Forums / Games / Halo Wars Series

[Locked] ATN Not In Season Pass?

OP H8TRFFC

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So to continue the discussion here, I will play devil's advocate on this one:

I understand where everyone is coming from, I really do. But the way I see it, this isn't a scam. This isn't a shameless "money grab." They were open with what would be included in the Season Pass. They never said all content. It never said all post-launch content would be included. We are getting our leaders, we are getting the mini-campaign.

Not only that, but the expansion more than covers the cost. That's a lot of content. I may be biased as a Halo freak but that's a lot of stuff for a decent price.

I just felt the game was a completed game when it launched (minus the technical difficulties, still wish those would be fully attended to). This feels like a legitimate expansion. A full campaign, a brand new survival mode, 2 new Banished leaders, and Blur cutscnes to back it all up? It's fantastic.

Now, before anyone comes at me saying I am biased because I'm a Monitor and I HAVE to like/support 343 in everything they do, this is false. I was quite open with my discontent at Halo 5 when it launched with barebones content (if it could even be referred to as such). This is all just my opinion. They didn't mislead us.
I think most people assume that when they pay extra for the season pass, they will be getting whatever future DLC rolls out. That's the implied promise. Why else would you buy a season pass? Why would you pay extra at launch for SOME of the unknown future content? 343 just shot themselves in the foot with this one. Gonna be tough to sell season passes for future 343 games.
In future marketing business classes this will be the real scenario case of how bad marketing can ruin a company.
343i should have released all they intended to include in the Season Pass before announcing a new separate expansion. The Season Pass specifically mentions "New Campaign Missions" and as someone who paid extra to get the season pass for the new campaign missions, I find it extremely annoying that that appears to no longer be the case. Now perhaps I am wrong and a different set of campaign missions following the Spirit of Fire will be added as part of the Season Pass. The new missions revealed today are a whole new playable faction after all, which means it could be separate from the other season Pass missions, but that just takes me back to what I said before. They could have avoided this by finishing the Season Pass and then announcing the separate expansion afterwards.

So far this doesn't appear to be the case though and 343i is basically doing this....
Hmm. $20. Is it worth it?
I have Ultimate Edition and want to buy next DLC's. But I am only playing this game on PC and don't have an xbox. So I wonder if this game is going to be on steam and if it goes will we able to cross play with them. If we can't crossplay then every money is a waste because of it's dead on pc atm. Oh and a dollar is 3.5 times of my local money, so it is really important for me.

Can you tell us something about that please? ske7chstckrboyEdit: Viper Skills
To my understanding, the last thing 343 said about Halo Wars 2 and Steam is that they had no plans to put it on Steam. But maybe someone can correct me if I am wrong on this one.
I'm pretty sure someone at Microsoft said it's going on steam, I'll find the quote
Awesome, thank you.
For some reason I couldn't link the tweet, but but here is an article that has the tweet in it.
H8TRFFC wrote:
So, after studying the Q&A of the 'Awakening the Nightmare' expansion's announcement article, it seems that it wont infact be a part of the Season Pass, and that it is an entirely standalone piece of DLC for a separate $19.99.

This comes after the reveal of the campaign missions in the Season pass being a mere 2.

Sorry 343, while I'm ecstatic to see the Flood back and excited to play as the Banished, I gotta call shenanigans where I see them.
This is shady, creating an enticing expansion that you know fans will love and then segmenting it to squeeze more cash from the spin-off because you delayed the next main game. Micro-transactions, Season Pass, and now a separate DLC expansion.
I'd like to say I expect better? But honestly at this point, I don't.

