Forums / Games / Halo Infinite

Keeping the immersion

OP PurplePowErX6

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Going to get straight to the point here. These types of things will fix the immersion of Halo's multiplayer, and probably for the whole game in general.
  • Naming classic weapons their original names, such as "M6D Magnum" instead of "Halo CE Magnum", this can simply be fixed by naming weapons by their correct name. Naming them by which video game they were in just sounds like the game is backtracking too much and you lose a sense of being in the game you're playing, such as H5.
  • Map design. Forged maps by the community are one thing, but it shouldn't be the basis for every BTB map. Nor is making everything look like a war simulation, such as in warzone. Arena maps just looked like they were made for spartan simulations, not real-life places. I don't want the maps to make it feel like I'm completely in a simulation, I want to feel a part of another world or map all-together.
  • Art style. I know this is already being addressed, but it also helps with map design. A lot of the objects in H5's forge were plain, and a lot of layout pieces for built-in maps were overused in Arena. Adding grit and character to objects and places gives it more depth. Everything looked too plastic in H5. The same goes with forerunner tech, not everything has to look super clean and over-the-top. Halo 1-3 did this very well in my opinion.
  • Getting rid of some spartan abilities (at least). Notice I said "some". It doesn't have to be everything, but spartan charge and ground pound need to go. They seem to be a nuisance in the gameplay of H5 and also seem a bit unrealistic (ground pound more than spartan charge).
Community additions:
  • Adding blood, mud, and grit (Modod)
  • Getting rid of hit markers (Hot Chili Fries)
  • Getting rid of cheesy spartan callout dialogue -- making it optional (M killshot)
  • Getting rid of weapon spawn callouts -- maybe for some game modes (can i have host)
  • Getting rid of goofy/childish cosmetics, such as some armor effects and/or some weapon skins -- Example: Pizza skin (TriedCrowd418)
  • Getting rid of sniper glare -- unrealistic for 2500s and lowers skill gap, can be replaced with bullet trail or smoke (King of Brunch)
If you have any suggestions to help with the immersion, give your thoughts.
: )
Going to get straight to the point here. These types of things will fix the immersion of Halo's multiplayer, and probably for the whole game in general.
  • Naming classic weapons their original names, such as "M6D Magnum" instead of "Halo CE Magnum", this can simply be fixed by naming weapons by their correct name. Naming them by which video game they were in just sounds like the game is backtracking too much and you lose a sense of being in the game you're playing, such as H5.
  • Map design. Forged maps by the community are one thing, but it shouldn't be the basis for every BTB map. Nor is making everything look like a war simulation, such as in warzone. Arena maps just looked like they were made for spartan simulations, not real-life places. I don't want the maps to make it feel like I'm completely in a simulation, I want to feel a part of another world or map all-together.
  • Art style. I know this is already being addressed, but it also helps with map design. A lot of the objects in H5's forge were plain, and a lot of layout pieces for built-in maps were overused in Arena. Adding grit and character to objects and places gives it more depth. Everything looked too plastic in H5. The same goes with forerunner tech, not everything has to look super clean and over-the-top. Halo 1-3 did this very well in my opinion.
  • Getting rid of some spartan abilities (at least). Notice I said "some". It doesn't have to be everything, but spartan charge and ground pound need to go. They seem to be a nuisance in the gameplay of H5 and also seem a bit unrealistic (ground pound more than spartan charge).
If you have any suggestions to help with the immersion, give your thoughts. :)
All positive and straight forward things. The point on abilities is a little asinine as they are about as believable as the games tech or space magic so while I'd welcome it I wouldn't consider it a benefit to immersion. One other thing I think would add to immersion is gore and a mud and blood battle scaring on Spartans like the slider in doom.
getting rid of hit markers would not only increase the immersion of the game, it would also bring back the skill gap that Halo 2 and 3 had. I always found it ridiculous that if you wanna know if an enemy's behind cover or in a room, all you have to do is spam a grenade and it'll show you exactly where he/she is at. It even shows you how much damage you did with through the hit markers. Now someone could argue that "oh it's in the lore that spartans have super dooper computer sensors build into their grenades and bullets." Well you can just add that to the list of features that people don't like in modern Halo that is justified by "canon" accurate multiplayer. They could also argue that grenade hit markers reduce camping, but honestly I just feel like the trade off isn't there. Grenades essentially serving two purposes as both a sensor and a damage emitter is just ridiculous. Hell, why not just make a special grenade that's job it is is to locate enemies?

