Forums / Community / Matchmaking Feedback & Discussion

[Locked] Matchmaking Feedback Update – May 21

OP ZaedynFel

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stckrboy wrote:
A NEW PROBLEM: for the past few days I have not advanced in CSR rank, only decreased, which is not unusual until you realize that my rank only changes when I lose. When I win (60+ % winning by the way in slayer) my CSR does NOT change. When I lose it decreases in its typical, now comical, amount. BUT THERE IS MORE. As far as I know, this is occurring only to me, which leads me down a different road of dispair.
This has been addressed in the first post
On a different note, 343 / Microsoft should consider not being so gullible when accepting criticism from the typical, less-than-analytical, YouTube pop personality. It's like listening to the baby that cries the most. Nor should they be head-over-heels for the great pro to rule them all. It's like implementing a suggestion to raise the basketball hoop height from the tallest of basketball players - it is most likely to help the tallest players. Instead, seek out people that are not "yes-men" and have jobs and can't spend time rehearsing what they will say on YouTube, which is usually simple reactionary criticism or unnecessary extolling.
This isn't what they are doing and not why Truskill2 was implemented. It was implemented becuase it's a much more accurate and faster system for predicting / determining player skill.
Whether trueskill influences what I mentioned above or not is irrelevant as the problem(s) exist. The fact that there isn't a connection to the issues I listed above and "changes" that are implemented to improve fairness in team selection - this is even more remarkable, and disappointing.
The new T2 system basically is a system in my view that “handcuffs” a strong team unit playing together at at the highest level in that they are only able to gain 1 CSR point for a win if CSR>MMR. That is the biggest issue with the new system . A solution in my mind would be to at least have CSR increase by 5 rather than 1 as a default when CSR>MMR. There are many intangibles that come into play when it comes to winning at slayer . A good “distraction” move can go a long way for example in a team game and MMR does not account for this .
No matter how mathematically sound the new system may seem , there is not a direct correlation between math and enjoyment of a team game when teams are being handcuffed unable to see the reward for winning .
ZaedynFel wrote:
I placed Diamond 4 on my main account (4000+ games), and have since dropped to Diamond 1.

On my 2 alternate accounts, I placed Diamond 1, both times (less than 200 games, per account).

I'd say it's pretty accurate.

My friend placed d5 on his main in dubs and champ 7 on a brand new smurf, I have placed anywhere from plat 3 to onyx 1800, from my perspective it seems like its not very good at predicting what rank you should be.
Which gamertags and playlists? I haven't seen this. By far the majority get the same ranks on their alts.
i got d4 on my main (blamed a 6 month break). then had 4 tags qualified 1750+, I was a swat champ for over a yr
So out of my last 20 games I’ve won 14 and lost 6. My CSR hasn’t increased an inch with a win but when I lose games it literally drops me almost half a rank every time. Most of the games I won I’m first or second place. I was normally Onyx and after 14 wins and only 6 losses it’s dropped me back down to diamond 4. So this means my MMR is lesser ranked than my CSR and it’s just trying to put me in my skill level? How do I see my MMR?
Your system is straight up broken man.

I win a couple of games and the game needs to ”calm me down”. I don't have a problem with playing against better than me, I have a problem in playing the game when your beautiful TS2, MMR or whatever you're calling it these days, is giving me s*** teammates over and over again. I mean, okay, in enemy teams are Onyxes and High Diamonds, but why the **** are you keeping giving me low diamonds with 3:13, 5:17 score in the end. No matter how good I'm playing. ITS IMPOSSIBLE to win games like those.

It is rigged. Literally rigged. As soon as you get a streak of a couple of good games, your beautiful matchmaking is giving you basically noobs to play with. How the **** is that fair, please explain that to me?

And yes, they are noobs, they don't know how to move, play, shoot. And I am playing against the trained party of onyxes/high diamonds.

If my MMR or call it whatever it suits you, jump because of a couple of good games, then give me teammates similar to me, if you're giving me good opponents.

You are literally punishing good players for playing well. There is no excitement, no rewarding feeling, no satisfaction in playing like this. This is the most broken system I encountered for my whole life, and I'm playing Halo online since 2. Even worse than Halo 4.
Wahadinho wrote:
Your system is straight up broken man.

