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The return of classic movement mechanics?

OP A So So Sniper

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Nuss902928 wrote:
I really like advanced movement, pls don't kill me yet
Go play TItanfall then, Halo isn't enhanced movement
But halo is not defined by its movement. If he likes other things about halo that titanfall does not have why is he inclined to play Titan fall. Also halo is actually is enhanced movement as of the moment so if I were you I would try playing offense and convincing him, not just stating his liked game feature is not halo because it is as of the moment
An PFS is defined by multiple things, but movement is one of the core pillars of it so yes Halo is somewhat defined by it's movement. Halo is not enhanced mobility since Infinite is barebones AAA redundancy, nothing enhanced about that but I guess you could say H5 was ( even though H5 was a failure sales numbers wise and only copied the Titanfall trend ) even though it was just as decisive as H4 and arguably worse for the franchise.
Woah cowboy I would not go saying anything about infinite yet. We are the entire time it took to make Halo 2 from launch so we don’t know what will happen. H5 is the most current halo FPS and guesss what. It has sprint so that is halo and the second most recent is H4 which also had sprint. Shocking figures I know
"Halo 4 and 5 have sprint, therefore sprint is a Halo mechanic"
>ignore the success ( or lack of ) of these games
>ignore the first 3 games that actually started the franchise
>ignore how sprint fundamentally goes against how Halo was designed
Halo 5 and 4 don't count as proper Halo games, only in the title are they Halo.
<Well look at the population of H5 vs all the other games combined in MCC
<H4 broke sales records so put that in your pipe and smoke it
<Great games no is is denying that but it is time to move on
<Halo games are allowed to be different than each other, if all halos were H3 how many less ppl would play
No not really, H4 and H5 are halos like it or not because I can use your logic and say, ohh CE is so different it is not actually halo
  • H5 also launched correctly and wasn't broken for over half it's lifespan
  • 90% playerbase gone within a year lul
  • Great games to who? casuals don't care and classic fans surely disagree
  • Halo 3 is still unbeaten in popularity and quality, even if all 343 did was re-make Halo 3 it would still be better than whatever they've made thus far
  • Halo 4 and 5 are not Halo as they are fundamentally different from every other game, using CE is a bad analogy as CE-3 ( and some parts of Reach ) play the same and the same core mechanics apply ( especially in MP )
>MCC needed updates for old games.
>But still enough people wanted to play it that it broke all the records
>NO because just like how H4 is just COD so you should go play COD everyone would just play H3 and not pay for more H3 that is not needed or new
>H4 and H5 are different because the industry evolved, ovens become different why not video games. CE had a wack sandbox and a bunch of noobish weapons which makes the game Super easy to pick up unlike H3
  • No they didn't, they just needed to be ported by someone who knew what they were doing
  • What record? sales records legit mean nothing.
  • People pay for new COD's, so people would pay for another H3
  • H4 and H5 aren't different because the industry evolved, they are different because 343 doesn't know what a proper Halo game is and copied whatever everyone else was doing. CE's sandbox is the best in the franchise, every weapon has a purpose and functions uniquely whereas H3 has weapons like the Carbine and Spiker which are useless in the overall sandbox ( plus H3 has a lot of RNG in it's BR which makes competitive play weird )
<Those games are old and as much as we all love CE it needs some new content after 15 years (20 now)
<No they mean exactly what they say. So I am going to type this out because you seem confused, MORE PEOPLE BOUGHT H4 THAN H3 so just a think about that for a sec would ya
<New CODS are different and than there predecessor. More H3’s are just H3 but better graphics which has no real difference from H3 so why waste money
<343 have made (you might want to skip this part) fun games to play that are designed in an intelligent manner and allowing players to easily use skills aquired in other games. CE has a sandbox of wierd weapons in damage and fire rate not it is actual useage. Surprised about the trash talk of H3, the spirit gives you that sweet melee damage increase and the carbine does not have that RNG
"MORE PEOPLE BOUGHT H4 THAN H3 so just a think about that for a sec would ya"

This is completely untrue, Halo 3 sold over 2 million more copies than Halo 4, and it maintained that population longer than any other Halo game while Halo 4 lost its population faster than any other.

"CE has a sandbox of wierd weapons in damage and fire rate not it is actual useage"

I'm not even sure what this means exactly, but the fact remains that CE's weapon sandbox is probably the best simply because each weapon fulfills a unique role with no weapons being redundant.

"Great games no is is denying that but it is time to move on"

This exact same dismissive attitude can be used against Halo 5 and it's mechanics.

"PPL found Halo4 much more interesting than H3"

Citation needed, how exactly do you even measure how interesting a game is? Personally, I think Halo 4 is the blandest game in the franchise because of how many mechanics it blatantly copied from COD.
-You should check your statics there (you would be wrong a quick google tells me H4 sold 44 million while J3 only sold 14.5)

-I have already posted about this in a post above

-Yes but those games were made 13 years ago Halo 5 was made 5 years ago
-More people bought the game than ppl who bought H3 which shows a lot more people were interested to see what was Chiefs next step
"You should check your statics there (you would be wrong a quick google tells me H4 sold 44 million while J3 only sold 14.5)"

Are you out of your mind?!?!?!? Halo 4 only sold around 9.87 million copies while Halo 3 sold 14.5 million copies. I did see some varying figures, but nothing even came close to showing Halo 4 with 44 million copies sold, 9.87 million is actually the highest figure I could find. If Halo 4 actually sold that many copies, it would make up well over half of all sales in the entire Halo franchise.