Hit markers are just some of the many things Halo never needed in the past yet modern developers felt the need to include them anyway.
getting rid of hit markers would not only increase the immersion of the game, it would also bring back the skill gap that Halo 2 and 3 had. I always found it ridiculous that if you wanna know if an enemy's behind cover or in a room, all you have to do is spam a grenade and it'll show you exactly where he/she is at. It even shows you how much damage you did with through the hit markers. Now someone could argue that "oh it's in the lore that spartans have super dooper computer sensors build into their grenades and bullets." Well you can just add that to the list of features that people don't like in modern Halo that is justified by "canon" accurate multiplayer. They could also argue that grenade hit markers reduce camping, but honestly I just feel like the trade off isn't there. Grenades essentially serving two purposes as both a sensor and a damage emitter is just ridiculous. Hell, why not just make a special grenade that's job it is is to locate enemies?

Hit markers are just some of the many things Halo never needed in the past yet modern developers felt the need to include them anyway.
I’ve said Halo went from being a trend setter to following trends. Hopefully the cycle is broken in Infinite.

Your point about the grenade being a sensor is spot on.
Along with the other great suggestions, can we get rid of Spartan callouts? It really destroys the immersion for me ironically. I want callouts from my real teammates only. Also, get rid of power weapon announcements letting everyone know when they're up. If I want to time a weapon or dirty it I should be able to without everyone explicitly being told when exactly they're going to spawn.

The older games were auditorily clean. You heard the game sound, the announcer only when necessary, and your real teammates talking. The other stuff just adds to the audio creating a messy experience.
baaask wrote:
Along with the other great suggestions, can we get rid of Spartan callouts? It really destroys the immersion for me ironically. I want callouts from my real teammates only. Also, get rid of power weapon announcements letting everyone know when they're up. If I want to time a weapon or dirty it I should be able to without everyone explicitly being told when exactly they're going to spawn.

The older games were auditorily clean. You heard the game sound, the announcer only when necessary, and your real teammates talking. The other stuff just adds to the audio creating a messy experience.
I don't mind the callouts telling you where an enemy is, that's fine. But when some random dude on your team yells "Shotgun's doing work!" when you get a kill, or something cheesy like that for other weapons, I hate it. I lean more towards removing them entirely too, as it increases the skill gap a little as you need to be more observant of your surroundings, but that stuff for sure needs to go.
baaask wrote:
Along with the other great suggestions, can we get rid of Spartan callouts? It really destroys the immersion for me ironically. I want callouts from my real teammates only. Also, get rid of power weapon timers letting everyone know when they're up. If I want to time a weapon or dirty it I should be able to without everyone explicitly being told when exactly they're going to spawn.
I've made a thread about both the spartan call-outs and the weapon pad announcer. According to some people, the weapon pad marker and announcer actually raises the skill gap.

So when Halo 5 tells you the exact location and spawn times of power weapons, shows you whether or not your spam grenades or your blind firing bullets are hitting, and having automated call outs from teammates, the game is actually much harder. I mean, who were we to think that the game doing the work for us and dumbing everything down was making the game easier?

(sarcasm intended.)

@killshot I don't mind call-outs that much, but I can see why people don't like them. However, if they're going to make comments about the gameplay or other people's shots, they might as well be funny and cool. When you play Gears of War 4, you hear some of the funniest issh come out of the character's mouths, and it definitely enhances the experience. Having custom Spartan voices would also be nice too. It makes no sense why your spartan would just get some random voice. lol
M killshot wrote:
baaask wrote:
Along with the other great suggestions, can we get rid of Spartan callouts? It really destroys the immersion for me ironically. I want callouts from my real teammates only. Also, get rid of power weapon announcements letting everyone know when they're up. If I want to time a weapon or dirty it I should be able to without everyone explicitly being told when exactly they're going to spawn.

