Forums / Games / Halo Infinite

The return of classic movement mechanics?

OP A So So Sniper

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tsassi wrote:
BTB Bill wrote:
To regain (and sustain) any type of popularity, Halo infinite needs to return to classic movement style.
[citation needed]
Okay let me rephrase. THE BEST CHANCE, Halo infinite has to regain and sustain popularity is to return to classic movement style.

We all know halo games with “modern” movement cant sustain a high level of population. It’s been tried and has failed.
BTB Bill wrote:
tsassi wrote:
BTB Bill wrote:
To regain (and sustain) any type of popularity, Halo infinite needs to return to classic movement style.
[citation needed]
Okay let me rephrase. THE BEST CHANCE, Halo infinite has to regain and sustain popularity is to return to classic movement style.

We all know halo games with “modern” movement cant sustain a high level of population. It’s been tried and has failed.
You still didn’t cite anything though. I have no problem finding games in Halo 5 four and a half years after it came out.
BTB Bill wrote:
tsassi wrote:
BTB Bill wrote:
To regain (and sustain) any type of popularity, Halo infinite needs to return to classic movement style.
[citation needed]
Okay let me rephrase. THE BEST CHANCE, Halo infinite has to regain and sustain popularity is to return to classic movement style.

We all know halo games with “modern” movement cant sustain a high level of population. It’s been tried and has failed.
Is it because of the "modern" movement style? That's the part you keep overlooking.

Games without Sergeant Johnson are also received poorly. He was released as DLC for Halo Wars 2 and people liked it again.

Therefore the best chance for Halo to be popular again is to bring back Johnson permanently.
In my opinion, this game has a really high chance of bringing back the classic gameplay so many old Halo fans have adored! I am so pumped for this!
The addition of Sprint as a static ability turned me off. Halo never needed it, same as Counter-Strike doesn't need it. If Sprint is gone in Infinite, I'm right back in.
Removing sprint, increasing base movement speed, and keeping thrust is the best and probably ONLY viable solution to the split fanbase sprint issue. I'll explain my reasoning as I understand both sides of the argument. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

Reasoning for pro-sprint: game feels faster and more fun to move, adds an additional layer of strategy (sacrifice shooting for speed), modernity appeals to large gaming population

Reasoning for no-sprint: sprint negatively affects map design, sprint breaks game flow by interrupting shooting, sprint can act as a get-out-of-jail-free card

Why my solution mostly works: increasing BMS, FOV and keeping thrusts will retain a fast game feel and—if the thrust is done well—moving around will feel fun and fluid. Map design won't be influenced by sprint, and the base movement speed increase won't be so drastic as to result in oversized maps.

Compromise will need to be had on both sides. With a fanbase so seemingly split down the middle, a one-or-the-other approach doesn't seem right to me. My idea is one that checks as many boxes on both sides as possible. I'd be interested to hear on either side why this wouldn't work and how it could be improved/what would be better.
I've been back and forth many years on whether I want classic through and through movement or have sprint. The game will have whatever it will have right? but I just want the game to be really good both story and multiplayer wise and correct me if I am wrong but that is the general consensus that 343i has not been able to do yet releasing a new Halo. Just my thoughts.
Reasoning for pro-sprint: game feels faster and more fun to move, adds an additional layer of strategy (sacrifice shooting for speed), modernity appeals to large gaming population
Over 40 million Overwatch players, over 20 million Counter-Strike players. Popular during modern times but do not include sprinting. Also no aiming down sights, only scopes. Halo can be popular and appealing without sprint.

I agree with compromise, but I feel it's essential to delete sprint for Halo. I'd be fine with higher base speed. If 343 is stubborn on making Halo "competitive", then look to what MLG did for Halo 3 and up the base speed to 110%. That still looks fine.
Reasoning for pro-sprint: game feels faster and more fun to move, adds an additional layer of strategy (sacrifice shooting for speed), modernity appeals to large gaming population
Over 40 million Overwatch players, over 20 million Counter-Strike players. Popular during modern times but do not include sprinting. Also no aiming down sights, only scopes. Halo can be popular and appealing without sprint.