This expansion had better be significant to warrant the extra cash.
You get more than your money's worth in the season pass through all the leaders and a 2 mission expansion. From a business persepective, it is completely justified to charge money for a full campaign expansion. A LOT of development goes into adding a new faction, blur cutscenes, etc. It would make no sense not to charge more for something that huge. If it was included in the season pass, the pass would give you like 6x value on your purchase.
Hmm. $20. Is it worth it?
I think it is, full new campaign, two new leaders (which are half of the total price right there), new game mode, and with the possibility of unreleased content? I'd say it's worth it.
Hmm. $20. Is it worth it?
I think it is, full new campaign, two new leaders (which are half of the total price right there), new game mode, and with the possibility of unreleased content? I'd say it's worth it.
Oh, I thought it was a mini campaign like the one that we are still waiting for.
The season pass says it includes all Missions that expand the campaign. So why isn't this a part of the season pass? That's pretty much under the basis of false advertisment.
Hmm. $20. Is it worth it?
I think it is, full new campaign, two new leaders (which are half of the total price right there), new game mode, and with the possibility of unreleased content? I'd say it's worth it.
Oh, I thought it was a mini campaign like the one that we are still waiting for.
No that comes in the season pass
The season pass says it includes all Missions that expand the campaign. So why isn't this a part of the season pass? That's pretty much under the basis of false advertisment.
I don't think it ever said ALL missions.
Just so everyone knows, Grim confirmed that the Season Pass will include Campaign missions as promised, even though this expansion is not part of that.

"There are two MORE campaign missions, that are part of the SP :-) Not part of this. We'll talk about it soon ;-)" - Grim

I still think they could have avoided the complaints by releasing all Season Pass content before revealing a separate expansion. This is a marketing fail.
H8TRFFC wrote:
Myrmidont wrote:
I'm more surprised that people expected an entire expansion to be given away to them.
Speaking personally, I didn't expect a full campaign expansion to be 'given away' to me, I expected 4 or 5 extra missions at most to be added as part of the Season Pass I payed for.
You did get loads of leaders........
Leaders are boring...
H8TRFFC wrote:
-----------------------
You get more than your money's worth in the season pass through all the leaders and a 2 mission expansion. From a business persepective, it is completely justified to charge money for a full campaign expansion. A LOT of development goes into adding a new faction, blur cutscenes, etc. It would make no sense not to charge more for something that huge. If it was included in the season pass, the pass would give you like 6x value on your purchase.
Just gonna paste my previous post here:
Quote:
I'm not talking about perceived value of items within said Season Pass, as I even defended it's worth in another thread, citing the inclusion of HW:DE as a big plus for myself personally, but I am talking about the fact that advertising it originally as a 'Campaign Expansion', which Awakening the Nightmare is, and then changing it afterwards to 'Mini-campaign' or 'extra missions', which is now 'Operation Spearbreaker', is shady...
Look, all I and anyone else want is disclosure.
You can argue about 343 saying that 'future expansions not covered by Season Pass' would have spoiled future releases, but that's negating that we wouldn't even know what said releases were, which I think would have been pretty negligible considering the -yoink- storm they're currently in.
H8TRFFC wrote:
Myrmidont wrote:
I'm more surprised that people expected an entire expansion to be given away to them.
Speaking personally, I didn't expect a full campaign expansion to be 'given away' to me, I expected 4 or 5 extra missions at most to be added as part of the Season Pass I payed for.
You did get loads of leaders........
Leaders are boring...
That's a matter of opinion, but still the point stands that we did get our money's worth for the season pass.
The season pass says it includes all Missions that expand the campaign. So why isn't this a part of the season pass? That's pretty much under the basis of false advertisment.
I don't think it ever said ALL missions.
No you are both wrong. Kind of

Season pass, The original description said it includes a campaign expansion. They then changed it to say "missions" (I.e the 2 mission DLC, and not the expansion). So yes, false advertising, again.

Second, I said this in another thread. We are barely half way through the "season" for the season pass, yet they've already announced a seperate expansion. Yes, I understand it is large. But they should have been clear, when advertising at launch, that a large expansion will be SEPERATE to the season pass. But they didn't. When purchasing something like a season pass-especially not knowing exactly what's in it in the first place- they needed to be very clear at launch it would be seperate. It is too late now for them to say "oh hey here's the stuff you've been begging for, but pay $20 US seperately for it".

It is a textbook cashgrab and abuse of fan feedback. They KNOW people will pay extra (those who own season pass) to play a banished campaign with flood. Therefore, they remove the expansion from the pass description, change it to a small spear breaker 2 mission DLC, and seperate the expansion.