"Yes but those games were made 13 years ago Halo 5 was made 5 years ago"

5 years is considered quite old by game standards, and it didn't even manage to keep people interested for very long when it was new, MCC is more popular than Halo 5 right now.
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please do not flame or attack other members. This includes stat-flaming.
*Original post. Click at your own discretion.
Spoiler:
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Nuss902928 wrote:
Nuss902928 wrote:
I really like advanced movement, pls don't kill me yet
Go play TItanfall then, Halo isn't enhanced movement
But halo is not defined by its movement. If he likes other things about halo that titanfall does not have why is he inclined to play Titan fall. Also halo is actually is enhanced movement as of the moment so if I were you I would try playing offense and convincing him, not just stating his liked game feature is not halo because it is as of the moment
An PFS is defined by multiple things, but movement is one of the core pillars of it so yes Halo is somewhat defined by it's movement. Halo is not enhanced mobility since Infinite is barebones AAA redundancy, nothing enhanced about that but I guess you could say H5 was ( even though H5 was a failure sales numbers wise and only copied the Titanfall trend ) even though it was just as decisive as H4 and arguably worse for the franchise.
Woah cowboy I would not go saying anything about infinite yet. We are the entire time it took to make Halo 2 from launch so we don’t know what will happen. H5 is the most current halo FPS and guesss what. It has sprint so that is halo and the second most recent is H4 which also had sprint. Shocking figures I know
"Halo 4 and 5 have sprint, therefore sprint is a Halo mechanic"
>ignore the success ( or lack of ) of these games
>ignore the first 3 games that actually started the franchise
>ignore how sprint fundamentally goes against how Halo was designed
Halo 5 and 4 don't count as proper Halo games, only in the title are they Halo.
<Well look at the population of H5 vs all the other games combined in MCC
<H4 broke sales records so put that in your pipe and smoke it
<Great games no is is denying that but it is time to move on
<Halo games are allowed to be different than each other, if all halos were H3 how many less ppl would play
No not really, H4 and H5 are halos like it or not because I can use your logic and say, ohh CE is so different it is not actually halo
  • H5 also launched correctly and wasn't broken for over half it's lifespan
  • 90% playerbase gone within a year lul
  • Great games to who? casuals don't care and classic fans surely disagree
  • Halo 3 is still unbeaten in popularity and quality, even if all 343 did was re-make Halo 3 it would still be better than whatever they've made thus far
  • Halo 4 and 5 are not Halo as they are fundamentally different from every other game, using CE is a bad analogy as CE-3 ( and some parts of Reach ) play the same and the same core mechanics apply ( especially in MP )
>MCC needed updates for old games.
>But still enough people wanted to play it that it broke all the records
>NO because just like how H4 is just COD so you should go play COD everyone would just play H3 and not pay for more H3 that is not needed or new
>H4 and H5 are different because the industry evolved, ovens become different why not video games. CE had a wack sandbox and a bunch of noobish weapons which makes the game Super easy to pick up unlike H3
  • No they didn't, they just needed to be ported by someone who knew what they were doing
  • What record? sales records legit mean nothing.
  • People pay for new COD's, so people would pay for another H3
  • H4 and H5 aren't different because the industry evolved, they are different because 343 doesn't know what a proper Halo game is and copied whatever everyone else was doing. CE's sandbox is the best in the franchise, every weapon has a purpose and functions uniquely whereas H3 has weapons like the Carbine and Spiker which are useless in the overall sandbox ( plus H3 has a lot of RNG in it's BR which makes competitive play weird )
<Those games are old and as much as we all love CE it needs some new content after 15 years (20 now)
<No they mean exactly what they say. So I am going to type this out because you seem confused, MORE PEOPLE BOUGHT H4 THAN H3 so just a think about that for a sec would ya
<New CODS are different and than there predecessor. More H3’s are just H3 but better graphics which has no real difference from H3 so why waste money
<343 have made (you might want to skip this part) fun games to play that are designed in an intelligent manner and allowing players to easily use skills aquired in other games. CE has a sandbox of wierd weapons in damage and fire rate not it is actual useage. Surprised about the trash talk of H3, the spirit gives you that sweet melee damage increase and the carbine does not have that RNG
"MORE PEOPLE BOUGHT H4 THAN H3 so just a think about that for a sec would ya"

This is completely untrue, Halo 3 sold over 2 million more copies than Halo 4, and it maintained that population longer than any other Halo game while Halo 4 lost its population faster than any other.

"CE has a sandbox of wierd weapons in damage and fire rate not it is actual useage"

I'm not even sure what this means exactly, but the fact remains that CE's weapon sandbox is probably the best simply because each weapon fulfills a unique role with no weapons being redundant.

"Great games no is is denying that but it is time to move on"

This exact same dismissive attitude can be used against Halo 5 and it's mechanics.

"PPL found Halo4 much more interesting than H3"

Citation needed, how exactly do you even measure how interesting a game is? Personally, I think Halo 4 is the blandest game in the franchise because of how many mechanics it blatantly copied from COD.
-You should check your statics there (you would be wrong a quick google tells me H4 sold 44 million while J3 only sold 14.5)

-I have already posted about this in a post above

-Yes but those games were made 13 years ago Halo 5 was made 5 years ago
-More people bought the game than ppl who bought H3 which shows a lot more people were interested to see what was Chiefs next step
"You should check your statics there (you would be wrong a quick google tells me H4 sold 44 million while J3 only sold 14.5)"

Are you out of your mind?!?!?!? Halo 4 only sold around 9.87 million copies while Halo 3 sold 14.5 million copies. I did see some varying figures, but nothing even came close to showing Halo 4 with 44 million copies sold, 9.87 million is actually the highest figure I could find. If Halo 4 actually sold that many copies, it would make up well over half of all sales in the entire Halo franchise.

"Yes but those games were made 13 years ago Halo 5 was made 5 years ago"

