Forums / Games / Halo Infinite

PC Aim Assist

OP Rewchy

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Hey Guys,

As much of a fan of classic Halo as I am, I think most, if not all, mouse and keyboard players have faced their fair amount of annoyance when it comes to controller aim assist on pc. Just curious where you guys, the community, stand on the matter, and how you guys think it will evolve when it comes to infinite.

Personally, I understand why these games have the aim assist they do, running at low frame rates on underpowered consoles, it was needed. But with next gen and many, many pc halo fans i think it should be tuned down to possibly just tracking assist and no bullet magnetism, or if youre going to add bullet magnetism, make sure mouse and keyboard players also have it, like what Destiny 2 has.

To be clear, this is not a controller vs M&K debate, its a balance change so that all players, high skill and low can enjoy themselves. With next gen consoles and new PC parts, Halo is going to run faster and better than ever, therefore the need for aim assist needs to be tuned accordingly.

Where do you guys stand?
I'm all for closing the gap. I don't game on PC so excuse my lack of knowledge but doesn't aim assist feel more OP the higher the frame rate? I know going from Reach on X360 at 30fps to XB1 60fps you can feel it's pretty strong, so I can only imagine what it then feels like to PC gamers running the game at 120+.

Whatever they do I hope Infinite will feel more balanced as it's being built ground up for PC, unlike the entirety of MCC's games.
Controller players will need a bit more help.

But if you have a large enough population you can directly compare the accuracy between the two and adjust as necessary.
I'm all for closing the gap. I don't game on PC so excuse my lack of knowledge but doesn't aim assist feel more OP the higher the frame rate? I know going from Reach on X360 at 30fps to XB1 60fps you can feel it's pretty strong, so I can only imagine what it then feels like to PC gamers running the game at 120+.

Whatever they do I hope Infinite will feel more balanced as it's being built ground up for PC, unlike the entirety of MCC's games.
Yes, thats why on MCC PC aim assist feels so strong. But as we know games like reach ran at 30fps, so it's completely understandable for mcc to feel the way it does without any huge engine and core mechanic changes. I agree, and I hope 343 will keep that in mind with Infinite. I believe the new xbox is going to have keyboard and mouse support as well so that should bring a whole new challenge for developers to really make sure they nail gameplay mechanics.
Darwi wrote:
Controller players will need a bit more help.

But if you have a large enough population you can directly compare the accuracy between the two and adjust as necessary.
I agree, controller players are 100% at a disadvantage compared to keyboard. But the issue with MCC is the games weren't built for high frames so the magnitude of the help they receive is amplified 10 fold. Hopefully 343 really hits this game right, and everybody can experience Halo in their own way without too much fuss.
Rewchy wrote:
Hey Guys,

As much of a fan of classic Halo as I am, I think most, if not all, mouse and keyboard players have faced their fair amount of annoyance when it comes to controller aim assist on pc. Just curious where you guys, the community, stand on the matter, and how you guys think it will evolve when it comes to infinite.

Personally, I understand why these games have the aim assist they do, running at low frame rates on underpowered consoles, it was needed. But with next gen and many, many pc halo fans i think it should be tuned down to possibly just tracking assist and no bullet magnetism, or if youre going to add bullet magnetism, make sure mouse and keyboard players also have it, like what Destiny 2 has.

To be clear, this is not a controller vs M&K debate, its a balance change so that all players, high skill and low can enjoy themselves. With next gen consoles and new PC parts, Halo is going to run faster and better than ever, therefore the need for aim assist needs to be tuned accordingly.

Where do you guys stand?
I agree with you, we need balance and i think that is a good way
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I'm not a game developer so I don't know all the numbers going on under the hood when it comes to aim assist + bullet magnetism, but I do know this: Halo was originally designed for 30 fps at low FoV and low resolution with that strange feeling classic halo style right stick look movement. Halo was also one of the first major console fps games, and the developers probably weren't sure how good or bad the general population would be at aiming on a controller.

At this point I think it's fair to say that players have mostly exceeded expectations in regard to their aiming abilities on controller. We have people pulling off insane skill shots in these games, even ones with very little to no aim assist. As a result the MCC Halo games aim assist has become WAY stronger than it needs to be, not only because of technology improvements, but because people are just better at games than they once were and were expected to be. This sort of leaves those classic Halo games feeling like they have stone age shooting mechanics given how much help they provide their players with aim. Halo 5 was a step in the right direction since the game was designed around 60 fps, but as for finding that "perfect" balance between MKB and controller.. I'm not sure we ever will..
Perhaps controlling aim assist like with sensitivity
i dont think theyll add it for pc becuase pc users are better
I think Halo Infinite will have crossplay, with controller support for PC and MKB support for XBSX.

If controllers have low aim assist (not none) and/or skill-based matchmaking, then i don't think mixing input types will be an issue. However, i also suspect that the option to turn off crossplay will be a feature (input-based matchmaking).

Unfortunately, i haven't heard if XBSX will support gyro aim on their new controllers. It's still not as good as MKB, imo, but it's the best chance for controller players to compete with MKB with little-to-no aim assist.
Rewchy wrote:
Darwi wrote:
Controller players will need a bit more help.

But if you have a large enough population you can directly compare the accuracy between the two and adjust as necessary.
I agree, controller players are 100% at a disadvantage compared to keyboard. But the issue with MCC is the games weren't built for high frames so the magnitude of the help they receive is amplified 10 fold. Hopefully 343 really hits this game right, and everybody can experience Halo in their own way without too much fuss.
Please don't post multiple time in a row. If you need to add more information or quote other users, you can edit your last post. Thanks
There is a debate to be had, but I think that we have to wait until Infinite comes out to specifically see the issue that game has. It is safe to assume that there will be a disparity between MK and controller, but we can hope that 343 is balancing that to the best of their ability.
What if I told you that KBM users on MCC already have bullet magnetism?

