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Johnson's Bunkers in Blitz

OP HugeBullfrog

Sergeant Johnson's Drop Bunker ability needs to be fixed in blitz.
For only 50 energy it is one of the hardest abilities to overcome. If a sniper and a cyclops or two are inside, the bunker can withstand a force much greater than its size. Even with a sizable army it still takes a while to destroy a bunker. I feel that this is both detrimental to the high-speed nature of blitz and is far too valuable for it's cost. Furthermore, if it's a 2v2 blitz and there's double Johnson players placing bunkers it becomes virtually impossible to take control of a point. My argument is that strategy games are all about moves and counter moves. If someone drops a bunker, artillery, blast units and anti-building units should be able to counter it much faster. Currently it takes an army backed by much more expensive abilities to destroy a cheap bunker filled with cheap troops.

I suggest bunkers have a cost increase to 70 and have their health reduced somewhere in the range of 25-50%. OR make it much more vulnerable to certain types of attacks (artillery, blast units, anti-building units).
Blast unit.
The Bunkers themselves aren't so much an issue at the moment. The real problem is Guard units affecting the Bunker, as they make the Bunker near invincible when properly supported.

Keep in mind, the Bunker is really all Johnson has. If the changes you suggested went through, there wouldn't be much of a point in playing him.

Also, the Bunker is static, meaning it stays in one place and can't move. If your opponent drops a Bunker on B with a Cyclops and Sniper (as you said), that's 140 energy they just spent on holding B. Take A and C away and force them to move. Additionally, if they're spending energy on the Bunker, they'll have less energy to contest the energy, allowing you to gain obtain it easier and pull ahead.
What if your leader doesn't have blast units?
Are other people seriously not having this issue? Granted I've only ran into this play three times (there are tons of skill levels and lots of leaders so it's only on occasion this has been a problem). I'm concerned that it will grow as people run into it more. It's a very cheesy strategy that is virtually impossible to beat, especially if your commander doesn't have blast units.

To recap, with my suggestion:
Bunkers can make it virtually impossible to gain control of points in Blitz. Blast units are the only somewhat cost-effective counter, but not every UNSC commander has blast units and even then blast units are not a fool proof counter.

Primary Balance Suggestion: Make Bunkers (or the units garrisoned in them rather) unable to contest control points.
Coming from someone who has Johnson as their most played leader in blitz i feel that the strat is quite beatable as it struggles with energy collection enough said he is a bad leader.
But to address some other points about the bunkers (Cuz his mech build sucks) The bunker can be stunned by anything (Drops, Jump pack brutes etc) unless they have a guard unit unsc does have outs to the bunker only no one plays them an example is the vulture a unit whitch chould kill a bunker with one hit with the missle (intil the damage nerf to buildings thanks DM players) and genally kodiaks on the base/ridges will deal with them as for specific leaders Jerome kills bunkers with the v turret, Serina frezzez the bunker (shout out to Srtz Vibzz) Forge runs 2 kodiaks for maximum chesse and Kinsano basically burns everything to death these are the counters to address your argument "My argument is that strategy games are all about moves and counter moves"- scrub well these are the counter moves and the guard bunker strat itself was to deal with infantry spam which was very relevent becuase of Shipmaster/Kinsano and their dumb drops .
And for the iceing on the cake JOHNSON HAS NO REPRESENTATION ON THE LEADERBOARDS CURRENTLY the last person who played him was miaeh last season and his Johnson build was very beatable i am in fact talking about 2v2 open becuase anything is viable in 3s.

In conclusion you are bad a this PTW gamemode
Johnson is fine LEAVE HIM ALONE
after a year no one still has learned how to play Blitz
and SaddJoker is going to get everything nerfed unjustly.
and SaddJoker is going to get everything nerfed unjustly.
Sadder Joker *

If you draw issue with any of the recommendations I made in regards to Blitz balancing I recommend you speak to me directly, instead of remaining silent then throwing jabs on a public forum. I asked as many Blitz players as I could for input, you had more than enough opportunities to provide your opinion.

Of all the Blitz players I spoke to about Blitz balancing, you are the only one who feels that Guard Bunkers are balanced, when they are so clearly broken beyond belief. Also, did you even see the recommendations we made? Unlikely, as in said recommendations, Johnson was given more buffs than nerfs.

Anyways, since you're ignorant to this, let me lay it out for you. Here's what we recommended for Johnson;

-the only nerf to him was not allowing his Bunker to be affected by Guard units and slightly lowering the heal rate of bunker
-Buffing Mantis/Colossus across the board
-Buffing his hero
-Giving him another rush unit
-Giving him another anti infantry option
-Buffing his Siege Turret drop
-Buffing his MAC
-Improving both starting hands

As you can see, Ol' Johny was recommended far more buffs than nerfs. So, please, don't speak from ignorance. Educate yourself first.

If you would like to discuss any balance related issue or offer your opinion, im happy to listen. But you're not going to get results like this.
What if your leader doesn't have blast units?
Doesn't every leader have access to suicide grunts or unstable units? I'm going off of memory but all the decks I've used have had access to these units.
In conclusion you are bad a this PTW gamemode
Johnson is fine LEAVE HIM ALONE
after a year no one still has learned how to play Blitz
and SaddJoker is going to get everything nerfed unjustly.
The salt is strong in this one.
I guess everyone would agree on this point: All the top-players will never have problems in dealing with Johnsons Bunkers. This has exactly 2 specific reasons: All the top players play leaders which can easily handle Bunkers (Anti-Building-Infantry, Locusts etc.). But the problem increases exponentially when lower tier players are faced against Bunkers. How to balance this? I have no idea.