5 years is considered quite old by game standards, and it didn't even manage to keep people interested for very long when it was new, MCC is more popular than Halo 5 right now.
Hey man, play H5 then we talk
First of all, I have played Halo 5, more importantly though, literally nothing in my last post has anything to do with my experience in Halo 5. I guess you're just trying to avoid admitting how absurdly wrong your sales numbers are
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please do not flame or attack other members. This includes stat-flaming.
*Original post. Click at your own discretion.
Spoiler:
Show
Nuss902928 wrote:
Nuss902928 wrote:
Nuss902928 wrote:
I really like advanced movement, pls don't kill me yet
Go play TItanfall then, Halo isn't enhanced movement
But halo is not defined by its movement. If he likes other things about halo that titanfall does not have why is he inclined to play Titan fall. Also halo is actually is enhanced movement as of the moment so if I were you I would try playing offense and convincing him, not just stating his liked game feature is not halo because it is as of the moment
An PFS is defined by multiple things, but movement is one of the core pillars of it so yes Halo is somewhat defined by it's movement. Halo is not enhanced mobility since Infinite is barebones AAA redundancy, nothing enhanced about that but I guess you could say H5 was ( even though H5 was a failure sales numbers wise and only copied the Titanfall trend ) even though it was just as decisive as H4 and arguably worse for the franchise.
Woah cowboy I would not go saying anything about infinite yet. We are the entire time it took to make Halo 2 from launch so we don’t know what will happen. H5 is the most current halo FPS and guesss what. It has sprint so that is halo and the second most recent is H4 which also had sprint. Shocking figures I know
"Halo 4 and 5 have sprint, therefore sprint is a Halo mechanic"
>ignore the success ( or lack of ) of these games
>ignore the first 3 games that actually started the franchise
>ignore how sprint fundamentally goes against how Halo was designed
Halo 5 and 4 don't count as proper Halo games, only in the title are they Halo.
<Well look at the population of H5 vs all the other games combined in MCC
<H4 broke sales records so put that in your pipe and smoke it
<Great games no is is denying that but it is time to move on
<Halo games are allowed to be different than each other, if all halos were H3 how many less ppl would play
No not really, H4 and H5 are halos like it or not because I can use your logic and say, ohh CE is so different it is not actually halo
  • H5 also launched correctly and wasn't broken for over half it's lifespan
  • 90% playerbase gone within a year lul
  • Great games to who? casuals don't care and classic fans surely disagree
  • Halo 3 is still unbeaten in popularity and quality, even if all 343 did was re-make Halo 3 it would still be better than whatever they've made thus far
  • Halo 4 and 5 are not Halo as they are fundamentally different from every other game, using CE is a bad analogy as CE-3 ( and some parts of Reach ) play the same and the same core mechanics apply ( especially in MP )
>MCC needed updates for old games.
>But still enough people wanted to play it that it broke all the records
>NO because just like how H4 is just COD so you should go play COD everyone would just play H3 and not pay for more H3 that is not needed or new
>H4 and H5 are different because the industry evolved, ovens become different why not video games. CE had a wack sandbox and a bunch of noobish weapons which makes the game Super easy to pick up unlike H3
  • No they didn't, they just needed to be ported by someone who knew what they were doing
  • What record? sales records legit mean nothing.
  • People pay for new COD's, so people would pay for another H3
  • H4 and H5 aren't different because the industry evolved, they are different because 343 doesn't know what a proper Halo game is and copied whatever everyone else was doing. CE's sandbox is the best in the franchise, every weapon has a purpose and functions uniquely whereas H3 has weapons like the Carbine and Spiker which are useless in the overall sandbox ( plus H3 has a lot of RNG in it's BR which makes competitive play weird )
<Those games are old and as much as we all love CE it needs some new content after 15 years (20 now)
<No they mean exactly what they say. So I am going to type this out because you seem confused, MORE PEOPLE BOUGHT H4 THAN H3 so just a think about that for a sec would ya
<New CODS are different and than there predecessor. More H3’s are just H3 but better graphics which has no real difference from H3 so why waste money
<343 have made (you might want to skip this part) fun games to play that are designed in an intelligent manner and allowing players to easily use skills aquired in other games. CE has a sandbox of wierd weapons in damage and fire rate not it is actual useage. Surprised about the trash talk of H3, the spirit gives you that sweet melee damage increase and the carbine does not have that RNG
"MORE PEOPLE BOUGHT H4 THAN H3 so just a think about that for a sec would ya"

This is completely untrue, Halo 3 sold over 2 million more copies than Halo 4, and it maintained that population longer than any other Halo game while Halo 4 lost its population faster than any other.

"CE has a sandbox of wierd weapons in damage and fire rate not it is actual useage"

I'm not even sure what this means exactly, but the fact remains that CE's weapon sandbox is probably the best simply because each weapon fulfills a unique role with no weapons being redundant.

"Great games no is is denying that but it is time to move on"

This exact same dismissive attitude can be used against Halo 5 and it's mechanics.

"PPL found Halo4 much more interesting than H3"

Citation needed, how exactly do you even measure how interesting a game is? Personally, I think Halo 4 is the blandest game in the franchise because of how many mechanics it blatantly copied from COD.
-You should check your statics there (you would be wrong a quick google tells me H4 sold 44 million while J3 only sold 14.5)

-I have already posted about this in a post above

-Yes but those games were made 13 years ago Halo 5 was made 5 years ago
-More people bought the game than ppl who bought H3 which shows a lot more people were interested to see what was Chiefs next step
"You should check your statics there (you would be wrong a quick google tells me H4 sold 44 million while J3 only sold 14.5)"

Are you out of your mind?!?!?!? Halo 4 only sold around 9.87 million copies while Halo 3 sold 14.5 million copies. I did see some varying figures, but nothing even came close to showing Halo 4 with 44 million copies sold, 9.87 million is actually the highest figure I could find. If Halo 4 actually sold that many copies, it would make up well over half of all sales in the entire Halo franchise.

"Yes but those games were made 13 years ago Halo 5 was made 5 years ago"

