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The return of classic movement mechanics?

OP A So So Sniper

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tsassi wrote:
Your explanation of sprint being a "one trick pony" is just odd an convoluted 🤣. There is more to it than just the tactical decision of whether or not to use it... Because it's also part of movement button combo's.
Again, I said there is no trick in the game that relies on the existence of sprint. All those movement combos can be made to work without sprint, just with one less button press. If you find that pressing more buttons is more fun, so be it, but that's not relevant to my original point. Sprint is not a fundamental part of any movement combo. It's just there because you can't reach maximum speed in Halo 5 without it.

Your first point is just weird and pretty wrong, and your second point is just actually flat out wrong 😃.
You misunderstood my first point, and yes, my second point is technically wrong because I misspoke. Would appreciate if you didn't rub it in my face though. In any case, the point that 343i has consistently made sprint less impactful with every iteration, whether it is making it slower, or reducing weapon draw times and grenade delays, isn't. I fully expect Halo Infinite to continue that trend.
Sprint vs slide out of movement--
Having slide occur out of a higher base movement speed rather than out of sprint will result in tons of accidental slides. Did you just flank into a good position and you want to crouch to get off radar? TOO BAD, you just slid, and now your'e still on radar and probably didn't stop behind cover quite when you meant.

Without requiring the user to engage sprint with slide, you're relying on the game systems automatically choosing between two player actions mapped to the same button (crouch vs slide) rather than the player having full control and choice over their actions. Similar situations to this are always very frustrating for players in my experience playing other games.

It's like H5's stabilizer. The auto-stabilize doesn't activate as fast or raise you as high as when you change settings to make it a direct player action.

Adding sprint as a pre-requisite to the slide/slide-jump adds another button into the movement combo, which does require more practice. Instead of "holding forward, slide, jump", you've got the extra button press and timing till you can engage slide to start that action sequence.
Requiring more practice -> adding to the skill ceiling and adding layers to skill gaps. We've already been through this part plenty though, so I'm sure you're tired if reading this.

The main new point is that I don't want the game to have to decide if I was trying to slide or just go into crouch when moving to a new position. I want to decide if I was trying to slide or crouch when moving into a new position.

Rubbing it in your face--
Think more globally about your points and evidence you present then. Get out of the fire if you don't want to get burned 😃🔥🍻
Darwi wrote:
Therefore, classic halo provides the player with the greatest amount of options, while newer halos limit player options.
But in new Halo I can also intially engage the enemy at different speeds (base or sprint) and can slide. I can then also continue the battle just like in classic - by jumping, moving, and/or shooting.
First of all, if you're engaging the enemy by sliding or sprinting into them, you're doing something wrong.
Stopped reading after your first line because you're already wrong right off the bat. And not just a little wrong. This line is like SUPER wrong. It's like you picked option e when there was only a, b, c, and d on the test. What are you even thinking at this point? That's how wrong this line is.

Go watch any high end player. There are literally tons of times every match where they use sprint and/ or slide to begin their challenges
So you respond to the side topic instead of the main topic. Strong IQ dude.
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Sprint SlideYou: You shouldn't sprint/ slide right at someone, if this is how you engage people you're doing something wrong.

Me: That's actually a pretty valid and effective way to start a challenge against people. Even pro players use it often in every match they play.

You: That's not the ideal way to engage enemies (continue with lots of points supporting that.

Uuuhhh... duh...? I'm not arguing your should always be slide sprinting directly at people... it's a trick in the toolbox you should be using. The ideal way to engage enemies is and always has been from above (with rockets!) That's not what anyone's talking about.
lmao okay dude, you can have this one. It's not the point I'm interested in discussing anyway.
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Map Scale Fun fact for the day! Did you know 343 doesn't play test maps having players ONLY sprint or ONLY not sprint? They actually design maps where players both sprint and walk during the game. It's a pretty crazy concept I know 🤣.
This has literally nothing to do with playtesting. Whether playtesting occurs or not, you literally can not escape the fact that if you have sprint as a base mechanic, then every part of the map must account for the existence of sprint. It really is that simple
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And yes, the scaled up map experiences are similar in regards to firefights. Weapon ranges stretch out a little, and so do firing lanes. Pushing carbine on Truth has a very similar feel to pushing carbine on Midship for example.