I agree with compromise, but I feel it's essential to delete sprint for Halo. I'd be fine with higher base speed. If 343 is stubborn on making Halo "competitive", then look to what MLG did for Halo 3 and up the base speed to 110%. That still looks fine.
Overwatch has so many other mechanics it's really nonsense to compare. CS OTOH I would agree.
As in we all have to walk around really slowly and such?
No. As in the game is designed to keep you moving at a fast pace all the time. Sprint slows down games.
Reasoning for pro-sprint: game feels faster and more fun to move, adds an additional layer of strategy (sacrifice shooting for speed), modernity appeals to large gaming population
Over 40 million Overwatch players, over 20 million Counter-Strike players. Popular during modern times but do not include sprinting. Also no aiming down sights, only scopes. Halo can be popular and appealing without sprint.

I agree with you. In my mind sprint ≠ modern, but many Halo fans seem to feel that way and prefer sprint for that reason among others. The split to me seems to be those who want the movement to be grounded, stable, and methodical versus those who want it to be freer, rapid, and dynamic. Sprint isn't the only issue at play here if you also consider clamber and whatnot, but sprint seems to be the wedge issue. I guess my biggest question is whether the preference for sprint is based on reasonable gameplay purposes or preferred "feel."
Reasoning for pro-sprint: game feels faster and more fun to move, adds an additional layer of strategy (sacrifice shooting for speed), modernity appeals to large gaming population
Over 40 million Overwatch players, over 20 million Counter-Strike players. Popular during modern times but do not include sprinting. Also no aiming down sights, only scopes. Halo can be popular and appealing without sprint.

I agree with compromise, but I feel it's essential to delete sprint for Halo. I'd be fine with higher base speed. If 343 is stubborn on making Halo "competitive", then look to what MLG did for Halo 3 and up the base speed to 110%. That still looks fine.
Overwatch has so many other mechanics it's really nonsense to compare. CS OTOH I would agree.
The point is, is that it's a hyper-popular game that's an FPS, and also doesn't feature Sprint or any other Advanced Movement mechanics (except possibly Teleports as part of Supers)
I'd like them to take away ground pound and spartan charge, but keep boosts, ads and sprinting simply because that's a fair balance of new and old, and because it makes more sense. For example imagine spending millions of pounds on a spartan but they cant even use the sights of a gun or even run, I would also like to see them add the ability to swim, or at least swim with a specialised suit, as again it just makes more sense, this could be added to the game in a power up or even by having selectable loadouts, having selectable loadouts would be awesome because it gives us more freedom on how we play the game, the customisation of guns would also be pretty cool as then another aspect is added to the game that make it more strategically based, however this would stray away from the original games but it is no longer Bungie in charge and this would be a good way to set 343 on its own path with Halo rather than coping what has already been done.
Reasoning for pro-sprint: game feels faster and more fun to move, adds an additional layer of strategy (sacrifice shooting for speed), modernity appeals to large gaming population
Over 40 million Overwatch players, over 20 million Counter-Strike players. Popular during modern times but do not include sprinting. Also no aiming down sights, only scopes. Halo can be popular and appealing without sprint.

I agree with compromise, but I feel it's essential to delete sprint for Halo. I'd be fine with higher base speed. If 343 is stubborn on making Halo "competitive", then look to what MLG did for Halo 3 and up the base speed to 110%. That still looks fine.
Over 60 million players play Call of Duty Warzone which has sprint. God knows how many more people play Fortnite which also has sprint. If we're going to have a popularity contest - more successful games feature sprint than those without.
For example imagine spending millions of pounds on a spartan but they cant even use the sights of a gun or even run
You put a severely augmented human being with increased strength and reflexes in an exoskeleton which further increases that being's physical capabilities, yet the exoskeleton can't for all it's advanced tech, allow the user to keep their gun up at all speeds?
Also, as we're talking advanced suits.
A spartan doesn't need to use the sights. See the crosshair on your HUD? Which is roughly at the center of the screen? That's what the spartan see. It's like a laser sight.