5 years is considered quite old by game standards, and it didn't even manage to keep people interested for very long when it was new, MCC is more popular than Halo 5 right now.
Hey man, play H5 then we talk
First of all, I have played Halo 5
IDK look at your service record
I've already explained this a few pages back, stop trying to gatekeep, it's extremely petty and not even valid.
<Well look at the population of H5 vs all the other games combined in MCC
<H4 broke sales records so put that in your pipe and smoke it
<Great games no is is denying that but it is time to move on
<Halo games are allowed to be different than each other, if all halos were H3 how many less ppl would play
No not really, H4 and H5 are halos like it or not because I can use your logic and say, ohh CE is so different it is not actually halo
  1. Halo MCC right now is placed 31st on the XBL most played games chart. Which is bad frankly, but it's still placed over H5 and it was like that for almost two years now. H5 right now is placed 42 btw. :/
  2. ...and than the population died out in t-minus two weeks. Reach retained more players than H4. Just say'n!
  3. You're right! But moving on means evolving the formula and Halo's formula is build around the sandbox. That's what needs to evolve! If 343i keeps copying other games Twitch mechanics instead of actually evolving and improving the sandbox Hi will fail. Again!
  4. Nobody wants H3.5, but you can make something new, something bigger and better with the mechanics that made Halo legendary to begin with. Wolfenstein, Doom and R6 did it and are now among the most beloved FPS ips around. You can't just copy what COD, Crysis and TF are doing and expect it to work. Especially because those games already have a following and they won't jump ship for a copy. Or they might for a while to be fair. ...just to walk straight back to the original. 🤷‍♀️
  5. Ehm... No. The logic doesn't work, because CE is the original.
1. And MCC has what is it? 5 more games? Is that right?
2. That argument has been tried turn after time but you look at a number or 2 and you see reach was the beginning of the end so If I were you I would keep reach far from this as it also has sprint
3. That copying you are referring to is not rlly there. Having sprint doesn’t make a game a copy, I will say that H4 was dangerously close to a COD game but H5 was unique as there is rlly not a game it copied. 343 does need to get on there sandbox game that has been lacking but this is the sprint thread
4. You are answering in this argument in a why were you have not read this entire argument. It was constructed after commando544 said a copy of H3 would do better than H5 or H4. I can t really answer this since it is kinda just is doubling down on that entire point.
5. this goes on the assumption Halp cannot change or evolve into something new so if you think that’s there is rlly no way for me to help you here
  1. MCC is a collection of old games, most of them used to run worse compared to their X360 versions, it came out a year before H5 and yet has still a bigger player-base. That tells me H5 is in a bad place right now. That, or there are more classic fans than I expected...
  2. Luckily you're not me. I don't care who introduced what first or what was the beginning of the quote on quote end is, Reach is still part of the discussion. I would be hypocrite to ignore it, the good and the bad. Also that point was made because it's true, so my point still stands: H4 died almost immediately.
  3. That copy is called Halo "I followed AMM trends and failed" 5. It's quite unique in the genre to he fair, but it's still closer to a TF or Crysis than an arena shooter. You say 343i needs to focus more on the sandbox aspects, but the genre itself reduces its importance to a hold.
  4. I did read it and kinda rolled my eyes frankly... I did so as well when you said CoD games are different btw, but that's beyond the point. I'm just tired to see "you just want H3 again" arguments when that's clearly not the case for most, so I just underlined that fact.
  5. And that's why point 4 exists! XD No, we are not saying nor implying that Halo can't evolve. What most of us are saying is that 343i focused on the absolute wrong aspects. In fact all those AMM additions are hurting the aspects that made Halo so unique in first place! And now Hi is doing the same. Again. I wonder why we're preoccupied!
  • Halo 4 didn't sell as much as Halo 3 according to sources I seen. As others have said, Halo 4 didn't really retain a population at all.
  • About CE, the pistol, button combos, and such, all help separate the pros from the noobs. Halo CE has the cleanest sandbox in any Halo. There's no debate. Halo 2 is close.
Cobra J24 wrote:
  • Halo 4 didn't sell as much as Halo 3 according to sources I seen. As others have said, Halo 4 didn't really retain a population at all.
  • About CE, the pistol, button combos, and such, all help separate the pros from the noobs. Halo CE has the cleanest sandbox in any Halo. There's no debate. Halo 2 is close.
Honestly H2's isn't that good considering weapons like the plasma rifles, magnum, needler and carbine are effectively useless ( either due to just being too weak to be used, or outclassed by a similar weapon ) for MP purposes.

Although 3, Reach, 4 and 5 all have this issue too, especially 343's games.
Cobra J24 wrote:
  • Halo 4 didn't sell as much as Halo 3 according to sources I seen. As others have said, Halo 4 didn't really retain a population at all.
  • About CE, the pistol, button combos, and such, all help separate the pros from the noobs. Halo CE has the cleanest sandbox in any Halo. There's no debate. Halo 2 is close.
Halo 4 was the third Halo title in just as many years and was completely eclipsed by Black Ops 2, which released just a week later. Black Ops 2 was so popular it was on the best seller list again several years later once it was backward compatible again. It's considered by many to be the best game in the franchise and best shooter of that generation.

Also dumb were the stalwarts dismissing the game without playing it saying, "Halo 4 is just a copy of Call of Duty," when in fact it is actually just a refined version of Reach's gameplay and even more ridiculous when those same people complaining about Halo 4 being a copy of Call of Duty praise Halo 5 when Halo 5 was an actual direct clone of Call of Duty Advanced Warfare but played at 2/3 speed.
Cobra J24 wrote:
  • Halo 4 didn't sell as much as Halo 3 according to sources I seen. As others have said, Halo 4 didn't really retain a population at all.
  • About CE, the pistol, button combos, and such, all help separate the pros from the noobs. Halo CE has the cleanest sandbox in any Halo. There's no debate. Halo 2 is close.
Halo 4 was the third Halo title in just as many years and was completely eclipsed by Black Ops 2, which released just a week later. Black Ops 2 was so popular it was on the best seller list again several years later once it was backward compatible again. It's considered by many to be the best game in the franchise and best shooter of that generation.

Also dumb were the stalwarts dismissing the game without playing it saying, "Halo 4 is just a copy of Call of Duty," when in fact it is actually just a refined version of Reach's gameplay and even more ridiculous when those same people complaining about Halo 4 being a copy of Call of Duty praise Halo 5 when Halo 5 was an actual direct clone of Call of Duty Advanced Warfare but played at 2/3 speed.
Halo 4 is a clone of COD, at least H5 brought back descope. H5 is still hot garbage but H4 is reserved for it's own separate landfill.
Cobra J24 wrote:
  • Halo 4 didn't sell as much as Halo 3 according to sources I seen. As others have said, Halo 4 didn't really retain a population at all.
  • About CE, the pistol, button combos, and such, all help separate the pros from the noobs. Halo CE has the cleanest sandbox in any Halo. There's no debate. Halo 2 is close.
Honestly H2's isn't that good considering weapons like the plasma rifles, magnum, needler and carbine are effectively useless ( either due to just being too weak to be used, or outclassed by a similar weapon ) for MP purposes.