And congrats, you're now the only person I've ever read on these forums imply that aspects of H5 and advance movement play slower than older titles 👏. Your defense seems to be going pretty well. /sarcasm
So I'm not really sure what to make of this part of your comment. It's a fact that sprint slows gameplay down. Not being able to engage in combat while sprinting means that defensive gameplay is encouraged. The existence of sprint also means poor map movement goes left unpunished more often.

One example is cat and mouse gameplay, where it's much more difficult to translate getting someone low into getting a kill in H5 compared to a classic Halo game. In H5, if you get low, you have the option to sprint away from combat. The mechanics in H5 favour this playstyle, because the aggressor can not maintain sprint speed while shooting. This can result in cat and mouse gameplay, where the aggressor is sprinting after another person sprinting, resulting in an extremely delayed kill or sometimes no kill at all. Alternatively, the aggressor may be forced to abandon the kill. Both instances result in slower and more jarring gameplay. In H3, the aggressor can maintain the same speed as the person put low, meaning they have much less survivability, resulting in far more kills and hence faster gameplay.

Sprint also acts as a crutch for players when they position themselves poorly. For this point I'm just gonna copy paste an old comment I made coz cba typing it all again. (Sprint) diminishes the importance of good map movement - Being in the right place at the right time is important for any FPS. Prior to sprint, if you were in a poor position, there were no movement mechanics that allowed you to relocate and compensate for your poor positioning. If your team was in a fight but you weren't there, your teammates would be fighting at a number disadvantage. If your teammates pulled the flag or oddball but you weren't holding the right angle to cover them, they would likely die as a consequence. The point is, your poor positioning meant you (or your team) were penalised in some way. Sprint allows players to relocate to the ideal position only after realising they are in a poor position, often negating this penalty. Hence, in this sense, sprint allows for sloppy map movement compared to no sprint. Also, since your fan of the skill gap, I'll chuck this one in here as well: It diminishes the significance of understanding spawn control and makes breaking spawn traps obscenely easy - One of the most unique aspects of Halo is its respawn system, and at the highest level of play understanding how spawns work is essential. This means knowing where the spawn locations are, how to manipulate them (by blocking them) and hence predict enemy spawns after killing them. Prior to sprint, when a team gained control of a map, they could position appropriately to capitalise on enemy respawns, either to spawn kill/trap them, or to block respawns to allow the flag carrier to run on that side of the map. Sprint throws this into disarray. Being able to sprint off spawn means that in a matter of seconds after spawning, a player can be on the enemies side of the map, avoiding any kind of spawn trap or containment. This is BAD as a mechanic because it lowers the skill ceiling - If you die, you should be penalised. If you killed the enemy and understand respawns you should be rewarded. This was how pre-sprint Halo was, but changed drastically after it was introduced. The result was a scrappy fiesta, where people would sprint off spawn to all corners of the map, making the game far more disjointed.
Also, you seem to really like to focus on the importance of the skill gap, but did you know enhanced mobility actually slows the game down (less kills per minute), therefore reducing the skill gap?
And congrats, you're now the only person I've ever read on these forums imply that aspects of H5 and advance movement play slower than older titles 👏. Your defense seems to be going pretty well. /sarcasm
In his defense, I've seen it stated multiple times on these forums that Halo CE's campaign is actually faster-paced than Halo 5's, and, from my experience, so is its multiplayer. He's not wrong in this argument, despite what your BPM may lead you to believe.

You don't think Halo 5's advanced movement allows for easier, or at least more common, escapes from encounters, thus extending the time it takes to kill your target? Because chasing your target around the map without being able to shoot sounds . . . dare I say it . . . slow, while the ease at which people can escape sounds like a reduction of the skill gap.
Darwi wrote:
Therefore, classic halo provides the player with the greatest amount of options, while newer halos limit player options.
But in new Halo I can also intially engage the enemy at different speeds (base or sprint) and can slide. I can then also continue the battle just like in classic - by jumping, moving, and/or shooting.
First of all, if you're engaging the enemy by sliding or sprinting into them, you're doing something wrong.
Stopped reading after your first line because you're already wrong right off the bat. And not just a little wrong. This line is like SUPER wrong. It's like you picked option e when there was only a, b, c, and d on the test. What are you even thinking at this point? That's how wrong this line is.

