Forums / Community / Matchmaking Feedback & Discussion

[Locked] MATCHMAKING FEEDBACK UPDATE – November 5

OP ZaedynFel

  1. 1
  2. ...
  3. 18
  4. 19
  5. 20
  6. 21
  7. 22
  8. ...
  9. 27
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please refrain from making posts that do not contribute to the topic at hand.
*Original post. Click at your own discretion.
Spoiler:
Show
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
MMR still gives more importance to KPM than winning game for example https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/01ffea6a-8ace-437b-9d56-422e82c90e68/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=14&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All I earned less after this game than the previous one for no reason at all but one: my kpm was lower
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
MMR still gives more importance to KPM than winning game for example https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/01ffea6a-8ace-437b-9d56-422e82c90e68/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=14&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All I earned less after this game than the previous one for no reason at all but one: my kpm was lower
KPM is a factor, but not as great of a factor as Win/Loss. Read the post HERE: Link
It helps breakdown the reason why.
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
MMR still gives more importance to KPM than winning game for example https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/01ffea6a-8ace-437b-9d56-422e82c90e68/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=14&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All I earned less after this game than the previous one for no reason at all but one: my kpm was lower
KPM is a factor, but not as great of a factor as Win/Loss. Read the post HERE: Link
It helps breakdown the reason why.
Then why did i earn more MMR steamrolling a bunch of platinum than having a fair game against at time 47 champion?
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
MMR still gives more importance to KPM than winning game for example https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/01ffea6a-8ace-437b-9d56-422e82c90e68/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=14&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All I earned less after this game than the previous one for no reason at all but one: my kpm was lower
KPM is a factor, but not as great of a factor as Win/Loss. Read the post HERE: Link
It helps breakdown the reason why.
Then why did i earn more MMR steamrolling a bunch of platinum than having a fair game against at time 47 champion?
I'm not privy to viewing your actual shifts in MMR leading up to and after those matches, so I cannot properly verify or give an accurate account of your claim to earn more MMR steamrolling Plats than against a team featuring a Champ. Josh would be much more capable to answer this inquiry.
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
MMR still gives more importance to KPM than winning game for example https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/01ffea6a-8ace-437b-9d56-422e82c90e68/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=14&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All I earned less after this game than the previous one for no reason at all but one: my kpm was lower
KPM is a factor, but not as great of a factor as Win/Loss. Read the post HERE: Link
It helps breakdown the reason why.
Then why did i earn more MMR steamrolling a bunch of platinum than having a fair game against at time 47 champion?
I'm not privy to viewing your actual shifts in MMR leading up to and after those matches, so I cannot properly verify or give an accurate account of your claim to earn more MMR steamrolling Plats than against a team featuring a Champ. Josh would be much more capable to answer this inquiry.
You didn't earn more MMR.

Your MMR went up more in the second game (42) than the first one (33).

The second game you won against harder odds as well.

Also, the second game you had a higher kpm than the earlier game.

So, no, I don't see evidence here that "steamrolling plat gives you more MMR" You got less MMR in the game vs. Plat.

You also had a lower kpm in that game. But you also won against easier odds in that game.

The MMR change is based on kpm vs. expected kpm and wins vs. how hard the win was.
ZaedynFel wrote:
You didn't earn more MMR.

Your MMR went up more in the second game (42) than the first one (33).

The second game you won against harder odds as well.

Also, the second game you had a higher kpm than the earlier game.

So, no, I don't see evidence here that "steamrolling plat gives you more MMR" You got less MMR in the game vs. Plat.

You also had a lower kpm in that game. But you also won against easier odds in that game.

The MMR change is based on kpm vs. expected kpm and wins vs. how hard the win was.
These stats are for NBK DarkWarlock, right? You quoted eLantern so it wasn't clear.
Chimera30 wrote:
ZaedynFel wrote:
You didn't earn more MMR.

Your MMR went up more in the second game (42) than the first one (33).

The second game you won against harder odds as well.

Also, the second game you had a higher kpm than the earlier game.

So, no, I don't see evidence here that "steamrolling plat gives you more MMR" You got less MMR in the game vs. Plat.

You also had a lower kpm in that game. But you also won against easier odds in that game.

The MMR change is based on kpm vs. expected kpm and wins vs. how hard the win was.
These stats are for NBK DarkWarlock, right? You quoted eLantern so it wasn't clear.
Yeah, I was answering NBK.
Josh, can you give an estimate on when you think the BTB refresh will be rolling out? Next month or two months from now, etc?
LUKEPOWA wrote:
Josh, can you give an estimate on when you think the BTB refresh will be rolling out? Next month or two months from now, etc?
And when will a BTB Refresh Thread appear?

