's the fact alot of people are too closed off and trapped in their nostalgia bubbles that they cannot appreciate something unique. This is something 343 Industries has taken note of and are using to capitalize on with Halo Infinite.
yeh its nostalgia bubbles i can find a game in h5 within seconds yet back on mcc it took a solid 5 minutes to find a game in mcc and apparently h5 is the worst. if you have some good memories of the og trilogy I would love to sit down and talk about them. 343 tried to modernise halo with 4 and 5 and still make halo in my opinion they did a great job but seen as the the majority of actual halo fans (people who play halo cos its halo not cos there board of cod) were still in their bubbles they didn't allow change. Back in the day halo was revolutionary however nowadays it would be considered outdated. So 343 took a leap of with 5 and added a lot of underrated features. Such as the all the weapon reqs (not the microtransactions the actual weapons and vehicles) they made super fiesta the best we have ever had it. Yes the campaign left something to be desired yes at the beginning there was nothing and it had to be all added in updates. However look at H5 now it has the best forge to date, best multiplayer of a halo game, we got a custom games browser so no more having to organise a big event for everyone to join on and also the graphics in 5 are amazing you may not like the design how ever the graphics are superb. So in my final opinion yes do I think h5 is flawed however if you take it for what it is now its the best halo in my opinion. P.S a good chunk of the problems of 5 can be found in the older games to.
Ken Static wrote:
Sprint was never the problem. Weapon balance isn't either. It's the fact alot of people are too closed off and trapped in their nostalgia bubbles that they cannot appreciate something unique. This is something 343 Industries has taken note of and are using to capitalize on with Halo Infinite.
Its far more unique to NOT have sprint in your game.
the problem with halo 5 in my eyes is that the game crashes after almost every game, and that 343 industries do absolutely nothing to change that
Tier 3 weapons for social mode.
24-32 vs 24-32 Grand Battle, more vehicles.
Gunner protection for warthogs and stationary guns.
Ken Static wrote:
Sprint was never the problem. Weapon balance isn't either. It's the fact alot of people are too closed off and trapped in their nostalgia bubbles that they cannot appreciate something unique. This is something 343 Industries has taken note of and are using to capitalize on with Halo Infinite.
there is a lot wrong with this statement as there are plenty of essays/dissection on what Bungie era halo (before reach) really was and how the current halo version, while solid, does not really understand the principles that the OG trilogy followed. I almost argue H5 superficially was a "halo" game. Was it bad, absolutely not. The mechanics and systems created were created with each other in mind (sprint, thruster, spartan charge, clamber, etc). They all existed in a system that worked fairly well.

I don't agree with the statement that "sprint is the problem" cause in reality its not the ONLY problem. Reach (and eventually sprint in 4) moved started shifting the focus away from the sandbox orientated gameplay to a player power focus oned. It was no longer about how players used the tools around them to improve their relatively weak OG self and were more about how can I make my powerful self more powerful (and even then, it was mainly around power weapons). H5 imparticular went this route. Sure, all players were equal from their spawn, but the inherent abilities given to the player subtracted from the sandbox orientated gameplay that made the OG trilogy unique. It was no longer about outweighing positives and negatives of weapons and equipment for a given engagement and or adapting to what you have to fit the situation. H5 made it so just about every weapon can be used at every range under the idea of (balance). True balance is not making it so everything is viable, but making it so everything has its place in the sandbox so one weapon or tool does not reign supreme. From an ability perspective, it becomes how you used the abilities, not making choices that made your character in that moment unique (equipment and weapon loadout combination). It became about memorizing buttons, not memorizing weapon and equipment combos for a variety of areas and situations.

