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Special Gametype Idea for Infinite

OP Greater Pain

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EDIT: I've overhauled the OP to include new ideas and be more concise. This may make much of the following conversation not make sense, but really it didn't make sense before either. People just weren't reading this initial post all the way through, and critiquing it on issues already solved. Anyway, here's the idea:

The Gametype Design:
Since Infinite is going to have an almost open world style, I had an idea for a multiplayer gametype that wouldn't be possible in past Halo games. Basically it's a special form of Slayer that subtly integrates other game types through new gameplay elements. The new gameplay elements are as follows:

  • Each player starts the match with whatever equipment they are holding in their single player save file.
  • Your starting equipment never despawns unless it falls from the map, and permanently respawns again every time that happens.
  • After dying you respawn with a basic "equal starts" style loadout, and need to go get your better weapons back or else take new ones.
  • The only weapons on the map are basic lower-tier weapons like grenades, SMG, pistols, etc, so what players bring from campaign is vital.
  • If a player drops their starting equipment, it is marked with a waypoint that all players can see.
  • Several ammo crates are on the map with a countdown timer to restock the ammo of weapons that otherwise don't spawn on the map for resupply.
  • The ammo crates are like territories that can be taken, and retaken by each team.
  • The team in control of the crate when the timer reaches 0 can each get 2 clips for each weapon they are holding.
  • When a team captures an enemy crate, the crate then only provides 1 clip for each weapon they are holding, even if it's recaptured by the team that had it at 0.
This gametype would be a sort of dance across the map, hunting for well equipped players rather than weapon spawn points, retrieving fallen power weapons wherever they may be, watching for the crate resupply cooldowns, capturing crates to maximize potential ammo acquired from it, and of course hunting the enemy. It's still a Halo waltz, but it's not the same dance steps as regular Slayer by any means.

These gametype mechanics are built around a gametype like Slayer, but incorporate subtle aspects of other gametypes. The dropped weapon waypoints are like crazy king of the hill zones. The ammo crates are like territories. And the starting equipment makes you like a juggernaut except in a team based mode. By being like these other gametypes combined, it's unlike any gametype that has ever been in Halo.

Some of the Potential Pitfalls:
  1. I realize this is almost like making your own loadout, and some players might try to min-max their campaign equipment for this gametype. But there are several reasons why this is NOT like making your own loadout. Players can try to get the weapons they want, but ammo count caries over as well. Since it's in campaign they will have to weigh their ammo use as they make it to the next checkpoint to save off their new equipment. Also, since 343 gives points each week for campaign weekly challenges, players will be forced to mess up their special loadouts frequently, or else miss out on those season points. And really it's only in this one gametype, and this gametype would probably be in Action Sack alongside Fiesta and Escalation. It doesn't need to be perfectly balanced. Just fun and challenging.
  2. Halo Infinite will have free to play multiplayer, so some players won't have the campaign to make a save file with. I've come up with multiple options that would solve this with differing effectiveness, and lots of controversy in the comment section here, but I guarantee you I haven't thought of every option. My suggested solutions for players that don't have campaign are the following:
  • Only players with the campaign have access to this gametype. This would be an extra incentive to get the campaign, and would be a hard-stop solution to the problem.
  • Give them a decent medium to strong equal-starts loadout. This would mean fewer power weapons, and would set the FTP players toward hunting from the start.
  • Give them a copy of another player's save game equipment from the same match. This would be an even playing field, but might feel random to the FTP player that gets it.
  • Randomly select from 343 curated loadouts for them to start with. This would work, but would be lame compared to the players with Campaign save files.
  • Allow the FTP players select from the same curated loadouts at the start of the match. They still respawn with equal starts, and starting weapons are persistent.
  • Randomly select their weapons like Fiesta. This would almost turn this gametype into Fiesta if not for respawning reducing you to basic equal starts gear, and the rest.
  • They spawn with basic gear, but there is 1 random power weapon spawned on the map for each FTP player which behaves as their persistent starting weapon. It spawns where a starting weapon would normally respawn after dropping off the map as mentioned above.
  • If there is a demo for the campaign, then you could pull from that save date, and encourage people to try it out for this gametype.
  • YukiryuFR suggested that players without campaign get to choose half of a loadout on their initial spawn by picking a power weapon as their primary, but always receive a specific standard secondary weapon such as an AR, BR, or Sidekick (I really like this one). Subsequent respawns are like everyone else.
Some other notes:
  • It seems like an easy enough thing to have the match startup scripts check your single player save data in order to mine the weapon and equipment data.
  • I was originally explaining this idea to a few people in a YouTube comment section, and everyone seemed pretty interested in it. One of them told me to come post it here on the off change 343 is interested, so there it is.
  • Spoiler:
    Show
I'd like everyone to let me know what you think, and if you have any ideas on how to refine the concept. I doubt 343 will see this and like the idea enough to put it in the game, but it'll be fun to talk about. Keep in mind, though, that the whole thing seems like it'll have to be a social kind of arcade style gametype since bringing just about any weapon you want into the fray can't be easily balanced for competitive play. After all, if this was in Halo 2, then you'd see people bringing the Scarab Gun into Matchmaking, so definitely not competitive play ready. lol

