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[Locked] Goliath Rush OP?

OP HowsTheCow00

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marmy080 wrote:
marmy080 wrote:
So far I've gone up against several Goliath rushes, it seems to be the only thing colony players do. Just always be on the look out for the few paths they can take to your base and destroy them with whatever army you have.
This guy is a noob, I goliath rushed him the other day and killed like 2 whole mini bases. Don’t listen to anything he has to say- Goliaths are OP and need a big nerf.
#googone
#goliathgone
Goliaths are not overpowered in the slightest. Scout and build counters, that's all that it takes.
pahaha dude I know that, check my game history
I did, I don't know what you expected me to find. There is no evidence suggesting Goliaths are OP
agree, all it can show what each of you built but does not show show if you challenged their rush before or after they reached your base or ability to micro, making no proof for the statement they are OP.
marmy080 wrote:
marmy080 wrote:
So far I've gone up against several Goliath rushes, it seems to be the only thing colony players do. Just always be on the look out for the few paths they can take to your base and destroy them with whatever army you have.
This guy is a noob, I goliath rushed him the other day and killed like 2 whole mini bases. Don’t listen to anything he has to say- Goliaths are OP and need a big nerf.
#googone
#goliathgone
Goliaths are not overpowered in the slightest. Scout and build counters, that's all that it takes.
pahaha dude I know that, check my game history
I did, I don't know what you expected me to find. There is no evidence suggesting Goliaths are OP
I was having a laugh at my 2v2 partner thats all
Goliaths don't really "rush" anywhere :)
joking aside, i've used goliaths early and I'm far from an expert (getting better),but pumping them out and getting them to an enemies base isn't as easy as other tactics.
marmy080 wrote:
marmy080 wrote:
So far I've gone up against several Goliath rushes, it seems to be the only thing colony players do. Just always be on the look out for the few paths they can take to your base and destroy them with whatever army you have.
This guy is a noob, I goliath rushed him the other day and killed like 2 whole mini bases. Don’t listen to anything he has to say- Goliaths are OP and need a big nerf.
#googone
#goliathgone
Goliaths are not overpowered in the slightest. Scout and build counters, that's all that it takes.
pahaha dude I know that, check my game history
I did, I don't know what you expected me to find. There is no evidence suggesting Goliaths are OP
He wants you to know that he plays the same leader and does the same strat every game. Also he that he hasn't played Colony in a very long time. Or thats what I got out of it
Honestly I do feel that Goliath are OP. Suicide grunts don't effect them so your counter options are scouts, flamers, or grunts. which that infantry is countered by suicide and the scouts by shrapnel mine grunts so the opponent can easily pump your counter and Goliath rush you at the same time and there is little you can do about that. I think this discussion really missed the point that Goliath have to be killed before they get to your base so you or your teammate needs to escort them there safely. Overall they do too much base damage for their price. Also note I mainly do 1v1 so I speak from that perspective mostly.
lJGl Fox wrote:
Honestly I do feel that Goliath are OP. Suicide grunts don't effect them so your counter options are scouts, flamers, or grunts. which that infantry is countered by suicide and the scouts by shrapnel mine grunts so the opponent can easily pump your counter and Goliath rush you at the same time and there is little you can do about that. I think this discussion really missed the point that Goliath have to be killed before they get to your base so you or your teammate needs to escort them there safely. Overall they do too much base damage for their price. Also note I mainly do 1v1 so I speak from that perspective mostly.
Goliath "Rush" isn't Op literally any early game comp can stop them assuming you dont let them get to your base and drop engineer swarm.

You cant pump grunts with goliaths on one base and if they stop building goliaths for sui then stop pushing the base and take map control. GG

Edit:
A Much more effective strategie with goliath is to harass, build 5-6. And split them across the map to mini bases while sending a couple to the main base, this splits your opponents attention and will more likely get you some nice building kills
Counter Strategy of course would be to split your units and micro accordingly,
A backup plan to this would be to raly your goliaths together and wait for your opponent to engage your army or attack your base and then send your goliath back in to the main base (or expos at this point) and try to connect and get that base kill,
Of course another counter to this is to have good map awareness and intercept the goliaths with a small group of your own or build some Turrets/fortification to simply shut it down.