I honestly don't care if Infinite has sprint or some abilities. I do care if the focus moves from the sandbox focused gameplay to the player focus one like H5 so heavily was.
Sprint is a major problem, because since it’s implementation they broke the golden Halo triangle of guns, grenades, and melee, while changing maps in a bad way.
Ken Static wrote:
Sprint was never the problem. Weapon balance isn't either. It's the fact alot of people are too closed off and trapped in their nostalgia bubbles that they cannot appreciate something unique. This is something 343 Industries has taken note of and are using to capitalize on with Halo Infinite.
yeh its nostalgia bubbles i can find a game in h5 within seconds yet back on mcc it took a solid 5 minutes to find a game in mcc and apparently h5 is the worst. if you have some good memories of the og trilogy I would love to sit down and talk about them. 343 tried to modernise halo with 4 and 5 and still make halo in my opinion they did a great job but seen as the the majority of actual halo fans (people who play halo cos its halo not cos there board of cod) were still in their bubbles they didn't allow change. Back in the day halo was revolutionary however nowadays it would be considered outdated. So 343 took a leap of with 5 and added a lot of underrated features. Such as the all the weapon reqs (not the microtransactions the actual weapons and vehicles) they made super fiesta the best we have ever had it. Yes the campaign left something to be desired yes at the beginning there was nothing and it had to be all added in updates. However look at H5 now it has the best forge to date, best multiplayer of a halo game, we got a custom games browser so no more having to organise a big event for everyone to join on and also the graphics in 5 are amazing you may not like the design how ever the graphics are superb. So in my final opinion yes do I think h5 is flawed however if you take it for what it is now its the best halo in my opinion. P.S a good chunk of the problems of 5 can be found in the older games to.
It's good to go back and play the old games now. See the problems with each of them, they all are flawed in some way. Infinite will have flaws of course too, and we will all rage at each other over what infinite could have been.
Ken Static wrote:
Sprint was never the problem. Weapon balance isn't either. It's the fact alot of people are too closed off and trapped in their nostalgia bubbles that they cannot appreciate something unique. This is something 343 Industries has taken note of and are using to capitalize on with Halo Infinite.
ok i forgot, halo 5 is perfect game and millions of people are playing it right now. nevermind
Can't tell if joking but generally Halo 5 tends to have mixed views, I've said before in other thread that H5 is the worst in the series while seen others claim it's somehow the best. I just hope Infinite is more like Halo 2/3, not like 5.
the problem with halo 5 in my eyes is that the game crashes after almost every game, and that 343 industries do absolutely nothing to change that
Has this been an issue for others? I've never experienced this, myself.
Ken Static wrote:
Sprint was never the problem. Weapon balance isn't either. It's the fact alot of people are too closed off and trapped in their nostalgia bubbles that they cannot appreciate something unique. This is something 343 Industries has taken note of and are using to capitalize on with Halo Infinite.
yeh its nostalgia bubbles i can find a game in h5 within seconds yet back on mcc it took a solid 5 minutes to find a game in mcc and apparently h5 is the worst. if you have some good memories of the og trilogy I would love to sit down and talk about them. 343 tried to modernise halo with 4 and 5 and still make halo in my opinion they did a great job but seen as the the majority of actual halo fans (people who play halo cos its halo not cos there board of cod) were still in their bubbles they didn't allow change. Back in the day halo was revolutionary however nowadays it would be considered outdated. So 343 took a leap of with 5 and added a lot of underrated features. Such as the all the weapon reqs (not the microtransactions the actual weapons and vehicles) they made super fiesta the best we have ever had it. Yes the campaign left something to be desired yes at the beginning there was nothing and it had to be all added in updates. However look at H5 now it has the best forge to date, best multiplayer of a halo game, we got a custom games browser so no more having to organise a big event for everyone to join on and also the graphics in 5 are amazing you may not like the design how ever the graphics are superb. So in my final opinion yes do I think h5 is flawed however if you take it for what it is now its the best halo in my opinion. P.S a good chunk of the problems of 5 can be found in the older games to.
Your personal experience with finding a match is irrelevant, we know that Halo 3 sold way more copies than Halo 5, had a much larger player population, and maintained it's player population for far longer.

Comparing the popularity of the classic Halo games to MCC is totally dishonest. MCC launched in a completely abysmal state, even worse than Halo 5, and it took a very long time for the game to become even remotely playable, and even now there are still some issues that were not present in the original games. The UI is also very unappealing, and on PC it still has numerous functionality problems.

Also your characterization of why Halo 4 and 5 sold less is just wrong, most Halo fans did try Halo 4 out, and they found themselves mostly disappointed by a game which was desperately trying to be COD that had stripped many of Halo's fundamental features in the process. It had absolutely nothing to do with not wanting any changes, it had to do with not accepting bad changes that were made to follow trends. Halo 5 was even worse because it chased the "advanced" mobility fad to it's fullest extent and strayed even farther from what makes Halo Halo and most classic fans weren't willing to waste their time and money on something they weren't interested in.
Halo has struggled with both weapon design and balance from Halo 2 onward. Frankly the sandboxes of Halo 3 and 5 are not that different and suffer from many of the same issues.

I give the edge to Halo 5 if only because many of the historically under-powered weapons in H2/H3/HR were buffed up to be usable again even if many of them are still boring reskins. The H5 Magnum doesn't have the random spread of the H3 BR which itself is a huge mark against Halo 3. I also don't think the AR necessarily needs to be limited to close range given there are 3 other bullet hoses in any given Halo game after H2, I would like to see an AR that behaves in a similar matter to ODST SMG, though I still wouldn't mind having a CE style AR if we ditched/redesigned the SMG and SAW.

