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[Locked] Matchmaking Feedback Update – April 10

OP ZaedynFel

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While i understand the logic of this update, this penalizes players like myself far, far too much. I started a clan with about 8 of my friends who are not the best halo players (some are fine but in general they don't play to win it's for fun). I'm very competitive and am a good halo player. We all love playing swat together, and now I am basically punished severely, regardless of how I do in the match or if i win or lose, for wanting to play swat with them? If I play with them, I gain 1 CSR for a win and lose 30 for a loss lol this honestly is too harsh. Sad day that I can no longer play swat with friends
So let's think about how this plays out. Let's just say I (champion rank) play with a bronze friend, as an example. I eventually get deranked to their level just simply because I play with them, and then suddenly there is a champion in bronze rank literally ruining all competitiveness and skill matchups. How is that a solution?
ubapook2 wrote:
So let's think about how this plays out. Let's just say I (champion rank) play with a bronze friend, as an example. I eventually get deranked to their level just simply because I play with them, and then suddenly there is a champion in bronze rank literally ruining all competitiveness and skill matchups. How is that a solution?
That will never happen. You're not going to lose CSR for a win, but you're probably going to gain very little CSR in exchange. And on the other side, get crushed for losing. The Bronze friend is going to rank up like normal.
ubapook2 wrote:
So let's think about how this plays out. Let's just say I (champion rank) play with a bronze friend, as an example. I eventually get deranked to their level just simply because I play with them, and then suddenly there is a champion in bronze rank literally ruining all competitiveness and skill matchups. How is that a solution?
That will never happen. You're not going to lose CSR for a win, but you're probably going to gain very little CSR in exchange. And on the other side, get crushed for losing. The Bronze friend is going to rank up like normal.
No what I'm saying is that it is realistically inevitable i will go down and down over time if we play as wins virtually do nothing and we won't win every single game. So yes, I technically would end up going down to their rank over time
ubapook2 wrote:
ubapook2 wrote:
So let's think about how this plays out. Let's just say I (champion rank) play with a bronze friend, as an example. I eventually get deranked to their level just simply because I play with them, and then suddenly there is a champion in bronze rank literally ruining all competitiveness and skill matchups. How is that a solution?
That will never happen. You're not going to lose CSR for a win, but you're probably going to gain very little CSR in exchange. And on the other side, get crushed for losing. The Bronze friend is going to rank up like normal.
No what I'm saying is that it is realistically inevitable i will go down and down over time if we play as wins virtually do nothing and we won't win every single game. So yes, I technically would end up going down to their rank over time
ZaedynFel will need to confirm or deny this, but I suspect your MMR would NOT de-rank to Bronze, just your CSR. So the game would still know how good you are, and match you against fair competition. But your visible CSR rank would decrease to be closer to the friends you constantly play with.
Personally, the ranking system now makes a lot more sense. I know people are mad because they aren't flying up in ranks when they beat that team or players of gold or platinum's but once there rank resets and everyone starts off fresh again, it'll make more sense to them I think. Just think about it for a second people.... If your an onyx player and you beat a gold player, why are you going up 15 points in rank? your an onyx!!! you SHOULD beat that gold player with ease!!! BUT if that gold player beats you, then they should go up a lot in rank because they just beat someone who was ranked much higher then them.

Think of it this way. Say Tiger woods (back in his hay day lol) plays someone who just started out on the PGA tour. Lets say Tiger is ranked 5 (just for argument shake) and this new guy is ranked 200. If tiger is playing this guy and he wins, should he go up to first now because he won? no lol He was favored to win, he SHOULD beat this guy. He'll go up a very SMALL amount as he was favored. ...BUT if that 200 ranked guy beats Tiger, then he's going to go up a lot!!! because he just beat one of the top players in the sport. This type of ranking system is used in other sports too like Tennis. It 100% makes the most sense. A player or team should not be rewarded the same amount of points for beating players or teams that are ranked much lower then them.