I win a couple of games and the game needs to ”calm me down”. I don't have a problem with playing against better than me, I have a problem in playing the game when your beautiful TS2, MMR or whatever you're calling it these days, is giving me s*** teammates over and over again. I mean, okay, in enemy teams are Onyxes and High Diamonds, but why the **** are you keeping giving me low diamonds with 3:13, 5:17 score in the end. No matter how good I'm playing. ITS IMPOSSIBLE to win games like those.

It is rigged. Literally rigged. As soon as you get a streak of a couple of good games, your beautiful matchmaking is giving you basically noobs to play with. How the **** is that fair, please explain that to me?

And yes, they are noobs, they don't know how to move, play, shoot. And I am playing against the trained party of onyxes/high diamonds.

If my MMR or call it whatever it suits you, jump because of a couple of good games, then give me teammates similar to me, if you're giving me good opponents.

You are literally punishing good players for playing well. There is no excitement, no rewarding feeling, no satisfaction in playing like this. This is the most broken system I encountered for my whole life, and I'm playing Halo online since 2. Even worse than Halo 4.
Tell me about it. I’ve literally been stuck with scrubs for the past three weeks now. 5 and 18... 2 and 15. It’s ridiculous. Some games I get 25+ kills then see the defeat on the screen and I’m like what the ****? Oh wait some guy just went 1-20.
Hmmm so lately (last two days) I’ve been winning and only going up 1 point. But I’ll play against onyx and diamond players. I’m an onyx 1600 so I should be playing high diamond/low onyx. But why am I only goin up 1 point lately? It’s not even the odd game, it should been literally every win today and yesterday.
Hmmm so lately (last two days) I’ve been winning and only going up 1 point. But I’ll play against onyx and diamond players. I’m an onyx 1600 so I should be playing high diamond/low onyx. But why am I only goin up 1 point lately? It’s not even the odd game, it should been literally every win today and yesterday.
Its literally the first paragraph of this update. The system thinks youre csr is inflated so they are artificially trying to make you lose csr
If you don't want sucky teammates, play with a team/people you know you can count on. It's seriously not that hard.

If you don't want to play with a team, then expect to be stuck in Platinum or Diamond or lower.
If you don't want sucky teammates, play with a team/people you know you can count on. It's seriously not that hard.

If you don't want to play with a team, then expect to be stuck in Platinum or Diamond or lower.
Yeah, the game isn't going to give you amazing teammates if you're getting 30+ kills a game especially if you're on a winning streak. You have to play with a party if you don't want random results.

After reading through this thread, I don't think I've wanted Monday to come faster before this. Sheesh.
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please do not flame or attack other members. This includes stat-flaming.

*Original post. Click at your own discretion.
Spoiler:
Show
Couple of true skill 2 questions....

If true skill 2 looks at every game ever played to determine MMR then if a player has 10k games then how many matches would they have to win/lose to even see an impact in their rank? Shouldn't true skill 2 only look at maybe the last 100-300 games or so to determine a players rank instead since that's a more accurate representation of their current skill level? Otherwise you're basically encouraging players to smurf and there's no point in playing on an account that has like 1k+ games.

I know one of the new updates includes players not losing as much csr when playing a 3v4 and not gaining as much when winning a 4v3 but does this still apply if a player quits a match because they're losing? Say you have a 40-20 slayer and a someone on the losing team quits out do the players on the winning team still not get as much csr? I would assume this has been taken into account but tbh i also would have assumed it wouldn't have taken this long to implement logic that keeps players from ranking up for winning 4v3s. <--- why did it even take this long when this is something most games implement before they're even released?