At the end of the day Goliath are not Op and its just another "rush" strategy expect it when you see a colony, its not hard to stop.
lJGl Fox wrote:
Honestly I do feel that Goliath are OP. Suicide grunts don't effect them so your counter options are scouts, flamers, or grunts. which that infantry is countered by suicide and the scouts by shrapnel mine grunts so the opponent can easily pump your counter and Goliath rush you at the same time and there is little you can do about that. I think this discussion really missed the point that Goliath have to be killed before they get to your base so you or your teammate needs to escort them there safely. Overall they do too much base damage for their price. Also note I mainly do 1v1 so I speak from that perspective mostly.
I did actually speak on prospective to goliaths as well mentioned they must be beaten before they reach your base. This is usually not a huge problem but they do need a build time nerf or higher cost to say the least but I think they are overall ok.
lJGl Fox wrote:
Honestly I do feel that Goliath are OP. Suicide grunts don't effect them so your counter options are scouts, flamers, or grunts. which that infantry is countered by suicide and the scouts by shrapnel mine grunts so the opponent can easily pump your counter and Goliath rush you at the same time and there is little you can do about that. I think this discussion really missed the point that Goliath have to be killed before they get to your base so you or your teammate needs to escort them there safely. Overall they do too much base damage for their price. Also note I mainly do 1v1 so I speak from that perspective mostly.
Goliath "Rush" isn't Op literally any early game comp can stop them assuming you dont let them get to your base and drop engineer swarm.

You cant pump grunts with goliaths on one base and if they stop building goliaths for sui then stop pushing the base and take map control. GG

Edit:
A Much more effective strategie with goliath is to harass, build 5-6. And split them across the map to mini bases while sending a couple to the main base, this splits your opponents attention and will more likely get you some nice building kills
Counter Strategy of course would be to split your units and micro accordingly,
A backup plan to this would be to raly your goliaths together and wait for your opponent to engage your army or attack your base and then send your goliath back in to the main base (or expos at this point) and try to connect and get that base kill,
Of course another counter to this is to have good map awareness and intercept the goliaths with a small group of your own or build some Turrets/fortification to simply shut it down.

At the end of the day Goliath are not Op and its just another "rush" strategy expect it when you see a colony, its not hard to stop.
Turrets don't shut down Goliaths It's either kill them before they get to the base or have a stun ability but if a good amount reach the base it will drop. Also if your opponent is wasting resources on flamers you can very well waste your on sui grunts. As for Splitting them I agree it is a great way to use them.
lJGl Fox wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
Honestly I do feel that Goliath are OP. Suicide grunts don't effect them so your counter options are scouts, flamers, or grunts. which that infantry is countered by suicide and the scouts by shrapnel mine grunts so the opponent can easily pump your counter and Goliath rush you at the same time and there is little you can do about that. I think this discussion really missed the point that Goliath have to be killed before they get to your base so you or your teammate needs to escort them there safely. Overall they do too much base damage for their price. Also note I mainly do 1v1 so I speak from that perspective mostly.
Goliath "Rush" isn't Op literally any early game comp can stop them assuming you dont let them get to your base and drop engineer swarm.

You cant pump grunts with goliaths on one base and if they stop building goliaths for sui then stop pushing the base and take map control. GG

Edit:
A Much more effective strategie with goliath is to harass, build 5-6. And split them across the map to mini bases while sending a couple to the main base, this splits your opponents attention and will more likely get you some nice building kills
Counter Strategy of course would be to split your units and micro accordingly,
A backup plan to this would be to raly your goliaths together and wait for your opponent to engage your army or attack your base and then send your goliath back in to the main base (or expos at this point) and try to connect and get that base kill,
Of course another counter to this is to have good map awareness and intercept the goliaths with a small group of your own or build some Turrets/fortification to simply shut it down.

