Forums / Games / Halo Infinite

The return of classic movement mechanics?

OP A So So Sniper

  1. 1
  2. ...
  3. 166
  4. 167
  5. 168
  6. 169
  7. 170
  8. ...
  9. 202
Heck no we do not need the return of classic mobility. We're playing as Spartans for -Yoink- sake. If I can sprint and clamber in the real world there is no logical reason Spartans in Halo games shouldn't be able to as well. It made sense back in 2007 and before when gameplay mechanics weren't as advanced, but anymore it makes no sense to not include basic mechanics like sprint and clamber.
Prone, and corner lean....
Advanced melee...

Pretty sure everything you've got in Halo 5 was possible in 2007, and earlier.
I mean, Lara Croft was clambering in, 96? For instance.
Heck no we do not need the return of classic mobility. We're playing as Spartans for -Yoink- sake. If I can sprint and clamber in the real world there is no logical reason Spartans in Halo games shouldn't be able to as well. It made sense back in 2007 and before when gameplay mechanics weren't as advanced, but anymore it makes no sense to not include basic mechanics like sprint and clamber.
You don't respawn when you die in the real world.
Also I think that sprint solves a major problem that I had with Bungie's games...Dual Wielding. One thing that always set me off was that someone holding two guns at once could run at top speed with two guns and aim perfectly, it upset balance dramatically, making it so that a guy with two SMG's could DECIMATE a guy that was holding a BR. Sprint could be the break that we have been waiting for, the ability to build a bridge between the old and new worlds of Halo. While the old fans could complain and whine about Sprint, they also have to love that it allows balance to the long loved mechanic Dual Wielding. The way this would work is that SMG is only a little bit weaker than the bigger rifles on its own, but when matched with a little bro, reload time becomes slightly slower, transition from sprint to ready to fire is slightly slower, and kick becomes slightly bigger. Notice how I said slightly for everyone of them? That's because, even if Dual Wielding is stronger and gives more ammo to a firefight, too many restrictions results in nobody smart doing it anyway, remember we are looking for balance.

Anyway, those were some ideas I had that I thought might be interesting.
Heck no we do not need the return of classic mobility. We're playing as Spartans for -Yoink- sake. If I can sprint and clamber in the real world there is no logical reason Spartans in Halo games shouldn't be able to as well. It made sense back in 2007 and before when gameplay mechanics weren't as advanced, but anymore it makes no sense to not include basic mechanics like sprint and clamber.
Forgive me, but what exactly about Sprint is "advanced"? In the same comment you said it's a basic mechanic but it was too advanced for the 2007 era?

Sprint is older than the Halo series. GTA 3 came out shortly before Halo CE and it had Sprint.
If I can sprint and clamber in the real world there is no logical reason Spartans in Halo games shouldn't be able to as well.
Of course there is, you said it yourself: Halo is a game. It doesn't have to adhere to the real world.

It made sense back in 2007 and before when gameplay mechanics weren't as advanced, but anymore it makes no sense to not include basic mechanics like sprint and clamber.
It made sense back in 2007 and before when motion controls weren't as advanced to make a game without motion controls. But now it makes no sense to not have Halo Infinite be Kinect exclusive. Do you find this reasoning compelling? Because I don't, but it's the exact reasoning you're using.

I mean, if you see game design as a soulless pursuit of realism, technology, and novelty, good for you. I don't. I see it as a creative exploration of fun and engaging experiences. It is helped by technological advancement, but the moment people start believing that some mechanic is mandatory is when creativity dies.

