Forums / Games / Halo 5: Guardians

Anyone else get really bad teammates in Social?

OP TheStupidPolice

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To start this out, I understand that not everyone is a God at video games. I get it, we all start somewhere. This post isn't here to bash new players for being at a skill level lower than veteran Halo gamers. Not everyone has hours every day to hone their skills, or the desire play competitive either. Rather, I'm making this post to question why I keep getting paired with veteran Halo players that play significantly worse than most legit newbies. We're talking SR100+ players who get 2 kills and die like 13-20 times. Sure, sometimes we have bad matches. It happens. But with the limited pool of remaining Halo 5 players, I can't help but notice just how consistently I get matched with people who I would actually have an easier time winning without. I have had a bare minimum of 10 matches where I went 30+ kills and less than 5 deaths, but still lost because the level 149 on my team cannot get a kill to save their life. It feels like I'm stuck playing with a legit handicap. Meanwhile, of course, the enemy team is made up of people who are all a quarter of their rank with 1000x the skill. Is there some sort of secret ranking system in Social Arena that I don't know about? Does anyone else have this problem? Not to mention, many of these players are quite toxic. They won't say anything at all when you carry the whole team to victory, but if they get matched against you with a 3 man team of Achilles ultra-tryhards, they will talk a ridiculous amount of trash when they win! What's more, it's really frustrating when you keep getting matched with these people time and time again. Today I had a dude (SR150) on my team in Anniversary four times in a row against randoms. Not a pre-made squad, but just randoms. I doubt that he got more than 6 kills for all four matches, but he probably died at least 13 times each game. When I looked at his Service Record, the guy had been playing Arena for a total of 50 days. I don't even have half of that time logged, but somehow this guy had scores that were basically the reverse of mine the whole time. It's not their internet, it's the fact that they are essentially armored bags of flour that you have to haul to victory. I honestly think that these types of teammates are worse than enemies. It's easy enough to crush one extra player on the enemy team, but it's another thing when you've got a score-hemorrhaging missile aimed right at you. Surely this can't be fun for them either. Who enjoys losing game after game while simultaneously winning the "worst player in the lobby" award? Maybe I am the only person who experiences this, but I'd love to know if this ain't just happening to me!

Thanks.
Depends on what mode they've accrued a bulk of their SR from , if it's warzone FF I'm sure they could be rank 149 without a clue in arena . As firefight play style is so very different to arena
Like I said, most of the people I check Service Record for have a ridiculously large amount of time spent in Arena. I'm just wondering if there's some sort of secret skill system that keeps nerfing the heck out of me by pairing me with guys whose lifetime Arena KD is -7.2. If I play on a smurf account, I almost never get paired with those types of players. This is what I find to be so strange. That dude with SR150 yesterday had all of like 10 games of Warzone in his SR, but literally logged almost two months of in-game hours. Never saw him lag, and all he did each time we were in a match was bellyache about how our "team" wasn't doing well. Sure, isolated toxic players do occur, but I consistently keep getting paired with these people. Meanwhile, my SR shows that my Arena KD is over 7.0, so I know it isn't me getting paired with similarly skilled players. As for some sort of "toxics pair with toxics," I am almost never on-mic. When I am, I'm never all that negative. Sometimes I'll get on mic to say "Hey SaltySphynx2342, remember that the Halo CE pistol is much more powerful than your Assault Rifle. You'll lose less fights if you use it to aim for their heads." That's about as "toxic" as I like getting in game chat.
The system balances the game by using the combined MMR of each team, so if you're getting 30 kills a game then you're likely going to get worse players to balance out the MMR compared to the other team's MMR. There can also be other factors at play like population for example, but generally it's best to play with a party if you don't want to risk getting anchors on your team.
LUKEPOWA wrote:
The system balances the game by using the combined MMR of each team, so if you're getting 30 kills a game then you're likely going to get worse players to balance out the MMR compared to the other team's MMR. There can also be other factors at play like population for example, but generally it's best to play with a party if you don't want to risk getting anchors on your team.
See, now that's exactly the thing that I was thinking. But why does it do this stuff in Social? I get that it isn't fair to match someone like myself against a new player in ranked, but why is it that random non-continuous enemy teams get players who are all about equivalent skill? Assuming that this MMR scale is from 1-10, and I am about a 9 on that scale, why do I get matched against four 8's with only a couple of 2's or 4's to back me up? I'd understand this system a lot better if they'd actually come out and say what it is, but it feels like 343 is punishing me for actually playing the game effectively. It feels like your options are:
A. Lose because your teammates are terrible.
B. Lose because the enemy team is competent and your squad isn't.
C. Win in utter spite of your team's worst efforts, taking the fun out of the game.
D. Spend three hours waiting for someone to ready up on Looking for Group, and have them disconnect after a round or two.

