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[Locked] do you think halo can become the top fps again?

OP ThexXx0MARxXx

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The realist in me knows that the game will not be able to be top dog again. Especially with Halo only being on Xbox but that is not the fault of the game itself. That is not to fault the game itself, there are just other factors that contribute to the decline in FPS like RPG's and other non-shooter games.

I believe the game play is pretty competitive and well balanced. While most people on this forum want all their game types instantly, 343 is sticking to their guns and giving them out in piecemeal. While a challenge for them to read all the negative posts, the piece by piece delivery does give the game longevity to which I applaud them and anyone who has patience to stick with them.
sadly no
Jazz246 wrote:
I don't think if you made miniature campaigns for Halo it would not turn out well, that was one of the main problems with Destiny you never knew what the main story was, there was way too many different campaigns, and I just think that alone would not be good for the Halo Franchise personally.
It wouldn't replace the main story, plus you can redo all the old ones.
With 343? no. With a quality developer? of course
Gravemint wrote:
Gravemint wrote:
The market was most saturated with high profile games with Halo 3. The market argument is such a copout. Of course Halo can be popular - all you have to do is make an actual successor to Halo 3, a popular Halo, which was a successor of Halo 2, a popular Halo, which was a successor of Halo CE, a popular Halo.

The correlation of content and design change with popularity starting with Reach is too strong to ignore. In every Halo that appealed to a social crowd and competitive crowd, that was filled with content, that had largely all of the standards from the previous Halos maintained and improved upon, the game was at the top of the charts and stayed there. In every Halo that didn't, the exact opposite was true.
I don't think a straight up arena style shooter will sway anyone from leaving CoD, or any other game that they are playing. H3 was 9 years ago. Great for it's time. It was stepping stone for so many other franchises, but I think a bare bones arena shooter just won't appeal to the console market.
I'm not advocating for a bare bones game, but rather a finished one - one that has all of the baseline content, features, functionality and more. It's 2016 and we're approaching getting somewhere close to even being somewhat near having the baseline standards of Halo 3. This should be the exact opposite. People should not go to prior Halo games and say, "Wow, you can do that?!" "Wow, this game has that?!"

That didn't happen to Halo 2 when Halo 3 came out. Granted, people understandably hated some design choices like no hitscan, but no one was complaining about losing anything tangibly understood. It did happen with Halo 4 and Halo 5, the fastest dropping Halo games in terms of population and the only Halos that the devs actively try to hide the population count of.
Out of curiosity, what would that game look like? I'm not being condescending, but it sounds a lot like a re-skinned H3. What is the "and more" part? I think that's the root problem. I completely agree on the content. Should've been there day, or released shortly thereafter. This trend sort of started with Reach.

And not to be a pain, but there was a lot of hate on the forums between game releases. The release of H2 saw it, as well as H3. One of our moderators has a good metric and analysis of the pop decline since H2. (yes, it started at H2). I'll try to dig it up for you. (but lets not get off topic in this thread).

Personally think the days of Arena FPS is coming to a close. Look at what games are the tops in terms of sales/population. All of those games really have some very similar elements and mechanics. This is not a trend. It just a fact. No, Halo doesn't have to follow suit, but not doing something to secure relevancy is a sure way to obsolete itself.
He didn't say anything about copying Halo 3 you clearly did not comprehend anything he just said. He was merely implying that the game could be a lot more popular if it came out with all the features that previous halos already had.

I highly doubt the population decreased after Halo 2, could you link this analysis and the sources for the data?
Honestly and even though I love halo, it will probably never return to its formal glory. There are a few reasons for this.
1. Market is simply more saturated
2. Halo has failed to innovate as with past titles.
3. I believe Halo has changed too much from what made it great, it hasn't evolved (as some may state). It has mostly taken things from other games and added it as their own.
4.Maps, probably the biggest issue. Halo maps are pathetic when compared to prior games.

