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Why are air units so hard to counter?

OP EVILWOMBAT25

It seems no matter how many reavers or wolverines I make they always get melted one by one by a massive swarm of air units, unless they're all clumped together and I destroy them with a leader power these mass air swarms are basically invincible in my experience. God help me if two enemy teams full of hornets or banshees attack at once as that's effectively an automatic win for them.

I think my biggest problem with air is that they are so ridiculously faster than my reavers. Every time I try to engage the air units just fly around to the other side of my base out of my units range, then when I get over to them they just do the same thing AGAIN!!! I mean this is just so ridiculous, and it's exactly why I encounter multiple people massing air units In literally every single match. They are simply far too fast to the point they can outmaneuver pretty much any other units to launch multiple hit and runs against however many bases they want. If things don't go their favor they simply run away and try again somewhere else in the span of like 6 seconds. So annoying.
Sigh another air thread. Your playing covenant you can just leave 8 Reavers in your shield and an air mass can't touch you..Have the rest of your units push.Scout enough and you'll stop them from massing air in the first place...
Sigh another air thread. Your playing covenant you can just leave 8 Reavers in your shield and an air mass can't touch you..Have the rest of your units push.Scout enough and you'll stop them from massing air in the first place...
"If your covenant"..... so you gotta be a certain leader or else you cant counter air?..

I use to be 1 on the leaderboard and i loved it when people made anti air to try and counter my deci banshees... basically just makes it so that they have to just defend the whole game until i eventually over power them since they cant damage bases with all the anti air they made to try and stop the banshee army.

I can admit air is still too strong.. and i still cant believe Decimus has not been nerfed yet..... and this is coming from a Deci main...
Sigh another air thread. Your playing covenant you can just leave 8 Reavers in your shield and an air mass can't touch you..Have the rest of your units push.Scout enough and you'll stop them from massing air in the first place...
I've been doing this for months but it doesn't stop them. Shields go down in like 5 seconds while my reavers get demolished immediately afterwards. Mass air is just too ridiculous. I just finished a game where my opponent was decimus and he spammed banshees which annihilated my army of wolverines, infantry and hogs with the addition of anti air base defenses .Please tell me what else I could've possibly done to counter. I know y'all like to act as if air ain't op but if it wasn't, players wouldn't be rushing to mass air 9 times out of 10 and air wouldn't be stomping anti air into the ground.

I sometimes try advancing but it doesn't help because I usually play in team games so my opponent team just gang up on me if I get to far into their territory.
chaosguy67 wrote:
Sigh another air thread. Your playing covenant you can just leave 8 Reavers in your shield and an air mass can't touch you..Have the rest of your units push.Scout enough and you'll stop them from massing air in the first place...
"If your covenant"..... so you gotta be a certain leader or else you cant counter air?..

I use to be 1 on the leaderboard and i loved it when people made anti air to try and counter my deci banshees... basically just makes it so that they have to just defend the whole game until i eventually over power them since they cant damage bases with all the anti air they made to try and stop the banshee army.

I can admit air is still too strong.. and i still cant believe Decimus has not been nerfed yet..... and this is coming from a Deci main...
I gave him a covenant response because he brought up reavers so clearly hes playing a covenant leader. UNSC AA turrets are broke they can handle air quite well too.Also your using deci banshees which everyone admits are broken.Regular banshees are trash and hornets issue is more wingmen being a really good upgrade.The game is balanced for 1s not 3s if air got nerfed anymore they would be worthless.
"The fools have sent in air units to harass me they'll learn!"
Sigh another air thread. Your playing covenant you can just leave 8 Reavers in your shield and an air mass can't touch you..Have the rest of your units push.Scout enough and you'll stop them from massing air in the first place...
I've been doing this for months but it doesn't stop them. Shields go down in like 5 seconds while my reavers get demolished immediately afterwards. Mass air is just too ridiculous. I just finished a game where my opponent was decimus and he spammed banshees which annihilated my army of wolverines, infantry and hogs with the addition of anti air base defenses .Please tell me what else I could've possibly done to counter. I know y'all like to act as if air ain't op but if it wasn't, players wouldn't be rushing to mass air 9 times out of 10 and air wouldn't be stomping anti air into the ground.