At the end of the day Goliath are not Op and its just another "rush" strategy expect it when you see a colony, its not hard to stop.
Turrets don't shut down Goliaths It's either kill them before they get to the base or have a stun ability but if a good amount reach the base it will drop. Also if your opponent is wasting resources on flamers you can very well waste your on sui grunts. As for Splitting them I agree it is a great way to use them.
Im pretty sure we agree on everything i just said expect you misunderstand what i mean by
"Turrets/Fortification Shut it down"
Without a doubt turrets can stop a few goliath in the mid game, im not saying they can stop a full 80 pop but definitely enough to clean up whatever
survive the "Rush" you also shouldn't have to worry about any more goliath harassment short of the drop.
The 2nd misunderstanding is you assume im saying buliding sui is a "Waste of Resources" but what im really saying is Its a Wast of Resources to charge a base that is (Potentially, Double) pumping suis and it would be much better to take map control.
(I.E Power Nodes, Mini Bases, Expos.)
If you're a good enough, you should be able to care that advantage to win.
lJGl Fox wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
Honestly I do feel that Goliath are OP. Suicide grunts don't effect them so your counter options are scouts, flamers, or grunts. which that infantry is countered by suicide and the scouts by shrapnel mine grunts so the opponent can easily pump your counter and Goliath rush you at the same time and there is little you can do about that. I think this discussion really missed the point that Goliath have to be killed before they get to your base so you or your teammate needs to escort them there safely. Overall they do too much base damage for their price. Also note I mainly do 1v1 so I speak from that perspective mostly.
Goliath "Rush" isn't Op literally any early game comp can stop them assuming you dont let them get to your base and drop engineer swarm.

You cant pump grunts with goliaths on one base and if they stop building goliaths for sui then stop pushing the base and take map control. GG

Edit:
A Much more effective strategie with goliath is to harass, build 5-6. And split them across the map to mini bases while sending a couple to the main base, this splits your opponents attention and will more likely get you some nice building kills
Counter Strategy of course would be to split your units and micro accordingly,
A backup plan to this would be to raly your goliaths together and wait for your opponent to engage your army or attack your base and then send your goliath back in to the main base (or expos at this point) and try to connect and get that base kill,
Of course another counter to this is to have good map awareness and intercept the goliaths with a small group of your own or build some Turrets/fortification to simply shut it down.

At the end of the day Goliath are not Op and its just another "rush" strategy expect it when you see a colony, its not hard to stop.
Turrets don't shut down Goliaths It's either kill them before they get to the base or have a stun ability but if a good amount reach the base it will drop. Also if your opponent is wasting resources on flamers you can very well waste your on sui grunts. As for Splitting them I agree it is a great way to use them.
Im pretty sure we agree on everything i just said expect you misunderstand what i mean by
"Turrets/Fortification Shut it down"
Without a doubt turrets can stop a few goliath in the mid game, im not saying they can stop a full 80 pop but definitely enough to clean up whatever
survive the "Rush" you also shouldn't have to worry about any more goliath harassment short of the drop.
The 2nd misunderstanding is you assume im saying buliding sui is a "Waste of Resources" but what im really saying is Its a Wast of Resources to charge a base that is (Potentially, Double) pumping suis and it would be much better to take map control.
(I.E Power Nodes, Mini Bases, Expos.)
If you're a good enough, you should be able to care that advantage to win.
Even if they double pump sui it won't matter sui countering Goliath is like countering warthogs with sui it just doesn't work. The best way is grunt spam or scout. Then Goliath sui comes into play. Other then that I think you have the right idea
lJGl Fox wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
Honestly I do feel that Goliath are OP. Suicide grunts don't effect them so your counter options are scouts, flamers, or grunts. which that infantry is countered by suicide and the scouts by shrapnel mine grunts so the opponent can easily pump your counter and Goliath rush you at the same time and there is little you can do about that. I think this discussion really missed the point that Goliath have to be killed before they get to your base so you or your teammate needs to escort them there safely. Overall they do too much base damage for their price. Also note I mainly do 1v1 so I speak from that perspective mostly.
Goliath "Rush" isn't Op literally any early game comp can stop them assuming you dont let them get to your base and drop engineer swarm.