Go watch any high end player. There are literally tons of times every match where they use sprint and/ or slide to begin their challenges
So you respond to the side topic instead of the main topic. Strong IQ dude.
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So I'm not really sure what to make of this part of your comment. It's a fact that sprint slows gameplay down. Not being able to engage in combat while sprinting means that defensive gameplay is encouraged. The existence of sprint also means poor map movement goes left unpunished more often.

One example is cat and mouse gameplay, where it's much more difficult to translate getting someone low into getting a kill in H5 compared to a classic Halo game. In H5, if you get low, you have the option to sprint away from combat. The mechanics in H5 favour this playstyle, because the aggressor can not maintain sprint speed while shooting. This can result in cat and mouse gameplay, where the aggressor is sprinting after another person sprinting, resulting in an extremely delayed kill or sometimes no kill at all. Alternatively, the aggressor may be forced to abandon the kill. Both instances result in slower and more jarring gameplay. In H3, the aggressor can maintain the same speed as the person put low, meaning they have much less survivability, resulting in far more kills and hence faster gameplay.

Sprint also acts as a crutch for players when they position themselves poorly. For this point I'm just gonna copy paste and old comment I made coz cba typing it all again. (Sprint) diminishes the importance of good map movement - Being in the right place at the right time is important for any FPS. Prior to sprint, if you were in a poor position, there were no movement mechanics that allowed you to relocate and compensate for your poor positioning. If your team was in a fight but you weren't there, your teammates would be fighting at a number disadvantage. If your teammates pulled the flag or oddball but you weren't holding the right angle to cover them, they would likely die as a consequence. The point is, your poor positioning meant you (or your team) were penalised in some way. Sprint allows players to relocate to the ideal position only after realising they are in a poor position, often negating this penalty. Hence, in this sense, sprint allows for sloppy map movement compared to no sprint. Also, since your fan of the skill gap, I'll chuck this one in here as well: It diminishes the significance of understanding spawn control and makes breaking spawn traps obscenely easy - One of the most unique aspects of Halo is its respawn system, and at the highest level of play understanding how spawns work is essential. This means knowing where the spawn locations are, how to manipulate them (by blocking them) and hence predict enemy spawns after killing them. Prior to sprint, when a team gained control of a map, they could position appropriately to capitalise on enemy respawns, either to spawn kill/trap them, or to block respawns to allow the flag carrier to run on that side of the map. Sprint throws this into disarray. Being able to sprint off spawn means that in a matter of seconds after spawning, a player can be on the enemies side of the map, avoiding any kind of spawn trap or containment. This is BAD as a mechanic because it lowers the skill ceiling - If you die, you should be penalised. If you killed the enemy and understand respawns you should be rewarded. This was how pre-sprint Halo was, but changed drastically after it was introduced. The result was a scrappy fiesta, where people would sprint off spawn to all corners of the map, making the game far more disjointed.
The copy/ pasted text came in without formatting, so I'll have to wait until after work to give you my thoughts. It'll take a little too long for me to digest it in its current formatting.

Also, you seem to really like to focus on the importance of the skill gap, but did you know enhanced mobility actually slows the game down (less kills per minute), therefore reducing the skill gap?
And congrats, you're now the only person I've ever read on these forums imply that aspects of H5 and advance movement play slower than older titles 👏. Your defense seems to be going pretty well. /sarcasm
In his defense, I've seen it stated multiple times on these forums that Halo CE's campaign is actually faster-paced than Halo 5's, and, from my experience, so is its multiplayer. He's not wrong in this argument, despite what your BPM may lead you to believe.

You don't think Halo 5's advanced movement allows for easier, or at least more common, escapes from encounters, thus extending the time it takes to kill your target? Because chasing your target around the map without being able to shoot sounds . . . dare I say it . . . slow, while the ease at which people can escape sounds like a reduction of the skill gap.
I have zero interest in discussing the difference in campaigns. H5's campaign is a hot mess of garbage, hindered by dumb squad mechanics, non-connected story points, and generally poor firefight arenas. It's not hard for any campaign to be faster paced than something that was created so disjointedly.

And as for the slower MP pace, I think that's just an equivocation fallacy or maybe a generalization. Less kills =/= less action. H5 has far more time spent with crosshairs pointed on opponents than other titles. The claim that people escape kills more in H5 than other titles? I just don't think that's something we can honestly present any objective evidence on, so I don't think we're should try and press it either way. Unless you can point to some sort of study or data point about all the Halo's average instances of escape per match (doesn't exist lol).