What would you name it?:
Hot Drop? Strapped? Suitcase? BYOB? BYOG (G for gear)? Short Stock? Limited? Pocket Change? Store Bought? Cary Over? Crossover? Backpack?
One major issue with this: Everyone who plays Infinite will have multiplayer, but not everyone will have campaign.
JoeySTRIKE wrote:
One major issue with this: Everyone who plays Infinite will have multiplayer, but not everyone will have campaign.
EDIT: This is not my main solution to this issue, and I have added better solutions above in the OP, but I'll leave this message for posterity. This original comment:
Quote:
That could be an issue, but people that don't have campaign could just be assigned random starting equipment, or maybe it could just pull from someone else's save file in the match. Otherwise it could be a gametype or custom game setting that is only available to those with the campaign. I prefer the former, but there are options.
I find your idea quite bad because of the "loadout".
Giving the advantage of choosing what weapons to start with by playing campaign while those who don't have campaign have to be lucky with your idea of random weapons is a really bad idea.
I think that keeping the same loadout for everyone is for the best as it makes the game more fair for everyone, except those that get the Power Weapons quickly and get an advantage but that's the main point.
YukiryuFR wrote:
I find your idea quite bad because of the "loadout".
Giving the advantage of choosing what weapons to start with by playing campaign while those who don't have campaign have to be lucky with your idea of random weapons is a really bad idea.
I think that keeping the same loadout for everyone is for the best as it makes the game more fair for everyone, except those that get the Power Weapons quickly and get an advantage but that's the main point.
Entirely agree, sorry OP, even starts for Halo MP is critically important

Since Infinite is going to be kind of open world, I had an idea for a multiplayer gametype that wouldn't be possible in past Halo games. Basically it's Slayer or any other gametype, except each player starts the match out with whatever equipment they are holding in single player. I realize this is sort of like just making your own loadout, except it would open things up to power weapons and such, and campaign only weapons that may be in the game if there are any. It might be cool to be an option when making a custom gametype, with a Social matchmaking gametype using this option somewhere in Action Sack or something.

It seems like an easy enough thing to have the match startup scripts check your single player save data to collect the weapon and equipment data.

I think when you respawn you shouldn't get all that nice gear again, just on initial spawn. Maybe the gear from start never disappears after you die, and there are limited equipment options on the map, so players will want to keep track of the special weapons everyone brought into the fray at the start. Maybe there are ammo resupplies, so even if those weapons get depleted they can still be useful.

I was originally explaining this idea to a few people in a YouTube comment section, and everyone seemed pretty interested in it. One of them told me to come post it here on the off change 343 is interested, so there it is.

I'd like everyone to let me know what you think, and if you have any ideas on how to refine the concept. I doubt 343 will see this and like the idea enough to put it in the game, but it'll be fun to talk about. Keep in mind, though, that the whole thing seems like it'll have to be a social kind of arcade style gametype since bringing just about any weapon you want into the fray can't be easily balanced for competitive play. After all, if this was in Halo 2, then you'd see people bringing the Scarab Gun into Matchmaking, so definitely not competitive play. lol

Anyway, let me know what you think about it!

And what would you name it?
Hot Drop? Strapped? Suitcase? BYOB? BYOG (G for gear)? Short Stock? Limited? Pocket Change? Store Bought? Cary Over? Crossover? Backpack?
Plus, Halo Infinite is NOT open world. It's an FPS with Open World elements.