On a side note, sprint in its modern form appeared at least as early as 2001 in GTA III. Climbing ledges appeared in probably many games in the 90's, incuding Super Mario 64, and Tomb Raider (both 1996). I just want us all to be on the same page that we are, in fact, discussing twenty year old gameplay mechanics, and not some marvels of modern technology.
Heck no we do not need the return of classic mobility. We're playing as Spartans for -Yoink- sake. If I can sprint and clamber in the real world there is no logical reason Spartans in Halo games shouldn't be able to as well. It made sense back in 2007 and before when gameplay mechanics weren't as advanced, but anymore it makes no sense to not include basic mechanics like sprint and clamber.
Should we also be able to cook grenades, do backflips, drop our weapons and fight bare handed etc? Does the realism argument only apply to mechanics that you want in the game or should Halo strive to be as realistic as possible?
No I'm not saying the game should be 100% realistic but you should be able to do basic movements that a Spartan should be more than capable of. I do think some Spartan abilities should be removed, especially Spartan charge, but sprint and clamber should be kept at the very least. They could even reduce the clamber like in modern warfare, it just needs to at least stay in the game at some level in my opinion. I also would like to see prone be added and reduced punch damage (Spartans should not die from 1 or 2 punches) and definitely they need to change the water situation. Spartans should not die in 4 foot deep water like in Halo 4 and 5! I do think some classic features should return but I just don't want Halo infinite to be too much like classic halo.
No I'm not saying the game should be 100% realistic but you should be able to do basic movements that a Spartan should be more than capable of. I do think some Spartan abilities should be removed, especially Spartan charge, but sprint and clamber should be kept at the very least. They could even reduce the clamber like in modern warfare, it just needs to at least stay in the game at some level in my opinion. I also would like to see prone be added and reduced punch damage (Spartans should not die from 1 or 2 punches) and definitely they need to change the water situation. Spartans should not die in 4 foot deep water like in Halo 4 and 5! I do think some classic features should return but I just don't want Halo infinite to be too much like classic halo.
Lets all just remember the FPS game that is considered modern that has clamber, dash, climb, and swing. Doom Eternal seems to have worked out without sprint as did Doom 2016. But Doom did not have a fan base that really wants dual wield, and as I have stated before I view that one must choose between a cleaner Doom style motion or dual wield. While I do not need spartan abilities, doom style wall/pole climbing, I feel that dash should be added and MAYBE sprint if we want dual wielding. But as I said, Doom feels modern, yet has no sprint.
they also have to love that it allows balance to the long loved mechanic Dual Wielding.
Is Dual Wielding even such a big deal to anyone?
pretending that keeping sprint to include Dual Wielding would be compromise seems far fetched...
Watch these videos. Come back to the thread and then you can give your opinion. EDIT: Unfortunately, I cannot figure out how to hyperlink these videos.

Duel-Wielding

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXBvMIM5cc8

The Benefits of a NO SPRINT Halo! How Movement/Mobility affects more than just Speed!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJ1cAra_CrA

How to Innovate Halo Without Changing its Formula

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yz9GA6oTWTY

Why Halo Struggles to Evolve

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHUSlPq5Nag

All excellent videos made by Favyn that explain what's different from Modern and Classic Halo. Looks at both sides of the fence and makes a lot of compelling arguments for why Classic is better and the way to go. Halo 4 and 5 are good games, but they aren't Halo games. They don't stick out from the crowd and the population numbers show it. 343 trendchased with the latest games in the series and its become a shadow of its former self. No better time than right now to innovate the Classic sandbox and bring Halo back like id did with Doom.

I understand those who like the newer games. I did hit cap in Halo 4 and I barely played any of H5G. In fact I didn't even bother beating the campaign because the gameplay was so poor imo. I get that I sound like a super jaded and grumpy old man, but that's because I care. I care a lot about Halo. I have 52 days worth of playtime in Halo 3 alone. There are very few games that I've played that much. In fact only 3 others: WoW, Smite and PUBG. I don't want Halo 3.5. I also don't want Halo 5.5. I want a Classic Halo experience that innovates and makes the game unique while respecting the massive legacy that comes before it. Build around Halo's Golden Triangle. Don't -Yoinking!- smash the pillars in half and try to put up new ones. Guns, grenades, melee. That's all we need the game to be based around.
Quote:
Watch these videos. Come back to the thread and then you can give your opinion. EDIT: Unfortunately, I cannot figure out how to hyperlink these videos.
All excellent videos made by Favyn that explain what's different from Modern and Classic Halo. Looks at both sides of the fence and makes a lot of compelling arguments for why Classic is better and the way to go. Halo 4 and 5 are good games, but they aren't Halo games. They don't stick out from the crowd and the population numbers show it. 343 trendchased with the latest games in the series and its become a shadow of its former self. No better time than right now to innovate the Classic sandbox and bring Halo back like id did with Doom.I understand those who like the newer games. I did hit cap in Halo 4 and I barely played any of H5G. In fact I didn't even bother beating the campaign because the gameplay was so poor imo. I get that I sound like a super jaded and grumpy old man, but that's because I care. I care a lot about Halo. I have 52 days worth of playtime in Halo 3 alone. There are very few games that I've played that much. In fact only 3 others: WoW, Smite and PUBG. I don't want Halo 3.5. I also don't want Halo 5.5. I want a Classic Halo experience that innovates and makes the game unique while respecting the massive legacy that comes before it. Build around Halo's Golden Triangle. Don't -Yoinking!- smash the pillars in half and try to put up new ones. Guns, grenades, melee. That's all we need the game to be based around.
To link an external site (in this case YouTube) copy the address, write the text to show, select it, press the link button in the option bar above and paste the link in the pop-up window! 😉