Maybe work is still being directed on the Doubles refresh, so the BTB refresh is waiting for that to complete first?
ZaedynFel wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
MMR still gives more importance to KPM than winning game for example https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/01ffea6a-8ace-437b-9d56-422e82c90e68/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=14&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All I earned less after this game than the previous one for no reason at all but one: my kpm was lower
KPM is a factor, but not as great of a factor as Win/Loss. Read the post HERE: Link
It helps breakdown the reason why.
Then why did i earn more MMR steamrolling a bunch of platinum than having a fair game against at time 47 champion?
I'm not privy to viewing your actual shifts in MMR leading up to and after those matches, so I cannot properly verify or give an accurate account of your claim to earn more MMR steamrolling Plats than against a team featuring a Champ. Josh would be much more capable to answer this inquiry.
You didn't earn more MMR.

Your MMR went up more in the second game (42) than the first one (33).

The second game you won against harder odds as well.

Also, the second game you had a higher kpm than the earlier game.

So, no, I don't see evidence here that "steamrolling plat gives you more MMR" You got less MMR in the game vs. Plat.

You also had a lower kpm in that game. But you also won against easier odds in that game.

The MMR change is based on kpm vs. expected kpm and wins vs. how hard the win was.
Josh, 11 of the top 25 Team Arena champions have lost more games than they've won. The average k/d of the top 25 is 1.7. There isn't one player in the top 250 with a negative k/d. It appears that having a high k/d is primary, winning secondary. Would you please explain why that isn't the case?
<p></p>
ZaedynFel wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
MMR still gives more importance to KPM than winning game for example https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/01ffea6a-8ace-437b-9d56-422e82c90e68/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=14&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All I earned less after this game than the previous one for no reason at all but one: my kpm was lower
KPM is a factor, but not as great of a factor as Win/Loss. Read the post HERE: Link
It helps breakdown the reason why.
Then why did i earn more MMR steamrolling a bunch of platinum than having a fair game against at time 47 champion?
I'm not privy to viewing your actual shifts in MMR leading up to and after those matches, so I cannot properly verify or give an accurate account of your claim to earn more MMR steamrolling Plats than against a team featuring a Champ. Josh would be much more capable to answer this inquiry.
You didn't earn more MMR.

Your MMR went up more in the second game (42) than the first one (33).

The second game you won against harder odds as well.

Also, the second game you had a higher kpm than the earlier game.

So, no, I don't see evidence here that "steamrolling plat gives you more MMR" You got less MMR in the game vs. Plat.

You also had a lower kpm in that game. But you also won against easier odds in that game.

The MMR change is based on kpm vs. expected kpm and wins vs. how hard the win was.
Okay but why the next game after i beated the champion i earned only 6 point when after i beated the platinum I earned for three game the max csr gain
then the KPM against platinum was 7.59 and the KPM against diamond with champion was 3.57 so how can it be lower?
ZaedynFel wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
MMR still gives more importance to KPM than winning game for example https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/01ffea6a-8ace-437b-9d56-422e82c90e68/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=14&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All I earned less after this game than the previous one for no reason at all but one: my kpm was lower
KPM is a factor, but not as great of a factor as Win/Loss. Read the post HERE: Link
It helps breakdown the reason why.
Then why did i earn more MMR steamrolling a bunch of platinum than having a fair game against at time 47 champion?
I'm not privy to viewing your actual shifts in MMR leading up to and after those matches, so I cannot properly verify or give an accurate account of your claim to earn more MMR steamrolling Plats than against a team featuring a Champ. Josh would be much more capable to answer this inquiry.
You didn't earn more MMR.

Your MMR went up more in the second game (42) than the first one (33).

The second game you won against harder odds as well.

Also, the second game you had a higher kpm than the earlier game.

So, no, I don't see evidence here that "steamrolling plat gives you more MMR" You got less MMR in the game vs. Plat.

You also had a lower kpm in that game. But you also won against easier odds in that game.

The MMR change is based on kpm vs. expected kpm and wins vs. how hard the win was.
Josh, 11 of the top 25 Team Arena champions have lost more games than they've won. The average k/d of the top 25 is 1.7. There isn't one player in the top 250 with a negative k/d. It appears that having a high k/d is primary, winning secondary. Would you please explain why that isn't the case?
<p></p>
K/D is irrelevant. We don't look at that at all. You're look at this the wrong way around.