I will say, imo, if that's true, that just shows more tools in the combat toolbox exist now than there used to be. This results in a wider variety of engagements, chases, and survivals.

Older titles movement mechanics to escape were all advanced techniques. Like spring jumping or crouch jumping onto ledges on The Pit for example. Or going for there jump backwards ninja around a corner. The inclusion of sprint and slide give newer players at least something to use to save themselves, while practiced players will still know how to punish them, because they'll be better at movement combos, and know where their advanced techniques can get them to cut off escapes.
Most of those suggestions are hyperbole, and would have a MASSIVE influence on game fluidity. Sprint doesn't remove fluid gameplay at all, it just adds button combos into movement much like H2 had button combos for some combat.

Hyperbole arguments are just dumb, but your can keep going for them if you want I guess.
And here I thought it was about arbitrarily increasing the complexity for actions.
Now it's tacking "fluidity" on.
Not that it matters because "practicing makes perfect" and the good players will get used to it and perform it without issues

But if none of those actually excite you all of a sudden, it's easy, don't fret, more required actions can easily be added to the side strafing mega button combo making it 8 - 10 right timed button presses to perform that same action displayed in the videos.

Of course it's hyperbole, but it's portraying the "complexity for the sake of complexity is good" attitude on other apsects of the game to showcase what kind of things could be done for no other reason than making it complicated.

Sprint vs slide out of movement--
Having slide occur out of a higher base movement speed rather than out of sprint will result in tons of accidental slides. Did you just flank into a good position and you want to crouch to get off radar? TOO BAD, you just slid, and now your'e still on radar and probably didn't stop behind cover quite when you meant.

Without requiring the user to engage sprint with slide, you're relying on the game systems automatically choosing between two player actions mapped to the same button (crouch vs slide) rather than the player having full control and choice over their actions. Similar situations to this are always very frustrating for players in my experience playing other games.
You do realise it's possible to have a Tapped vs Held button input to either slide or crouch?

Run at full speed then tap crouch to slide, or hold to start crouching.
Or if you've got settings to toggle crouch, tap to start crouching and hold to slide.

It's not really that different to Assassinations.
Older titles movement mechanics to escape were all advanced techniques. Like spring jumping or crouch jumping onto ledges on The Pit for example. Or going for there jump backwards ninja around a corner.
Sounds a little like these new combo tricks, no?

The inclusion of sprint and slide give newer players at least something to use to save themselves, while practiced players will still know how to punish them, because they'll be better at movement combos, and know where their advanced techniques can get them to cut off escapes.
So in other words, new mechanics make it easier for newer players to escape more experienced players than before?
Or, alternatively, we're back to square one where escaping still require "advanced techniques" because the more experienced players still do their stuff to hunt down newer players. Sounds like the end result hasn't changed. Only that you chose to portray escaping as difficult in previous Halos, but turn the stake on Halo 5 and say that despite these new mechanics, it's simple to chase and eliminate.

Ah, and why exactly are newer players playing against more experienced ones again?
Having slide occur out of a higher base movement speed rather than out of sprint will result in tons of accidental slides. Did you just flank into a good position and you want to crouch to get off radar? TOO BAD, you just slid, and now your'e still on radar and probably didn't stop behind cover quite when you meant.

Without requiring the user to engage sprint with slide, you're relying on the game systems automatically choosing between two player actions mapped to the same button (crouch vs slide) rather than the player having full control and choice over their actions. Similar situations to this are always very frustrating for players in my experience playing other games.
Come on, we can be more creative, not every implementation detail needs to be identical. It would obviously be activated differently. With both sprint and thrust gone there'd be plenty of options to remap it. Even with Thruster Pack in game it could be mapped to a secondary action where thrusting while crouching or crouching while thrusting would activate slide.

Adding sprint as a pre-requisite to the slide/slide-jump adds another button into the movement combo, which does require more practice. Instead of "holding forward, slide, jump", you've got the extra button press and timing till you can engage slide to start that action sequence.

Requiring more practice -> adding to the skill ceiling and adding layers to skill gaps. We've already been through this part plenty though, so I'm sure you're tired if reading this.
I'm still not in favor of this idea that more button presses = better, but as I said making things more complex is easy. As I said above, if we retain Thruster Pack, and map slide to a button combo on thrust instead of sprint, the amount of button presses in every button combo involving a slide remains the same.