I sometimes try advancing but it doesn't help because I usually play in team games so my opponent team just gang up on me if I get to far into their territory.
You brought up deci banshess...they are broken that is the consensus.When my group plays 3s and we see a decimus we immediately rush him until hes out because he's a broken leader.He is the exception not the rule.Anyone else using banshees you can handle with AA.The reason people spam air is because it has high maneuverability which is useful on a big map(Im assuming your playing 3s because mass air doesnt work on 1s).Again, scout them to see if they're spamming air.You should be able to take them out or cripple them because massing air takes a hot minute.
chaosguy67 wrote:
"If your covenant"..... so you gotta be a certain leader or else you cant counter air?..

I use to be 1 on the leaderboard and i loved it when people made anti air to try and counter my deci banshees... basically just makes it so that they have to just defend the whole game until i eventually over power them since they cant damage bases with all the anti air they made to try and stop the banshee army.

I can admit air is still too strong.. and i still cant believe Decimus has not been nerfed yet..... and this is coming from a Deci main...
Please please please don't flex about being #1 at one point. You boost relentlessly. And I can say from experience playing you that you aren't the kind of person anyone should be asking for advice from. Air is not OP, Deci is OP. If you struggle with air, it's an issue with you as a player, not an issue with the game. Case closed.
chaosguy67 wrote:
"If your covenant"..... so you gotta be a certain leader or else you cant counter air?..

I use to be 1 on the leaderboard and i loved it when people made anti air to try and counter my deci banshees... basically just makes it so that they have to just defend the whole game until i eventually over power them since they cant damage bases with all the anti air they made to try and stop the banshee army.

I can admit air is still too strong.. and i still cant believe Decimus has not been nerfed yet..... and this is coming from a Deci main...
Please please please don't flex about being #1 at one point. You boost relentlessly. And I can say from experience playing you that you aren't the kind of person anyone should be asking for advice from. Air is not OP, Deci is OP. If you struggle with air, it's an issue with you as a player, not an issue with the game. Case closed.
So they should take advice from you even though i beat you? Lol ok. Salty much?
A good tactic I have used when dealing with air is just use shipmaster and teleport either half the force or the largest concentration away from your battle. Your reavers can easily finish off what's left. Using shrouds in combination with reavers is also good tactic.
chaosguy67 wrote:
Air is not OP, Deci is OP.
I agree, air is mostly balanced. Deci banshees still pack a punch too. I think an irritating aspect of fighting air spam is how a decent chunk of your population is suddenly devoted to AA, a unit type that is incapable of dishing out damage to bases. Meanwhile, air is agile/fast AF and is capable of dealing decent base damage. If they had to touch air anymore, I would recommend a nerf to banshee/hornet base damage. The only change would be unit vs base dmg. Unit vs unit dmg would remain the same.
I feel like the problem so many people have with air stems from them never getting global vehicle upgrades for their AA. Upgraded reavers and wolves absolutely munch mass air.
chaosguy67 wrote:
chaosguy67 wrote:
Please please please don't flex about being #1 at one point. You boost relentlessly. And I can say from experience playing you that you aren't the kind of person anyone should be asking for advice from. Air is not OP, Deci is OP. If you struggle with air, it's an issue with you as a player, not an issue with the game. Case closed.
So they should take advice from you even though i beat you? Lol ok. Salty much?
You beat me? That's not what "I can say from experience playing you that you aren't the kind of person anyone should be asking for advice from" means. What that means is that I've played you multiple times and they were laughably easy games. Seriously, the last game I played you, it didn't even get to 6 minutes and I played Serina lmao. It's hard to believe you and your friend ever even got into Champ let alone got Champ 1. But that's teams for you. A bunch of low skill Deci abusers boosting their way to an empty prize.
CarsandCameras and chaosguy67 drop whatever personal feud you guys are developing. Have your posts contribute to the topic or don't post at all.
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chaosguy67 wrote:
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Rank in this game doesn't matter, even leaderboard doesn't for how easily exploited and skewed it is. The only way to really show you're great now a days imo is having high Win percentage.
It seems no matter how many reavers or wolverines I make they always get melted one by one by a massive swarm of air units, unless they're all clumped together and I destroy them with a leader power these mass air swarms are basically invincible in my experience. God help me if two enemy teams full of hornets or banshees attack at once as that's effectively an automatic win for them.

I think my biggest problem with air is that they are so ridiculously faster than my reavers. Every time I try to engage the air units just fly around to the other side of my base out of my units range, then when I get over to them they just do the same thing AGAIN!!! I mean this is just so ridiculous, and it's exactly why I encounter multiple people massing air units In literally every single match. They are simply far too fast to the point they can outmaneuver pretty much any other units to launch multiple hit and runs against however many bases they want. If things don't go their favor they simply run away and try again somewhere else in the span of like 6 seconds. So annoying.
Banished countering air spam expecally in team games tho it can be annoying if your mates don’t know what they are doing.

