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OP nuchey

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This thread is no longer relevant, plz lock
I wouldn't mind a small buff to Anti Air, maybe a little health or damage, but honestly they're in a decent spot right now. As UNSC you should be mixing in Marines to counter Air, especially upgraded Marines, they shred air and they're not bad units overall. As Banished, Grunts are less of a viable Anti Air option because.....well....they're Grunts lol. But that's why Banshees get an AA upgrade. If you scout an opponent building Air, hit them while they're building up, air isn't cheap. And keep your AA towards the back of your army, they need buffer units to soak up damage because AA units are squishy.

Edit: Also I agree with you that Anti Air sucks against everything that isn't Air, so a small buff probably wouldn't hurt.
Please don't, Banshees are hardly worth it unless you have 120 pop of them.
Hell to tha naw.

If air gets nerfed anymore (directly or indirectly), it will be useless, and I would personally hate to see this happen.

I know I keep saying this a thousand times over, but air is ONLY an issue if one allows an opponent to build up a significant population and purchase the upgrades. On some larger maps, air can be annoying due to its mobility, but that's the point of air units.

I'm almost all cases, I prefer when an opponent(s) goes air because I find it rather easy to deal with. If you're struggling against air, it's likely you're being out playered and/or require more practice at the game.

Air is fine. Please, stop asking for direct/indirect nerfs to it. I don't wish for the Devs to see threads like this, and make un-needed nerfs.
nuchey wrote:
Here we go.

Unlike units like hunters/cyclops, if you buff AA it's only goiing to effect air! So why not do it? Anti air does pathetic damage to air. If I have a good amount of banshees/Hornets and I see reavers/wolverines I don't feel threatened at all. I know all I have to do is use a few leader powers to weaken the AA or use leader powers to buff my air and I can wipe it out. In fact, a full pop of air can take half a full pop of anti air! and that's without the use of any leader powers! What is this madness! Why isn't anti air an effective counter against air? The only effective counter is more air! It makes the gameplay very repetitive.

Let's also not forget that Air is fast, and anti air is slow. Therefore it should do a lot of damage to air when it can before they all fly away to wreak havoc somewhere else.

TLDNR; Air shouldn't be better than Anti Air.
Air isn't better than AA, unless you're outnumbered or out-teched pretty heavily.

AA wrecks Air, but you need to upgrade your vehicles and prepare. If you scout 2 apexes, or start seeing lots of banshees/hornets, get your AA going stat. Yes, air is fast and can harass your minis and hop around, but it can also be dealt with.

Also, if you put constant pressure on your opp, with a few AA mixed in, you'll be able to stop them before the 120pop banshees emerge.
I wouldn't mind a small buff to Anti Air, maybe a little health or damage, but honestly they're in a decent spot right now. As UNSC you should be mixing in Marines to counter Air, especially upgraded Marines, they shred air and they're not bad units overall. As Banished, Grunts are less of a viable Anti Air option because.....well....they're Grunts lol. But that's why Banshees get an AA upgrade. If you scout an opponent building Air, hit them while they're building up, air isn't cheap. And keep your AA towards the back of your army, they need buffer units to soak up damage because AA units are squishy.

Edit: Also I agree with you that Anti Air sucks against everything that isn't Air, so a small buff probably wouldn't hurt.
Banished grunts are not great against air unless yapyap's heavy grunts. In my experience, they serve as some of the best cheap anti-air as a core infantry. In many cases of my own, banshees can destroy bases very quicly, even with all wolfs and reavers, but they are not cheap either. Even being more costly, they have fly nearly and where while anti air can hardly dent my air units. All in all, i think anti-air is weaker than spamming core infantry in many cases. A good upside is the range in which they can fire and even kite away while they suffer in thir futile chase but that can hardly present itself a benefactor when banshees keep destroying someones base. The only persons fault for losing to air is always YOUR fault as you should never even gave someone time to build air units.
I was hoping this would be a necro thread. I'm disappointed.
nuchey wrote:
Here we go.

Unlike units like hunters/cyclops, if you buff AA it's only goiing to effect air! So why not do it? Anti air does pathetic damage to air. If I have a good amount of banshees/Hornets and I see reavers/wolverines I don't feel threatened at all. I know all I have to do is use a few leader powers to weaken the AA or use leader powers to buff my air and I can wipe it out. In fact, a full pop of air can take half a full pop of anti air! and that's without the use of any leader powers! What is this madness! Why isn't anti air an effective counter against air? The only effective counter is more air! It makes the gameplay very repetitive.