Absolutely filthy. Not even EA has done this. Sure they do too many season passes, but atleast they don't do seperate expansions to them.
Myrmidont wrote:
I'm more surprised that people expected an entire expansion to be given away to them.
Considering That's literally what was advertised..

http://i.imgur.com/4pxDG8d.png

I'm certainly not supporting this kind of cash grab. if 343 wants to lose my money that badly... I was already on the fence about buying future Halo games. If this is the kind of -Yoink- I have to look forward to, I think it's time to put the series down, even if I have been playing it since CE.
TYRELL zx wrote:
Myrmidont wrote:
This really sucks. What is the point of a Season Pass if you don't get all future content?

And 20 bucks is an insane asking price for this. The game isn't exactly content-heavy to begin with.

Myrmidont wrote:
I'm more surprised that people expected an entire expansion to be given away to them.
An "Expansion" is more than 2 missions, a couple new leaders, and 1 new mode...

I miss the days where expansions added a sequel's worth of content to a game...
I missed the part where an entire campaign is two missions, can you point out where that was said? There's also an extra two multiplayer maps on top of it.

Also, I guess everybody missed the part where this was absolutely not outlined as something you were going to get as part of the season pass.

It's not 343's fault that you all set yourselves up for disappointment despite the information already available being perfectly clear.
Erm, yes, it is their fault.

1. The season pass NEVER specified that there was DLC that would be exempt from it.

2. They've deliberately changed the season pass description at least once, and this was AFTER people bought it.

3. Season passes, unless specifically specified, are supposed to include ALL DLC.

And those maps had better be free, since 343 has said any new maps will be free...
2. This is an issue I am only dimly aware of and if it is true they did that, it's a pretty low move.
I can confirm that it's true, however people are twisting it a little.

This is the original description of the season pass:

"Grow your war chest with the Halo Wars 2 Season Pass. The Season Pass delivers regular updates that span more than six months and include: New Leaders with abilities that change the course of multiplayer battles, new Units that add to your multiplayer arsenal, a new campaign expansion with exclusive missions, and even more content to be announced soon."

This is the new version:

"Grow your war chest with the Halo Wars 2 Season Pass. The Season Pass delivers regular updates that span more than six months, including: New Leaders with abilities that change the course of multiplayer matches, new Units that add to your multiplayer arsenal, new Blitz cards to collect and take into battle, and new campaign missions that expand the Halo Wars 2 story."

This is also something that only happened on the Windows store. GameStop, Amazon, and I assume many other places still use the original description.

The only change is that they swapped out "campaign expansion with exclusive missions" to "new campaign missions that expand the Halo Wars 2 story. It still supports the fact that 343i didn't lie about any of this. At all. We're still getting Spearbreaker but we now know it's only two missions. But that doesn't change anything. Two missions or not, it still expands the story and adds more missions to the campaign. People are changing the definition to make it sound like the word 'expansion' has to be this giant package of content.
The ice on which 343 is moving here is incredibly thin.
It is, but people are acting like this is enough proof to call 343i worse than EA when they never outright lied to it's fans. They twisted a few words yes, but they never lied about anything. If you want to get upset about them twisting words, go ahead because they actually did that. But don't get mad at them for something that they never did.

Again, I'm not happy about this being separate from the season pass either, but everything I've seen brought up in this thread and more about how 343i "lied" or "screwed fans over" is evidence that either doesn't exist or can be broken down and used against them easily. I find the $20 price tag justified. We're getting a full campaign, two leaders, a game mode, and Blur cutscenes. One of those things costs a million a minute to produce.
So when they said they would completely fix MCC and years later the haven't, what would u call that? The fact people defend this company is sickening.
Myrmidont wrote:
I'm more surprised that people expected an entire expansion to be given away to them.
Considering That's literally what was advertised..

http://i.imgur.com/4pxDG8d.png

I'm certainly not supporting this kind of cash grab. if 343 wants to lose my money that badly... I was already on the fence about buying future Halo games. If this is the kind of -Yoink- I have to look forward to, I think it's time to put the series down, even if I have been playing it since CE.
Well, that's true https://news.xbox.com/2016/06/14/halo-wars-2-ultimate-edition-season-pass-halo-wars-definitive-edition-detailed/
The season pass says it includes all Missions that expand the campaign. So why isn't this a part of the season pass? That's pretty much under the basis of false advertisment.
Wrong.
Myrmidont wrote:
This really sucks. What is the point of a Season Pass if you don't get all future content?