Remember the section we saw last summer is supposedly *hours* into the campaign and may be the first time we get that open world element.
YukiryuFR wrote:
I find your idea quite bad because of the "loadout".... Etc.
Your concerns make sense, which is why I addressed them already. I said in the original post that it would be an arcade style gametype. While your concerns are valid, they could also equally be applied to Fiesta Slayer with its randomly selected loadouts. After all, remember that "equal starts" is just "same loadout". The word loadout is not the system of loadouts seen in past Halo games, and I mentioned in my OP that you'd respawn without these weapons. You go back to equal starts on respawn. This arcade style is why I suggested in my OP that it may be best as part of Action Sack, rather than any more serious gametype.

In other words I get your concerns, and I feel that I have already addressed them before you mentioned them. I had already thought of all of that. The gametype would still be pretty interesting and fun to play for many players like myself, like tens of thousands of players at least since it's basically a modified Slayer mode. It would also be kept fresh and interesting as a "once or twice in a few dozen matches" kind of game type by being shuffled into Action Sack.

Quote:
Plus, Halo Infinite is NOT open world. It's an FPS with Open World elements.
Yes, I'm aware it's NOT open world. as I said:
Quote:
... kind of open world,...
That wasn't just me saying it was 100% open world but with some kind of grammatical flair. I was saying "kind of" as it is defined. As in "not, but close to". Like how Destiny is "kind of an MMO" because it's online and massively multiplayer.

Regardless, the thing it is said to be according to 343 is a continuous pervasive gameplay experience as opposed to the mission picker screen of past Halo games. Or at least they described it that way at one point, but many changes to Infinite have been revealed over the years despite 343 being pretty mute, and this may change before release. Still, the point is that as the mission progression of Infinite has been described by 343 in the past, Infinite will invariably have a save file somewhere with your current equipment, and that equipment will presumably not reset just by starting a new campaign level as in previous Halo games because they broke away from that level selection convention. Again, this may be old news, meaning they may have returned to that classic Halo convention since then, but if not then there is an opportunity here that Halo has never had before, and it sounds like a lot of arcade styled fun.

Anyway,
It would be interesting to see what people try to keep on-hand in campaign to fight AI, and how good they are at switching gears to use it against players. Remember, this isn't just picking a loadout as simply as Halo 4 or something. It's a carry over from campaign where you may not be using the same gear you prefer against players. There will be a sort of balance there, with the occasional player that is finished with campaign mode just leaving their save file with a specific loadout. But I imagine with the way 343 does daily challenges specifically geared toward completing campaign tasks, that issue will be very few and far between.

I mean, keep in mind that the ammo count would carry over too, so keeping your save file at peak fighting capacity with specific weapons would be harder than you might think. It would likely be either "the weapons you want", or "full ammo at the start", and it would be very difficult to accomplish both at the same time unless you know the campaign mode so well that you know where to go to get full ammo in the weapon you want after every time you complete some of 343's campaign challenges. All of this to say, this would NOT be like picking a loadout. It would become tedious for players to try to make a specific loadout consistently, and those players that would do this would simply get bored with the gametype and avoid it, leaving it open for players that actually like the idea to spawn in with the gear of their campaign.
YukiryuFR wrote:
I find your idea quite bad because of the "loadout".
Giving the advantage of choosing what weapons to start with by playing campaign while those who don't have campaign have to be lucky with your idea of random weapons is a really bad idea.
I think that keeping the same loadout for everyone is for the best as it makes the game more fair for everyone, except those that get the Power Weapons quickly and get an advantage but that's the main point.
Hard agree. The only mode that should have random loadouts is Super Fiesta.
JoeySTRIKE wrote:
YukiryuFR wrote:
I find your idea quite bad because of the "loadout".
Giving the advantage of choosing what weapons to start with by playing campaign while those who don't have campaign have to be lucky with your idea of random weapons is a really bad idea.
I think that keeping the same loadout for everyone is for the best as it makes the game more fair for everyone, except those that get the Power Weapons quickly and get an advantage but that's the main point.
Hard agree. The only mode that should have random loadouts is Super Fiesta.
Then pose an alternative way to handle those players that don't have campaign, like I asked for in the OP. Like, I was grateful for your first post because it was worded as just a direct concern. But now it's gotten to a point where no one is providing an alternative, which is what I asked for in my OP in the first place. I wanted to discuss and polish the idea to a fully working concept, not receive negativity from every comment. The exact opposite of what I'm getting on YouTube.

I mean, like I said, there are multiple ways to do this and I listed several... Although it turns out they don't seem to be in my OP here... I must have accidentally deleted that section before posting. It's definitely on the YouTube comment where everyone loved the idea, though, and this one started out as a copy/paste of that one that I just rewrote to better fit this forum format.