Rubbing it in your face--
Think more globally about your points and evidence you present then. Get out of the fire if you don't want to get burned 😃🔥🍻
That's not a good attitude. Everyone's bound to say something wrong at some point. Being wrong is actually fine if you admit it, and don't make a habit of it. Politely correcting errors creates a more productive atmosphere than jumping on every mistake somebody makes with glee.
A saw few things from the last 2 pages or so that should be addressed.

Halo 5 is NOT slower due to Sprint. You cannot Sprint out of a duel. If you try to Sprint out of a fight it will be cancelled. If you reach full speed in Sprint then you will no longer get canceled out of it when shot but you will be slowed down. However, shield s don't recharge and you are easy target for everyone.

I think the matches are longer due to the mechanics allowing for more risks. So often in halo 5 you can jump into a 1vs2 and survive with just a kill or no shields on two because the games mechanics allow this to happen. You can quickly move in and out from fights if you know the maps and mechanics.

Classic halo made you play incredibly safe due to its lack of movement. You always had to be next to a corner or a ledge as a fall back. And crossing any open areas was basically suicide (Zanzibar for example, even though it's one of my favorite halo maps haha). This meant many of the classic maps felt more crammed with smaller corridors and paths to make up for the lack of movement. (arena maps is what I'm talking about).

Classic and halo 5 are both different styles and I cannot say I prefer one over the other. Both have their own flaws and to me it's just preference.
Darwi wrote:
Therefore, classic halo provides the player with the greatest amount of options, while newer halos limit player options.
But in new Halo I can also intially engage the enemy at different speeds (base or sprint) and can slide. I can then also continue the battle just like in classic - by jumping, moving, and/or shooting.
First of all, if you're engaging the enemy by sliding or sprinting into them, you're doing something wrong.
Stopped reading after your first line because you're already wrong right off the bat. And not just a little wrong. This line is like SUPER wrong. It's like you picked option e when there was only a, b, c, and d on the test. What are you even thinking at this point? That's how wrong this line is.

Go watch any high end player. There are literally tons of times every match where they use sprint and/ or slide to begin their challenges
So you respond to the side topic instead of the main topic. Strong IQ dude.
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The claim that people escape kills more in H5 than other titles? I just don't think that's something we can honestly present any objective evidence on, so I don't think we're should try and press it either way. Unless you can point to some sort of study or data point about all the Halo's average instances of escape per match (doesn't exist lol).s.
So you tell us that our point can not be objectively supported, but not before you make this claim:
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H5 has far more time spent with crosshairs pointed on opponents than other titles.
A claim equally or possibly even more difficult to prove. It certainly is a rather convenient out to say that because something can't be proven by data alone one way or other, that's it's not worth discussing.

The idea that this phenomenon occurs is certainly not new. I personally don't need to see the data because I experienced it every god damn day when I played those games. However, if you still think I'm alone in this discussion, here are a couple of videos which mention cat and mouse gameplay specifically. Watch about 30 seconds after the timestamps for each video:

https://youtu.be/Upk5dwrqXaA?t=571
https://youtu.be/a_oKr8fLDnw?t=149

Of course, I would encourage you or anyone genuinely interested in this debate to watch the videos in their entirety as they list a plethora of negative outcomes caused by sprint, but I digress.
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I will say, imo, if that's true, that just shows more tools in the combat toolbox exist now than there used to be. This results in a wider variety of engagements, chases, and survivals.
Again, you're viewing sprint as a tool when it is in fact a hindrance and an illusion.
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Older titles movement mechanics to escape were all advanced techniques. Like spring jumping or crouch jumping onto ledges on The Pit for example. Or going for there jump backwards ninja around a corner. The inclusion of sprint and slide give newer players at least something to use to save themselves, while practiced players will still know how to punish them, because they'll be better at movement combos, and know where their advanced techniques can get them to cut off escapes.
You know what's great about all these skills though? You can perform all of them while in combat. Combat speed and Maximum speed does not need to be separated to foster the development of high level mechanical gameplay.
"It was very flawed in the beginning. Over the last 10 years it's been improved upon until now, where it actually adds a lot of value."

