Forums / Community / Matchmaking Feedback & Discussion

[Locked] Matchmaking Feedback Update – March 13

OP ZaedynFel

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I think the ability to see everyone's rank in the matching screen before loading into a game is something that would be nice to have back. Just as a preface as to what you, as a player, is going to have to go up against. In my mind, if I see a player at my skill level and a player reasonably above me, that helps me in game as to where I need to focus my fights. I guess a draw back to that would be the entire opposing team focusing the lower skilled player for the majority of the game. It may not happen in H5, but hopefully we could see it in future games.
I already noticed a difference. I almost always place into Silver and climb to Gold in Slayer. Placed into Gold for 1st time this season- must be due to the changes because I definitely didn't play better in my placements!

Completely agree on the Social vs Ranked. I go into Social and feel like I get stomped on, I go into Ranked and if I avoid smurfs and it is a little ways into the season the matches are way more even, enjoyable, and competitive.
Willko wrote:
Will we ever be seeing a classic playlist in Halo 5, with sprinting and abilities turned off?

I understand that it won't be the most balanced thing in the world, but having it is still better than not having it. It is literally the only thing that will get me to ever re-install Halo 5.
Thanks for the update zaedyn even if i did not quote you.Wilko send me a msg regarding your question and write me that question,I have the answer to your question even if its not the best one.
Love reading the philosophy behind the actions and insights into the development process!
SPRTN94 wrote:
ZaedynFel wrote:
PeterAK91 wrote:
Im stuck on platinum 1 due to solo queue and i admit thats part of a players fault, but based on what i understand on "proving your rank" in which my case is platinum 1 means i will be forever platinum or have a chance on moving forward?
You are not stuck. Play like a Diamond and you will get there.

Matchmaking tries to make everyone as close in skill as possible, but gets less picky over time.
If you have a headset it'll help you get higher in the ranks. Even as a solo queue player
In fact, i do have a headset (turtle beach X0 7 pro). Even before the match begins i say "anyone with a mic?". a very few times i get lucky with someone saying "i do" and it feels relief to think your not alone. but like i said, its very rarely to hear someone out. even if no one says anything (because there a people with no mics) i do call outs on my own. sounds silly but i do it in hopes for someone to be actually able to hear me and to be aware. having a mic is one small thing to rank up like you mentioned, solo queue takes the risk of dealing with quitters, trolls and or really bad teammates and im sure everyone has gone thru this at least once.
PeterAK91 wrote:
SPRTN94 wrote:
ZaedynFel wrote:
PeterAK91 wrote:
Im stuck on platinum 1 due to solo queue and i admit thats part of a players fault, but based on what i understand on "proving your rank" in which my case is platinum 1 means i will be forever platinum or have a chance on moving forward?
You are not stuck. Play like a Diamond and you will get there.

Matchmaking tries to make everyone as close in skill as possible, but gets less picky over time.
If you have a headset it'll help you get higher in the ranks. Even as a solo queue player
In fact, i do have a headset (turtle beach X0 7 pro). Even before the match begins i say "anyone with a mic?". a very few times i get lucky with someone saying "i do" and it feels relief to think your not alone. but like i said, its very rarely to hear someone out. even if no one says anything (because there a people with no mics) i do call outs on my own. sounds silly but i do it in hopes for someone to be actually able to hear me and to be aware. having a mic is one small thing to rank up like you mentioned, solo queue takes the risk of dealing with quitters, trolls and or really bad teammates and im sure everyone has gone thru this at least once.
I made it to Diamond 5 on a 7 match win streak by doing callouts solo. Sometimes people chime in and sometimes they don't just stay with it man : )
ZaedynFel wrote:
Social vs. Ranked
  • Casual players (especially lower-skilled ones) get the opposite experience. They get owned in Social, and have the impression that Ranked is the only fair place for them. That, or they just stop playing the game because they may think Ranked is going to be even worse.
What if you had rank/MMR cutoff points for social? This would allow lower skilled players like bronze/silver for example to not match high diamond through champion level players. Or a more general example, a 1600 MMR player wouldn't match anyone that has 600 or lower MMR.

Edit: You would obviously have to make exceptions for mixed skill parties or low population, but the mismatched skill matching could be made so it's only the required minimum in those instances.
ZaedynFel wrote:
I've been frustrated by the win/loss only determination of rank. If I am on a team as a solo or maybe party of two (99% of my games) and I do well but the others on the team do not then why can't I get at least a small bump in ranking provided I played well.

This way when the system matches players the good players still float to the top the bad ones to the bottom and maybe we will get some more fair matches? If this is how it works in the backend but just not on the visible rank then can we fix that to reward players who play better but may not be on a team of individuals who caused them to lose the match?
Yes, I agree. It's not something we can fairly represent in Halo 5, but my personal design philosophy agrees with you that we should have a way to both:
  • Make it clear that winning as a team is still the highest bar to achieve.
  • Reward and account for great individual performances, even when you lose
How do you balance this appropriately? Like, how do you balance rewarding players on the losing team that do well but keep them from going for personal stats at the cost of the team objective?
A few seasons ago they started putting a little dot beside the most kills, most assists, and least deaths. I've wondered if maybe this could be used to determine who gains or loses CSR. Like a little bonus maybe. For example, if your team loses, you still lose the usual amount of CSR, but maybe if you had the most kills out of both teams, you'd get some CSR points to kinda lessen that blow. I do wonder if this might cause players to stat rather than playing like a team, but if they're trying not to die as often, or trying to get more kills or assists, this could end up helping the team's overall performance after all, as long as they're not sacrificing teammates for these stats (but this is more of a "some people are just jerks" issue rather than something that can be fixed by an update).
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please refrain from making non-constructive posts.
*Original post. Click at your own discretion.
Spoiler:
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LUKEPOWA wrote:
ZaedynFel wrote:
Social vs. Ranked
  • Casual players (especially lower-skilled ones) get the opposite experience. They get owned in Social, and have the impression that Ranked is the only fair place for them. That, or they just stop playing the game because they may think Ranked is going to be even worse.
What if you had rank/MMR cutoff points for social? This would allow lower skilled players like bronze/silver for example to not match high diamond through champion level players. Or a more general example, a 1600 MMR player wouldn't match anyone that has 600 or lower MMR.
I believe they do something similar to that with BTB. There used to be a hidden social rank which I think was removed due to community outcry
It's really annoying that the team snipers playlist is basically just citadel over and over and over. It'd be really nice if Lockout, Beaver Creek, Sanctuary, and Construct were in the playlist.
god oh wrote:
It's really annoying that the team snipers playlist is basically just citadel over and over and over. It'd be really nice if Lockout, Beaver Creek, Sanctuary, and Construct were in the playlist.
It sounds like you're talking about a different game, and this thread has nothing to do with it.
ZaedynFel wrote:
ZaedynFel,