You cant pump grunts with goliaths on one base and if they stop building goliaths for sui then stop pushing the base and take map control. GG

Edit:
A Much more effective strategie with goliath is to harass, build 5-6. And split them across the map to mini bases while sending a couple to the main base, this splits your opponents attention and will more likely get you some nice building kills
Counter Strategy of course would be to split your units and micro accordingly,
A backup plan to this would be to raly your goliaths together and wait for your opponent to engage your army or attack your base and then send your goliath back in to the main base (or expos at this point) and try to connect and get that base kill,
Of course another counter to this is to have good map awareness and intercept the goliaths with a small group of your own or build some Turrets/fortification to simply shut it down.

At the end of the day Goliath are not Op and its just another "rush" strategy expect it when you see a colony, its not hard to stop.
Even if they double pump sui it won't matter sui countering Goliath is like countering warthogs with sui it just doesn't work. The best way is grunt spam or scout. Then Goliath sui comes into play. Other then that I think you have the right idea
I was talking from the perspective of UNSC since that is what you mentioned

"Also if your opponent is wasting resources on flamers you can very well waste your on sui grunts."

Going back to the goliath discussion, they're easy to stop with core infantry alone, Goliath are not Op.
lJGl Fox wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
Honestly I do feel that Goliath are OP. Suicide grunts don't effect them so your counter options are scouts, flamers, or grunts. which that infantry is countered by suicide and the scouts by shrapnel mine grunts so the opponent can easily pump your counter and Goliath rush you at the same time and there is little you can do about that. I think this discussion really missed the point that Goliath have to be killed before they get to your base so you or your teammate needs to escort them there safely. Overall they do too much base damage for their price. Also note I mainly do 1v1 so I speak from that perspective mostly.
Goliath "Rush" isn't Op literally any early game comp can stop them assuming you dont let them get to your base and drop engineer swarm.

You cant pump grunts with goliaths on one base and if they stop building goliaths for sui then stop pushing the base and take map control. GG

Edit:
A Much more effective strategie with goliath is to harass, build 5-6. And split them across the map to mini bases while sending a couple to the main base, this splits your opponents attention and will more likely get you some nice building kills
Counter Strategy of course would be to split your units and micro accordingly,
A backup plan to this would be to raly your goliaths together and wait for your opponent to engage your army or attack your base and then send your goliath back in to the main base (or expos at this point) and try to connect and get that base kill,
Of course another counter to this is to have good map awareness and intercept the goliaths with a small group of your own or build some Turrets/fortification to simply shut it down.

At the end of the day Goliath are not Op and its just another "rush" strategy expect it when you see a colony, its not hard to stop.
Turrets don't shut down Goliaths It's either kill them before they get to the base or have a stun ability but if a good amount reach the base it will drop. Also if your opponent is wasting resources on flamers you can very well waste your on sui grunts. As for Splitting them I agree it is a great way to use them.
Im pretty sure we agree on everything i just said expect you misunderstand what i mean by
"Turrets/Fortification Shut it down"
Without a doubt turrets can stop a few goliath in the mid game, im not saying they can stop a full 80 pop but definitely enough to clean up whatever
survive the "Rush" you also shouldn't have to worry about any more goliath harassment short of the drop.
The 2nd misunderstanding is you assume im saying buliding sui is a "Waste of Resources" but what im really saying is Its a Wast of Resources to charge a base that is (Potentially, Double) pumping suis and it would be much better to take map control.
(I.E Power Nodes, Mini Bases, Expos.)
If you're a good enough, you should be able to care that advantage to win.
Even if they double pump sui it won't matter sui countering Goliath is like countering warthogs with sui it just doesn't work. The best way is grunt spam or scout. Then Goliath sui comes into play. Other then that I think you have the right idea
You must be accidentally double pumping Jump Pack Brutes or Grunts! That happens from time to time! Whem he says sui or suicides, he is refering to suicide grunts that are from the raid camp, second from the top on the right side. I have used this interesting and uniqur strategy from time to time, and its amazing how double pumping (thats using two raid camps, generally on the same base, not a mini, for maximum effectiveness) actually kills Goliaths!!