Anyway, I added the options that I had brainstormed in an easy to spot new section of the main post above. I think any of them could easily work and wouldn't ruin the gametype, but I can see how random weapons might be less ideal than the others listed.
Just stick to super fiesta I say, no need to make it more complicated and unfair.
Why comment if you're just going to ignore what I wrote? How many people are going to come in here and assume that players without campaign are going to 100% get random loadouts? I'm seriously wondering why this is the hill you've all chosen to stand on and ignore that I've given half a dozen different options for handling players without campaign. Seriously, this gametype is nothing like Fiesta, and you can't get an experience exactly like this gametype in any Halo to date. This gametype idea has its own merits outside of how players without campaign are handled.

I continue to get nothing but positive responses in the YouTube comments, and nothing but negativity here from people that don't seem to want to read the alternatives to random loadouts for the occasional odd player out that won't own campaign. Is this forum's community this toxic all the time, not reading before commenting unwarranted negativity, or did I just get unlucky here?

Like, I'm new to the Waypoint forums, and I don't think I want to stick around after this BS.
Why comment if you're just going to ignore what I wrote? How many people are going to come in here and assume that players without campaign are going to 100% get random loadouts? I'm seriously wondering why this is the hill you've all chosen to stand on and ignore that I've given half a dozen different options for handling players without campaign. Seriously, this gametype is nothing like Fiesta, and you can't get an experience exactly like this gametype in any Halo to date. This gametype idea has its own merits outside of how players without campaign are handled.

I continue to get nothing but positive responses in the YouTube comments, and nothing but negativity here from people that don't seem to want to read the alternatives to random loadouts for the occasional odd player out that won't own campaign. Is this forum's community this toxic all the time, not reading before commenting unwarranted negativity, or did I just get unlucky here?

Like, I'm new to the Waypoint forums, and I don't think I want to stick around after this BS.
Ok let me resume, your game mode is literally the normal arena mode with an unfair starting loadout, that is determined either by what weapons you had in campaign last time you played it or is random if you didn't buy the campaign, that become a fair loadout once you die once.
Yeah I don't like it and I don't see the point when you have Fiesta for unfair loadouts or simply normal arena mode.

Because from what I understand, if a player that play campaign had a sniper last time he played as Chief, he will spawn with it the first time, but if another doesn't have campaign he can either spawn with a sniper and another weapon or a shotgun and another weapon.
Now imagine, the map they are in has more open area great for sniper and br than close quarter area, well the guy with the shotgun and fuel rod has more chance to get wrecked at the start while the other one, if he is good with precision weapon, will have an excellent start.

You understand my point now, one can choose what he will start with, and if it's weapons he is great at using, will have an advantage against the other one who can't choose and have to bet on a good start or die to have a proper loadout (hopefully, I don't know what will be standard loadout AR/BR or AR/Sidekick).

And before you say "but what about my idea to take someone else campaign files to have his weapons", that's still super random because you don't know what the guy had last time he played and I'm pretty sure it would be a pain to program that.

Also, not liking an idea even if, in your opinion, the problems have solutions isn't toxicity and while you say people on Youtube like your idea, you don't show any proof of that by either :
A - writing the URL to the video were you told your idea so that we can go to the comment section and see the reactions
or B - taking a screenshot of your idea with the reactions that you upload on an image host then drop the link here
I know that because you're new, you can't insert link but doesn't stop you from droping the link that we can copy/paste as long as you proove your point about people liking your idea. (it's Internet, can't trust what people say without proof even if it's harmless)
You only addressed 2 of the 5 options I provided for dealing with that minor issue with the gametype. That's the toxicity. Hating on the idea without actually reading the things I've said. I added to the original post with a clearly flagged edit, and made a comment that directed you back to read that section.

I'm getting really done with this forum, to be honest, so I don't care much to go beyond this last comment. And I definitely care enough to provide you with a link to a thread on another forum that I'll be hard pressed to find in the first place. YouTube doesn't exactly make it easy to search for past conversations, and my notifications on there are far too active to scroll through for over an hour just to find a conversation from over a week ago. A conversation that won't change your mind anyway.

Tell me, Why should I think that seeing other people say that they like the idea sway your negative mood after you've already ignore 3 of the 5 options for the issue you're pushing, and already given disingenuous feedback saying it would basically just be Fiesta or regular arena mode? This mode would drastically change the way the game is played from regular arena modes because it would become a game of preservation and hunting down the power weapons from enemy hands rather than from the map, and it would not necessarily have random weapons for those that don't have campaign save files to pull from. From start to finish the game would be about hunting for people to steal weapons from, rather than trying to get weapons off the map based on respawn timers. This is nothing like any previous Halo arena gametype.