The older games were auditorily clean. You heard the game sound, the announcer only when necessary, and your real teammates talking. The other stuff just adds to the audio creating a messy experience.
I don't mind the callouts telling you where an enemy is, that's fine. But when some random dude on your team yells "Shotgun's doing work!" when you get a kill, or something cheesy like that for other weapons, I hate it. I lean more towards removing them entirely too, as it increases the skill gap a little as you need to be more observant of your surroundings, but that stuff for sure needs to go.
I agree that there is probably too much audio going on all at once in H5 that can distract from gameplay. My opinion would be to create an option that allows the player to disable spartan callouts/dialogue, and possibly have classic game modes where power weapons don't reveal timers or callouts either. But I must agree I am not a fan of the cheesy spartan dialogue in the background, but when playing solo, it can feel more immersive if it isn't as cheesy.
getting rid of hit markers would not only increase the immersion of the game, it would also bring back the skill gap that Halo 2 and 3 had.
Crud. Who knew even simple hit markers could be a topic of controversy. I prefer them but I can live without them if necessary.
baaask wrote:
Also, get rid of power weapon announcements letting everyone know when they're up. If I want to time a weapon or dirty it I should be able to without everyone explicitly being told when exactly they're going to spawn.
Strongly disagree on this one. I can't tell you how many times I've been playing Halo 2 or 3, been blown up by a rocket launcher, react "Oh wow. There's a rocket launcher on this map." Respawn, get spawn camped by a sniper, react "Oh wow. There's a sniper on this map." Respawn, trudge out to the middle of the map, get killed by a cloaked person, react "Oh wow. There's camo on this map." It gets seriously annoying because the veterans will always beat inexperienced people like me to the weapons so even if I wander past their spawn accidentally I still won't know it spawns there since a vet will already have it. While I still enjoy those games, it does kill some of the fun knowing I won't even have had a chance to prevent a lot of my deaths because an enemy has a superior weapon I don't stand the slightest chance at getting either. I think the timer telling when they respawn could go but their locations need to stay visible. Yeah Yeah tell me to git gud and bore myself to death running around in customs for hours to learn the maps all you want I'm just expressing my opinion as a noob. It's not a skill gap it's an experience gap and noobs like me have very little chance of closing that gap as long as experienced players stay around.
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I can't tell you how many times I've been playing Halo 2 or 3, been blown up by a rocket launcher, react "Oh wow. There's a rocket launcher on this map." Respawn, get spawn camped by a sniper, react "Oh wow. There's a sniper on this map." Respawn, trudge out to the middle of the map, get killed by a cloaked person, react "Oh wow. There's camo on this map."
In Halo 3, there's still forge, where you can go into the map at your own will by yourself and check for where weapons spawn, the timers on them, etc. Just letting you know, there are tools around that.
getting rid of hit markers would not only increase the immersion of the game, it would also bring back the skill gap that Halo 2 and 3 had.
Crud. Who knew even simple hit markers could be a topic of controversy. I prefer them but I can live without them if necessary.
baaask wrote:
Also, get rid of power weapon announcements letting everyone know when they're up. If I want to time a weapon or dirty it I should be able to without everyone explicitly being told when exactly they're going to spawn.
Strongly disagree on this one. I can't tell you how many times I've been playing Halo 2 or 3, been blown up by a rocket launcher, react "Oh wow. There's a rocket launcher on this map." Respawn, get spawn camped by a sniper, react "Oh wow. There's a sniper on this map." Respawn, trudge out to the middle of the map, get killed by a cloaked person, react "Oh wow. There's camo on this map." It gets seriously annoying because the veterans will always beat inexperienced people like me to the weapons so even if I wander past their spawn accidentally I still won't know it spawns there since a vet will already have it. While I still enjoy those games, it does kill some of the fun knowing I won't even have had a chance to prevent a lot of my deaths because an enemy has a superior weapon I don't stand the slightest chance at getting either. I think the timer telling when they respawn could go but their locations need to stay visible. Yeah Yeah tell me to git gud and bore myself to death running around in customs for hours to learn the maps all you want I'm just expressing my opinion as a noob. It's not a skill gap it's an experience gap and noobs like me have very little chance of closing that gap as long as experienced players stay around.