EDIT: like Celestis down here just said, Recruits can't link outside references. Sorry about that! I did not know!
EDIT 2: Something broke my comment and replaced all rectangular break of the html code with triangular one, fixed it I hope and sorry about that!
To link an external site (in this case YouTube) copy the address, write the text to show, select it, press the link button in the option bar above and paste the link in the pop-up window! 😉
Recruit-ranks cannot use the link-function yet. It's annoying, but that's just how it is.
I think the sprint argument is rather interesting. I strongly dislike the mechanic as it's been implemented in Halo as of late, all it does is slow the game down - forcing you to pull your weapon up and slow down before firing. Let's not beat around the bush, Halo's sprint wasn't implemented because the developers of Reach, 4 or 5 had interesting ideas for it, or genuinely believed in the mechanic bettering Halo - no, it was implemented because every other shooter had it. That doesn't mean it has to be terrible, though, and it makes me think back to a similar arena shooter's implementation of sprint; that being Half-Life 2 and it's sprint mechanics. In Half-Life 2, you have three speeds: walking, running and sprinting. Walking and running are only a smidge slower than their Half-Life 1 counterparts, while running is significantly faster, all the while all sprinting does is just that it makes you run faster. You can still shoot, duck and jump the same as you would running, just you're movement speed is faster, so Half-Life 2 isn't retroactively slowing itself down because of the mechanic, rather it's making you think about combat encounters more carefully if you want to keep your momentum going.

Now how does this apply to Halo? Well in terms of multiplayer, it doesn't. In fact even for campaign you shouldn't copy Valve's homework, it's more-so an example of a game that creatively included the mechanic without copying the CoD template. For multiplayer, sprint does not belong in Halo, period. You either have a Reach situation where your maps aren't designed around everyone sprinting, so people get through set pieces way too quickly and frustrates players without sprint, and players who use it feel confined to such small spaces - then you have the opposite problem with a game designed around sprint, the levels feel needlessly stretched out, where the purpose of sprint is meaningless because you're traversing these larger maps the same equivalent speed as you would the classic maps. That argument is tired and has been done to death, though. Where I think sprint does have a place is in the campaign, so long as you don't design around it. If I were asked to implement sprint in a Halo game, I would have it enabled through a skull. No score multipliers, similar to the purely beneficial skulls in CEA and H2A. You enable the skull, and instead of a flashlight once you push the flashlight key (wherever you decide to bind it) you start sprinting, not in a CoD-like fashion however, instead you start running significantly faster than your base run, all the while maintaining all previous abilities: such as shooting and the like. You have a short period of stamina, if you exhaust all your sprint, you must wait for it to completely recharge before you can sprint again.

