Forums / Games / Halo 5: Guardians

Can we get rid of spartan charge in all playlists

OP Peyote Wizard

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Charge and Ground pound is not all bad, I don't really use it, I like sprint and boost, but if someone is using them on you, you too close and didn't see them; either way they are on ya, you dead.
I am a very long time player and a veteran of all Halo games. I do not mind Spartan charge at all.

Halo 5 made leaps and bounds towards making Spartans feel like...Spartans.
But you don't need spartan charge or even sprint to accomplish that. Look at Doom. No Sprint, but you still feel like a God among men. Let Spartans move faster, change how they physically interact with objects (we apparently weigh in excess of a ton, when I run or fly into a car I should hear an impact and give a large impulse into it)

Gameplay is bigger than lore accuracy, especially when you consider that the games made the lore and the EU just took it and ran.

Also saying you've been a fan of all the games doesn't make your point any more or less credible because I've played all the Halo's and I can safely say I disagree completely with your point.
JediMac wrote:
Charge and Ground pound is not all bad, I don't really use it, I like sprint and boost, but if someone is using them on you, you too close and didn't see them; either way they are on ya, you dead.
When someone sprints around a blind corner and I have a 15-20 meter radar there's little to no warning. There's also no risk to them because charge gets aim assist so you have a pretty huge chance of hitting them. You can't always blame the player.
I disagree, Halo is not based around the magnum as the primary go to weapon. You spawn with an AR and the BR as well, and many people make use of both rather than foolishly relying on the magnum for everything.
Halo's go-to weapon, it is not. Halo 5's go-to weapon, yes it is. Just like how Halo CE's was the CE Magnum, and Halo 2's & 3's was the Battle Rifle. You can certainly play games without relying on the utility weapon, but that doesn't stop them from being utility weapons.

I'm pretty sure the only playlist that supports AR/BR starts is BTB (minus rotational playlists, which aren't meant to be conventional), and that's a whole different can of worms considering every map (minus one of the more recent ones) was designed around starting with the Pistol, not the BR.

"Even giving you the benefit of the doubt about your warzone stats, it was a trend consisting of multiple players. It is interesting to see someone suggest the removal of spartan charge after suggesting they are mostly playing against the AI in warzone." - Because again. Go-to weapon. It's better than the AR at mid-range, reliable enough at close range, and you always spawn with it. Of course most people are going to use it. That doesn't mean they rely on it or they suddenly can't play well if they don't have it or are playing in a situation where it isn't as helpful.

Also, I don't solely play against the AI, and part of the reason I do is because a good number of mechanics and sections of game design frustrate me against other players, but that's not the most relevant to this topic.

"Hanging back and providing overwatch so that you never encounter spartan charge is a pretty good counter. It's akin to getting sniped less by avoiding open areas, that's just how you counter certain things." - It doesn't actually solve the problem of Spartan Charge, it's more or less a way of saying you're hiding from it so you don't have to deal with the problems of Spartan Charge.

The Sniper Rifle had a huge problem with bullet magnetism back during launch. Using your logic, all you had to do is counter it by staying away from open areas. Of course people do that, but that wasn't the problem. The problem was the Sniper Rifle itself having a lot of bullet magnetism (especially aim-assist from the hip). As a result, the weapons themselves were changed instead of people just saying to adapt to it.

"As for the roles of spartan charge and melee, you realize there is a difference in their roles because you're complaining about one and not both. You even listed range as the difference between the pistol and AR. If you can make that connection, then you can make the same connection with spartan charge and melee."Again, the worst part of Spartan Charge (and the biggest difference between it and melee) is the "bullet" magnetism that it gives you, and the fact that it is tied to Sprint. Beyond that, the difference is negligible. You're giving me "half-explanations" expecting me to tell you the differences when I'm explicitly asking you to tell me the differences if Spartan Charge is this worthwhile mechanic that melee can never accomplish.

"And that brings me to my next point: with the difference being range, you also understand why "Most usages of Spartan Charge can be accomplished by you walking up and doing a regular melee" just isn't true. You don't have that range while casually walking up to someone and hitting them, but with spartan charge, you do. You also have to sneak up or around people to use it very effectively, otherwise you usually get shot a few times and wrapped up with a melee if you even make it to your target." - The range is not that much higher than a standard melee (you don't have to be right in front of someone to do a standard melee anyway), and you have to Sprint before you can accomplish it. Walking up to someone who's shooting at you in the hopes to melee them is a all-around bad idea from the start, I mean you said the same thing happens with Spartan Charge when you sprint up to people. At least with melee, you can deal damage with your weapons walking up to someone and then finish with a melee, something that can't happen with Spartan Charge.

"It's not this easy, spammable, guaranteed kill you make it out to be." - I didn't say it was. My very first statement was "It's close to one", and then it's been expanded to there being no reliable counter, the best counter being to stop the opponent before Spartan Charge is activated in the first place.
I am a very long time player and a veteran of all Halo games. I do not mind Spartan charge at all.