Also, why do social games count towards your ranked MMR? Shouldn't there at the very least be a separate MMR for warzone/social/arena? Ideally it would be by playlist right and whenever you play a new playlist for the first time it would use an average of your MMR in other playlists to decide your initial MMR for that playlist. If I'm bad at elimination why should that impact my rank in HCS?
Hmmm so lately (last two days) I’ve been winning and only going up 1 point. But I’ll play against onyx and diamond players. I’m an onyx 1600 so I should be playing high diamond/low onyx. But why am I only goin up 1 point lately? It’s not even the odd game, it should been literally every win today and yesterday.
Its literally the first paragraph of this update. The system thinks youre csr is inflated so they are artificially trying to make you lose csr
So... if I keep winning then eventually I’ll start going up by more than 1
Will Someone let me know when they Keep winning and not lose and win into getting more than one CSR ... right now it seems that we seeing the MMR just not catching up to the CSR you and after major win streaks across all rankings but I still can't find anybody who is passing their CSR with MMR without losing and then start learning more than just one CSR.
Also too I went back and checked all of my games and CSR from when I was a champ and I went against people who were lower rank than me and still got 8 or 9 CSR meaning if that were possible then I had an MMR that was much higher so the sea is our had to try to catch up to that even if I was going against lower-ranked players by giving me extra CSR on the win
《《《《
https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/fd7f90e1-11d2-4d98-9f89-83da383facec/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=56&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena
》》》》

Here's a funny one so we were 3 versus 4 and still want on this Riptide game their player left somewhere towards the end
《《《《
https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/2f1a3d15-2bdf-4ecd-b3ea-b7bde195367f/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=20&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena
》》》》

Followed by this,
《《《
https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/1003dadf-1ab8-451e-92c5-726d28b41052/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=55&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena
》》》

Then....

https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/09395c2d-b10c-466d-ba80-559d790b567e/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=51&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena

And so and that was it after that I got only one CSR for everyone till even now and I'm sorry but that's just that's just rediculous in a bad way

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/publication/trueskill-2-improved-bayesian-skill-rating-system/

* the above is a link to them describing the formula for the new true skill rank 2.0

And I could go on forever about why I disagree this topic but there's two main points that I want address for right now number one being if you're only going up one CSR per game but lose 15 on a loss then it takes 15 games to actually get that back so right now on average who actually has time to play 15 games and then on top of that most people's win percentage is at anywhere between 50 and 70 so it's almost mathematically impossible for anybody to even reclaim this lost CSR which brings me to my next point like I stated at the very beginning has anybody who started getting one CSR per game ever got more than plus one without losing so win win win win win getting + + 1 + 1 + 1 and then finally win to get plus 8 for example

P.s. this whole system of MMR is built up from making assumptions of a person and you know what they say when you assume....
this game is not worth grinding for players.... this is coming from someone who ranked in as Onyx or Champion in every playlist... For us high ranks there is no point to play because you automatically rank in as onyx/champ and don't really have to grind anymore....and for people who are lower ranked they are hard locked at diamond.... I Just played 10 games with my buddy Noisyboi here and we lost ONE GAME (When our 4th quit out) and he did not go up at all for any of the wins but did drop for the one loss....tell me why anyone would wanna waste their time grinding when you can't even rank up.... Pathetic. Rip Halo. I Hope Halo 6 gives more incentive to grind for all skill levels.
Amen brother
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please refrain from making non-constructive posts.
*Original post. Click at your own discretion.
Spoiler:
Show
SUNKISTT wrote:
Will Someone let me know when they Keep winning and not lose and win into getting more than one CSR ... right now it seems that we seeing the MMR just not catching up to the CSR you and after major win streaks across all rankings but I still can't find anybody who is passing their CSR with MMR without losing and then start learning more than just one CSR.
Also too I went back and checked all of my games and CSR from when I was a champ and I went against people who were lower rank than me and still got 8 or 9 CSR meaning if that were possible then I had an MMR that was much higher so the sea is our had to try to catch up to that even if I was going against lower-ranked players by giving me extra CSR on the win
《《《《
https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/fd7f90e1-11d2-4d98-9f89-83da383facec/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=56&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena
》》》》

Here's a funny one so we were 3 versus 4 and still want on this Riptide game their player left somewhere towards the end
《《《《
https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/2f1a3d15-2bdf-4ecd-b3ea-b7bde195367f/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=20&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena
》》》》

Followed by this,
《《《
https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/1003dadf-1ab8-451e-92c5-726d28b41052/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=55&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena
》》》

Then....

https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/09395c2d-b10c-466d-ba80-559d790b567e/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=51&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena

And so and that was it after that I got only one CSR for everyone till even now and I'm sorry but that's just that's just rediculous in a bad way

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/publication/trueskill-2-improved-bayesian-skill-rating-system/