Okay, that is a lot of effort put towards a skull, but it's one of the only ways I could see such a mechanic working. You can't make it an option always available because that would force the speedrunning community to conform to sprint, plus it'd be way too tempting to start designing sections around sprint. At the same time a lot of people would love the option, hell I, (a classic Halo fan with zero interest in sprint or any of the advanced mobility) would definitely use it to bypass some more lengthy, less replayable sections. In addition, it'd give you a custom games option, so you could have a classic Halo multiplayer across the board, with options to accommodate modern Halo fans in custom games. Everybody wins! ...Sorta. I'm fully aware that having a few custom games options won't satisfy the tastes of many modern Halo fans, and really truly it isn't fair. Infinite won't be fair to one of the spit sides in the community, and honestly odds are they'll favor the modern fans. In my hypothetical Halo title it'd probably be the reverse, mainly because that's what well... what I would play. If Infinite plays like Halo 5 again, I probably won't play it's multiplayer. I'll run through it's campaign and be done-so, because I don't find advanced movement fun. And that's precisely what I tried accommodating here with this sprint concept, something that isn't necessary, nor is gamebreaking for classic fans - but maybe some fun little extra movement options for modern fans.
it needs to be at least as fast as 5 if not faster. It is really rough going back to 5 after playing games like apex legends where movement is so fluid.
There are a lot more benefits for Infinite to not have sprint and there is none for having sprint.You increase walking speed,keep thrust and add some armor abilities from Halo 3.That's it,perfect movement mechanics.
Well, in my opinion the old mechanics are too slow but u can't go faster than H5 (too fast)... I suggested like a speed boost instead of thrust (like 3 or 4 seconds worth with a recharge).. I played some elimination last night and picked up the speed boost.... It seemed perfect speed to me... I think it's a good idea but.... Who knows...
Well, in my opinion the old mechanics are too slow but u can't go faster than H5 (too fast)... I suggested like a speed boost instead of thrust (like 3 or 4 seconds worth with a recharge).. I played some elimination last night and picked up the speed boost.... It seemed perfect speed to me... I think it's a good idea but.... Who knows...
Why is it too slow,where you want or need to sprint to?You walk quickly and have thrusters to avoid any fast projectiles,also you can stand behind cover,crouch and jump.
Sprinting is just gonna mess with gameplay and enemy AI,it could only be good for speedrunners.
Well, in my opinion the old mechanics are too slow but u can't go faster than H5 (too fast)... I suggested like a speed boost instead of thrust (like 3 or 4 seconds worth with a recharge).. I played some elimination last night and picked up the speed boost.... It seemed perfect speed to me... I think it's a good idea but.... Who knows...
Why is it too slow,where you want or need to sprint to?You walk quickly and have thrusters to avoid any fast projectiles,also you can stand behind cover,crouch and jump.
Sprinting is just gonna mess with gameplay and enemy AI,it could only be good for speedrunners.
Bc kind sir... With no speed increase ability it becomes so much of a team game that solo Q'n is a joke... I learned that from reach.... The individual has to be able to make an impact not just teamshot wins every time...
Well, in my opinion the old mechanics are too slow but u can't go faster than H5 (too fast)... I suggested like a speed boost instead of thrust (like 3 or 4 seconds worth with a recharge).. I played some elimination last night and picked up the speed boost.... It seemed perfect speed to me... I think it's a good idea but.... Who knows...
Why is it too slow,where you want or need to sprint to?You walk quickly and have thrusters to avoid any fast projectiles,also you can stand behind cover,crouch and jump.
Sprinting is just gonna mess with gameplay and enemy AI,it could only be good for speedrunners.
Bc kind sir... With no speed increase ability it becomes so much of a team game that solo Q'n is a joke... I learned that from reach.... The individual has to be able to make an impact not just teamshot wins every time...
If anything having a speed boost makes teamshot even more essential due to the ease in which players can break line of sight. CE is still the fastest paced Halo game which also happens to be the Halo that is the least focused on teamshots. If you want individuals to shine then you want shorter TTK combined with a smooth strafe, and a larger aiming skillgap. Adding "speed boosts" of any kind just causes the the average TTK to get even longer than it is on paper which means the game gets even more teamshot reliant than it already was.
I personally like both classic and enhanced mobility game play...
If infinite has enhanced mobility It needs to have a simple setting in custom games for switching between classic and enhanced mobility game play...
  1. 1
  2. ...
  3. 166
  4. 167
  5. 168
  6. 169
  7. 170
  8. ...
  9. 202