Halo needs to set itself apart, warzone was an awesome way of doing this, however adding certain abilities was more of a copy/paste from other games.
It would need hard work (343i and the community both) and luck, but I reckon it can happen. We need to tell 343i what they need and they have to actually LISTEN.
Halo has always been a great game in my eyes and same with many others, and it was the very first polished off first person shooter game that ever came out and I think a lot of people tend to forget that, and that it was really the first game that was just on that large of a scale with those kind of graphics.
esnoox wrote:
With 343? no. With a quality developer? of course
In all likelihood a new developer would want to change some core fundamentals about Halo. the next game would then be shunned yet again. When new people take over they try to change things based on what they think they know without consideration for the fans. My proof of this is the outsourcing of Gears:Judgment to the Studio-People can Fly. that studio changed a few small things , though small were absolutely fundamental to the Gears franchise. That game died quicker than Halo 4. Much quicker. Now it has less than 600 players across all gametypes on most days. While Halo 4 has between 4000 and 6000 any given weekend. Heck , you can't even get people on here to agree on what the next game's mechanics should be.
Halo is the only reason I still play online seriously, other games don't encourage me as halo to be good in multiplayer, and even if love multiplayer I hated the yoink! disappointing campaign that came with h5 and more games only make even worse the history, after a long thinking I concluded that I hope that Halo 6 becomes the worst selling one so ms shuts down the halo project and stops destroying it's legacy. I wouldn't mind if the stop making campaigns and deliver multiplayer-only releases with microtransacctoins and all that b.s..
Halo it's not getting bad with every game, it's improving but the player's that began the halo journey with halo ce are kinda getting bored, well that is what happens to me.
the games that come out with bad releases is hurting the community
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Gravemint wrote:
The market was most saturated with high profile games with Halo 3. The market argument is such a copout. Of course Halo can be popular - all you have to do is make an actual successor to Halo 3, a popular Halo, which was a successor of Halo 2, a popular Halo, which was a successor of Halo CE, a popular Halo.

The correlation of content and design change with popularity starting with Reach is too strong to ignore. In every Halo that appealed to a social crowd and competitive crowd, that was filled with content, that had largely all of the standards from the previous Halos maintained and improved upon, the game was at the top of the charts and stayed there. In every Halo that didn't, the exact opposite was true.
But we have a ton of other games that are taking up what Halo used to do, its not that Halo is going to not be popular, its just not going to be AS popular as it used to be
Variety, halo needs to be halo, for example if they would generate a warzone map all ai*s and 12 v 12 no bases just plain old big team slayer, go back to the basics i mean warzone is fun but no matter how much content i feel that they wanna impose playlists give ppl the ability to choose froms tons of different maps and playlist.
Halo has definitely changed over the years. What everyone fell in love with no longer exists. Every game is different because if it wasn't we would have COD not Halo. The campaign for Halo 5 almost made me cry because of how little thought was put into it, like master chief only being playable in 3 missions. Master Chief is the bread and butter of this once glorious franchise and without thoughtful game design and story line, halo may keep fading until it doesn't exist anymore. I'm sad and heart broken because I've played these games all my life and I do not want to admit that other games have taken its place but the facts speak for themselves... I really hope Halo 6 is the save and grace for this franchise because if it's not, then Halo is NO more. Halo is still my favorite game and I will defend it against anyone who says other wise, all I'm saying is I wish the campaign felt more like traditional Halo.
Halo is the top FPS for me and thats all that matters to myself.
And if so, how?
Do I think it can? Absolutely.

Do I think it will? No, not unless 343i seriously reconsider how they choose to design the game.

For starters, what can we say about the first three Halo games? Each one continously improved on the last. Each one added to the player experience, giving them more reason to come back, to explore, and gave the player greater agency over the game. Halo 2 added deeper custom options and more gamemodes, it added skulls to campaign and contextualized the story. Halo 3 brought in forge, theatre, even deeper customs, character customization (beyond what Halo 2 offered), Campaign scoring, terminals etc.

That's part of why I think Halo 3 is considered the epitome of the Halo experience, it added so much to Halo as a whole. We can criticize the campaign or individual aspects of the multiplayer all we want, but overall it was a solid title that improved the Halo experience.

And this has been my fundamental problem with 343i, and what I consider to be the current problem with Halo. Ignoring my own opinions on questionable multiplayer, architectural and stylistic changes, 343i haven't done anything that's significantly improved what Halo 3 did. In Halo 4 they attempted to take their own spin on things, but in the process they butchered customs, forge and theatre, they removed campaign skulls and in-game terminals, among a slew of other problems too numerous to name individually. The recompense, the addition was Spartan Ops. And while Spartan Ops was a great idea it failed to capture any sort of magic, falling flat as more of a repetitive button-pressing simulator than an evolving episodic side story.