Shyway perfectly addresses some normal sprint arguments.
Ok so you can do a sprint, slide, jump challenge… ok so I’ll concede it adds that one very small thing. Does that really constitute its inclusion? Does that over ride all the negatives.
Yes, because they are abilities that are easy-to-use but hard-to-master. Mechanics with that trait are almost always beneficial in a game because there is a positive influence on the skill gap.

A newer player can use these abilities, and understands them very quickly. A well practiced player knows when and how to best use them to punish opponents.

And as to the map scale, I've always just thought that's a dumb brainless argument. If they map size is scaled up, but so is every other aspect of the game, you're still getting a very similar experience between the two scales! The only major difference at that point is one of the situations has MORE techniques for a player to learn and master, which increases potential skill ceilings and adds more layers to combat.
I think when evaluating a mechanics cohesion in a broader gameplay system, there is a bit more to it than ‘it’s easy to learn, hard to master’.

Saying sprint makes maps bigger is an over simplification of the effects of movement mechanics on map design. It won’t necessarily just be a 1 to 1 increase in scale. But I will say there is certainly an experiential difference between a long range fight and a shorter one, and there is certainly an experiential difference between combat in a space with sparse geometry variation and cover compared to a more compact combat space. Weaving in and out and jumping on/off/over this geometry makes the combat more dynamic. This is lost in Sprint no mans lands.
Absolute chad.

Sorry I got nothing new to add to the conversation. I'm happy to see a lot of people making great arguments against sprint. Warms my heart to know I'm not alone in this.
Based on today's gameplay reveal, the battle rifle has no penalty for shooting out of sprint.
And if you ask me, movement speed does not seem to change when the player exits sprint.
Would love for sprint to be animation-only, people could disable the animation of they prefer. I think this decision would unite the Halo player base!
i think and i am sure a lot off people going to disagree with it but i think its time to make a end on this discusion more about sprint and other mechanics and that thread can be closed.
sure this thread has show in the past 3 years that sprint and other mechanics is for a lot off people a problem and wane see the classic way again in the halo series but we have see in the E3 multiplayer trailer and we know all from the campaing trailer that sprint is staying in the halo series and that other new and old mechanics are in halo infinitie.
so my point is more that 343 is not going follow the same road with the halo series what bungie took.
it shows more there have took a diffrend way with the halo series and sprint and other new mechanics are now part off the halo series.
so there not going to chance it any more so this discusion on this thread can also end since 343 has show on the E3 what for the next 10 years the halo game will become.
and who knows there is a classic playlist with classic rule's there going to add for the classic fans.
Spikanor wrote:
sure this thread has show in the past 3 years that sprint and other mechanics is for a lot off people a problem and wane see the classic way again in the halo series
I never thought about it like that. That's a very good reason to use this thread for all discussions related to sprint. It will demonstrate how big of a topic this is to the Halo community! :)
LarsBars wrote:
Spikanor wrote:
sure this thread has show in the past 3 years that sprint and other mechanics is for a lot off people a problem and wane see the classic way again in the halo series
I never thought about it like that. That's a very good reason to use this thread for all discussions related to sprint. It will demonstrate how big of a topic this is to the Halo community! :)
but the point i was making that discussions about sprint is good to have that point you have right.
but what for use has it then still then if the halo series is following a new way and is staying for good more on the new way and not going back to the old classic way what a lot off people on this thread wane see.
we have all see in the halo multiplayer trailer from the E3 that 343 is not going to listing to the classic players that wane see the halo series become classic again that part has end more.
what the classic players maybe will get and thats something we need to see if there is a classic playlist coming for then with the classic rule's that you cant sprint and so and thats also a problem with some people since there wane see it full classic and not one playlist.
Spikanor wrote:
LarsBars wrote:
Spikanor wrote:
sure this thread has show in the past 3 years that sprint and other mechanics is for a lot off people a problem and wane see the classic way again in the halo series
I never thought about it like that. That's a very good reason to use this thread for all discussions related to sprint. It will demonstrate how big of a topic this is to the Halo community! :)
but the point i was making that discussions about sprint is good to have that point you have right.
but what for use has it then still then if the halo series is following a new way and is staying for good more on the new way and not going back to the old classic way what a lot off people on this thread wane see.
we have all see in the halo multiplayer trailer from the E3 that 343 is not going to listing to the classic players that wane see the halo series become classic again that part has end more.
I disagree. The fact that spartan abilities have been significantly tuned down or deleted entirely, as well as focusing on a sandbox driven experience and classic art style, implies that 343 are listening carefully to the classic audience. At the end of the day though, 343 decides what to do with that feedback - it may hit the mark, or may look like they weren't paying attention at all.
Spikanor wrote:
LarsBars wrote:
Spikanor wrote:
sure this thread has show in the past 3 years that sprint and other mechanics is for a lot off people a problem and wane see the classic way again in the halo series
I never thought about it like that. That's a very good reason to use this thread for all discussions related to sprint. It will demonstrate how big of a topic this is to the Halo community! :)
but the point i was making that discussions about sprint is good to have that point you have right.
but what for use has it then still then if the halo series is following a new way and is staying for good more on the new way and not going back to the old classic way what a lot off people on this thread wane see.
we have all see in the halo multiplayer trailer from the E3 that 343 is not going to listing to the classic players that wane see the halo series become classic again that part has end more.
I disagree. The fact that spartan abilities have been significantly tuned down or deleted entirely, as well as focusing on a sandbox driven experience and classic art style, implies that 343 are listening carefully to the classic audience. At the end of the day though, 343 decides what to do with that feedback - it may hit the mark, or may look like they weren't paying attention at all.
about the art style between new and old i really not care in halo infinitie if there going to use the old art style again and not going to use the new one's that is something i really not care and that is also counting for the art style from weapons and vehicles if there use the old one's.
the thing i only care about is the game play.
if that was going back to the bungie way's with halo 3 more then it was a diffrend story.
but since there keep following there own way what there have done with halo 4 and halo 5 and not go back to the old classic way is it for me a good thing that there keep following there own road with the halo series and not stay on the same road what bungie has done.
so thats why i ask that in the 3 years off discussion and feedback about sprint and other mechanics that 343 has make a choice now on what for road there going to walk with the halo series so the feedback on this thread is something there not going to chance it with the series.
the only thing i can think about it is to show that there need to do something with the classic fanbase like give then there own classic playlist in multiplayer.
and for the classic fanbase that wane see a classic campaign of halo infinitie there need to deal with it that its not happing any more the sprint is stay in the campaign and same go's for the other mechanics in the game for the campaign.
Spikanor wrote:
Spikanor wrote:
LarsBars wrote:
Spikanor wrote:
sure this thread has show in the past 3 years that sprint and other mechanics is for a lot off people a problem and wane see the classic way again in the halo series
I never thought about it like that. That's a very good reason to use this thread for all discussions related to sprint. It will demonstrate how big of a topic this is to the Halo community! :)
My main concern is also gameplay. The obvious nerf to sprint and deletion of several mobility mechanics implies 343 is trying to at least partially cater to the classic crowd. It also appears that they are using the sandbox as their primary vehicle of innovation, which is another thing classic fans have asked for.

