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[Locked] Design Feedback : Blitz

OP ske7ch

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Loving this game mode. It's the first time I've played RTS in a good few years but am hooked after playing some 39 matches over the weekend.

My go to is Shipmaster simply because of his Scout deck as it can secure B&C before anyone else gets close. Gives me time to get on the base and then look at what my opponent is bringing in so I can counter it. There in is my first suggestion, don't throttle group movement to the slowest member of the group. It appears that if I send my ghost out with a locust my ghost only moves as fast as the locus, I want my squad where I tell it ASAP.

I've lost a fair few blitz packs because the connection has dropped out on the very game I win the pack e.g. daily challenge or level upgrade.

There simply HAS to be more maps made available for 2v2 and 3v3. If this doesn't happen and new maps are paid DLC it will be a travesty.

Matchmaking appears random, I've had matches where I'm paired up with a 1 or 2 whilst the other team has 20+. I'm currently rank 10. Other matches might have a 10 and 12 against a 3 and 5 where it could have been evened out much better.

With deck cards I want to know what effect each level has on the cards. Am I better sending out a level 3 ghost or a level 1 something else?

I'm guessing DLC will involve either additional card types, leaders or maps. Any of these will split the game. I want to see some longer term progression possible other than random cards now and again to upgrade a unit. There's no real strategy to building my decks after the initial unit selection and I see no point in having more than one deck per leader. Once I find a set up I like I'm simply waiting for the right card to drop so I can upgrade my squad slightly. Some sort of user decision on where to strengthen would be good, so over time I can build my blitz army.
Oh and another thing, I'm stat crazy so would love to see something more in depth on the stat recording side for viewing online.

e.g. number of each type of unit or weapon used, running totals on win/loss, k/d, energy, captures etc. Separate break down of win/loss per leader and against each leader.

I'm sure all this info is recorded it just needs displaying on the website for people that love stats!
xLEEx82x wrote:
Loving this game mode. It's the first time I've played RTS in a good few years but am hooked after playing some 39 matches over the weekend.

My go to is Shipmaster simply because of his Scout deck as it can secure B&C before anyone else gets close. Gives me time to get on the base and then look at what my opponent is bringing in so I can counter it. There in is my first suggestion, don't throttle group movement to the slowest member of the group. It appears that if I send my ghost out with a locust my ghost only moves as fast as the locus, I want my squad where I tell it ASAP.

I've lost a fair few blitz packs because the connection has dropped out on the very game I win the pack e.g. daily challenge or level upgrade.

There simply HAS to be more maps made available for 2v2 and 3v3. If this doesn't happen and new maps are paid DLC it will be a travesty.

Matchmaking appears random, I've had matches where I'm paired up with a 1 or 2 whilst the other team has 20+. I'm currently rank 10. Other matches might have a 10 and 12 against a 3 and 5 where it could have been evened out much better.

With deck cards I want to know what effect each level has on the cards. Am I better sending out a level 3 ghost or a level 1 something else?

I'm guessing DLC will involve either additional card types, leaders or maps. Any of these will split the game. I want to see some longer term progression possible other than random cards now and again to upgrade a unit. There's no real strategy to building my decks after the initial unit selection and I see no point in having more than one deck per leader. Once I find a set up I like I'm simply waiting for the right card to drop so I can upgrade my squad slightly. Some sort of user decision on where to strengthen would be good, so over time I can build my blitz army.
You do know that if you want your fast units not to be impeded by your slower units if you're commanding them together, all you have to do it use the right trigger to cycle to your fast units and order them on the place u want? The unit you cycled to will move individually when you do this.

And I know that many has said this, but I just wanted to kind of elaborate on this. NERF LOCUSTS IN BLITZ MAN. For Multiplayer, they're good to go as very deadly building killers that have to be quickly countered. But in Blitz? Their range is just too far for the small Blitz map, considering they're not even Artillery units. I have seen players deploying locusts on high ground where they can shoot down on targets very far away, without facing retaliation at all. They might as well replace Blisterbacks, considering how far they can shoot, sometimes bypassing the Fog of War even. Their range should be decreased slightly, and their cost increased, because they are just too effective at picking off troops from Long range. They're like Sniper units, but with shields and effective against anything!

It is literally inpossible to win a blitz match once my enemy has spawned at least 3 Locusts.
CR0N14 wrote:
xLEEx82x wrote:
You do know that if you want your fast units not to be impeded by your slower units if you're commanding them together, all you have to do it use the right trigger to cycle to your fast units and order them on the place u want? The unit you cycled to will move individually when you do this.