I personally love going for assassinations, but I have a hard time doing that when uber-competitive greasebuckets can just get free points off of the SR152 seagull on my team who is blaring random music through their garbo Kinect. I spend the whole round dominating, not even trying for assassinations, only to lose because I had a teammate who (seen from a score perspective) is literally boosting for the enemy team.
Depends on what mode they've accrued a bulk of their SR from , if it's warzone FF I'm sure they could be rank 149 without a clue in arena . As firefight play style is so very different to arena
Man that's so me. I'm 145 with mainly wz assault. It's just my favorite game mode ever even if I am solo 99% the time. Hardly do arena and I suck at it since I'm not used with all the spawns and such
you are a good player if you can control the game despite teammates, the best top players play with 3 or even in 2 lobby friends , with 1 or 2 random players in the team.
After classifying themselves at high levels they can even play alone, they go down a little csr but always remain between onyx and champion.

yesterday I met a player who hurt me and betrayed me at random, after the third betrayal came out, we finished the game but lost only 1 csr.
if I won the match would have given me +30 csr.
I am one of those that you refer to OP (without the music playing and other stuff): for too long i was grinding to 152 in WZFF, hence 145, though, latterly i did use a lot of the time to get some loadout weapon skills.

I object to be being referred to as a "bad teammate"; I don't get to choose the level of player that i have to play with, or against.

In at least one game, having played less than 10 games in ranked - ever - i was in a team of Champ and 2 Diamonds vs 2 Champs an Onyx and a Diamond. Do you really think that's a game i'd *want* to be in? TBH i do feel sorry for those that have had to play alongside me because i know that i just won't come close and best thing to do (e.g. in slayer) is be killed as little as possible.

Also being completely new to arena i know nothing about the maps or the modes and the only way to learn any of this is to play. I have went to the Customs Browser and got some map knowledge but not absolutely every combination. It's all outside my control and i just have to grit my teeth and do it. Yeah sure it would be great to get others just to practice with but that's a whole different issue.

Another problem is that there is little to no *real* information on ranked out there. For instance it's only within the last couple of days that i found out that team kill is on in ranked...

I should also mention Slayer bores the hill out me, i want to play games with objectives other than "kill them all". But i don't get the choice not to play that either.

I think a big problem in all of this is the severely limited options in matchmaking and indeed poor "matchmaking" itself.
vengeant wrote:
I am one of those that you refer to OP (without the music playing and other stuff): for too long i was grinding to 152 in WZFF, hence 145, though, latterly i did use a lot of the time to get some loadout weapon skills.

I object to be being referred to as a "bad teammate"; I don't get to choose the level of player that i have to play with, or against.

In at least one game, having played less than 10 games in ranked - ever - i was in a team of Champ and 2 Diamonds vs 2 Champs an Onyx and a Diamond. Do you really think that's a game i'd *want* to be in? TBH i do feel sorry for those that have had to play alongside me because i know that i just won't come close and best thing to do (e.g. in slayer) is be killed as little as possible.