Like, your whole argument is based on not reading the entire original post for its merits, ignoring the flow of conversation and me addressing your complains, and then Yoinking! on the idea relentlessly like you know what you're talking about. That's called negativity, and it's 100% toxic behavior. You don't know what you're talking about if you didn't read the edit I made to the original post, since the idea in the original post is the topic at hand and lists 5 options of which you only read about 2 and gave up trying to understand the gametype.

So I'm done here, and I don't think I like what I've seen of this forum's community enough to come back. It's just Borins Syndrome toxicity, and I don't like it.
You only addressed 2 of the 5 options I provided for dealing with that minor issue with the gametype. That's the toxicity. Hating on the idea without actually reading the things I've said. I added to the original post with a clearly flagged edit, and made a comment that directed you back to read that section.

I'm getting really done with this forum, to be honest, so I don't care much to go beyond this last comment. And I definitely care enough to provide you with a link to a thread on another forum that I'll be hard pressed to find in the first place. YouTube doesn't exactly make it easy to search for past conversations, and my notifications on there are far too active to scroll through for over an hour just to find a conversation from over a week ago. A conversation that won't change your mind anyway.

Tell me, Why should I think that seeing other people say that they like the idea sway your negative mood after you've already ignore 3 of the 5 options for the issue you're pushing, and already given disingenuous feedback saying it would basically just be Fiesta or regular arena mode? This mode would drastically change the way the game is played from regular arena modes because it would become a game of preservation and hunting down the power weapons from enemy hands rather than from the map, and it would not necessarily have random weapons for those that don't have campaign save files to pull from. From start to finish the game would be about hunting for people to steal weapons from, rather than trying to get weapons off the map based on respawn timers. This is nothing like any previous Halo arena gametype.

Like, your whole argument is based on not reading the entire original post for its merits, ignoring the flow of conversation and me addressing your complains, and then Yoinking! on the idea relentlessly like you know what you're talking about. That's called negativity, and it's 100% toxic behavior. You don't know what you're talking about if you didn't read the edit I made to the original post, since the idea in the original post is the topic at hand and lists 5 options of which you only read about 2 and gave up trying to understand the gametype.

So I'm done here, and I don't think I like what I've seen of this forum's community enough to come back. It's just Borins Syndrome toxicity, and I don't like it.
Hunting people who have Power Weapons and preserving it when you have it just like in regular arena when you want the ennemy to lose it's advantage or don't have any.

The ideas for those that don't have campaign:
- Same loadout as someone on the same game, still random because you don't know what the other have (worse if they forgot that they didn't have good weapon last time they played Campaign)
- random loadout made by 343i still random
- Use save file from another player = random
- give them decent loadout = AR/BR or AR/DMR (if it's in the game) is medium level loadout for me cause AR is good at close range and BR or DMR is good at long range so normal loadout of normal arena
- close the gametype for those that didn't buy campaign = yeah it really is a good idea (I'm being Ironic in case you didn't understand)

Again I don't see the point of you're idea. It's just regular arena but with a different start and apparently no power weapons spawn except those you start with (where you get ammo then?)

But I wonder if you will read this, after all you're done with us and we are so toxic that we don't want understand your idea or say we like it when we don't and have reasons and the right to not like it.
Why comment if you're just going to ignore what I wrote? How many people are going to come in here and assume that players without campaign are going to 100% get random loadouts? I'm seriously wondering why this is the hill you've all chosen to stand on and ignore that I've given half a dozen different options for handling players without campaign. Seriously, this gametype is nothing like Fiesta, and you can't get an experience exactly like this gametype in any Halo to date. This gametype idea has its own merits outside of how players without campaign are handled.

I continue to get nothing but positive responses in the YouTube comments, and nothing but negativity here from people that don't seem to want to read the alternatives to random loadouts for the occasional odd player out that won't own campaign. Is this forum's community this toxic all the time, not reading before commenting unwarranted negativity, or did I just get unlucky here?

Like, I'm new to the Waypoint forums, and I don't think I want to stick around after this BS.
There's some polarization but most of the times people try to be constructive as possible to avoid any misshapens. Although misconceptions can happen.