You literally just described a skill gap in which you don't care to put the time in to learn. Why should you be granted knowledge right off the bat if you don't care to actively learn the nuances of the game? This applies to any competitive scenario.
getting rid of hit markers would not only increase the immersion of the game, it would also bring back the skill gap that Halo 2 and 3 had.
Crud. Who knew even simple hit markers could be a topic of controversy. I prefer them but I can live without them if necessary.
baaask wrote:
Also, get rid of power weapon announcements letting everyone know when they're up. If I want to time a weapon or dirty it I should be able to without everyone explicitly being told when exactly they're going to spawn.
Strongly disagree on this one. I can't tell you how many times I've been playing Halo 2 or 3, been blown up by a rocket launcher, react "Oh wow. There's a rocket launcher on this map." Respawn, get spawn camped by a sniper, react "Oh wow. There's a sniper on this map." Respawn, trudge out to the middle of the map, get killed by a cloaked person, react "Oh wow. There's camo on this map." It gets seriously annoying because the veterans will always beat inexperienced people like me to the weapons so even if I wander past their spawn accidentally I still won't know it spawns there since a vet will already have it. While I still enjoy those games, it does kill some of the fun knowing I won't even have had a chance to prevent a lot of my deaths because an enemy has a superior weapon I don't stand the slightest chance at getting either. I think the timer telling when they respawn could go but their locations need to stay visible. Yeah Yeah tell me to git gud and bore myself to death running around in customs for hours to learn the maps all you want I'm just expressing my opinion as a noob. It's not a skill gap it's an experience gap and noobs like me have very little chance of closing that gap as long as experienced players stay around.
Experience ties in with skill. Weapon markers/announcer and hit markers are just things that reduce the skill ceiling so that newer players will feel more welcome. But ask yourself, wasn't every player of Halo 2 or Halo 3 a new player at one point? Do you think they got that advantage over you for no reason? No. It's because they put the time and effort into the game and learned how it worked. It really doesn't even take that long to learn them either. Then that brings the issue of creating an obnoxious and annoying game for experienced players. If ive played on Eden or Stasis over 100 times, why the hell should I not have the option to turn off some random announcer and giant green icon that indicates information I already know?
getting rid of hit markers would not only increase the immersion of the game, it would also bring back the skill gap that Halo 2 and 3 had.
Crud. Who knew even simple hit markers could be a topic of controversy. I prefer them but I can live without them if necessary.
baaask wrote:
Also, get rid of power weapon announcements letting everyone know when they're up. If I want to time a weapon or dirty it I should be able to without everyone explicitly being told when exactly they're going to spawn.
Strongly disagree on this one. I can't tell you how many times I've been playing Halo 2 or 3, been blown up by a rocket launcher, react "Oh wow. There's a rocket launcher on this map." Respawn, get spawn camped by a sniper, react "Oh wow. There's a sniper on this map." Respawn, trudge out to the middle of the map, get killed by a cloaked person, react "Oh wow. There's camo on this map." It gets seriously annoying because the veterans will always beat inexperienced people like me to the weapons so even if I wander past their spawn accidentally I still won't know it spawns there since a vet will already have it. While I still enjoy those games, it does kill some of the fun knowing I won't even have had a chance to prevent a lot of my deaths because an enemy has a superior weapon I don't stand the slightest chance at getting either. I think the timer telling when they respawn could go but their locations need to stay visible. Yeah Yeah tell me to git gud and bore myself to death running around in customs for hours to learn the maps all you want I'm just expressing my opinion as a noob. It's not a skill gap it's an experience gap and noobs like me have very little chance of closing that gap as long as experienced players stay around.
As many other's have pointed out, that's indeed a skill gap that was present but now isn't. One skill of Halo is map knowledge: knowing your way around each map, different ways to move about on it, where weapons spawn, etc.. You always have a chance of finding a power weapon in game, no one really keeps track of the time between spawns to pick it up instantly. And if you really want to expand your knowledge quickly, hop into a custom game or forge and look around the map and see the locations of each weapon, and the spawn timer of it.
See you come from a school of thought that a more stripped down gameplay is better. I see the opposite.