Although 3, Reach, 4 and 5 all have this issue too, especially 343's games.
Not disagreeing with you, but at least the weapons don't all overlap each other in Halo 2. Weapons like the spiker in Halo 3, or the Supressor in Halo 4, clutter their sandboxes.
Cobra J24 wrote:
  • Halo 4 didn't sell as much as Halo 3 according to sources I seen. As others have said, Halo 4 didn't really retain a population at all.
  • About CE, the pistol, button combos, and such, all help separate the pros from the noobs. Halo CE has the cleanest sandbox in any Halo. There's no debate. Halo 2 is close.
Halo 4 was the third Halo title in just as many years and was completely eclipsed by Black Ops 2, which released just a week later. Black Ops 2 was so popular it was on the best seller list again several years later once it was backward compatible again. It's considered by many to be the best game in the franchise and best shooter of that generation.

Also dumb were the stalwarts dismissing the game without playing it saying, "Halo 4 is just a copy of Call of Duty," when in fact it is actually just a refined version of Reach's gameplay and even more ridiculous when those same people complaining about Halo 4 being a copy of Call of Duty praise Halo 5 when Halo 5 was an actual direct clone of Call of Duty Advanced Warfare but played at 2/3 speed.
You have a point about Bo2. You are also correct, imo, about Halo 4 being a more refined Reach. Halo 5 feels super similar to CoD in many aspects, but personal loadouts, hitmarkers, and the like, all make Halo 4 feel CoD like too. However, I think 343i was just experimenting and dare I say, copying, what worked for other FPS at the time.
Cobra J24 wrote:
  • Halo 4 didn't sell as much as Halo 3 according to sources I seen. As others have said, Halo 4 didn't really retain a population at all.
  • About CE, the pistol, button combos, and such, all help separate the pros from the noobs. Halo CE has the cleanest sandbox in any Halo. There's no debate. Halo 2 is close.
Halo 4 was the third Halo title in just as many years and was completely eclipsed by Black Ops 2, which released just a week later. Black Ops 2 was so popular it was on the best seller list again several years later once it was backward compatible again. It's considered by many to be the best game in the franchise and best shooter of that generation.

Also dumb were the stalwarts dismissing the game without playing it saying, "Halo 4 is just a copy of Call of Duty," when in fact it is actually just a refined version of Reach's gameplay and even more ridiculous when those same people complaining about Halo 4 being a copy of Call of Duty praise Halo 5 when Halo 5 was an actual direct clone of Call of Duty Advanced Warfare but played at 2/3 speed.
Halo 4 is a clone of COD, at least H5 brought back descope. H5 is still hot garbage but H4 is reserved for it's own separate landfill.
I have no time for Halo 3 kiddies. At least try to refute my points. "Oh no, sprint is a mechanic for everyone instead of a Spartan ability! The end is nigh! Oh Halo 5 copying air dashes ground pounds and aiming down sights from Advanced Warfare? Nothing wrong with that."

At the end of the day Halo 4 was you sprinting back into the fight to play Halo Reach. Halo 5 was sprinting to air dash your way to stop and pop just like Call of Duty.
Cobra J24 wrote:
  • Halo 4 didn't sell as much as Halo 3 according to sources I seen. As others have said, Halo 4 didn't really retain a population at all.
  • About CE, the pistol, button combos, and such, all help separate the pros from the noobs. Halo CE has the cleanest sandbox in any Halo. There's no debate. Halo 2 is close.
Halo 4 was the third Halo title in just as many years and was completely eclipsed by Black Ops 2, which released just a week later. Black Ops 2 was so popular it was on the best seller list again several years later once it was backward compatible again. It's considered by many to be the best game in the franchise and best shooter of that generation.

Also dumb were the stalwarts dismissing the game without playing it saying, "Halo 4 is just a copy of Call of Duty," when in fact it is actually just a refined version of Reach's gameplay and even more ridiculous when those same people complaining about Halo 4 being a copy of Call of Duty praise Halo 5 when Halo 5 was an actual direct clone of Call of Duty Advanced Warfare but played at 2/3 speed.
I'm sure some feel different but to me H4 copied clasdic CoD and H5 copied advanced movement games which includes CoD also.

I think the only thing i would call refined in H4 is sprint. The custom loadouts, loadout perks, killstreaks, carepackage map drops, flinch, hitmarkers, killcam, join in progress make the game more chaotic and unfocused than Reach. Especially once ZBNS dropped.

As for Halo 5, the chained movement that aped contemporaries were the big issue sprint, slide, thrust, stabilise, ground pound, clamber ad nauseum.

Also whoever said Halo 4 sold 44 million copies thank you for the laugh. The sales record was in a 24hr window. The game had huge numbers week 1 but the playlists were a mess, the interface sucked, many features werent working, campaign sucked and there were so many bugs. The pop was crushed when BO2 released then continued to die further over 6 months as the dlc sucked and the game was slow to repair.
I'm sure some feel different but to me H4 copied clasdic CoD and H5 copied advanced movement games which includes CoD also.

I think the only thing i would call refined in H4 is sprint. The custom loadouts, loadout perks, killstreaks, carepackage map drops, flinch, hitmarkers, killcam, join in progress make the game more chaotic and unfocused than Reach. Especially once ZBNS dropped.

As for Halo 5, the chained movement that aped contemporaries were the big issue sprint, slide, thrust, stabilise, ground pound, clamber ad nauseum.

Also whoever said Halo 4 sold 44 million copies thank you for the laugh. The sales record was in a 24hr window. The game had huge numbers week 1 but the playlists were a mess, the interface sucked, many features werent working, campaign sucked and there were so many bugs. The pop was crushed when BO2 released then continued to die further over 6 months as the dlc sucked and the game was slow to repair.
Let's be honest here; these "killstreak" drops made zero impact on the game. They were so ineffectual to the outcome of the game I don't see how people are still complaining about them 8 years later.