So just to clarify on your idea to avoid any confusion, players will be geared with whatever current loadout they have in campaign (players who don't have access to campaign will get a similar player's loadout or somewhat of equal balance) and once that player is killed, you won't get the nice gear incentivizing players to track down people with the power weapons. (You

And it WON'T be exactly like picking a loadout as you've mentioned
Quote:
ammo count would carry over too, so keeping your save file at peak fighting capacity with specific weapons would be harder than you might think. It would likely be either "the weapons you want", or "full ammo at the start", and it would be very difficult to accomplish both at the same time
Essentially the goal of the game mode is for players to hunt down the person with the power weapon instead of controlling a map piece (exception is for ammo refill places)
It feels a bit like juggernaut, 4v4, and you could say super fiesta was mushed up all into one game mode.

I don't think the concept is bad, there are a few nitpicks but I feel like addressing them at this point will be just redundant, sometime later I'll revisit this post add on to your idea.
I would like to see some Halo story themed big team battle modes. It would be awesome if they had 50 vs 50 and you had to activate a Halo so it would be sort of a tower defense mode.
You only addressed 2 of the 5 options I provided for dealing with that minor issue with the gametype. That's the toxicity. Hating on the idea without actually reading the things I've said. I added to the original post with a clearly flagged edit, and made a comment that directed you back to read that section.

I'm getting really done with this forum, to be honest, so I don't care much to go beyond this last comment. And I definitely care enough to provide you with a link to a thread on another forum that I'll be hard pressed to find in the first place. YouTube doesn't exactly make it easy to search for past conversations, and my notifications on there are far too active to scroll through for over an hour just to find a conversation from over a week ago. A conversation that won't change your mind anyway.

Tell me, Why should I think that seeing other people say that they like the idea sway your negative mood after you've already ignore 3 of the 5 options for the issue you're pushing, and already given disingenuous feedback saying it would basically just be Fiesta or regular arena mode? This mode would drastically change the way the game is played from regular arena modes because it would become a game of preservation and hunting down the power weapons from enemy hands rather than from the map, and it would not necessarily have random weapons for those that don't have campaign save files to pull from. From start to finish the game would be about hunting for people to steal weapons from, rather than trying to get weapons off the map based on respawn timers. This is nothing like any previous Halo arena gametype.

Like, your whole argument is based on not reading the entire original post for its merits, ignoring the flow of conversation and me addressing your complains, and then Yoinking! on the idea relentlessly like you know what you're talking about. That's called negativity, and it's 100% toxic behavior. You don't know what you're talking about if you didn't read the edit I made to the original post, since the idea in the original post is the topic at hand and lists 5 options of which you only read about 2 and gave up trying to understand the gametype.

So I'm done here, and I don't think I like what I've seen of this forum's community enough to come back. It's just Borins Syndrome toxicity, and I don't like it.
If you come here expecting only praise for a quite simple idea I am not sure if you were raised as a spoiled brat or if you just think this is such an amazing idea that no one can have a different opinion on it. People are allowed to say their thoughts and opinions, its not toxicity, I read your post and yes its a unique idea but not groundbreaking enough that everyone will support it when it is basing off other gametypes or if you didnt mean to base it, merely reflecting other gametypes. Also you mentioned that you dont want to find the comments yet earlier you said the idea continues to get support on youtube. In your original post you literally asked "let me know that you think about it!" If you didnt want to hear our doubts or concerns you could've said "only post if you think its good!" And if you wont be coming back because you cant handle some criticism that int shaming the idea or saying its trash then I say good riddance!
Castle Wars and one mode where there is a lot of players (more than warzone 24)
Quote:
CapableClover39:
Essentially the goal of the game mode is for players to hunt down the person with the power weapon instead of controlling a map piece (exception is for ammo refill places)
It feels a bit like juggernaut, 4v4, and you could say super fiesta was mushed up all into one game mode.
So this whole time I've been having to explain the same thing over and over because people have been ignoring half of my post, and haven't gotten to mention some of the new ideas I had for it. I'm glad someone is interested, so I'll fill you in on some of my new additions.

For example, I think it might be cool to include a waypoint beacon on any starting weapon that a player drops. This may only apply to power weapons, but I'm not sure if that's necessary. I also realized that if a starting weapon falls off the map, it will just be gone, and greifers would take advantage of this. To prevent this I'll change it so that those weapons would actually respawn, but only after despawning by a killzone or by leaving a safe zone, and would appear at one or two special respawn locations like stockpiles around the map. They might be the ammo supply locations I mentioned in my OP, or they may be different locations because these would be extra cool if they drop in weapon drop pods. They could just spawn onto the map, but drop pods are cool when used sparingly.