What Sadder adresses: I would also suggest that guard units shouldnt affect Bunkers.
Hey Sadder Joker I'd love to see that full list you made with other champs and weigh in. Where's it at?
In regardes to Sadd joker looking at the quip i made at the end (wasn't related to the argumet btw just talking about counters) and having to make a comment calling me ignorant just have to say to that I have been playing blitz at champ lv since season 3, I have been playing Johnson as my main sice season 4 i have talked to all of the relevant players at the champ lv im well aware of each leader in the meta game the Johnson-Atriox combo and while a cool interaction between the two leaders is not fast or powerful enough to deal with Kinsano decks right now so i don't see why it needs to be nerfed i get you said that Johnson wanted buffs thats a good idea comeing from a person who has played Johnson as thier main (yes im repeating myself) and im going to go over the list to agree/disagree

-the only nerf to him was not allowing his Bunker to be affected by Guard units and slightly lowering the heal rate of bunker
Why whould take away his only viable strategy?
-Buffing Mantis/Colossus across the board
This is good because mech builds have always been hot garbage.
-Buffing his hero
he already has his hero with T3 upgrades so i don't see the point he just cost to much like all heros do
-Giving him another rush unit
literally the fix to any unsc leader not named kinsano or cutter.
-Giving him another anti infantry option
Bunkers are already an A tier anti infantry option makeing it a already good pick against shipmaster/Atriox/Cutter/Kinsano jk on that last part hellbringers are anti-building
-Buffing his Siege Turret drop
I don't see the point in this it already is just a kodiak but worse as the kodiak dosen't self-destruct.
-Buffing his MAC
The mac is already a good card choice why do you think it was nerfed in the first place as it gives a soft-solution to mass locust spam that Johnson decks struggle against.
-Improving both starting hands
*Starting Armys it chould have a jackrabbit in one of them its ok how it is not great as the faster leaders but johnsons playstyle is slow control focused.

Again the I don't think the Atriox-Johnson strategy (yes it is one like it or not) dosen't need to be adressed and i doubt that they can "patch it" as its already hard coded into the game, i think we shouldent expand on this as this thread as it is intended to focus on the bunker aspect of Johnson and not the leader as a whole and next time don't get so trigger happy about a line of text thats unrelated to the main argument Joker you muppet ;)
In regardes to Sadd joker looking at the quip i made at the end (wasn't related to the argumet btw just talking about counters) and having to make a comment calling me ignorant just have to say to that I have been playing blitz at champ lv since season 3, I have been playing Johnson as my main sice season 4 i have talked to all of the relevant players at the champ lv im well aware of each leader in the meta game the Johnson-Atriox combo and while a cool interaction between the two leaders is not fast or powerful enough to deal with Kinsano decks right now so i don't see why it needs to be nerfed i get you said that Johnson wanted buffs thats a good idea comeing from a person who has played Johnson as thier main (yes im repeating myself) and im going to go over the list to agree/disagree

-the only nerf to him was not allowing his Bunker to be affected by Guard units and slightly lowering the heal rate of bunker
Why whould take away his only viable strategy?
-Buffing Mantis/Colossus across the board
This is good because mech builds have always been hot garbage.
-Buffing his hero
he already has his hero with T3 upgrades so i don't see the point he just cost to much like all heros do
-Giving him another rush unit
literally the fix to any unsc leader not named kinsano or cutter.
-Giving him another anti infantry option
Bunkers are already an A tier anti infantry option makeing it a already good pick against shipmaster/Atriox/Cutter/Kinsano jk on that last part hellbringers are anti-building
-Buffing his Siege Turret drop
I don't see the point in this it already is just a kodiak but worse as the kodiak dosen't self-destruct.
-Buffing his MAC
The mac is already a good card choice why do you think it was nerfed in the first place as it gives a soft-solution to mass locust spam that Johnson decks struggle against.
-Improving both starting hands
*Starting Armys it chould have a jackrabbit in one of them its ok how it is not great as the faster leaders but johnsons playstyle is slow control focused.

Again the I don't think the Atriox-Johnson strategy (yes it is one like it or not) dosen't need to be adressed and i doubt that they can "patch it" as its already hard coded into the game, i think we shouldent expand on this as this thread as it is intended to focus on the bunker aspect of Johnson and not the leader as a whole and next time don't get so trigger happy about a line of text thats unrelated to the main argument Joker you muppet ;)
Oh, you ;).

I wasnt caling you ignorant as a player, only ignorant to the balance recommendations I made (your little quip). I know you're good; I learned first hand, lol.

While brief, I appreciate the input. Thank you.

But yes, let's not derail this thread any more than we already have.
What if your leader doesn't have blast units?
Doesn't every leader have access to suicide grunts or unstable units? I'm going off of memory but all the decks I've used have had access to these units.
All covenant have Blast units because they all have access to suicide grunts.
Most UNSC leaders don't have blast units.
Johnson
Anders
Forge
Sierna
Jerome
Kinsano (grey area, hero is a blast unit and hell charge ability is blast-unit-like)

Back on topic for everyone.
What about my simple suggestion that garrisoned bunkers simply cannot contest control points?
Leave everything else about them the same. Go ahead and suggest whatever other buffs for Johnson. I'm simply talking about this one problem - bunkers.