* the above is a link to them describing the formula for the new true skill rank 2.0

And I could go on forever about why I disagree this topic but there's two main points that I want address for right now number one being if you're only going up one CSR per game but lose 15 on a loss then it takes 15 games to actually get that back so right now on average who actually has time to play 15 games and then on top of that most people's win percentage is at anywhere between 50 and 70 so it's almost mathematically impossible for anybody to even reclaim this lost CSR which brings me to my next point like I stated at the very beginning has anybody who started getting one CSR per game ever got more than plus one without losing so win win win win win getting + + 1 + 1 + 1 and then finally win to get plus 8 for example

P.s. this whole system of MMR is built up from making assumptions of a person and you know what they say when you assume....
Atm there are 3 ways to fix this.

1. Throw every game until you eventually stop losing 15 csr and that's what trueskill2 thinks your rank is and everything should behave normally. That is until trueskill2 decides you're winning more than you should.
2. Stop playing until ranks reset.
3. New smurf
Pvppey wrote:
SUNKISTT wrote:
Will Someone let me know when they Keep winning and not lose and win into getting more than one CSR ... right now it seems that we seeing the MMR just not catching up to the CSR you and after major win streaks across all rankings but I still can't find anybody who is passing their CSR with MMR without losing and then start learning more than just one CSR.
Also too I went back and checked all of my games and CSR from when I was a champ and I went against people who were lower rank than me and still got 8 or 9 CSR meaning if that were possible then I had an MMR that was much higher so the sea is our had to try to catch up to that even if I was going against lower-ranked players by giving me extra CSR on the win
《《《《
https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/fd7f90e1-11d2-4d98-9f89-83da383facec/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=56&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena
》》》》

Here's a funny one so we were 3 versus 4 and still want on this Riptide game their player left somewhere towards the end
《《《《
https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/2f1a3d15-2bdf-4ecd-b3ea-b7bde195367f/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=20&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena
》》》》

Followed by this,
《《《
https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/1003dadf-1ab8-451e-92c5-726d28b41052/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=55&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena
》》》

Then....

https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/09395c2d-b10c-466d-ba80-559d790b567e/players/sunkistt?gameHistoryMatchIndex=51&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=Arena

And so and that was it after that I got only one CSR for everyone till even now and I'm sorry but that's just that's just rediculous in a bad way

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/publication/trueskill-2-improved-bayesian-skill-rating-system/

* the above is a link to them describing the formula for the new true skill rank 2.0

And I could go on forever about why I disagree this topic but there's two main points that I want address for right now number one being if you're only going up one CSR per game but lose 15 on a loss then it takes 15 games to actually get that back so right now on average who actually has time to play 15 games and then on top of that most people's win percentage is at anywhere between 50 and 70 so it's almost mathematically impossible for anybody to even reclaim this lost CSR which brings me to my next point like I stated at the very beginning has anybody who started getting one CSR per game ever got more than plus one without losing so win win win win win getting + + 1 + 1 + 1 and then finally win to get plus 8 for example

P.s. this whole system of MMR is built up from making assumptions of a person and you know what they say when you assume....
Atm there are 3 ways to fix this.

1. Throw every game until you eventually stop losing 15 csr and that's what trueskill2 thinks your rank is and everything should behave normally. That is until trueskill2 decides you're winning more than you should.
2. Stop playing until ranks reset.
3. New smurf
This game is just becoming a joke. I miss the simplicity of halo 3s system. 1-50. Easy and it got the job done
Dear Master Jedi Menke, I am curious as to what my MMRs are across the board? Social/Warzone/Ranked! Not sure if you will see this but I am very eager to know this! Thanks in advance, I love this update so far.
Hmmm so lately (last two days) I’ve been winning and only going up 1 point. But I’ll play against onyx and diamond players. I’m an onyx 1600 so I should be playing high diamond/low onyx. But why am I only goin up 1 point lately? It’s not even the odd game, it should been literally every win today and yesterday.
Its literally the first paragraph of this update. The system thinks youre csr is inflated so they are artificially trying to make you lose csr
So... if I keep winning then eventually I’ll start going up by more than 1
No, to get more csr you have perform better than the system expects you to. So better stats
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