You say no ground pound and spartan charge. I say have both.

You say no hit markers. I say they have a practical application and convey information.

You want no sprint. I say make the sprint even faster.

You say no splinter grenades. I think they fullfill a purpose as an area of denial item.

I want all the gimmicks and amenities and then some.

Infinite.
Going to get straight to the point here. These types of things will fix the immersion of Halo's multiplayer, and probably for the whole game in general.
  • Naming classic weapons their original names, such as "M6D Magnum" instead of "Halo CE Magnum", this can simply be fixed by naming weapons by their correct name. Naming them by which video game they were in just sounds like the game is backtracking too much and you lose a sense of being in the game you're playing, such as H5.
  • Map design. Forged maps by the community are one thing, but it shouldn't be the basis for every BTB map. Nor is making everything look like a war simulation, such as in warzone. Arena maps just looked like they were made for spartan simulations, not real-life places. I don't want the maps to make it feel like I'm completely in a simulation, I want to feel a part of another world or map all-together.
  • Art style. I know this is already being addressed, but it also helps with map design. A lot of the objects in H5's forge were plain, and a lot of layout pieces for built-in maps were overused in Arena. Adding grit and character to objects and places gives it more depth. Everything looked too plastic in H5. The same goes with forerunner tech, not everything has to look super clean and over-the-top. Halo 1-3 did this very well in my opinion.
  • Getting rid of some spartan abilities (at least). Notice I said "some". It doesn't have to be everything, but spartan charge and ground pound need to go. They seem to be a nuisance in the gameplay of H5 and also seem a bit unrealistic (ground pound more than spartan charge).
Community additions:
  • Getting rid of hit markers (Hot Chili Fries)
  • Adding blood, mud, and grit (Modod)
  • Getting rid of cheesy spartan callout dialogue -- making it optional (M killshot)
  • Getting rid of weapon spawn callouts -- maybe for some game modes (can i have ghost)
If you have any suggestions to help with the immersion, give your thoughts. : )
I love this, particularly the mention of forge maps being far too prevalent. Forge maps are a great way for the community to express their creativity and talent, but over reliance on forge maps is a cop out for the developers to not have to design fantastic environments from the ground up. It also hurts the diversity of the map pool. Just look at Halo Reach, nearly every map looked roughly the same.
These definitely would help with the immersion aspect. I personally like hit markers.
Going to get straight to the point here. These types of things will fix the immersion of Halo's multiplayer, and probably for the whole game in general.
  • Naming classic weapons their original names, such as "M6D Magnum" instead of "Halo CE Magnum", this can simply be fixed by naming weapons by their correct name. Naming them by which video game they were in just sounds like the game is backtracking too much and you lose a sense of being in the game you're playing, such as H5.
  • Map design. Forged maps by the community are one thing, but it shouldn't be the basis for every BTB map. Nor is making everything look like a war simulation, such as in warzone. Arena maps just looked like they were made for spartan simulations, not real-life places. I don't want the maps to make it feel like I'm completely in a simulation, I want to feel a part of another world or map all-together.
  • Art style. I know this is already being addressed, but it also helps with map design. A lot of the objects in H5's forge were plain, and a lot of layout pieces for built-in maps were overused in Arena. Adding grit and character to objects and places gives it more depth. Everything looked too plastic in H5. The same goes with forerunner tech, not everything has to look super clean and over-the-top. Halo 1-3 did this very well in my opinion.
  • Getting rid of some spartan abilities (at least). Notice I said "some". It doesn't have to be everything, but spartan charge and ground pound need to go. They seem to be a nuisance in the gameplay of H5 and also seem a bit unrealistic (ground pound more than spartan charge).
Community additions:
  • Getting rid of hit markers (Hot Chili Fries)
  • Adding blood, mud, and grit (Modod)
  • Getting rid of cheesy spartan callout dialogue -- making it optional (M killshot)
  • Getting rid of weapon spawn callouts -- maybe for some game modes (can i have ghost)
If you have any suggestions to help with the immersion, give your thoughts. : )
I love these notes! The one about weapon names is precise and subtle but spot on. And I love what you said about the art style: I think back to some of the best arena maps from Halo 3--Guardian, Construct, Blackout, Pit, etc. Pretty much anything you'd find in the doubles playlist. They all take you to a different place! They're memorable for that.