The reason K/D is high for top players is because they mostly play with players worse than them. Both their teammates and their opponents are all significantly worse than they are (because of pop), so of course they are going to have higher K/D while playing against Diamonds.

Also, win% is irrelevant because we are team balancing. It doesn't matter how good of a player you are if the opposing team is just as good as your team. You're not going to win more than half the time because the system is very good at enforcing that.

High level players with low win% just means they have been in more fair or even harder matches than lower ranked players with higher win%.
ZaedynFel wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
MMR still gives more importance to KPM than winning game for example https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/01ffea6a-8ace-437b-9d56-422e82c90e68/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=14&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All I earned less after this game than the previous one for no reason at all but one: my kpm was lower
KPM is a factor, but not as great of a factor as Win/Loss. Read the post HERE: Link
It helps breakdown the reason why.
Then why did i earn more MMR steamrolling a bunch of platinum than having a fair game against at time 47 champion?
I'm not privy to viewing your actual shifts in MMR leading up to and after those matches, so I cannot properly verify or give an accurate account of your claim to earn more MMR steamrolling Plats than against a team featuring a Champ. Josh would be much more capable to answer this inquiry.
You didn't earn more MMR.

Your MMR went up more in the second game (42) than the first one (33).

The second game you won against harder odds as well.

Also, the second game you had a higher kpm than the earlier game.

So, no, I don't see evidence here that "steamrolling plat gives you more MMR" You got less MMR in the game vs. Plat.

You also had a lower kpm in that game. But you also won against easier odds in that game.

The MMR change is based on kpm vs. expected kpm and wins vs. how hard the win was.
Okay but why the next game after i beated the champion i earned only 6 point when after i beated the platinum I earned for three game the max csr gain
then the KPM against platinum was 7.59 and the KPM against diamond with champion was 3.57 so how can it be lower?
KPM has zero to do with a single game's CSR update, and also remember that the CSR update you get is based on your PRE-game MMR, not the MMR after that game happened.

So if you were getting max CSR for awhile, it's likely your CSR was just catching up to your MMR, and the 6 point game happened after it over-shot it.
ZaedynFel wrote:
ZaedynFel wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
MMR still gives more importance to KPM than winning game for example https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/01ffea6a-8ace-437b-9d56-422e82c90e68/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=14&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All I earned less after this game than the previous one for no reason at all but one: my kpm was lower
KPM is a factor, but not as great of a factor as Win/Loss. Read the post HERE: Link
It helps breakdown the reason why.
Then why did i earn more MMR steamrolling a bunch of platinum than having a fair game against at time 47 champion?
I'm not privy to viewing your actual shifts in MMR leading up to and after those matches, so I cannot properly verify or give an accurate account of your claim to earn more MMR steamrolling Plats than against a team featuring a Champ. Josh would be much more capable to answer this inquiry.
You didn't earn more MMR.

Your MMR went up more in the second game (42) than the first one (33).

The second game you won against harder odds as well.

Also, the second game you had a higher kpm than the earlier game.

So, no, I don't see evidence here that "steamrolling plat gives you more MMR" You got less MMR in the game vs. Plat.

You also had a lower kpm in that game. But you also won against easier odds in that game.

The MMR change is based on kpm vs. expected kpm and wins vs. how hard the win was.
Josh, 11 of the top 25 Team Arena champions have lost more games than they've won. The average k/d of the top 25 is 1.7. There isn't one player in the top 250 with a negative k/d. It appears that having a high k/d is primary, winning secondary. Would you please explain why that isn't the case?
<p></p>
K/D is irrelevant. We don't look at that at all. You're look at this the wrong way around.

The reason K/D is high for top players is because they mostly play with players worse than them. Both their teammates and their opponents are all significantly worse than they are (because of pop), so of course they are going to have higher K/D while playing against Diamonds.

Also, win% is irrelevant because we are team balancing. It doesn't matter how good of a player you are if the opposing team is just as good as your team. You're not going to win more than half the time because the system is very good at enforcing that.

High level players with low win% just means they have been in more fair or even harder matches than lower ranked players with higher win%.
Isn't k/d just kpm/dpm? You're telling me that's irrelevent?

So basically, a champ will have a high kpm/dpm, but won't necessarily have a high winning percentage. That sounds like winning is less relevant. If they're given even matches, then kpm is what actually separates them.