Let's also not forget that Air is fast, and anti air is slow. Therefore it should do a lot of damage to air when it can before they all fly away to wreak havoc somewhere else.

TLDNR; Air shouldn't be better than Anti Air.
Air isn't better than AA, unless you're outnumbered or out-teched pretty heavily.

AA wrecks Air, but you need to upgrade your vehicles and prepare. If you scout 2 apexes, or start seeing lots of banshees/hornets, get your AA going stat. Yes, air is fast and can harass your minis and hop around, but it can also be dealt with.

Also, if you put constant pressure on your opp, with a few AA mixed in, you'll be able to stop them before the 120pop banshees emerge.
AA does not "wreck air" what game have you been playing
I think an AA buff to health and speed should help balance things out!
nuchey wrote:
nuchey wrote:
Here we go.

Unlike units like hunters/cyclops, if you buff AA it's only goiing to effect air! So why not do it? Anti air does pathetic damage to air. If I have a good amount of banshees/Hornets and I see reavers/wolverines I don't feel threatened at all. I know all I have to do is use a few leader powers to weaken the AA or use leader powers to buff my air and I can wipe it out. In fact, a full pop of air can take half a full pop of anti air! and that's without the use of any leader powers! What is this madness! Why isn't anti air an effective counter against air? The only effective counter is more air! It makes the gameplay very repetitive.

Let's also not forget that Air is fast, and anti air is slow. Therefore it should do a lot of damage to air when it can before they all fly away to wreak havoc somewhere else.

TLDNR; Air shouldn't be better than Anti Air.
Air isn't better than AA, unless you're outnumbered or out-teched pretty heavily.

AA wrecks Air, but you need to upgrade your vehicles and prepare. If you scout 2 apexes, or start seeing lots of banshees/hornets, get your AA going stat. Yes, air is fast and can harass your minis and hop around, but it can also be dealt with.

Also, if you put constant pressure on your opp, with a few AA mixed in, you'll be able to stop them before the 120pop banshees emerge.
AA does not "wreck air" what game have you been playing
Ones that include scouting.
It's a flawed move because Air is meant to be strong against ground vehicles. Since AA is crap right now, if you are UNSC, use upgraded marines with wolverines, and if you are Banished, use the upgraded banshees. Hopefully this tactic won't have to be relied on forever because I would like to use Reavers and Wolves more effectively.
Anti air should have a damage buff vs core air only. Core air can already out maneuver and out spam anti air. Right now 20 hornets can fly in and wreck 10 wolverines with focus fire and you don't need to pay a dime of energy to do it, but the person who is spamming reavers or wolverines need to put an arm and a leg worth of energy down to stay alive. Also I think that air spam is only a problem in 2v2s and 3v3s. It's much harder to prevent someone from getting critical mass unless your entire team is super aggressive.
I wish the Grunts did more damage to Air. Infantry is supposed to beat Air and Grunts are the only Infantry that can even shoot Air which is frustrating I think.
Anti air should have a damage buff vs core air only. Core air can already out maneuver and out spam anti air. Right now 20 hornets can fly in and wreck 10 wolverines with focus fire and you don't need to pay a dime of energy to do it, but the person who is spamming reavers or wolverines need to put an arm and a leg worth of energy down to stay alive. Also I think that air spam is only a problem in 2v2s and 3v3s. It's much harder to prevent someone from getting critical mass unless your entire team is super aggressive.
This.
nuchey wrote:
nuchey wrote:
Here we go.

Unlike units like hunters/cyclops, if you buff AA it's only goiing to effect air! So why not do it? Anti air does pathetic damage to air. If I have a good amount of banshees/Hornets and I see reavers/wolverines I don't feel threatened at all. I know all I have to do is use a few leader powers to weaken the AA or use leader powers to buff my air and I can wipe it out. In fact, a full pop of air can take half a full pop of anti air! and that's without the use of any leader powers! What is this madness! Why isn't anti air an effective counter against air? The only effective counter is more air! It makes the gameplay very repetitive.

Let's also not forget that Air is fast, and anti air is slow. Therefore it should do a lot of damage to air when it can before they all fly away to wreak havoc somewhere else.

TLDNR; Air shouldn't be better than Anti Air.
Air isn't better than AA, unless you're outnumbered or out-teched pretty heavily.

AA wrecks Air, but you need to upgrade your vehicles and prepare. If you scout 2 apexes, or start seeing lots of banshees/hornets, get your AA going stat. Yes, air is fast and can harass your minis and hop around, but it can also be dealt with.