Yes I knew that, just never tend to do it in Blitz. In Campaign I group units and select by type but in Blitz I sometimes just want to select most of my units and send them where I need them. I don't see why they all have to go at the same pace as the slowest.
As most know the ultimate units like the scarab and the condor in blitz have a limited life regardless of how much health they have I wouldn't mind having a timer or something showing how long they last for if that's an option
The Locusts still need more nerfs. The fact they can still move at full speed while firing is too easy to abuse.
The unit response rate as well selecting leader abilities has a huge latency issue. When using special abilities they don't respond half the time or will just move to the area and just sit there. This is causing an individual to fiddle with that unit loosing valuable time commanding other units.
Do starting armies also level up? Because I just had a match where my 3 starting Warthogs (Cutter) could not take down a level 6 Bloodfuel Locust. In my opinion 3 Warthogs should be able to take down one Bloodfuel Locust and yes I used all 3 Rams but it just heal itself fast than I could hurt it. No to mention why am I (with level 4 cards at most) facing a 3 premade group with all level 6 card or higher. Yes at least one of my teammates had level 6 cards as well but I felt -Yoinking!- powerless! My level 2 Archer Missiles hit one players full army and the worst hurt units lost maybe half of their health. Matches like these really suck the fun out of Blitz.
[Edit] Sry this was more venting the feedback. To put it in another way. You (CA/343) should think about revising the Blitz leveling system. Even if a player does an non optimal play having a significantly higher level opponent deck to face always feels cheap to play against! I suggested something like a max level for card for competitive game modes on reddit as a possible solution to the problem. Link: https://www.reddit.com/r/HaloWars/comments/5vau3t/suggestion_competitive_blitz_mode/
Spartans hyjack far too quickly to the point where they're immposible to stop before they steal one of your vehicles. This is incredibly annoying with expensive vehicles like Grizzlys and Vultures. The hyjacks need to take a lot longer or Spartans need to be considerably more vunerable while hyjacking so it's less easy to abuse. Spartans can simply solo jump into the middle of a sizeable army steal a high cost vehicle then retreat far too easily. Anti-Infantry barely puts a scratch on them so there's no viable countermeasures.
why421 wrote:
Do starting armies also level up? Because I just had a match where my 3 starting Warthogs (Cutter) could not take down a level 6 Bloodfuel Locust. In my opinion 3 Warthogs should be able to take down one Bloodfuel Locust and yes I used all 3 Rams but it just heal itself fast than I could hurt it. No to mention why am I (with level 4 cards at most) facing a 3 premade group with all level 6 card or higher. Yes at least one of my teammates had level 6 cards as well but I felt -Yoinking!- powerless! My level 2 Archer Missiles hit one players full army and the worst hurt units lost maybe half of their health. Matches like these really suck the fun out of Blitz.
No they do not level up starting armies. And you need some anti-vehicle to take out a bloodfuel locust not warthogs.
1.The Banished leaders feel much too similar at the moment because of the prevalence of locusts spamming on the B/C ridge. Decimus' powers Blast Hammer and Vortex don't feel like they are worth the cost.
2. Locusts and bloodfuel locust still feel game breaking strong. Locusts can hit targets beyond their line of sight and their beam weapons never miss like scorpions and such. This range and consistently high damage output coupled with their ability to move while firing makes them much stronger than units twice the cost. I feel that that they should cost at least 80/120. Where they are now, at 40/60, they feel like they provide too much value for the cost and let players camp the ridge and hold 2 control points and 3 energy spawns. Even outside of the ridge camping strategy, bloodfuel locusts do so much damage that they can siphon heal themselves enough to kill a scorpion in single combat. A vehicle that can easily kill another vehicle of double the cost is simply imbalanced. It makes games against Banished much less fun than UNSC opponents. Edit: Oh, and hellbringers could use a buff, I know they're the cheapest UNSC unit, but they are anti-infantry and struggle to kill a lowly grunt squad.
3. I have only played a few games of blitz firefight but the change in energy gathering style and mindless zerging AI were not fun for me. The flat energy gain makes cycling cards feel bad and no experience gain from such a long game mode is unrewarding.
4. How do I like the design of the single map? I liked the blitz mode beta for the fast paced, dynamic gameplay but that has diminished now that people recognize the advantage of holding the ridge between B/C. I like that this is somewhat counteracted by having 5 energy spawns on the other side but it doesn't feel like enough with the current state of unit balancing.
5. I like the overall idea of blitz and it is my favorite game mode in HW2. The siphon mechanic just feels a bit too strong at the moment and the locust imbalance needs work
As a full leader specific deck is more important than a leveled up deck, I am not liking that I have some cards above lvl5, an average deck of lvl.2.4 but I am without a full library.