Boltshot aside, custom loadouts didn't hurt the game. If you wanted a BR, an AR or a DMR it was up to you. I mean, either do custom loadouts or you have everyone do AR starts or BR or DMR starts and then everyone complains about not having the other as a starter because when it's AR starts competitive players complain about not starting with BRs or DMRs, which is quite valid mind you even in casual play, or you start with BRs or DMRs and the AR is pointless except for those people who want ARs. And if you have a BR in the game, there is zero reason to have a DMR and if you have a DMR there is zero reason to have a BR in the game. This has pretty clearly been the case: you can't have both in the game if one is the default as there is zero point to having both. Their roles are identical therefore it is a complete overlap; therefore one needs removed, thus pissing one group off. Also getting to choose your grenade loadout didn't hurt the game at all. As we saw with Halo 3 the game doesn't work with 3 or 4 sets of nades. So now you completely limited player agency again as only some maps will have certain grenades available, which just like the BR/DMR situation means we might as well get rid of anything other than the frags and plasmas because the lack of options for both on all maps goes over like a led balloon.

Also, there's zero argument here that Halo 4 had the most definitive hit registration in the series. If it hit, you knew. If it didn't, you knew. There was no "I put 8 bursts into him and he didn't die! He's cheating!" There is zero doubt whether the hit registered or not. In Halo 2 or 3 when things got laggy you wouldn't know then you would say it's the hit reg, when in fact you never actually hit anything. Knowing definitively whether it hit or not is good intel in my book.

Join in progress is good for casual play. Sure, it doesn't belong in ranked, but for casual gametypes it absolutely needs to be there. There is nothing worse than people leaving and playing a half lobby. It blows. And to prove my point, look at TMCC. You get banned for five minutes when you quit out of a game in big team when you stayed but the lone guy on the other team won't leave. That's terrible. You can get banned for a month if you quit out of a dead game. WTH is that? Why should anyone have to waste there time NOT PLAYING when they didn't do anything wrong to ruin the game for others? Why should they suffer? It's cancer and join in progress for casual is the cure.

The game is still a hip fire game same as Halo 1-3. Halo 5 is an ADS game. Also, Reach was boring.

Also Killcam is good unless you're a camper (you in the proverbial sense, not you in particular, Celtic). Also helps proves if someone is cheating or not. I don't care if the next game plays like Quake or Rainbow Six; it should have a killcam and anyone who disagrees is a camper or disagreeing for the sake of being petty over the fact Halo didn't do it first.
I'm sure some feel different but to me H4 copied clasdic CoD and H5 copied advanced movement games which includes CoD also.

I think the only thing i would call refined in H4 is sprint. The custom loadouts, loadout perks, killstreaks, carepackage map drops, flinch, hitmarkers, killcam, join in progress make the game more chaotic and unfocused than Reach. Especially once ZBNS dropped.

As for Halo 5, the chained movement that aped contemporaries were the big issue sprint, slide, thrust, stabilise, ground pound, clamber ad nauseum.

Also whoever said Halo 4 sold 44 million copies thank you for the laugh. The sales record was in a 24hr window. The game had huge numbers week 1 but the playlists were a mess, the interface sucked, many features werent working, campaign sucked and there were so many bugs. The pop was crushed when BO2 released then continued to die further over 6 months as the dlc sucked and the game was slow to repair.
Let's be honest here; these "killstreak" drops made zero impact on the game. They were so ineffectual to the outcome of the game I don't see how people are still complaining about them 8 years later.

Boltshot aside, custom loadouts didn't hurt the game. If you wanted a BR, an AR or a DMR it was up to you. I mean, either do custom loadouts or you have everyone do AR starts or BR or DMR starts and then everyone complains about not having the other as a starter because when it's AR starts competitive players complain about not starting with BRs or DMRs, which is quite valid mind you even in casual play, or you start with BRs or DMRs and the AR is pointless except for those people who want ARs. And if you have a BR in the game, there is zero reason to have a DMR and if you have a DMR there is zero reason to have a BR in the game. This has pretty clearly been the case: you can't have both in the game if one is the default as there is zero point to having both. Their roles are identical therefore it is a complete overlap; therefore one needs removed, thus pissing one group off. Also getting to choose your grenade loadout didn't hurt the game at all. As we saw with Halo 3 the game doesn't work with 3 or 4 sets of nades. So now you completely limited player agency again as only some maps will have certain grenades available, which just like the BR/DMR situation means we might as well get rid of anything other than the frags and plasmas because the lack of options for both on all maps goes over like a led balloon.

Also, there's zero argument here that Halo 4 had the most definitive hit registration in the series. If it hit, you knew. If it didn't, you knew. There was no "I put 8 bursts into him and he didn't die! He's cheating!" There is zero doubt whether the hit registered or not. In Halo 2 or 3 when things got laggy you wouldn't know then you would say it's the hit reg, when in fact you never actually hit anything. Knowing definitively whether it hit or not is good intel in my book.

Join in progress is good for casual play. Sure, it doesn't belong in ranked, but for casual gametypes it absolutely needs to be there. There is nothing worse than people leaving and playing a half lobby. It blows. And to prove my point, look at TMCC. You get banned for five minutes when you quit out of a game in big team when you stayed but the lone guy on the other team won't leave. That's terrible. You can get banned for a month if you quit out of a dead game. WTH is that? Why should anyone have to waste there time NOT PLAYING when they didn't do anything wrong to ruin the game for others? Why should they suffer? It's cancer and join in progress for casual is the cure.

The game is still a hip fire game same as Halo 1-3. Halo 5 is an ADS game. Also, Reach was boring.

Also Killcam is good unless you're a camper (you in the proverbial sense, not you in particular, Celtic). Also helps proves if someone is cheating or not. I don't care if the next game plays like Quake or Rainbow Six; it should have a killcam and anyone who disagrees is a camper or disagreeing for the sake of being petty over the fact Halo didn't do it first.
Bad take, stop defending a bad game.
  • KIllstreaks aren't Halo and did have an impact on the game through being RNG gift baskets, not part of the arena forumla
  • Loadouts do the same thing and force the weapon sandbox to be more generic so all weapons can be used, why have the cool fight over rockets if I can just spawn with them? same applies to the BR and DMR, grenades are the same
  • Hitmarkers are uneeded and just another bad feature we don't need, we have shield flare for when you hit an enemy player and blood splatter for meat shots
  • JIP won't work if MCC matchmaking doesn't give teams an equal chance, 80% of MCC matches are pre-set and no personal skill can help if your teammates are braindead
  • "but hipfire is the same so it's the same exact game!" literally the dumbest take on a game ever put forth, Reach is better than H4 :^)
  • Killcam is from COD, bad mechanic and not needed. Ruins stealthy gameplay and serves no purpose. CSGO doesn't have a killcam and nobody is complaining, stop trying to force generic mechanics into a game where they aren't needed or wanted.
I'm sure some feel different but to me H4 copied clasdic CoD and H5 copied advanced movement games which includes CoD also.