I would also like to see them add the ability to swim, or at least swim with a specialised suit, as again it just makes more sense
That specialised suit wouldn't be armor.
It'd be light body protection.
Your spartan's density is far higher than that of water.
Heck, I'm even uncertain if a Spartan II would actually be able to swim after agumentation, without a suit.
Fat float as its density is lighter than water, a Spartan does not have much body fat I'd imagine, and they've got an augmentation which increases muscle density further.
Then there's the skeletal coating, if that'd affect the density or not.

this could be added to the game in a power up
Very few games provide water combat, and here's the question, what exactly would swiming provide Halo?

or even by having selectable loadouts, having selectable loadouts would be awesome because it gives us more freedom on how we play the game, the customisation of guns would also be pretty cool as then another aspect is added to the game that make it more strategically based
We already had that to some degree in Halo: Reach, and then more in Halo 4, those didn't go down too well with the community.
The "freedom of how we play" is questionable at best, as you'd have to have some some Hero shooter style loadouts for that to be closer to the truth, as loadouts in previous Halo games have had you grounded in the same gameplay mechanics with some slight changes here and there carefully applied through the loadouts. Sure, Armor Lock vs Jet Pack game styles are most likely somewhat different, but that would be nothing compared to say, Mercy gameplay vs Hanzo in Overwatch, and I've probably played a total of 3-4 hours of that game.

The strategical aspect of Loadouts is also questionable.

however this would stray away from the original games but it is no longer Bungie in charge and this would be a good way to set 343 on its own path with Halo rather than coping what has already been done.
Myes, the irony is rather heavy here.
i343 was created by Microsoft to continue the development of further Halo games, one would expect that if Microsoft would've liked some other IP created, then a new IP would've been created. Now of course, it's not about the game, it's about the money, that much was clear after Halo 4, and the development story that's been told regarding i343's first Halo build.

Now, i343 have an issue with having its own path for Halo.
For Reach they made an update which changed quite a lot for what many believe was for the better, like the No Bloom part, and the Armor Lock nerf, and so forth.
Yet, with Halo 4 they made a u-turn and took it to "modern shooter" town, after that, with Halo 5 they steered in on another road, abandoning quite a few of the concepts they had going for them in Halo 4. Before you blame the "nostalgia tards" and our feedback, keep in mind that i343 is under no obligation to follow any of that feedback, they could've easily doubled down on Halo 4 with even more new stuff.

As for "copying what's been done".
You suggested loadouts, we've had that, and it was largely removed.
Halo 4 copied, and altered a little, of what modern shooters was about in that time and age. No, CoD didn't invent these features, but pretty much every addition and change in Halo 4, can be found in some way or form in CoD, down to Grenade Indicators, Perks and Flinch.

There aren't actually many who speak for a new Halo game which is a carbon copy of any of the older ones.
Merely that the devs take the classic Halo gameplay, and use that as a base, while not going with this "modern stuff" ( sprint isn't that modern to be honest ), or otherwise following trends.
Mario Kart isn't becoming Forza Horizons, Gran Turismo or whatever other popular driving games there are.

You'll find more games failing after abandoning what they were from the start, copying popular games of their time, than you'll find succesful ones that did the same thing.
Reasoning for pro-sprint: game feels faster and more fun to move, adds an additional layer of strategy (sacrifice shooting for speed), modernity appeals to large gaming population
Over 40 million Overwatch players, over 20 million Counter-Strike players. Popular during modern times but do not include sprinting. Also no aiming down sights, only scopes. Halo can be popular and appealing without sprint.

I agree with compromise, but I feel it's essential to delete sprint for Halo. I'd be fine with higher base speed. If 343 is stubborn on making Halo "competitive", then look to what MLG did for Halo 3 and up the base speed to 110%. That still looks fine.
Over 60 million players play Call of Duty Warzone which has sprint. God knows how many more people play Fortnite which also has sprint. If we're going to have a popularity contest - more successful games feature sprint than those without.
The point is that games without sprint can be and are popular, and this is important to bring up because some people seem to be convinced that new games need to have sprint to be successful despite mountains of evidence to the contrary.