I've played the campaign for decks, bought some decks, and am grinding challenges for decks... But not having my Shipmaster's Honor Guard is preventing me from enjoying him further as he's missing his champion card.

And it's not like I'm only a few decks in. That's sorta my issue, knowing how the leader specific cards give flavour to my possible decks but I'm missing possibilities relatively "far" into deck opening.

Can only imagine grief of someone buying as many pack as I've opened and still have 5 or so cards to fill out the library.

Enjoying the gameplay in the meantime :)
Blood Fuel Locusts are invincible when spammed and put on the ridge between b and a. They should definitely be more expensive or less range.
Blood Fuel Locusts are invincible when spammed and put on the ridge between b and a. They should definitely be more expensive or less range.
I think you mean between B and C. Have you tried flying a single unit over there and dropping a blast unit in? In 2v2 or 3v3 drop a blast unit and a couple of powers. It wrecks that ridge in seconds. I've done it myself and been on the receiving end of it many times. It actually cripples their army, as believe me most of their resources go into securing that ridge.

I honestly don't mind it. This map shows that artillery is very important but I am sure later maps could be geared towards other strengths. They could do anything. Like points only accessible with air units. Artillery ridges that are constantly EMP blasted or something. Needless to say this is only the first Blitz map. I am not worried. I expect each map will have different strategies.
Blood Fuel Locusts are invincible when spammed and put on the ridge between b and a. They should definitely be more expensive or less range.
I think you mean between B and C. Have you tried flying a single unit over there and dropping a blast unit in? In 2v2 or 3v3 drop a blast unit and a couple of powers. It wrecks that ridge in seconds. I've done it myself and been on the receiving end of it many times. It actually cripples their army, as believe me most of their resources go into securing that ridge.

I honestly don't mind it. This map shows that artillery is very important but I am sure later maps could be geared towards other strengths. They could do anything. Like points only accessible with air units. Artillery ridges that are constantly EMP blasted or something. Needless to say this is only the first Blitz map. I am not worried. I expect each map will have different strategies.
Yeah I wholly agree with what u said, but the thing people are angry about isn't the ridge between B and C and artillery units. Those are gameplay aspects we all have to take advantage of or counter, but what lots of people can't accept is the effectiveness of the Locust. Not just when it's placed on the ridge, but anywhere on the map in general, fighting your units. Anyway I think that even if Locusts were put on the ridge and we did the tactics you said to counter them, since they don't have to lockdown like artillery units, they can scramble off the ridge quickly to escape any blast units and bombardments. Any damage they take from any leader powers will probably just inflict onto their shields if they escape fast enough, which will just recharge after a few seconds. This is one of many reasons that Locusts are hard to counter.
CR0N14 wrote:
Blood Fuel Locusts are invincible when spammed and put on the ridge between b and a. They should definitely be more expensive or less range.
I think you mean between B and C. Have you tried flying a single unit over there and dropping a blast unit in? In 2v2 or 3v3 drop a blast unit and a couple of powers. It wrecks that ridge in seconds. I've done it myself and been on the receiving end of it many times. It actually cripples their army, as believe me most of their resources go into securing that ridge.

I honestly don't mind it. This map shows that artillery is very important but I am sure later maps could be geared towards other strengths. They could do anything. Like points only accessible with air units. Artillery ridges that are constantly EMP blasted or something. Needless to say this is only the first Blitz map. I am not worried. I expect each map will have different strategies.
Yeah I wholly agree with what u said, but the thing people are angry about isn't the ridge between B and C and artillery units. Those are gameplay aspects we all have to take advantage of or counter, but what lots of people can't accept is the effectiveness of the Locust. Not just when it's placed on the ridge, but anywhere on the map in general, fighting your units. Anyway I think that even if Locusts were put on the ridge and we did the tactics you said to counter them, since they don't have to lockdown like artillery units, they can scramble off the ridge quickly to escape any blast units and bombardments. Any damage they take from any leader powers will probably just inflict onto their shields if they escape fast enough, which will just recharge after a few seconds. This is one of many reasons that Locusts are hard to counter.
You say that but I have effectively countered them no problem, and have had mine countered no problem. Not all units should have the same ranges or powers. When they are bunched together granted they are harder to deal with. But you missed my point with a blast unit and a leader power. You use them to trap them in. One either side. They have nowhere to go. With Mac Blast or Archer Missiles they die instantly if done correctly. Believe me it is so effective in 2v2 or 3v3 that I really don't care about the ridge at all anymore.
noticed a glitz today. if the reaver locks on to the blitserback in air it can keep firing when it locks down on the ground. i recorded this on my profile today if that makes it easier to view-