Also, if you put constant pressure on your opp, with a few AA mixed in, you'll be able to stop them before the 120pop banshees emerge.
AA does not "wreck air" what game have you been playing
Ones that include scouting.
You all act like scouting is the fix all to every balance problem. So you're playing 3v3 and scout, oh no double apex! Better make those wolverines. So you make them and then what? Wait to be attacked? What will the banshees do once they see your wolverines. Either A) Nuke them with powers or B) Fly to your teammates and take them out. And sometimes C) Take out your wolverines with your banshees bc wolverines aren't effective against Air! (Why do wolverines and reavers focus fire naturally? It makes no sense)

So let's say all of your teammates make anti air. You probably won't have gone T3 because of all the power required to make Wolvs and Reavers. So what has the enemy been up to? They've been going T3 because all they spend are resources on their air army. T3=Leader points faster. So now they have a natural advantage by going air in that they are T3 before you're T3 and they have more leader powers than you.

So what's the other option to do after you scout? Rush the banshees guy right? Only problem is you'll be expose your slow army of AA. So the enemy will either A) Nuke your AA. B) Repel your rush with their teammates and counter attack you (Ending the game prematurely FUN!) or C) your rush works and it ends the game prematurely (FUN!)

Rinse repeat rinse repeat. This is the cycle Halo Wars 2 has always been in. You know why Air wasn't as much of a problem in HW1? Because AA was effective against Air!!
Pelican transports for every UNSC player meant you could get your wolverines around the map and their missiles absolutely shredded air, even if you only had a few mixed in with your army. Vampires on the other hand were fast and could literally stasis air units and use them to heal themselves!

Make AA great again!
People keep saying scout out the enemy, but even if you do and you see the two apexes it is highly likely that they already have about 5-6 Banshees out and if you try to switch to AA that is a whole lot of time to have to build your counter. Remember, they'll have two apexs double pumping, probably with logistics whilst you still need to build at least two factories, then, upgrade your AA, then build them. So even if you do switch to AA, all that time you used to get some wolvs or reavers is a massive chunk of time the enemy has to build up a full pop. By the time you have 2-3 wolvs the enemy will just have a full population and not only that probably Tier 3 as core air requires no power.
EVEN if you are lucky enough to build a substantial army you can't really attack as if you leave your base the air will just fly right by your slow AA and just melt your base unless you invested in 4 lvl 3 AA turrets. If you're playing 3's you better hope one of the other enemies just doesn't come on by and sweep your AA with tanks or anti-vehicle.
If you encounter the air, they'll just fly away because they are faster than your AA and just harass or destroy your expansions as air - banshees in particular - are pretty much flying locusts.
People keep saying scout out the enemy, but even if you do and you see the two apexes it is highly likely that they already have about 5-6 Banshees out and if you try to switch to AA that is a whole lot of time to have to build your counter. Remember, they'll have two apexs double pumping, probably with logistics whilst you still need to build at least two factories, then, upgrade your AA, then build them. So even if you do switch to AA, all that time you used to get some wolvs or reavers is a massive chunk of time the enemy has to build up a full pop. By the time you have 2-3 wolvs the enemy will just have a full population and not only that probably Tier 3 as core air requires no power.
EVEN if you are lucky enough to build a substantial army you can't really attack as if you leave your base the air will just fly right by your slow AA and just melt your base unless you invested in 4 lvl 3 AA turrets. If you're playing 3's you better hope one of the other enemies just doesn't come on by and sweep your AA with tanks or anti-vehicle.
If you encounter the air, they'll just fly away because they are faster than your AA and just harass or destroy your expansions as air - banshees in particular - are pretty much flying locusts.
This is exactly why when AA does make contact with Air it should do more damage to make it count! Also Reavers and Wolverines should not naturally focus fire, it makes no sense!
What do you all not understand? Sure, AA needs a buff but because you see 2 apex build does not mean they can build a full army. To max out Banshees, you need no less than 12k. That is a huge cost so you rush really everything against them before they can max out, which will take time if they don't have resources. Even if Grunts are not strong to combat air, they are cheaper and far quicker to build to end their resources. What if both sides have established economy? you keep hitting them so they don't have surplus supplies and time to build them.
Maybe just a very slight buff to the anti-air? We wouldn't want them to strong as it will make air useless. In 3v3 there is a whole lotta positioning, scouting, and good teamwork to deal with any given situation. That is why it is really good to always keep the pressure on as much as possible to prevent out of control huge air armies.
AA Doesn't need a buff. They're already a little too overwhelming
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