Quote:
"There are two key design mechanics at play depending on which method of input a player uses in Halo: Reach. Player magnetism is what gives the reticule a gentle nudge to stick to a hit location. Pretty much every shooter on the market has some degree of magnetism to assist players. This code only applies to controllers because it is substantially harder to aim with a controller relative to the precision offered by a mouse. Aim assist is a degree of “bullet bending” that is applied when players shoot at opponents to ensure a shot that is close enough registers as a hit and is core to how Halo weapons like the Needler work. This code is the same across both controller and mouse and keyboard inputs."
The aim assist we talk about is 343's version of "player magnetism" while the bullet magnetism we talk about is 343's version of "aim assist."

That being said, I think the reason that controllers are preferred is because of a long TTK. This requires people to track and the controller does this for us pretty well resulting in a more consistent performance. So to balance inputs (if it is possible) they need to tone down the "player magnetism" that assists controller players.
qlimm wrote:
What if I told you that KBM users on MCC already have bullet magnetism?

Quote:
"There are two key design mechanics at play depending on which method of input a player uses in Halo: Reach. Player magnetism is what gives the reticule a gentle nudge to stick to a hit location. Pretty much every shooter on the market has some degree of magnetism to assist players. This code only applies to controllers because it is substantially harder to aim with a controller relative to the precision offered by a mouse. Aim assist is a degree of “bullet bending” that is applied when players shoot at opponents to ensure a shot that is close enough registers as a hit and is core to how Halo weapons like the Needler work. This code is the same across both controller and mouse and keyboard inputs."
The aim assist we talk about is 343's version of "player magnetism" while the bullet magnetism we talk about is 343's version of "aim assist."

That being said, I think the reason that controllers are preferred is because of a long TTK. This requires people to track and the controller does this for us pretty well resulting in a more consistent performance. So to balance inputs (if it is possible) they need to tone down the "player magnetism" that assists controller players.
Yes KBM players have magnetism, but in comparison to a controllers magnetism its a joke. That being said, it's not a debate of what the aim assist is or how it works, it's just how 343 can help to remedy this in a new game. It's a big reason a ton of KBM players have quit mcc or uninstalled it. Personally, I hate seeing a die hard community such as Halo fall off because of something that a developer has control over.
I'm not a game developer so I don't know all the numbers going on under the hood when it comes to aim assist + bullet magnetism, but I do know this: Halo was originally designed for 30 fps at low FoV and low resolution with that strange feeling classic halo style right stick look movement. Halo was also one of the first major console fps games, and the developers probably weren't sure how good or bad the general population would be at aiming on a controller.

At this point I think it's fair to say that players have mostly exceeded expectations in regard to their aiming abilities on controller. We have people pulling off insane skill shots in these games, even ones with very little to no aim assist. As a result the MCC Halo games aim assist has become WAY stronger than it needs to be, not only because of technology improvements, but because people are just better at games than they once were and were expected to be. This sort of leaves those classic Halo games feeling like they have stone age shooting mechanics given how much help they provide their players with aim. Halo 5 was a step in the right direction since the game was designed around 60 fps, but as for finding that "perfect" balance between MKB and controller.. I'm not sure we ever will..
I 100% agree with you on pretty much every aspect, I think we even touched on the older Halo's and their frames. Obviously both inputs have their upsides and downsides. I don't think there will ever be a perfect balance in any game, and it's a given that controllers NEED some sort of assistance compared to PC. The closest we can come to it will most likely lie in the hands of 343 and what they can figure out with their team. I have no doubts they'll try their best to give the most amount of options for both inputs to be competitive and being this game is being built ground up for PC makes those hopes even higher.
Rainye5788 wrote:
i dont think theyll add it for pc becuase pc users are better
not when it comes to Halo LOL
Perhaps controlling aim assist like with sensitivity
I think call of duty has something like this where you can turn up your aim assist slider. But even with that controller players would probably max that bar out for the most advantage. I think doing away with bullet magnetism and leaving tracking assistance would work very well. We'll just have to see.
D1LLYBEAN wrote:
I think Halo Infinite will have crossplay, with controller support for PC and MKB support for XBSX.

If controllers have low aim assist (not none) and/or skill-based matchmaking, then i don't think mixing input types will be an issue. However, i also suspect that the option to turn off crossplay will be a feature (input-based matchmaking).

Unfortunately, i haven't heard if XBSX will support gyro aim on their new controllers. It's still not as good as MKB, imo, but it's the best chance for controller players to compete with MKB with little-to-no aim assist.
They probably will have input based crossplay or something of the sort. I agree controllers aren't as viable as KBM. Personally, I think the core aim assistance (slowing down your crosshair when over an enemy) is fine and it's something pretty much every game with controller support has. I think the bullet magnetism is really what kills the balance.
I think the PC release should be entirely separate from the Xbox release
No crossplay at all, PC vs PC and Console vs Console.

Also no aim assist on PC.
Already regret buying the MCC for PC, I wanted a PC experience and what I got was a bunch of non-strafing individuals who will bum rush at you with a precision weapon, not missing a single headshot and then pummel you if their headshot softlock hasn't doen you in yet. Rarely get a balanced match, hoping that will change with input based matchmaking.
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