xbox prof: germb0t
I was looking forward to this patch and when it finally arrived I was very happy.
But unfortunately this patch hasn't fixed half of the existing issues. Yeah they have tweaked stuff here and there, but I still get network errors when opening Blitz Packs and I still get network errors while joining or leaving friends. Matchmaking is extremely slow. Yeah the loading times are less when your map is loading, but searching for other players takes ages. And I'm still not happy about the fact that we can't decide if we want to play 2v2 or 3v3. It's allways random, why???They also need to do something about the Marine/Chopper/Jackrabbit/Ghost rushes. 9/10 people rush your base in under 5 minutes and that is not fun. They only thing you can do to counter that is to do the same thing. I don't want to do that. I want to play late games.So, I expressed my concerns and the game isn't fixed by far. But I guess we have to wait for better patches to come.
ah and atleast Show us in a blitz match the average lvl of the deck we are playing with and against. since you established a P2W mode into a full Price game at least Show us the power of the decks.

Nobody can cry about P2W anymore when they are constantly in Matches with Players of an equal average lvl and if you have f.e. 1 Player in each Team with average lvl of 6 and 1 Player each Team with lvl 3 deck then you at least know which Opponent is the bigger threat and can adjust your tactic. if you see the better Opponent attacking a Point your teammate with avg. decklvl of 3 is Holding then you know you have to Support otherwise it could end badly, but you know that before the Opponent steamrolls over him.

this wouldnt Change the blitzmode and the paymodel, but People who get equal opponents constantly will stop complaining and gives us in multiplayer where we have unequal Teams a sense of tactic in where we have to Support a teammate more or less depending on his strenght and the strenght of the Opponent sending troops to him.

and maybe Display the full decklist from our whole Team in the loading Screen with the lvl of the Cards. so yeah its basically a new type of loadscreen where you dont stare at cause you are bored, you stare at it cause it gives you relevant informations about your team. its like a briefing before a Mission. load Screen Needs to be up for at least like 10-15sec which isnt hard since the loadscreens are painfully Long right now anyway. and/or give us the damn warmup time for it.

and for gods sake the warmup time where i cant even move my camera or select my Units already is so annoying. right now you spam E to get your Units asap. why cant you let us select our Units in the warmup time and put them in different Groups. they cant move but the damn preparation for the start of the game can be done in the warmup. how can i "warmup" when i cant even do anything.
I was looking forward to this patch and when it finally arrived I was very happy.
But unfortunately this patch hasn't fixed half of the existing issues. Yeah they have tweaked stuff here and there, but I still get network errors when opening Blitz Packs and I still get network errors while joining or leaving friends. Matchmaking is extremely slow. Yeah the loading times are less when your map is loading, but searching for other players takes ages. And I'm still not happy about the fact that we can't decide if we want to play 2v2 or 3v3. It's allways random, why???They also need to do something about the Marine/Chopper/Jackrabbit/Ghost rushes. 9/10 people rush your base in under 5 minutes and that is not fun. They only thing you can do to counter that is to do the same thing. I don't want to do that. I want to play late games.So, I expressed my concerns and the game isn't fixed by far. But I guess we have to wait for better patches to come.
Well the rushes can be countered if you take the right steps early game. You got to scout aggressively to see if the enemy is planning a rush, and just train the counter units to combat the units you've spotted.

However, yes I do agree that something has to be done about the rushes, we shouldn't let these unskilled strategies affect how we play the first 10 minutes of every game, because just the threat of these rushes are forcing us to adopt the same play style early game just so that we can survive these encounters. For example, because of how often these rushes happen, nobody can rapidly expand their bases and focus on economy because the moment they do and neglect training an army, if a rush happens, theyll be wrecked.

Focusing less on building an army and scouting shouldn't be so harshly punished by these deadly rushes, they should still remain a viable strategy, but just not so effective until it can defeat players within minutes.
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