Since you usually play banished this is what you do

1)scout you need to be scouting out the gate imo if your a 3s player id prefer rushing if your running in teams if your solo queuing don’t rush because people aren’t good mate they will watch you get jumped it’s laughable. Constantly scout until to confirm what they are doing he might air spam one game then switch it up but usually in 3s there is a air spamer maybe 2

2)once you confirm there are air spammers starting making units. I suggest this army making this army marauder, and revers. Never make wraiths when dealing with an rediculous amount of air.

Why this army because In any situation it’s never good to have to many revers in your army you can’t do base damage and on top of that your army can’t do damage to anything other than air. Also although revers are the best anti air unit there is a problem with pure revers they have a tendency to overkill one unit but with maradars in the mix it’s like they guide the revers also having marauders in the mix allows you to get your global upgrades so you can keep up with them teching up their air

3)6 out of 8 leaders have the ability of teleport make sure you get this ability it’s really important that’s you do revers lack the speed to keep up with air you will need teleport and the revers y ability to keep up with the air spammer.

if you do this you shouldn’t have a problem with any air spammer even if it’s deci banshees.

4)base defenses you should have a shield gen and 3 watch towers or shield gen cloaking gen and two watch towers. Or cloaking gen and 3 watch towers

banished turrents aren’t worth the investment outside the early game if your getting overwhelmed with early rush.

what would you rather do spend 300 on 3 watch towers and have your counter army there or spend 900 on dog crap turrents?

hope this help you air isn’t really all that hard to beat imo the real air that hard to beat is valtures for valtures you can’t make marudars just pure revers
Mr BluDawn wrote:
chaosguy67 wrote:
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please do not flame or attack other members. This includes stat-flaming.*Original post. Click at your own discretion.
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Rank in this game doesn't matter, even leaderboard doesn't for how easily exploited and skewed it is. The only way to really show you're great now a days imo is having high Win percentage.
That’s not accurate either because for one you can boost your win percentage off of the AI matchmaking. Secondly if you decided not to boost the only way win percentage would matter is if the only gamemode was 1v1. Because you can solo que in a team game and lose because of your mates

stats are meaningless because their will always be a way to inflate ones own states to make it look good imo which is a waste of time of time if personally don’t care about stats even leaving games a lot of the time because your the only person getting jumped because your the only threat to the other team it gets annoying.

so really imo and always stats will never matter to me playing me in a custom 1v1 is the best way to see where someone stands in this game imo
This got pretty toxic, pretty fast. as far as air goes just crack open a nice cold can of git gud and build infantry or AA and upgrade them. people are on the mind set of "half an army of level 1 AA/marines should beat a level 3 popped air army" and if you're being out maneuvered by air, use a hero with pelicans/ teleport to move back to your base, or scout like the U.S government finding the next oil haven and shut down the air rush, air in low numbers are beyond weak. (sorry admins totally understand if i get a warning for this just getting bored of seeing AiR iS uNbAlAnCeD everyday on this glorious forum <3)
Air can be controlled now, but it is still too hard to stop, and once someone goes Mass Air , it is nearly impossible to stop without good use of the best leader powers.

The issues with air are they require no power, but their counters require tons of power. Why do the counter units require power when most are only good at being a counter unit and nothing else? It makes no sense.

The next issue is air moves too quickly or the anti units are too slow. Air is already unrestricted in regards to being able to travel around the map. Anti-air, whether infantry, reavers, or wolverines cant keep up. Air just leaves to heal and come back with new units. You can't continually mass any other unit like air because they are simply too slow. You would be prepared about time they get back.

Finally, the rate of fire. Wolverines, reavers, and late game infantry shoot in bursts while hornets (especially wingman) and banshees shoot a continuous stream of bullets. With no explosive damage, there is no way the anti-air units can keep up unless you have nearly 2 to 1 air to anti air. That is entirely too many against someone who masses air because again, anti-air requires too much power, and anti air is useless against everything else. All the mass air person has to do is switch to vehicles, and the anti air person is done.

Again, air can be stopped now, but it is still too viable an option and too difficult to stop if you aren't playing with the right hero.

My suggestions are to make air require some power, and to reduce the power required for anti-air, add a pop. point to air so that you can't mass so many units, give anti-air some explosion damage, make anti-air faster, and finally give anti air more defense against air (especially wolverines). Finally, either slow air down, or speed anti air up (not both).
Just my opinion.