Sarcasm aside, Goliaths are not OP, far from it. They are exactly where they should be and should stay. Double puming sui’s (look above for referance incase you forgot!) does stop them. Unless you’re just getting a raid camp up when you see them running to you from the middle of the map, and you didnt scout, you should be able to easily fend them off with sui’s. One or two engineers from a mini, while you double pump would make it much easier to get that extra time. Assuming you have teammates, you should have no issue fending it off if you scout. Theres plenty of time to adapt, and we have yet to find a true goliath strat that takes the base down. If we can do it so can you!!

For OP, Many say a turret would work, which it might. Personally my team doesnt use this method. If you do, one or two would need to have the anti infantry upgrade to really be viable. Engineers are essential to surving rushes and you should be able to always have 4+ by the 3 minutes mark. Snipers can do well should they not drop. Flamers are a solid choice aswell to double pump. Marines to kill any engineers to keep the goliaths alive after the initial engy healing drop is important. Make sure you prioritize your fire to them with marines/grunts. Killing the base killers leaves you with room to 2v3 theirs remaining units. The reason goliaths shouldnt be to hard to fight is if you have healing on the base the goliaths are stuck to hitting it. If they change their priority to ram,base hp goes up, they generally lose one or two because of the counter units fighting and the turrets hitting them, and they struggle to get into the base in a proper line, leaving a few not hitting it for a few seconds. All in all, since they are stuck to a base, your in a 3v2 war. If you need yo heal the base while fightig the supporting units do so. Chip out a few of the goliaths and let healing from your teams engineers do the rest. Focus the supportif units, then return to the goliaths. Push nodes with weak
units you can pull from the fight.

My final and major piece of advice, the moment you realize where they intend to target, before the rush happens, get that user a base on the opposite side. If they succeed in the fight and taking the base, you should have had enough time to get it to its 5 pad self with your eco moving.

Good luck!
Ruzylo wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
Honestly I do feel that Goliath are OP. Suicide grunts don't effect them so your counter options are scouts, flamers, or grunts. which that infantry is countered by suicide and the scouts by shrapnel mine grunts so the opponent can easily pump your counter and Goliath rush you at the same time and there is little you can do about that. I think this discussion really missed the point that Goliath have to be killed before they get to your base so you or your teammate needs to escort them there safely. Overall they do too much base damage for their price. Also note I mainly do 1v1 so I speak from that perspective mostly.
Goliath "Rush" isn't Op literally any early game comp can stop them assuming you dont let them get to your base and drop engineer swarm.

You cant pump grunts with goliaths on one base and if they stop building goliaths for sui then stop pushing the base and take map control. GG

Edit:
A Much more effective strategie with goliath is to harass, build 5-6. And split them across the map to mini bases while sending a couple to the main base, this splits your opponents attention and will more likely get you some nice building kills
Counter Strategy of course would be to split your units and micro accordingly,
A backup plan to this would be to raly your goliaths together and wait for your opponent to engage your army or attack your base and then send your goliath back in to the main base (or expos at this point) and try to connect and get that base kill,
Of course another counter to this is to have good map awareness and intercept the goliaths with a small group of your own or build some Turrets/fortification to simply shut it down.

At the end of the day Goliath are not Op and its just another "rush" strategy expect it when you see a colony, its not hard to stop.
Turrets don't shut down Goliaths It's either kill them before they get to the base or have a stun ability but if a good amount reach the base it will drop. Also if your opponent is wasting resources on flamers you can very well waste your on sui grunts. As for Splitting them I agree it is a great way to use them.
K pretty sure we agree on everything i just said expect you misunderstand what i mean by
"Turrets/Fortification Shut it down"
Without a doubt turrets can stop a few goliath in the mid game, im not saying they can stop a full 80 pop but definitely enough to clean up whatever
survive the "Rush" you also shouldn't have to worry about any more goliath harassment short of the drop.
The 2nd misunderstanding is you assume im saying buliding sui is a "Waste of Resources" but what im really saying is Its a Wast of Resources to charge a base that is (Potentially, Double) pumping suis and it would be much better to take map control.
(I.E Power Nodes, Mini Bases, Expos.)
If you're a good enough, you should be able to care that advantage to win.
Even if they double pump sui it won't matter sui countering Goliath is like countering warthogs with sui it just doesn't work. The best way is grunt spam or scout. Then Goliath sui comes into play. Other then that I think you have the right idea
You must be accidentally double pumping Jump Pack Brutes or Grunts! That happens from time to time! Whem he says sui or suicides, he is refering to suicide grunts that are from the raid camp, second from the top on the right side. I have used this interesting and uniqur strategy from time to time, and its amazing how double pumping (thats using two raid camps, generally on the same base, not a mini, for maximum effectiveness) actually kills Goliaths!!