This isn't really my point. I am talking about people who have spent weeks worth of hours on Arena, and can't even come close to a positive score in Social. The thing that is the most frustrating is knowing that I am *NOT* playing in a ranked game mode. Theoretically, this whole constant state of bad-to-balance-tryhard should have no gravity in the situation. Heck, the vast majority of the times I will just chill or go for assassinations now. Yet, for some reason, I end up in 1st place on my team almost every single game. This sounds fun on paper, but it really just means that I've had a hard time finding decent players. The fact that I can get more kills by performing assassinations than most of my teammates get while using the Whiplash in R&R is something I find disturbing. I bet that out of the past 50 rounds I've played, I might've been in 2nd three times. Not to mention the fact that I average at least 1 toxic message every 3-4 rounds of playtime. Getting the oddball poor team isn't really a big deal to me. However, it seems that I can't play anything on Halo without getting teammates who might as well have paid a Chinese hacker to boost their rank to 152. It's not the people who are coming into Arena from Warzone that bother me. As I said, I check stats on players who play poorly. In fact, many of the players I am describing have less than 20 rounds of Warzone played. We're talking about someone who plays nothing but Arena and still plays WORSE than someone who just hopped over from Fortnite. It's like watching someone play Super Mario Bros for 5 hours a day, but they never get past World 1-1.
I think the problem is the lack of a fully-fledged party matching system.
This isn't really my point. I am talking about people who have spent weeks worth of hours on Arena, and can't even come close to a positive score in Social. The thing that is the most frustrating is knowing that I am *NOT* playing in a ranked game mode.
...
Ah. When you mention toxic messages and Arena i assumed ranked following my experience in Team Arena (though not in Swat).

As i mentioned (and aluded to by omarlotrc) i think a lot is down to limited matchmaking choices and questionable and inefficient "matchmaking" algorithms, right across the board. Personally i use only Extended as that tis the only option that gives me a game in a reasonable time frame. Only once have i managed to get a game on Focused in Social within 3 "Unable to join"s ....

Also i do agree with your broad sentiment. For me moving across from PC multiplayer (on e.g. Battlefield) i see a lot less teamwork / team spirit and focus on objectives. I also see a lot more quits when the going gets tough. But then the average age on Halo must be much lower than on those games, the average maturity certainly is.

Sadly, I doubt any of that will change soon.
vengeant wrote:
Also i do agree with your broad sentiment. For me moving across from PC multiplayer (on e.g. Battlefield) i see a lot less teamwork / team spirit and focus on objectives. I also see a lot more quits when the going gets tough. But then the average age on Halo must be much lower than on those games, the average maturity certainly is.

It's funny, because I also play games like Battlefield. Toxicity is virtually nonexistent there, however we all know that Halo is probably the most competitive mainstream console franchise. Sure, games like Overwatch and F2P/BR games have competitive modes, but the majority of their populations still play casually. That being said, maybe it is that competitive nature that magnifies the incompetence/toxicity of certain players. Halo's fair-start mechanic means that skill wins out over luck 99.99% of the time. You can't flashbang or "counter" your way out of trouble here. Skill is the only true counter there is in Anniversary Throwback. And, theoretically, Practice+Time=Skill. Play Warzone? You've put in the time for game mechanics, but likely haven't practiced map control on Arena. Play Customs? Second verse, same as the first. BUT, when I come across players who clearly have had more than enough time and practice to have high skill, I get visibly angry when they play worse than someone who has never touched an Arena map in their life. Don't give me any of that: "tHeY'RE ProBaBlY JusT oN tHeir Big BRotHEr'S AcCouNt" bs either. (Not directing this at anyone in particular, more just using it as a vent.)
At this point in Halo 5's life cycle, the vast majority of remnant players are die-hard Halo fans. This is not a new game, and most of us aren't new to it. That means, even in the most casual of Social queues, you get the same degree of toxicity as ranked. Don't believe me? Try this out: go on any small team social mode, take note of a specific player above rank 100 who plays poorly, win against them twice (preferably 1st place, so they remember your GT), and continue to stay in that queue. If anyone's going to send you a toxic message, it's gonna be him. After getting absolutely nuked for 2 rounds, even if his KDA is still trash, these are the players who are the sorest winners. I think it's because they spent the whole day getting dumped on, and thus their Napoleon complex basically forces them to gloat when they finally beat you. It doesn't matter that you had a teammate who went 0-21. It doesn't matter that you killed them 20 times in the past two games. Heck, it doesn't even matter that they got carried by the max level clan on their team. If they got a single kill on you anytime at all, you'll be hearing about it.