And hit markers, yes! Dear God. Get rid of'em.
to add more, the biggest killer of immersion was in Reach: the armor affects. lets not see those return for the sake of immersion and gameplay. then there's the weapon skins from H5. the weapons and vehicles don't belong to the spartans, they are property of the UNSC military, any military organization would not allow their soldiers to customize their gear with pizzas and candy cane stripes and stuff, its not practical.
See you guys come from a school of thought that a more stripped down gameplay is better. I see the opposite.

You say no ground pound and spartan charge. I say have both.

You say no hit markers. I say they have a practical application and convey information.

You want rockets to have 2 rounds. I say have 4.

You want no sprint. I say make the sprint even faster.

You say no splinter grenades. I think they fullfill a purpose as an area of denial item.

You want Magnum only starts. I say Halo2 BR starts and the SMG to pair with it.

I want all the gimmicks and amenities and then some.

You worship in the past. I want to be Infinite.
A lot of these statements contradict the identity of Halo. You want to go play some super-fast, 300% sprint leveled game with tons of rockets and OP weapon pearing starts? Go play Overwatch, because those traits fit Overwatch's identity, not Halo's. It's not about worshiping the past, it's helping create a game that isn't some generic shooter.
Going to get straight to the point here. These types of things will fix the immersion of Halo's multiplayer, and probably for the whole game in general.
  • Naming classic weapons their original names, such as "M6D Magnum" instead of "Halo CE Magnum", this can simply be fixed by naming weapons by their correct name. Naming them by which video game they were in just sounds like the game is backtracking too much and you lose a sense of being in the game you're playing, such as H5.
  • Map design. Forged maps by the community are one thing, but it shouldn't be the basis for every BTB map. Nor is making everything look like a war simulation, such as in warzone. Arena maps just looked like they were made for spartan simulations, not real-life places. I don't want the maps to make it feel like I'm completely in a simulation, I want to feel a part of another world or map all-together.
  • Art style. I know this is already being addressed, but it also helps with map design. A lot of the objects in H5's forge were plain, and a lot of layout pieces for built-in maps were overused in Arena. Adding grit and character to objects and places gives it more depth. Everything looked too plastic in H5. The same goes with forerunner tech, not everything has to look super clean and over-the-top. Halo 1-3 did this very well in my opinion.
  • Getting rid of some spartan abilities (at least). Notice I said "some". It doesn't have to be everything, but spartan charge and ground pound need to go. They seem to be a nuisance in the gameplay of H5 and also seem a bit unrealistic (ground pound more than spartan charge).
Community additions:
  • Getting rid of hit markers (Hot Chili Fries)
  • Adding blood, mud, and grit (Modod)
  • Getting rid of cheesy spartan callout dialogue -- making it optional (M killshot)
  • Getting rid of weapon spawn callouts -- maybe for some game modes (can i have ghost)
  • Getting rid of goofy/childish cosmetics, such as some armor effects and/or some weapon skins -- Example: Pizza skin (TriedCrowd418)
If you have any suggestions to help with the immersion, give your thoughts. : )
Naming classic weapons their original names: Naming classic weapons "Halo X [Weapon]" is probably to tell newcomers where did this gun come from so they can search it up themselves and see why they were added. Being a lore fanatic, I would like this change, but it would probably be better to have it as an option, with game names being the default.
Map design: This. I don't play much of Halo 5's Arena, but when I play in Forge maps whose geometry is is around flat or detail-less blocks, it really just loses the immersion. If they had an option to add some sort of texture on top, maybe that would have refined the design, but overall, dev-made maps do an amazing job at immersing us in the Universe. When I play, I become who I play as.. so to say, because I just want to feel immersed in a world I love so much.
Art style: I'd argue for a mix instead. No, not for many aspects, just some. Like: bringing back the old UNSC design, but mixing it with current Halo's details. Or vice versa.
Getting rid of some spartan abilities: Spartan Charge, Ground Pound, Stabilizers, Sprint, Clamber and Smart-Link ADS need to go. (Basically 85% of the arsenal). I'm fine with Thruster Packs, in fact, they're my favorite additions to the Halo sandbox and I can see it fit quite well in classic gameplay (but without any real way to see it, I can only imagine). Any secondary ability or anything? Honestly, tough call. If there is, the golden "triangle" (more like a square at this point) of Halo will instead be a pentagon unless Thrusters are completely removed. But the gameplay would be more dynamic.

As for the rest of the points, I wholeheartedly agree.
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