Sarcasm aside, Goliaths are not OP, far from it. They are exactly where they should be and should stay. Double puming sui’s (look above for referance incase you forgot!) does stop them. Unless you’re just getting a raid camp up when you see them running to you from the middle of the map, and you didnt scout, you should be able to easily fend them off with sui’s. One or two engineers from a mini, while you double pump would make it much easier to get that extra time. Assuming you have teammates, you should have no issue fending it off if you scout. Theres plenty of time to adapt, and we have yet to find a true goliath strat that takes the base down. If we can do it so can you!!

For OP, Many say a turret would work, which it might. Personally my team doesnt use this method. If you do, one or two would need to have the anti infantry upgrade to really be viable. Engineers are essential to surving rushes and you should be able to always have 4+ by the 3 minutes mark. Snipers can do well should they not drop. Flamers are a solid choice aswell to double pump. Marines to kill any engineers to keep the goliaths alive after the initial engy healing drop is important. Make sure you prioritize your fire to them with marines/grunts. Killing the base killers leaves you with room to 2v3 theirs remaining units. The reason goliaths shouldnt be to hard to fight is if you have healing on the base the goliaths are stuck to hitting it. If they change their priority to ram,base hp goes up, they generally lose one or two because of the counter units fighting and the turrets hitting them, and they struggle to get into the base in a proper line, leaving a few not hitting it for a few seconds. All in all, since they are stuck to a base, your in a 3v2 war. If you need yo heal the base while fightig the supporting units do so. Chip out a few of the goliaths and let healing from your teams engineers do the rest. Focus the supportif units, then return to the goliaths. Push nodes with weak
units you can pull from the fight.

My final and major piece of advice, the moment you realize where they intend to target, before the rush happens, get that user a base on the opposite side. If they succeed in the fight and taking the base, you should have had enough time to get it to its 5 pad self with your eco moving.

Good luck!
While I do agree Goliath rush is not OP where they are unbeatable, your speaking as though they are not a problem to any sense. Goliaths are indeed dangerous and goliaths are actually good at killing core infantry just like most building killers but better. Also, suicide Grunts are between trash and decent against goliaths. Suicide Grunts are used too wipe infantry and though they are Overpowered as anti infantry, damage dealt as AoE or splash damage and because Goliaths are big, Its actually cheaper too mass Goliaths as they will actually be far less effective as the AoE will barely touch them, making the best anti-rush in game worthless. Same thing goes for Flamers as they Completely destroy by Goliaths with their Charge while dealing great damage for their cost. Even if Flamers DO beat them, the costs are still greater and thats assuming they are not building Suicide Grunts themselves into the mix. Goliaths are beatable but they indeed need a debuff nonetheless for early game strength such as increasing their cost slightly and build time. I also want to point out even if you have maxed turrets as UNSC, you must beat them BEFORE they reach your base on first tec as they kill your base too fast.
Ruzylo wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
lJGl Fox wrote:
Honestly I do feel that Goliath are OP. Suicide grunts don't effect them so your counter options are scouts, flamers, or grunts. which that infantry is countered by suicide and the scouts by shrapnel mine grunts so the opponent can easily pump your counter and Goliath rush you at the same time and there is little you can do about that. I think this discussion really missed the point that Goliath have to be killed before they get to your base so you or your teammate needs to escort them there safely. Overall they do too much base damage for their price. Also note I mainly do 1v1 so I speak from that perspective mostly.
Goliath "Rush" isn't Op literally any early game comp can stop them assuming you dont let them get to your base and drop engineer swarm.