And 20 bucks is an insane asking price for this. The game isn't exactly content-heavy to begin with.

Myrmidont wrote:
I'm more surprised that people expected an entire expansion to be given away to them.
An "Expansion" is more than 2 missions, a couple new leaders, and 1 new mode...

I miss the days where expansions added a sequel's worth of content to a game...
I missed the part where an entire campaign is two missions, can you point out where that was said? There's also an extra two multiplayer maps on top of it.

Also, I guess everybody missed the part where this was absolutely not outlined as something you were going to get as part of the season pass.

It's not 343's fault that you all set yourselves up for disappointment despite the information already available being perfectly clear.
Erm, yes, it is their fault.

1. The season pass NEVER specified that there was DLC that would be exempt from it.

2. They've deliberately changed the season pass description at least once, and this was AFTER people bought it.

3. Season passes, unless specifically specified, are supposed to include ALL DLC.

And those maps had better be free, since 343 has said any new maps will be free...
1. That would just be confirming future DLC/expansions they probably weren't legally able to discuss at that point in time. This is aside from the fact that it's not their responsibility to discuss what won't be included. I mean, wouldn't that just be silly? "If you are interested in this season pass and the new leaders it will bring, please note that it will NOT include: An air-based leader, any new tanks, any new infantry units, etc. etc.

2. This is an issue I am only dimly aware of and if it is true they did that, it's a pretty low move.

3. False. A season pass is exactly as implied - a seasonal pass. Season meaning temporary. You don't get a Summer pass at a theme park and get upset when they don't accept your pass in the Fall, right?
I am sorry, I get you are playing devils advocate but you are a consumer and as thus are directly being hurt by 343s decision here. A seasonal pass as in all games to my knowledge includes all downloadable content for a full year, though temporary we as consumers commonly have been told they exist for a year, now I'm now genius but this game ain't been out that long yet so the expansion should be covered.
The season pass description is deliberately vague to mislead a consumer to believe all content would be included, by saying:
"Grow your war chest with the Halo Wars 2 Season Pass. The Season Pass delivers regular updates that span more than six months, including: New Leaders with abilities that change the course of multiplayer matches, new Units that add to your multiplayer arsenal, new Blitz cards to collect and take into battle, and new campaign missions that expand the Halo Wars 2 story." The pass clearly states free regular updates for more than six months, this is deliberately said to give them an excuse but can still fall into Fall 2017. The vagueness begins when it states new campaign missions that expand the Halo Wars 2 story; here it does not state that only two future campaign missions are included and no other campaign expansions. This led us to the consumers to believe all campaign dlc is covered because it says that new campaign missions which expand the story are included and the expansion falls within this category.
This is a blatant money grab, it mislead consumers and it is wrong to reveal future dlc before they have even fulfilled there obligation of the season pass frankly, why have we been shown this before the 2 missions from the season pass??? If the expansion comes out before those then its plain and simple, they bent the description for which it was sold to undercut consumers and hurt our investment. I bought the season pass with the obvious reason that it meant I didn't have to fork out anymore money in the year, I don't care if I have already made my money's worth that is the whole point of the pass, I subscribed to support them with the promise of the dlc over the next 'more than' six months period being free, they lied...
Lastly, you said they would be stupid saying what is not in the expansion but at least then they would not have this backlash, when you sell a toy, companies will say "batteries not included", this is to not mislead customers. 343 did not pre-warn any consumer so as to boost Season Pass sells with the full knowledge they were working on an expansion which would not be included...you have to admit that is shady company practice. They should say because otherwise people will assume as they have that all dlc is included simple.
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