FFA was THE WORST for people having high ranks that really weren't that skill level. I love it when someone says "I'm a champ in FFA your garbage bro!!" ....am I suppose to be impressed? It's FFA!!! It's super easy to rank up in, everyone knows this lolol (or it was at least) Sure, maybe you are a legit Champ but most aren't. Which is sad, because the FFA players that ARE legit Champs get a bad rep for not being that good which isn't fair to them. Now with this tweak, players that are legit Champs will get the recognition they deserve I feel. If you go into Team Arena or Team Slayer say, and play a 2100 Onyx, you were like "ya, this guy is good! because the ranks in those playlist are more (not perfect lets be clear here) legit and will be even more so now that the ranking system is being "fixed" You could easily tell the difference between say a 2100 onyx FFA player or a 2100 Team Slayer/Arena player. It'll take a while to get your ranks straighten out but it'll be much better when it does I think. I think people just want to always rank up a ton no matter who they beat.... This isn't Halo 4 or Reach where ranks meant absolutely nothing! lol

Keep up the good work ZaedynFel!!! People will complain now because your telling people they aren't a legit Onyx or Champ player when they think they are (when most aren't...) or they just don't understand the system fully. I know you said you are, but I would look into having something IN GAME (maybe a video...?) explaining the ranking system in detail. In the long run this will make ranked games a much better experience I feel.
ubapook2 wrote:
ubapook2 wrote:
So let's think about how this plays out. Let's just say I (champion rank) play with a bronze friend, as an example. I eventually get deranked to their level just simply because I play with them, and then suddenly there is a champion in bronze rank literally ruining all competitiveness and skill matchups. How is that a solution?
That will never happen. You're not going to lose CSR for a win, but you're probably going to gain very little CSR in exchange. And on the other side, get crushed for losing. The Bronze friend is going to rank up like normal.
No what I'm saying is that it is realistically inevitable i will go down and down over time if we play as wins virtually do nothing and we won't win every single game. So yes, I technically would end up going down to their rank over time
No because if you keep playing with your friend(s) and keep wining they will catch up as they are getting more points then you (and be getting better along the way) getting closer to your rank now. Then once they are a lot higher and your fireteam wins, you'll all get more points because you'll be beating players that are of similar skill of your fireteam.
I've already been playing with them for months lol and its just been the way it is. They don't take it super seriously so they don't get better, we've found fair enough games usually (there has always been one player on the enemy team somewhat close to my rank, and then the rest are fairly matched). It just sucks now that if I want to maintain a good rank in SWAT I can no longer play with friends who are worse than me. Not even in a smurf way, halo might just not be their best game but we enjoy playing it together.
Honestly, this whole CSR and MMR thing is getting ridiculous. You tweak the ranking system in the middle of a season and expect everyone to be cool with losing some CSR? I feel like i need an advanced degree in computer science from MIT with mutiple internships to even grasp what is going on. I was playing with a friend, who has much higher CSR and MMR than me and i was going up literally 4-5 CSR a game. I couldn't get out of Diamond 6 and he is a Onyx 1800+ and we won consistently. Not to mention, FFA is broke. I won a game and literally stayed the same CSR. Punish the smurfs, I'm sure you can tell when its illegitimate and let the rest be.
Small update from my previous ffa post above.Ever since that post a few days ago I consistently placed around 5 matches in the top 3 in FFA and lose CSR,I mostly match either 1or 2 smurfs,plats,diamonds,unranked and i kept losing CSR.At least bring back earning positive CSR when placing top 3 or contesting 3rd place if you are going to keep diamond reaching onyx or if you remove this too and still bring in the positive CSR change.That will motivate people to play FFA more.
RzR J3ST3R wrote:
ubapook2 wrote:
ubapook2 wrote:
So let's think about how this plays out. Let's just say I (champion rank) play with a bronze friend, as an example. I eventually get deranked to their level just simply because I play with them, and then suddenly there is a champion in bronze rank literally ruining all competitiveness and skill matchups. How is that a solution?
That will never happen. You're not going to lose CSR for a win, but you're probably going to gain very little CSR in exchange. And on the other side, get crushed for losing. The Bronze friend is going to rank up like normal.
No what I'm saying is that it is realistically inevitable i will go down and down over time if we play as wins virtually do nothing and we won't win every single game. So yes, I technically would end up going down to their rank over time
ZaedynFel will need to confirm or deny this, but I suspect your MMR would NOT de-rank to Bronze, just your CSR. So the game would still know how good you are, and match you against fair competition. But your visible CSR rank would decrease to be closer to the friends you constantly play with.
This is correct. The system assumes you are losing because your friend isn't as good, and so your MMR will not drop, and you will not be playing vs. Bronze, but instead stay in the middle.

Your CSRs will eventually converge. If you are a truly high Champ player, that may still put you in Onyx.

Basically, we are OK with you keeping Onyx playing with your worse friends, but "Champion" is reserved for the 100% tryhard experience. You probably won't be able to maintain Champ on that particular account unless you only play with Champs, or are near Pro-level.
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