With these additions the game type is like you said, a sort of mechanical mix of several game types into slayer through organic additions and alterations to the base Slayer format.

It's like Juggernaut like you said, because the other players will be hunting the power weapons. But with these additions the weapon drops with the waypoints become like king of the hill zones that you can take when you survive grabbing the weapon. When weapons do fall off the map and return to the drop zones, those become like king of the hill zones as well.

I also realize that the haters are now asking where you get new ammo even though I already mentioned the answer to that in the original post. You seem to have read the whole thing, though. Those resupply locations add another gametype to the mix. Since the resupply spots would be static, they'd almost be like territories, rather than the crazy king-like weapon waypoints. Which just inspired some more specific ideas for them that I'll explain below.

If the ammo resupply spots were team dependent so that they only resupplied the team in control of them, but any team could capture them, that would work very well with all of these other ideas, I think. So the ammo resupply locations would be on cooldowns, and the teams would be trying to keep them under control for their team to stay fully stocked on ammo. Every time a resupply cools down, two resupply locations would cool down at the same time at different locations across the map to prevent one team from being able to completely dominate those locations very easily, and I'd say most maps would have 4 or 6 in total that cycle 2 or 3 at a time. And after cooling down a resupply location will resupply each player on its controlling team up to one time, but if you manage to steal one for your team before the same resupply point cools down again, then each of your teammates can also resupply once. But a stolen resupply location is weaker than one you controlled at the moment of the cooldown. After changing hands it's always only half as potent, meaning half the ammo is given, up until it cools down again. The actual amount of ammo would need to be tuned by the devs, but I imagine may be something like two clips for each weapon you're holding, and one for each weapon if your team stole the supply point. And maybe grenades are some of the few weapons on the map to keep the resupply locations simpler.

This would also serve to keep players moving so they don't camp on top of power weapons they aren't using. Instead they will be heading toward the next resupply location to get more rockets, or what have you.

This would create a sort of dance across the map, hunting for well equipped players, retrieving fallen power weapons, watching for the resupply cooldowns, capturing resupply locations to maximize potential ammo from it, etc. It's still a Halo waltz, but it's not the same dance steps as regular Slayer by any stroke of a hater's imagination.

That's just how I see the ammo thing, though. I admit it's pretty complicated, but aside from the restrictions on how many times each player can use it, I could build something almost like this in Halo 2A forge using switches and timers right now. Mine wouldn't work 100% as I described, but it would be close. And if I can make it in Halo 2A Forge, then 343 can make it with access to the source code even easier. And actually, I'm gonna do that in a new Forge map to play on the CGB when it releases. It won't be this gametype, but it'll still be a fun map feature.

Spoiler:
Show
Quote:
CapableClover39:
Essentially the goal of the game mode is for players to hunt down the person with the power weapon instead of controlling a map piece (exception is for ammo refill places)
It feels a bit like juggernaut, 4v4, and you could say super fiesta was mushed up all into one game mode.
So this whole time I've been having to explain the same thing over and over because people have been ignoring half of my post, and haven't gotten to mention some of the new ideas I had for it. I'm glad someone is interested, so I'll fill you in on some of my new additions.

For example, I think it might be cool to include a waypoint beacon on any starting weapon that a player drops. This may only apply to power weapons, but I'm not sure if that's necessary. I also realized that if a starting weapon falls off the map, it will just be gone, and greifers would take advantage of this. To prevent this I'll change it so that those weapons would actually respawn, but only after despawning by a killzone or by leaving a safe zone, and would appear at one or two special respawn locations like stockpiles around the map. They might be the ammo supply locations I mentioned in my OP, or they may be different locations because these would be extra cool if they drop in weapon drop pods. They could just spawn onto the map, but drop pods are cool when used sparingly.

With these additions the game type is like you said, a sort of mechanical mix of several game types into slayer through organic additions and alterations to the base Slayer format.

It's like Juggernaut like you said, because the other players will be hunting the power weapons. But with these additions the weapon drops with the waypoints become like king of the hill zones that you can take when you survive grabbing the weapon. When weapons do fall off the map and return to the drop zones, those become like king of the hill zones as well.