Halo 5 made leaps and bounds towards making Spartans feel like...Spartans.
Comments like this?

Why is it the armour makes the Spartan?

A Spartan is Spartan with our without the armour, the gameplay should reflect this. We should be able to do physically impressive things, not technological things.
I disagree, Halo is not based around the magnum as the primary go to weapon. You spawn with an AR and the BR as well, and many people make use of both rather than foolishly relying on the magnum for everything.
Halo's go-to weapon, it is not. Halo 5's go-to weapon, yes it is. Just like how Halo CE's was the CE Magnum, and Halo 2's & 3's was the Battle Rifle. You can certainly play games without relying on the utility weapon, but that doesn't stop them from being utility weapons.

I'm pretty sure the only playlist that supports AR/BR starts is BTB (minus rotational playlists, which aren't meant to be conventional), and that's a whole different can of worms considering every map (minus one of the more recent ones) was designed around starting with the Pistol...
It's not Halo's go to weapon though, especially when you are trying to counter close quarters attacks. Part of the reason you're here is because the magnum doesn't counter spartan charge so well. If it were, you could be over reliant on it in that situation as well and probably never be the wiser. You can try to characterize mid range support as "hiding from spartan charge," but that doesn't cheapen a good counter, especially coming from someone who just admitted immediately after that they play against the AI so much because game mechanics like spartan charge frustrate them. Any problems with the sniper rifle at launch don't make a bit of difference either. Countering enemies with longer ranged weapons by avoiding open areas is something that has been omnipresent in the Halo franchise and pretty much all FPS games. Likewise if you don't want to get hit by a CQC attack, you simply avoid CQC encounters. And there are tons of reliable counters using automatics and CQC power weapons irregardless of your willingness to use them. Overall it's a great feature that punishes people who let you get close and do not use the proper weapons to counter your attack.
It's not Halo's go to weapon though, especially when you are trying to counter close quarters attacks.
Utility weapon or "go-to weapon" doesn't mean it's a weapon that counters every situation or something that works perfectly in all situations. If anything, it's closer to "Jack of all trades, master of none" (though recent history shows Halo's utility weapons tend to excel in mid range, so more like "master of one"). The utility weapon is again, the weapon the sandbox revolves around, and the weapon most people tend to use in average situations. The niche weapons are used for their specific roles, which is why they are not go-to weapons.

You don't see anyone upset that the Pistol can't beat the Sniper Rifle, because it isn't meant for long range. But you could probably hit someone with it one time if you're good enough. Get into mid-range distance, and the Pistol fares much better.

You don't see anyone upset that the Pistol can't beat the Shotgun, because it's not as good in close range. But you might be able to hit someone or melee someone instead. Back up into mid-range distance, and again the Pistol dominates.

"Part of the reason you're here is because the magnum doesn't counter spartan charge so well." - I've said nothing of the sort. No one here did.

You're the one that made the assumption that because I use the Pistol a lot, I "obviously" over-rely on it and therefore tried to use it on a Spartan Charge and it failed. You assume that I'm here because Spartan Charge keeps killing me, when I haven't said that either. You've actually been prone to making a lot of assumptions here beyond the fact that maybe some people just don't like Spartan Charge and find it a bad game mechanic.

I could just as easily call you over-reliant on the Battle Rifle due to the fact that you have more kills with that over the Assault Rifle.

I still use the Assault Rifle when the situation calls for it, including Spartan Charge. I still have kills under it. I just am placed in more situations where the Pistol is just as useful, if not more useful, than using the Assault Rifle. I don't have a lot of melee kills either, implying that I don't always spend my time trying to get into close range if I don't have to. Someone a few pages back said it best: Once you eliminate/dodge Spartan charge, it doesn't really matter what weapon you have whether it's an automatic weapon or the Pistol. I have often punished Spartan Charge with the Pistol.

"You can try to characterize mid range support as "hiding from spartan charge," but that doesn't cheapen a good counter, especially coming from someone who just admitted immediately after that they play against the AI so much because game mechanics like spartan charge frustrate them." - I didn't say it wasn't a good counter. I said it didn't solve the problem.

Also, it wasn't just Spartan Charge, or even Spartan Abilities. I said "a good number of mechanics and sections of game design frustrate me when used against other players." There are things with Firefight that frustrate me as well, and I did say that it wasn't entirely relevant to this thread. So don't draw so much of a conclusion from it.

"Any problems with the sniper rifle at launch don't make a bit of difference either. Countering enemies with longer ranged weapons by avoiding open areas is something that has been omnipresent in the Halo franchise and pretty much all FPS games." - And yet, just going "avoid open areas" wasn't enough. The sniper rifle still got an update due to its bullet magnetism. So clearly even 343i had some belief that it was a problem that deserved fixing.

"And there are tons of reliable counters using automatics and CQC power weapons irregardless of your willingness to use them." - I have never once said that I was unwilling to use a weapon.