You cant pump grunts with goliaths on one base and if they stop building goliaths for sui then stop pushing the base and take map control. GG

Edit:
A Much more effective strategie with goliath is to harass, build 5-6. And split them across the map to mini bases while sending a couple to the main base, this splits your opponents attention and will more likely get you some nice building kills
Counter Strategy of course would be to split your units and micro accordingly,
A backup plan to this would be to raly your goliaths together and wait for your opponent to engage your army or attack your base and then send your goliath back in to the main base (or expos at this point) and try to connect and get that base kill,
Of course another counter to this is to have good map awareness and intercept the goliaths with a small group of your own or build some Turrets/fortification to simply shut it down.

At the end of the day Goliath are not Op and its just another "rush" strategy expect it when you see a colony, its not hard to stop.
Turrets don't shut down Goliaths It's either kill them before they get to the base or have a stun ability but if a good amount reach the base it will drop. Also if your opponent is wasting resources on flamers you can very well waste your on sui grunts. As for Splitting them I agree it is a great way to use them.
K pretty sure we agree on everything i just said expect you misunderstand what i mean by
"Turrets/Fortification Shut it down"
Without a doubt turrets can stop a few goliath in the mid game, im not saying they can stop a full 80 pop but definitely enough to clean up whatever
survive the "Rush" you also shouldn't have to worry about any more goliath harassment short of the drop.
The 2nd misunderstanding is you assume im saying buliding sui is a "Waste of Resources" but what im really saying is Its a Wast of Resources to charge a base that is (Potentially, Double) pumping suis and it would be much better to take map control.
(I.E Power Nodes, Mini Bases, Expos.)
If you're a good enough, you should be able to care that advantage to win.
Even if they double pump sui it won't matter sui countering Goliath is like countering warthogs with sui it just doesn't work. The best way is grunt spam or scout. Then Goliath sui comes into play. Other then that I think you have the right idea
You must be accidentally double pumping Jump Pack Brutes or Grunts! That happens from time to time! Whem he says sui or suicides, he is refering to suicide grunts that are from the raid camp, second from the top on the right side. I have used this interesting and uniqur strategy from time to time, and its amazing how double pumping (thats using two raid camps, generally on the same base, not a mini, for maximum effectiveness) actually kills Goliaths!!

Sarcasm aside, Goliaths are not OP, far from it. They are exactly where they should be and should stay. Double puming sui’s (look above for referance incase you forgot!) does stop them. Unless you’re just getting a raid camp up when you see them running to you from the middle of the map, and you didnt scout, you should be able to easily fend them off with sui’s. One or two engineers from a mini, while you double pump would make it much easier to get that extra time. Assuming you have teammates, you should have no issue fending it off if you scout. Theres plenty of time to adapt, and we have yet to find a true goliath strat that takes the base down. If we can do it so can you!!

For OP, Many say a turret would work, which it might. Personally my team doesnt use this method. If you do, one or two would need to have the anti infantry upgrade to really be viable. Engineers are essential to surving rushes and you should be able to always have 4+ by the 3 minutes mark. Snipers can do well should they not drop. Flamers are a solid choice aswell to double pump. Marines to kill any engineers to keep the goliaths alive after the initial engy healing drop is important. Make sure you prioritize your fire to them with marines/grunts. Killing the base killers leaves you with room to 2v3 theirs remaining units. The reason goliaths shouldnt be to hard to fight is if you have healing on the base the goliaths are stuck to hitting it. If they change their priority to ram,base hp goes up, they generally lose one or two because of the counter units fighting and the turrets hitting them, and they struggle to get into the base in a proper line, leaving a few not hitting it for a few seconds. All in all, since they are stuck to a base, your in a 3v2 war. If you need yo heal the base while fightig the supporting units do so. Chip out a few of the goliaths and let healing from your teams engineers do the rest. Focus the supportif units, then return to the goliaths. Push nodes with weak
units you can pull from the fight.