I also realize that the haters are now asking where you get new ammo even though I already mentioned the answer to that in the original post. You seem to have read the whole thing, though. Those resupply locations add another gametype to the mix. Since the resupply spots would be static, they'd almost be like territories, rather than the crazy king-like weapon waypoints. Which just inspired some more specific ideas for them that I'll explain below.

If the ammo resupply spots were team dependent so that they only resupplied the team in control of them, but any team could capture them, that would work very well with all of these other ideas, I think. So the ammo resupply locations would be on cooldowns, and the teams would be trying to keep them under control for their team to stay fully stocked on ammo. Every time a resupply cools down, two resupply locations would cool down at the same time at different locations across the map to prevent one team from being able to completely dominate those locations very easily, and I'd say most maps would have 4 or 6 in total that cycle 2 or 3 at a time. And after cooling down a resupply location will resupply each player on its controlling team up to one time, but if you manage to steal one for your team before the same resupply point cools down again, then each of your teammates can also resupply once. But a stolen resupply location is weaker than one you controlled at the moment of the cooldown. After changing hands it's always only half as potent, meaning half the ammo is given, up until it cools down again. The actual amount of ammo would need to be tuned by the devs, but I imagine may be something like two clips for each weapon you're holding, and one for each weapon if your team stole the supply point. And maybe grenades are some of the few weapons on the map to keep the resupply locations simpler.

This would also serve to keep players moving so they don't camp on top of power weapons they aren't using. Instead they will be heading toward the next resupply location to get more rockets, or what have you.

This would create a sort of dance across the map, hunting for well equipped players, retrieving fallen power weapons, watching for the resupply cooldowns, capturing resupply locations to maximize potential ammo from it, etc. It's still a Halo waltz, but it's not the same dance steps as regular Slayer by any stroke of a hater's imagination.

That's just how I see the ammo thing, though. I admit it's pretty complicated, but aside from the restrictions on how many times each player can use it, I could build something almost like this in Halo 2A forge using switches and timers right now. Mine wouldn't work 100% as I described, but it would be close. And if I can make it in Halo 2A Forge, then 343 can make it with access to the source code even easier. And actually, I'm gonna do that in a new Forge map to play on the CGB when it releases. It won't be this gametype, but it'll still be a fun map feature.

Spoiler:
Show
Now that you put more features into it that would actually work, it looks like a pretty fun game type. I still dont know why you think we are haters though for just saying our opinion and even at that no one said it was a stupid idea just that it wasnt implemented as good as it could be like you did just now. :/
gei89 wrote:
Quote:
[My stuff]
Now that you put more features into it that would actually work, it looks like a pretty fun game type. I still dont know why you think we are haters though for just saying our opinion and even at that no one said it was a stupid idea just that it wasnt implemented as good as it could be like you did just now. :/
I might have been over reacting, but it felt like hating because it was about 10 comments in a row that were all just the same exact thing with no constructive criticism after the first person that mentioned the "players without campaign" issue.

Like, don't get me wrong, JoeySTRIKE had a to-the-point criticism that wasn't inherently negative from the start, and was constructive because it needed to be addressed. I loved that comment. But everyone else seemed to just dogpile the same criticism in an increasingly negative tone over and over. I kept expecting someone to bring in some constructive feedback or even just positive vibes, but it was just negativity, and not just that but the same exact negative post being quoted and piled onto over and over. If everyone just points out the same issue like that in a continuous negative tone, it just feels like ganging up and shooting down an idea that I feel has solid potential, which feels like people just being haters.

But anyway, I'm glad you and CapableClover39 are the game type it!

I'd love if we could get the rest of the thread back on track to brainstorm more cool additions or tweaks to the original idea, and that I could keep the main post updated with the changes over time, slowly honing in on a golden idea. I feel like it's at a good silver place at this point, and may be for a while longer, but with further improvements we could bring it to a conceptually finished gold standard.

For example:
  • We still don't have a name for it yet. That's important.
  • It lacks a specific list of weapons to spawn on the map. I said low tier + grenades, but gave no specifics.
  • We haven't gone over the deployable equipment that 343 is bringing back and expanding on from Halo 3. That gear is expendable, so it might need to spawn on the map. Would there just be equipment like that on the map, or would it be possible to respawn your spent equipment at of your initial spawn location once used?
  • We also haven't gone over the staples of Halo to see if they should be adjusted or left alone like the motion tracker and shields. Like should you start with extra shields on your first life since everyone probably has power weapons, or just leave it alone to encourage power weapon mayhem?
  • And other stuff I'm not even thinking of.
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