I think the only thing i would call refined in H4 is sprint. The custom loadouts, loadout perks, killstreaks, carepackage map drops, flinch, hitmarkers, killcam, join in progress make the game more chaotic and unfocused than Reach. Especially once ZBNS dropped.

As for Halo 5, the chained movement that aped contemporaries were the big issue sprint, slide, thrust, stabilise, ground pound, clamber ad nauseum.

Also whoever said Halo 4 sold 44 million copies thank you for the laugh. The sales record was in a 24hr window. The game had huge numbers week 1 but the playlists were a mess, the interface sucked, many features werent working, campaign sucked and there were so many bugs. The pop was crushed when BO2 released then continued to die further over 6 months as the dlc sucked and the game was slow to repair.
Let's be honest here; these "killstreak" drops made zero impact on the game. They were so ineffectual to the outcome of the game I don't see how people are still complaining about them 8 years later.

Boltshot aside, custom loadouts didn't hurt the game.
Clearly even 343i thinks outherwise because...they changed it. At least when talking about something like sprint where people go "it's not bad they just have to keep tweaking it!", this is a case of 343i just removing it entirely from standard gameplay either within Halo 4 or when creating Halo 5 (Arena).
I'm sure some feel different but to me H4 copied clasdic CoD and H5 copied advanced movement games which includes CoD also.

I think the only thing i would call refined in H4 is sprint. The custom loadouts, loadout perks, killstreaks, carepackage map drops, flinch, hitmarkers, killcam, join in progress make the game more chaotic and unfocused than Reach. Especially once ZBNS dropped.

As for Halo 5, the chained movement that aped contemporaries were the big issue sprint, slide, thrust, stabilise, ground pound, clamber ad nauseum.

Also whoever said Halo 4 sold 44 million copies thank you for the laugh. The sales record was in a 24hr window. The game had huge numbers week 1 but the playlists were a mess, the interface sucked, many features werent working, campaign sucked and there were so many bugs. The pop was crushed when BO2 released then continued to die further over 6 months as the dlc sucked and the game was slow to repair.
Let's be honest here; these "killstreak" drops made zero impact on the game. They were so ineffectual to the outcome of the game I don't see how people are still complaining about them 8 years later.

Boltshot aside, custom loadouts didn't hurt the game. If you wanted a BR, an AR or a DMR it was up to you. I mean, either do custom loadouts or you have everyone do AR starts or BR or DMR starts and then everyone complains about not having the other as a starter because when it's AR starts competitive players complain about not starting with BRs or DMRs, which is quite valid mind you even in casual play, or you start with BRs or DMRs and the AR is pointless except for those people who want ARs. And if you have a BR in the game, there is zero reason to have a DMR and if you have a DMR there is zero reason to have a BR in the game. This has pretty clearly been the case: you can't have both in the game if one is the default as there is zero point to having both. Their roles are identical therefore it is a complete overlap; therefore one needs removed, thus pissing one group off. Also getting to choose your grenade loadout didn't hurt the game at all. As we saw with Halo 3 the game doesn't work with 3 or 4 sets of nades. So now you completely limited player agency again as only some maps will have certain grenades available, which just like the BR/DMR situation means we might as well get rid of anything other than the frags and plasmas because the lack of options for both on all maps goes over like a led balloon.

Also, there's zero argument here that Halo 4 had the most definitive hit registration in the series. If it hit, you knew. If it didn't, you knew. There was no "I put 8 bursts into him and he didn't die! He's cheating!" There is zero doubt whether the hit registered or not. In Halo 2 or 3 when things got laggy you wouldn't know then you would say it's the hit reg, when in fact you never actually hit anything. Knowing definitively whether it hit or not is good intel in my book.

Join in progress is good for casual play. Sure, it doesn't belong in ranked, but for casual gametypes it absolutely needs to be there. There is nothing worse than people leaving and playing a half lobby. It blows. And to prove my point, look at TMCC. You get banned for five minutes when you quit out of a game in big team when you stayed but the lone guy on the other team won't leave. That's terrible. You can get banned for a month if you quit out of a dead game. WTH is that? Why should anyone have to waste there time NOT PLAYING when they didn't do anything wrong to ruin the game for others? Why should they suffer? It's cancer and join in progress for casual is the cure.

The game is still a hip fire game same as Halo 1-3. Halo 5 is an ADS game. Also, Reach was boring.