"Overall it's a great feature that punishes people who let you get close and do not use the proper weapons to counter your attack." - In other words, a melee? Something we already have?
LUKEPOWA wrote:
I am a very long time player and a veteran of all Halo games. I do not mind Spartan charge at all.
I'm a Halo veteran and I think Spartan charge is one of the worst abilities since armor lock.
Amen. I really hope this is an ability that Halo Infinite removes. It really is bad.

Watch Halo Infinite have supers, like destiny. #eww
I would not miss it in Arena one bit. I don't mind ground pound at all, but that charge has got some killer tracking on that lunge, and the knock-back is awful to deal with when the charge doesn't kill you.

Although this late into Halo 5's lifecycle where I doubt a change will be made, if I do get Spartan Charged from behind and it leads to death, I just can't help but laugh at it, where before I would get pretty annoyed. Alot like getting hit by a truck in GTA that you just didn't see until the last second.
This is pure opininion about the spartan charge being bad in the game. some people use it expertly and can make good use of it. rather than attempt to get it removed entirely from the game, why not make halo infinite have the spartan charge as an optional thing such as some playlists having it while others do not, such as the classic playlists from call of duty.
Why? Just look at your radar and you won't get hit. Charge is not a problem.
Why? Just look at your radar and you won't get hit. Charge is not a problem.
You mean the radar that only shows a red dot once your holding hands with the enemy?
Why? Just look at your radar and you won't get hit. Charge is not a problem.
Radar doesn't flag a sprinter fast enough to make an actionable defense. It would be one thing if strafing/boost/jump/ninja/counter-melee were actually able to dodge or counter a spartan charge reliably. If those things existed, there would be a much needed risk-reward type situation to blindly charging in and pressing one button. As it stands now, SC is easily spammable, unavoidable in most indoor areas, travels further than a boost, has aim assist, can maneuver around corners, cannot be cancelled by actually shooting, and gives the advantage to the charger even if the chargee had outplayed the charger up to that point.

Sprint is controversial. Weaponizing sprint is just plain dumb. Weaponizing sprint with the current SC is the dumbest mechanic in Halo history.
Why? Just look at your radar and you won't get hit. Charge is not a problem.
Radar doesn't flag a sprinter fast enough to make an actionable defense. It would be one thing if strafing/boost/jump/ninja/counter-melee were actually able to dodge or counter a spartan charge reliably. If those things existed, there would be a much needed risk-reward type situation to blindly charging in and pressing one button. As it stands now, SC is easily spammable, unavoidable in most indoor areas, travels further than a boost, has aim assist, can maneuver around corners, cannot be cancelled by actually shooting, and gives the advantage to the charger even if the chargee had outplayed the charger up to that point.

Sprint is controversial. Weaponizing sprint is just plain dumb. Weaponizing sprint with the current SC is the dumbest mechanic in Halo history.
You can jump and boost backward most times. Also, you do have enough time to do something after seeing them on radar. Further, you can usually hear them running, since the jetpack makes a lot of noise at full sprint. In practice, you can also use the terrain to your advantage to evade a charge.

How is sprinting controversial? Can't humans run? Wouldn't superhumans be able to run? There's nothing wrong with sprinting. It even has built-in trade-offs, such as having frame disadvantage when attacked (since you have to stop your sprint to shoot), and being attacked before full run prevents you from accelerating.
eTs Wild wrote:
Why? Just look at your radar and you won't get hit. Charge is not a problem.
You mean the radar that only shows a red dot once your holding hands with the enemy?
You're not paying enough attention to your radar. You can also hear someone sprinting from even further away, since the jetpack makes a loud noise at full run.
I assume halo infinite won't be out for a while.. maybe it would bring back players and keep veteran players playing H5 if you got rid of the worst feature in the entire game. Just speculation.
Agreed. Worst ability since spartan lock.
Zafro817 wrote:
Worst ability since spartan lock.
I don't think he'd appreciate that. :D
LUKEPOWA wrote:
Zafro817 wrote:
Worst ability since spartan lock.
I don't think he'd appreciate that. :D
haha... Yea tell him my bad from me. You know what I mean, armor lock, haven't played Reach in quite some time now.
I really dont mind it. Its pretty easy to predict if your looking at your radar and have your thrust avaliable. Then its an easy kill. And its satisfying when you land it and kill someone.
I disagree with the notion that it removes skill out of a cqc engagement. If anything it adds more to it.
common sense tells you that if you see a spartan running visually, or thru the sensor that he will charge. its up to you how to react. you can melee them while they are mid charge, i know because thats what Ido and then you're both 1 shot. a spartan charge is no faster than a spartan sprinting. keep that in mind. they are only fast when you aren't paying attention. you can thrust evade then they basically have their back facing you. or shoot them as they come. if they are coming sround a corner just sit tight and get them when tey arent expecting it.
it cant take akill away from cqc because anyone who would try to start sprinting in a cqc would fkn die lol.
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