After all, you're a noob. Your score of 26-6 pales in comparison to their pristine 11-15. "Get rekt, and something something I did your mom." Haha.
Hahaha.

Really good points, particularly about skill, and you're bang-on that the 'learning to shoot' bit is easier than the 'map knowledge and movement', which is down to experience.

Once i'm at a level at which i can actually compete, i'll check out your theory, though i'll probably be playing Infinity by then...
LUKEPOWA wrote:
The system balances the game by using the combined MMR of each team, so if you're getting 30 kills a game then you're likely going to get worse players to balance out the MMR compared to the other team's MMR. There can also be other factors at play like population for example, but generally it's best to play with a party if you don't want to risk getting anchors on your team.
See, now that's exactly the thing that I was thinking. But why does it do this stuff in Social? I get that it isn't fair to match someone like myself against a new player in ranked, but why is it that random non-continuous enemy teams get players who are all about equivalent skill? Assuming that this MMR scale is from 1-10, and I am about a 9 on that scale, why do I get matched against four 8's with only a couple of 2's or 4's to back me up? I'd understand this system a lot better if they'd actually come out and say what it is, but it feels like 343 is punishing me for actually playing the game effectively. It feels like your options are:
A. Lose because your teammates are terrible.
B. Lose because the enemy team is competent and your squad isn't.
C. Win in utter spite of your team's worst efforts, taking the fun out of the game.
D. Spend three hours waiting for someone to ready up on Looking for Group, and have them disconnect after a round or two.

I personally love going for assassinations, but I have a hard time doing that when uber-competitive greasebuckets can just get free points off of the SR152 seagull on my team who is blaring random music through their garbo Kinect. I spend the whole round dominating, not even trying for assassinations, only to lose because I had a teammate who (seen from a score perspective) is literally boosting for the enemy team.
From what I have heard, the part about using MMR even in Social is true. The system isn't trying to punish you per se, it is trying to even the teams out. They do this because a lot of data shows that even in Social more people either quit out of matches or even quit playing the game entirely for the night when they match into poorly balanced matches. The MMR system actually doesn't go to only 10, but if you would like to know basics of how it works feel free to respond back and I will tell you some of what I know about it.
Warzone and BTB give me the most ridiculous teammates. It’s been like that since 2017 :(
Volize wrote:
Warzone and BTB give me the most ridiculous teammates. It’s been like that since 2017 :(
Warzone I can't really say anything about because I don't know much about it, but BTB from what I heard has a relatively low pop, so its search restrictions are pretty relaxed I'm sure.
LKG Gluby wrote:
Depends on what mode they've accrued a bulk of their SR from , if it's warzone FF I'm sure they could be rank 149 without a clue in arena . As firefight play style is so very different to arena
Man that's so me. I'm 145 with mainly wz assault. It's just my favorite game mode ever even if I am solo 99% the time. Hardly do arena and I suck at it since I'm not used with all the spawns and such
I've been sucking bad trying to get better at ranked big team slayer. It's not going well.
Regardless of how good or bad teammates are and their level of experience is , play style .kda ect ect
, it's a social mode end of story , key word social .
Volize wrote:
Warzone and BTB give me the most ridiculous teammates. It’s been like that since 2017 :(
in my time zone between morning and evening nobody plays BTB, in the few times I can play after evening or night, the game find 2 games against platinum and gold, then 8 games always against the usual 6 champions and 2 diamonds and my random team is never enough strong to beat them when i play in solo lobby.
Regardless of how good or bad teammates are and their level of experience is , play style .kda ect ect
, it's a social mode end of story , key word social .
Normally that'd be fine, but the level of "social" I keep seeing is RIDICULOUS. It's like, I've been in countless matches where someone is so incredulously bad at the game that I question if they are even remotely trying at all. Being in casual queue is not a legit excuse to be an anchor 24/7. It takes the fun away from people who actually enjoy the game. If folks want to dink around without getting a single kill, that's fine. They belong in customs. Or campaign. Or firefight. Or at the very least, Action Sack. It's reaaaallly hard to have fun when you end up losing matches because there's a dude on your team with 21 deaths and zero kills on Anniversary Throwback.
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