Any thoughts or insight into having forge maps(Orion, Pegasus 2, white cell) in Ranked? Those maps just don't perform well with frame lag and in my opinion they bring down the ranked experience. They are fine in social..
If solo queuing or double queuing in Team Arena then the player(s) should not face teams of 4. Also if a teammate quits at anytime during a match and you lose said match then the effect of the L should be zero or very minimal. I hate having teammates quit in strongholds and automatically lose because of it.
This has been great to see and read.
Quote:
I think it would be cool to tell players their exact performance after a match in CSR terms. For example, a Gold player might see “even though you’re Gold, you just played like a Diamond player, so don’t be surprised if you see Diamond opponents! Keep it up and you’ll get to Diamond!” Stuff like that.
This helps a LOT for someone that may have a lot of rust but isn't inexperienced at gaming or Halo.

Out of curiosity, is it known how much a player or groups of players vary their gaming experience by proxy to server?
By that I mean, 1 game I can have a solid tag with my hits, another I can have a rough time (thruster didn't activate but my cadence was off, then I got a 4-shot bulltrue), and once, I betrayed a teammate by killing the Gauss gunner ;).
SPRTN94 wrote:
I believe they do something similar to that with BTB. There used to be a hidden social rank which I think was removed due to community outcry
All of social has hidden MMR balancing, but it's really loose. In my experiences mainly playing BTB, there definitely doesn't seem like there's something in place where certain skill levels don't play each other.
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please do not post inappropriate content.

*Original post. Click at your own discretion.
Spoiler:
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ZaedynFel wrote:
ZaedynFel,

Any thoughts or insight into having forge maps(Orion, Pegasus 2, white cell) in Ranked? Those maps just don't perform well with frame lag and in my opinion they bring down the ranked experience. They are fine in social..
There's no single reason for a Forge map to be on Ranked playlists. EVER.
You're a legend for doing these. I'm really glad to know you've got a few solutions in the pipes!

It's incredibly encouraging to hear such insight and depth of understanding about the specific game design challenges and solutions. As a budding game designer I'm pretty inspired.

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I'm interested in how the game handles low population pools, being from Australia. As such I had an idea:
What if the game, as soon as you logged in and started a lobby (even just by yourself) in the matchmaking section, already placed you in a hidden queue and started sussing out potential perfect and ideal matches, INCLUDING those who are currently in a game.
From this info could it not then predict out better and more perfect matches in a playlist? With a coordination system going "Ok so if we make this guy wait an extra minute here these other two guys can then join up and match this party of 3 which is of similar ping and similar skill".
Could it not also relatively accurately convey what it was doing, to the player, so rather than sitting there waiting for a match it would give you little tid bits, perhaps a traffic light system, just saying things like "expecting a great match for you in this playlist, just waiting to see if these guys finish, or you could get a great match in this playlist right away". It may require people letting the system know their intentions (aka if they're up for another game, while already playing this one).
I know there are branching and potentially exponential levels of complexity here but could it be dare I say a revolutionary improvement in matchmaking?
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Another idea from the head vault borrowed from Heroes of the Storm:

End of game performance screen where the game highlights players from either team for individual skill or feats of awesomeness.
- MVP: overall best in game for reasons X (highest damage), X (most kills), X (Least deaths), (most captures) etc etc
- Flagrunner: ran X flags, stopped x captures, etc etc
- Momentum Shifter: killing spree to turn the game around after being down in slays or obj
- Teamshooter: most protector medals / assists etc etc
- Sharpshooter: Most headshots / sniper kills etc etc

There could even be some tongue-in-cheek ones - Goose, Breadstick, Coward (most times shield recharged), Power Weapon Hog, Betrayer, Hyper (most kills AND most deaths).
I'm sure there are plenty of others people could have fun coming up with.

I think this would benefit the game in two main ways:
- Provide satisfaction to a player who legitimately did well but may have lost the game.
- Identify and place importance on multiple roles that make up success in the game or, quantify and recognise performance which both directly and indirectly achieved victory. Often in Halo you can play really well and be a major contributor to your teams success only to be outshone by a main slayer, and only a very experienced eye will be able draw that out of the stats screen (or by observing the game). I think there are algorithms that could do this and present it to the player in an interesting and exciting way.

Hand in hand with this and your idea which I thought was super neat (the written english, "hey you just went against diamonds and did well, keep it up and you'll get to diamond!") is a little stat block after the match just saying "well done, you achieved X this game, more than your average of X, or more than similar players average of X".
Where X could be assists, damage, or any number of other stats.
Dee Ferya wrote:
You're matching smurfs I'm guessing ?
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