I can understand the desire to limit player effectiveness at range, but I don't think Halo 3 is a very good example of that. There are plenty of alternatives for limiting a players effective range though. Decreasing auto aim and magnetism, switching to projectile weapons rather than hitscan are themselves huge steps towards limiting a players effectiveness at range. Map design also plays a crucial role as you need to avoid making maps any larger than they need to be, you need to ensure there are not to many wide open sightlines with little cover, and you need to make sure the power ups with fast timers are placed so players have to leave their comfortable power positions to obtain them and they are forced to leave with regularity in order to maintain weapon control.
Sprint, thrust, and abilities are the problems. The weapons are fine.
Sprint, thrust, and abilities are the problems. The weapons are fine.
In Halo 5 there are way too many weapons that share a purpose. What made Halo unique was that most weapons (some weapons were too similar to others like the beam rifle and sniper) had a different use in combat which then affected how matches would play out by fighting for control over certain weapons like the br. Halo 5 starts you with a pistol that is just as effective as the dmr and the br which makes chasing those weapons completely pointless and thus affects the playstyles used (staying as far away from each other as possible) and ultimately how maps are played.

Sprint, thrust and abilities add to this problem but ultimately the sandbox is the worst part of 5.
This was actually the magic of halo 3. It was because the starting weapons encouraged players to gravitate towards each other for excellent close quarter combat. Also because the starting weapons took so much creativity to kill with, it gave a lot of incentive to fight for "easy" power weapons.

Nah...the magic of H2 and H3 wasn't the gameplay. That foundation was rock solid (even though I don't like equipment in H3). The magic was something far more difficult to recapture. It was the fact that both were pretty 'early' online console games. There was still a sense of community. People using their mics, communicating and strategizing. That was the magic sauce that made everything more awesome.

Also: don't forget about map design. Valhalla for instance. That's the kind of map you don't find in 343i Halo. Its also the kind of map where you NEED to fight for the power weapons. No sniper in your team? Good luck. No Splazer while the other team is wrecking you with the Hog or Banshee? Good luck. Map design was a major incentive to fight for the power weapons.
The more I re-watch the launch trailer the more I feel like 343 is already going back to the Halo 3 feel/model. The armor looks like halo 3 in 4K. The cinematic shot of a warthog in the reflection of the visor is the same as it was for the cinematic trailer for Halo 3. I feel like this new game will have halo 3's feel with picking and choosing things from other halo's that people liked (eg. Reach armor customization, H2 hitscan, etc)
Nuss902928 wrote:
Ken Static wrote:
Sprint was never the problem. Weapon balance isn't either. It's the fact alot of people are too closed off and trapped in their nostalgia bubbles that they cannot appreciate something unique. This is something 343 Industries has taken note of and are using to capitalize on with Halo Infinite.
yeh its nostalgia bubbles i can find a game in h5 within seconds yet back on mcc it took a solid 5 minutes to find a game in mcc and apparently h5 is the worst. if you have some good memories of the og trilogy I would love to sit down and talk about them. 343 tried to modernise halo with 4 and 5 and still make halo in my opinion they did a great job but seen as the the majority of actual halo fans (people who play halo cos its halo not cos there board of cod) were still in their bubbles they didn't allow change. Back in the day halo was revolutionary however nowadays it would be considered outdated. So 343 took a leap of with 5 and added a lot of underrated features. Such as the all the weapon reqs (not the microtransactions the actual weapons and vehicles) they made super fiesta the best we have ever had it. Yes the campaign left something to be desired yes at the beginning there was nothing and it had to be all added in updates. However look at H5 now it has the best forge to date, best multiplayer of a halo game, we got a custom games browser so no more having to organise a big event for everyone to join on and also the graphics in 5 are amazing you may not like the design how ever the graphics are superb. So in my final opinion yes do I think h5 is flawed however if you take it for what it is now its the best halo in my opinion. P.S a good chunk of the problems of 5 can be found in the older games to.
Your personal experience with finding a match is irrelevant, we know that Halo 3 sold way more copies than Halo 5, had a much larger player population, and maintained it's player population for far longer.

Comparing the popularity of the classic Halo games to MCC is totally dishonest. MCC launched in a completely abysmal state, even worse than Halo 5, and it took a very long time for the game to become even remotely playable, and even now there are still some issues that were not present in the original games. The UI is also very unappealing, and on PC it still has numerous functionality problems.

Also your characterization of why Halo 4 and 5 sold less is just wrong, most Halo fans did try Halo 4 out, and they found themselves mostly disappointed by a game which was desperately trying to be COD that had stripped many of Halo's fundamental features in the process. It had absolutely nothing to do with not wanting any changes, it had to do with not accepting bad changes that were made to follow trends. Halo 5 was even worse because it chased the "advanced" mobility fad to it's fullest extent and strayed even farther from what makes Halo Halo and most classic fans weren't willing to waste their time and money on something they weren't interested in.
This. Halo has lost its well-established identity from the original trilogy. Reach, 4, and 5 changed it so much.
Um we need skull hunting like halo 3!!!!!!
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