Also Killcam is good unless you're a camper (you in the proverbial sense, not you in particular, Celtic). Also helps proves if someone is cheating or not. I don't care if the next game plays like Quake or Rainbow Six; it should have a killcam and anyone who disagrees is a camper or disagreeing for the sake of being petty over the fact Halo didn't do it first.
Bad take, stop defending a bad game.
  • KIllstreaks aren't Halo and did have an impact on the game through being RNG gift baskets, not part of the arena forumla
  • Loadouts do the same thing and force the weapon sandbox to be more generic so all weapons can be used, why have the cool fight over rockets if I can just spawn with them? same applies to the BR and DMR, grenades are the same
  • Hitmarkers are uneeded and just another bad feature we don't need, we have shield flare for when you hit an enemy player and blood splatter for meat shots
  • JIP won't work if MCC matchmaking doesn't give teams an equal chance, 80% of MCC matches are pre-set and no personal skill can help if your teammates are braindead
  • "but hipfire is the same so it's the same exact game!" literally the dumbest take on a game ever put forth, Reach is better than H4 :^)
  • Killcam is from COD, bad mechanic and not needed. Ruins stealthy gameplay and serves no purpose. CSGO doesn't have a killcam and nobody is complaining, stop trying to force generic mechanics into a game where they aren't needed or wanted.
Trash take. Please delete.
  • Killstreaks were never in Halo 4. Get over this nonexistent boogeyman. As soon as there's an artillery strike or a chopper gunner in Halo 4 I'll take this seriously. Until then it's nonsense.
  • Oh, you could set a loadout to spawn with rockets? OH REALLY? Show me one loadout where somebody went into Team Slayer with a rocket launcher equipped. It's your big brain argument, so I simply ask for proof of your outrageous claim.
  • TMCC broke JIP. JIP worked fantastically in Halo 4. The number of games quit out or being a waste of time because everyone quit in Halo 4 big team was practically nonexistent, compared to 1v8s making up a solid 2/5 of all Halo 3 big team matches. Quitters in social is a big problem and always had been in Halo. It was not a problem at all during Halo 4's life. Period.
  • OK, what part of shooting at someone with a BR in Halo 4 is fundamentally different than shooting someone with a BR in Halo 3? Other than the fact that in Halo 4 your BR shots actually go where you aim? What's the difference? What's the difference between shooting someone with a BR in Halo 4 compared to Halo 2? There is none. You can keep crying about Strawman arguments you think are so dumb that YOU CREATED, but fact is if you're both land ten feet from each other and both expelled your armor abilities and deployables, Halo CE, 2, 3 & 4 all play the exact same; you strafe, you shoot, you try to throw the enemy off. The only two games that change that dynamic are Reach and 5. In Reach in that situation you strafe, you shoot, but you pace your shots because the bloom is so severe that spamming the trigger is not productive at anything other than point blank. In Halo 5, you aim down sights, shoot, and ADS strafe, or maybe boost dodge.
  • "kiLLcAm FrOm cOd. KiLl CaM bAd." ...Found the camper. 🤣
    Protip, kiddo: You're not stealthy, you're just camping.
Next time you argue, argue the points made, not the points you made up.
Clearly even 343i thinks outherwise because...they changed it. At least when talking about something like sprint where people go "it's not bad they just have to keep tweaking it!", this is a case of 343i just removing it entirely from standard gameplay either within Halo 4 or when creating Halo 5 (Arena).
They changed it cuz of the crying over spilt milk. Frankly, if they had removed it without announcing it for TMCC, no one would have noticed. It was that inconsequential.
It's not all the time I get proper replies, don't take any of my criticism as hostility i'm just passionate, though you've seen me around so you're fine. Also if i've misremembered something point it out, I really only played H4 until the Xbox one came out so that's what i'm basing it off. I'll just match my paragraphs to yours for readability.

By killstreak drops we're talking about personal ordnance right and not global? i'll criticise both, first i'll get global out of the way. Global ordnance didn't have a significant impact on how broken H4 was in relation to all changes made, but it taken static weapons on predictable timers and made the location, time and weapon random. I believe they did an update to curb how wacky it was but that was likely by champions bundle when the game fell out of the top 10 on xbl. That isn't a good change from what we had. In terms of personal ordnance it was awful, SAWs, rockets, damage boosts, snipers, beam rifles were all very common and usually one of the choices every choice. It taken the natural rolling advantage of earning a power weapon on map (which is now random) and put that into hyperdrive by allowing the player to stack killstreak advantage in their favour, especially during damage boost or sniper. Given that you could also steal ordnance (albeit slower) it didn't add anything positive and made casual play more bitter, unfair and random.

As for custom loadouts the issue came down to having 4 weapons doing the same thing with slightly different attributes with similar kill times, if there is 1 default weapon the the role of the developer is to create more differentiation if that is the baseline. Say if it was BR starts, the carbines high rate of fire creates a good enough reason to justify as a pick-up. However a pistol could be a short range powerhouse and the DMR could be horrible to use short range by adjusting aim assist values and make it a mini-sniper, etc. Not that it mattered too much in 4 as all the good players used light rifles as the scoped killtime was decently higher than the other weapons. Also in BTB being able to spawn with a plasma pistol and sticky nades was disgusting, considering that like 70% of H4 population were playing the 2 or 3 BTB playlists that isn't good. The perks just made the game far more uncertain in any given encounter and made way for players to tech into cheese playstyles that didn't add any benefit to the game or the players. Unfortunately automatic weapons in Halo games have always sucked, If there was no sprint and maps became more compact with less openness they would get more use. CE AR was pretty good but it wasn't used on hang'em, got more use in chillout and prisoner though. I feel the solution like CE is to make the sandbox powerful, limit ammo on all pick-ups but have many pick-ups on a decently fast timer. That way players get more use out of the sandbox, no issue, compared to H3 where it's just like 2 things.

Hit reg was good, though being a New Zealander i found Reach had the better local search options so many of my games were against Americans in H4 and the crisp reg i mostly got to feel in customs only.

I don't feel it's a good solution to the problem of quitters. It's either a random quit, a lagout or a rage quit. Random quits usually happen in the first minute of play, you could do a JiP solution for that but then they start off disadvantaged. A lagout should be able to re-enter game, it's a necessity. A rage quit is because the game was 1-sided. The amount of times i was put into 1-sided games or games about to finish made my individual experience far worse than if it wasn't there, the same for everyones experience. Social games shouldn't record win loss in general imo, so after ~3 min or once the teams become lopsided there should be a resign feature for the losing team with no penalty attached. In the silly gametypes like living dead, multi-team, rumble pit where there isn't any seriousness whatsoever then sure but for any serious playlist even in social, that have structure JiP is not ideal. If everyone had the choice of turning off JiP, JiP couldn't work, i would also wager most would turn it off which is telling of the mechanic.

I don't really understand this one. But I disagree Reach was great fun, though i mostly played snipes, BTB and MLG customs. I was #2 in the world for BTB laser kills at one point probably around a month after renegade and abridged came out. I'll never let that down ;) Think i was top 30 for team snipers, top 100 team slayer and the only non-vehicle user in the top 100 globally on Halotracker, though that's a long long time ago.

Oh don't worry, i always assume people are speaking figuratively. Killcam and it's application in Halo was very janky and not very useful. If there was an option between that and the old style of 3rd person camera over corpse i'd choose the 2nd option. At least give the choice. Going from play to the killcam back to play just doesn't feel nice, especially because in online play the killcam is more often than not, inaccurate to your experience.
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