How many games make sprint work is irrelevant because it doesn't mean that it will work in every game, and specifically with the case of Halo sprint has caused numerous issues and has caused a split in the playerbase that did not exist with the earlier games despite new mechanics being added with each game.
There is absolutely no way this game won't have the classic gameplay
That's purely speculation. Making assumptions like this is goofy at best.
the oldest of Halo fans have adored! I am so pumped for this!
I think the first part of this statement is biased based on the second part. There are plenty of older Halo fans that like the new mechanics.
At first I didn’t really mind the new abilities but now I’m just super sick of them. They only added them to continue the enhanced mobility trend a lot of shooters used to follow. Halo needs to be unique again by bringing back the classic gameplay
True that, Halo 5/4's gameplay seemed a bit to much too like modern FPS games. It could use a little more of its own unique style.
Reasoning for pro-sprint: game feels faster and more fun to move, adds an additional layer of strategy (sacrifice shooting for speed), modernity appeals to large gaming population
Over 40 million Overwatch players, over 20 million Counter-Strike players. Popular during modern times but do not include sprinting. Also no aiming down sights, only scopes. Halo can be popular and appealing without sprint.

I agree with compromise, but I feel it's essential to delete sprint for Halo. I'd be fine with higher base speed. If 343 is stubborn on making Halo "competitive", then look to what MLG did for Halo 3 and up the base speed to 110%. That still looks fine.
Over 60 million players play Call of Duty Warzone which has sprint. God knows how many more people play Fortnite which also has sprint. If we're going to have a popularity contest - more successful games feature sprint than those without.
Halo tried to be like other games and failed. It's been tried and tested three times with more and more players abandoning the series. Halo started declining with sprint, not the lack thereof, though sprint wasn't the only cause. It's time to go back to what worked.
I know I commented on here some time ago (can't find my comment) but one small thing to take note of is in the Discovery Hope trailer, if you noticed the way John placed his Assault rifle on his back, he placed it vertically on his back. That started in Halo 5 so the gun won't get caught up in the thrusters. Safe to say Spartan Abilities may return or at least to some extent.
Reasoning for pro-sprint: game feels faster and more fun to move, adds an additional layer of strategy (sacrifice shooting for speed), modernity appeals to large gaming population
Over 40 million Overwatch players, over 20 million Counter-Strike players. Popular during modern times but do not include sprinting. Also no aiming down sights, only scopes. Halo can be popular and appealing without sprint.

I agree with compromise, but I feel it's essential to delete sprint for Halo. I'd be fine with higher base speed. If 343 is stubborn on making Halo "competitive", then look to what MLG did for Halo 3 and up the base speed to 110%. That still looks fine.
Over 60 million players play Call of Duty Warzone which has sprint. God knows how many more people play Fortnite which also has sprint. If we're going to have a popularity contest - more successful games feature sprint than those without.
You also forgot to mention that the only reason why those games are successful is because their FREE! When people don't have to pay $60 for a game, you'd be surprised how successful they are. Also the fact they're battle royal which is the trend right now. Such as the Titanfall trend games including Halo 5 followed 5 years ago.
BTB Bill wrote:
tsassi wrote:
BTB Bill wrote:
To regain (and sustain) any type of popularity, Halo infinite needs to return to classic movement style.
[citation needed]
Okay let me rephrase. THE BEST CHANCE, Halo infinite has to regain and sustain popularity is to return to classic movement style.

We all know halo games with “modern” movement cant sustain a high level of population. It’s been tried and has failed.
Is it because of the "modern" movement style? That's the part you keep overlooking.

Games without Sergeant Johnson are also received poorly. He was released as DLC for Halo Wars 2 and people liked it again.

Therefore the best chance for Halo to be popular again is to bring back Johnson permanently.
They'd have to come up with a good story as to how he survived H3 events... but I really hope they do bring him back, and not a watered down version. I don't care if he swears and gives the game a language sticker on the rating, that's the Johnson I remember and the Johnson I want
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