Skipping the mess that was Halo MCC because 343i stated they had very little to do with the project, lets move on to Halo 5. Halo 5 takes everything the first three Halo games had set forward about improving the gameplay experience and giving the players agency, and chucks it out the -Yoinking!- window. We regressed across the board. No splitscreen, no offline multiplayer to be found what-so-ever, no Forge on release, no functioning fileshare, a pitiful amount of gamemodes, poor player customization that I can only assume was done to sell REQ packs and again, among a slew of other problems. The guise this falls under is of course "free DLC" and the promise that 343i will add everything back eventually, but they're by no means obligated to add everything that people have come to expect from the series, and instead of using this post-release time to work on the next game or add new content to the series, they're using it to finish up a game that can only be described as an Early Access title.

The only new feature Halo 5 brought to replace everything it removed was Warzone. Warzone was a great idea, and I think it could (and should) have been a stand-alone Halo title. But by tacking it onto Halo 5, not only does it not get all the attention it deserves, but it has to restrict itself to "traditional" Halo design philosphies, even with all the additional mechanics at play. And at the end of the day, warzone as it stands is no more than glorified BTB, it can't replace everything else 343i have removed.

I could rant on and on about how and why I think this is awful decisions making, but to draw the line: Halo built itself upon continuously giving the players agency and improving the experience. I believe Halo's current problems lie in the fact that 343i insist on delivering their experience, and not necessarily a Halo or Quality Player experience. All my objections in relation to gameplay changes stem from this fact, all the problems in relation to the lack of Social playlists. Other problems such as the lack of armor customization appear to be driven by money, they restrict and remove armor to sell REQ's later instead of giving players the option to choose their own and unlock it in a logical way. The lack of an armor based progression system that gave the player something to actively work towards, among other things.

So what do I think Halo needs to be on top? I think it needs to focus on providing a top notch player experience. 343i need to take along, hard look at how they choose to design, whether it be the introduction of new mechanics that negatively impact the depth of the game for the sake of market accessibility or the conscious decision to remove social playlists because "it makes players play properly", and ask themselves if they are providing the best possible Halo experience they can. They need to look just what made Halo 3 so popular beyond it's gameplay, figure out how Bungie managed to cultivate such a fervent and dedicated community. They need to look at other successful titles, such as Counter-Strike Global Offensive, and ask themselves just what makes those games so successful with the competitive, casual, and creative communities alike.

There are reasons those things are as popular as they are, and there are reasons Halo fails to capture the attention that it used to. It's not as simple as gameplay or aesthetic, even if those do play a huge part.

If 343i are willing to ask these questions, to learn, understand, and perhaps apply different strategies or philosophies than those they currently use, I think Halo has potential to be a top game again. As it stands right now however, I expect Halo to fall slowly into obscurity. Not immediately, the quality of the games and legacy they are built on will keep people around for a while, but it'll fade to a point where people are tired of hearing its name, where it's used in a similar sense to Assassins creed to describe a series that has gone on too long, without fully understanding or realizing just where the heart of the issue lies.

Doesn't matter how many fancy skins or million dollar tournaments they throw out, there's something deeper in the game that's missing, and without that I don't really see a hope of greater success.

Honestly, I could go on for another hour or so, talking about designing for longevity, accessibility in game design, teaching players rather than designing for them, but those are different topics for a different time. Point is, I think Halo's problems extend far beyond its gameplay and have more to do with 343i and the premise on which they build the game than anything else.

... Well, back to lurking.
No it's not multiplatform for one. Also when halo 2 ruled the world it had zero competition. It will always be number one as far as I'm concerned. Halo has a smaller but zealot fan base. Games like cod are a lot more casual. For instance my dad can play cod and still feel competitive. He tried halo a few times and literally finished with one kill. Personally halo is the only reason I still play videogames. I can't get enough of halo 5. I played 15 matches straight on Sunday and could have played 15 more if I had the time.
i feel the halo campaigns have got poorer since 3, the online is still good but work is still needed
Is it possible? Maybe. Not by doing what it's doing now though or when decisions are being made by whoevers making them. Being more popular than CoD is a tall order, but it can definitely be up there like it used to be.

Halo needs to be accessible, unique and full of stuff to do for all types. Halo has had those those qualities in years.
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