My final and major piece of advice, the moment you realize where they intend to target, before the rush happens, get that user a base on the opposite side. If they succeed in the fight and taking the base, you should have had enough time to get it to its 5 pad self with your eco moving.

Good luck!
While I do agree Goliath rush is not OP, your speaking as though they are not a problem to any sense. Goliaths are indeed dangerous and goliaths are actually good at killing core infantry just like most building killers but better. Also, suicide Grunts are between trash and decent against goliaths. Suicide Grunts are used too wipe infantry and though they are Overpowered as anti infantry, damage dealt as AoE or splash damage and because Goliaths are big, Its actually cheaper too mass Goliaths as they will actually be far less effective as the AoE will barely touch them, making the best anti-rush in game worthless. Same thing goes for Flamers as they Completely destroy by Goliaths with their Charge while dealing great damage for their cost. Goliaths are not OP but they indeed need debuff nonetheless for early game strength such as increasing their cost slightly and build time. I also want to point out even if you have maxed turrets as UNSC, you must beat them BEFORE they reach your base on first tec as they kill your base too fast.
I guess we are at a disagreement then. I have never considered Goliaths to be a threat to anything but a disorganized team. In my opinion, if they get nerfed they will more then likely become useless, as they already are in top tier games. Unless you are dark
maximus.
Lun06 wrote:
Whenever someone posts something like this I always look at their game history to see what went wrong and how they can improve.

Individually, the team you played against built 39 units. 13 goliath and over 20 jump pack brutes and a couple of grunts. Your team built..... around 10 units and no anti infantry. And had only 1 turret on your base. Total not each. First off if I faced a Atriox and colony combo my first thought is rush, and I will check for it. How in Chiefs name did neither you nor your teammate not notice 33 rush units until they were at your base? Can you honestly tell me you didn't deserve that defeat? The result would have been the same with flamers, enforcers, or maybe even grunts with how few units you built.

Onto the wider issue, yes Goliaths fringe upon the OP territory. If you don't catch them before they arrive at your base you are screwed, unless you are a higher level player. However even then a higher level player would know to use chopper stun, leaders powers, anti infantry units, and maybe a turret in the back of the base if they see it coming. Anti infantry also shreds Goliaths if they are caught out in the open. The main problem with Goliaths is their y ability. It makes it where with the stun, the Goliaths are able to kill units that they should not. I say if the y ability is an upgrade costing say 300 to 400 power, then it would be a fair and balanced. However others feel free to give your input as well.
You can pump out 3 Goliaths in the first 2 minutes and have them at the enemy base no problem.
At that point unless you've went entirely into anti infantry/rush there's nothing you can really do
Getting out 3 Goliaths and at enemy base in 2 minutes does seem a bit much
draycole wrote:
Getting out 3 Goliaths and at enemy base in 2 minutes does seem a bit much
Lol if they do that their eco will be terrible
lJGl Fox wrote:
draycole wrote:
Getting out 3 Goliaths and at enemy base in 2 minutes does seem a bit much
Lol if they do that their eco will be terrible
You can only do it if you go barracks first, so yeah, it's pretty much suicide. Should get scouted and wrecked easily. Once dealt with it's an economic auto win.
Assuming you don't die

I think it's more of an issue in team games than in singles. In singles you can just scout it and react. But in doubles when there are 2+ colony players it's extremely difficult to stop. I think the build I went for was sui's and ghosts. I picked off quite a few goliaths before they reached my main, even blocking them at a choke for a while, but he just dropped more in and engineer swarmed it. Come ot think of it, he might have been doing the colony exploit.
Ive only pulled off goliaths rushes in 1s when I straight up caught the other guy with his pants down and in 3s when I have double chopper support. If the other team expects it and they have half a mind for the game, it is very stoppable with snipers, banished scouts, suicide grunts, a well split marine ball to intercept in the field. I honestly think its a strategy like any other. It works sometimes and it doesn't other times depending on how good you and your opponents are.
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