Why isn't the irrelevant win % manifesting on the other leaderboards? For example, the Slayer list only has 4 losing records in the top 25.
Hi Josh. Just wanted to bump this in case you missed it. Would appreciate an answer, thanks.

Edit: Just realised that the game history for the links other than the individual games don't work the way I expected them to, they check the last 10 games rather than that specific page of games. To find games like the individual one I linked you'd have to go to the games history in and around the date I posted

Here is an updated link that points to those games: https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-gb/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/game-history/players/aggrxssiv?gameModeFilter=All&start=440&count=10
ZaedynFel wrote:
ZaedynFel wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
eLantern wrote:
My skill is fine. The problem is even with wins (which they've said is primary in regards to moving up or down) are broken. I've played plenty of games going positives which wins that I "shouldn't" have won and get almost nothing. Lose once or have a bad game, lose all progress and then some. My opinion of the system won't change, it's not good.
Wins are primary, but all wins and losses are not of equal value to the system's assessment of your skill. You reference unexpected wins, but it'd be easier to understand your claim if you could provide links to those match outcomes. It seems like you've made up your mind that you'd rather have a visual indication that's more reflective of experience than actual skill.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/110c9d59-f9ff-449f-970f-33ddf46b9f23/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=5&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All

this victory made me jump from Onyx 1730 to Onyx 1830 only because i reached the quota of KPM
Not possible. You can only gain a max CSR adjustment of + or - 30 from a match. So, at most you would have gone from 1730 to 1760. But I can't see your numerical Onyx rank within that link. I can only see that you're Onyx.

Hey Josh, could you look closer at the adjustment NBK got from this match? What was his CSR was going in and what did it adjust to after.
My bad. MMR jumped from 1730 to 1830 i know because next game i earned 30 point
MMR is free to make dramatic shifts. And because of the 1-match lag you'll usually see the CSR shift accordingly the following match based on that match's outcome -- still need to win.
MMR still gives more importance to KPM than winning game for example https://www.halowaypoint.com/it-it/games/halo-5-guardians/xbox-one/mode/arena/matches/01ffea6a-8ace-437b-9d56-422e82c90e68/players/nbk%20darkwarlock?gameHistoryMatchIndex=14&gameHistoryGameModeFilter=All I earned less after this game than the previous one for no reason at all but one: my kpm was lower
KPM is a factor, but not as great of a factor as Win/Loss. Read the post HERE: Link
It helps breakdown the reason why.
Then why did i earn more MMR steamrolling a bunch of platinum than having a fair game against at time 47 champion?
I'm not privy to viewing your actual shifts in MMR leading up to and after those matches, so I cannot properly verify or give an accurate account of your claim to earn more MMR steamrolling Plats than against a team featuring a Champ. Josh would be much more capable to answer this inquiry.
You didn't earn more MMR.

Your MMR went up more in the second game (42) than the first one (33).

The second game you won against harder odds as well.

Also, the second game you had a higher kpm than the earlier game.

So, no, I don't see evidence here that "steamrolling plat gives you more MMR" You got less MMR in the game vs. Plat.

You also had a lower kpm in that game. But you also won against easier odds in that game.

The MMR change is based on kpm vs. expected kpm and wins vs. how hard the win was.
K/D is irrelevant. We don't look at that at all. You're look at this the wrong way around.
Isn't k/d just kpm/dpm? You're telling me that's irrelevent?

So basically, a champ will have a high kpm/dpm, but won't necessarily have a high winning percentage. That sounds like winning is less relevant. If they're given even matches, then kpm is what actually separates them.

Why isn't the irrelevant win % manifesting on the other leaderboards? For example, the Slayer list only has 4 losing records in the top 25.
Like Josh said, you are looking at it the wrong way around. The champ's high K/D is a SYMPTOM of his high MMR and the fact that the population is much worse, not the CAUSE of his high MMR and CSR.

Winning is very relevant. If a champ is on a team favored to win a game, and get a high K/D that game, but his team loses (maybe it was a CTF game and he was just playing for stats not playing obj), he will lose MMR (and probably CSR) cause his team was supposed to win.

Good question about the difference in the slayer playlist. I'm going to guess it's because you have more teams running in the high slayer ranks (because they can find games easier), and they tend not to lose games, where in TA the pros are running solo to find games and constantly having to carry potato teammates (and losing impossible games a lot). But Josh would know better than me.
  1. 1
  2. ...
  3. 18
  4. 19
  5. 20
  6. 21
  7. 22
  8. ...
  9. 27