To your point about a separate playlist: this won't work. Everything in the game, from maps to weapons, are balanced with enhanced mobility in mind. Creating a playlist without enhanced mobility essentially relegates the classic audience to an incomplete, sub par version of the game. The maps will feel poorly designed and the weapons will seem overpowered. It would also divide the community right off that bat, which is not a very good start to a release.
Sometimes I wonder if Skulls and other modifiers could really go in-depth when it comes to changing game settings. It wouldn't fix map design, but it might make things a little better for some people. Like being able to travel at Sprint speed without having to press a button or have the animation play, alter bullet magnetism, blast radii, and other things like that, to make it play more like Classic Halo.

I know I'm sounding defeatist, but I'm just trying to figure out a way the game could be changed for people who want it. I may be speaking too soon, because less than a day from now more multiplayer will be shown, and the game isn't out yet, but I really don't want to have to use Sprint in my preferred campaign and co-op/vs AI modes. I want the buttery smooth classic gameplay, and not the stop/start juddery "meh" I'm forced into in Reach and later. If Sprint is like it has been in the last 3 games, the least 343 can do is throw me a bone in the form of a "Classic" Skull/setting for non-matchmaking things. Is that really too much to ask at this point?
297 pages, of comments on both sides of coin, and all of the advanced movement comments are negated by one 6 minute video by Tommy Kost posted a year ago. https://youtu.be/B_eF9vcILW4

There’s no positives which AM brings to the franchise and this can be seen by the decreased population and player retention cycles with each release.

Another title and another missed opportunity.
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