Forums / Games / Halo 5: Guardians

#HUNTTHETRUTH Episode 8 Discussion Thread

OP TryingHydra351

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Only possible female rebel leader I can think of is that woman from Cole's story in Halo Evolutions, Lyrenne Castilla.

That said, I don't get how halo 4 established she didn't need a storage medium. It was probably the most consistent game in emphasizing she did. You're always using her chip for things. Handing her chip over to Del Rio is involved with decommissioning her. And she claims she can't go with you when the ship she's currently in explodes.
Only possible female rebel leader I can think of is that woman from Cole's story in Halo Evolutions, Lyrenne Castilla.

That said, I don't get how halo 4 established she didn't need a storage medium. It was probably the most consistent game in emphasizing she did. You're always using her chip for things. Handing her chip over to Del Rio is involved with decommissioning her. And she claims she can't go with you when the ship she's currently in explodes.
Smart AI's don't need a storage medium, they simply need a network in which to expand. Smart AIs, by the very nature of what they do, would have to operate via quantum computation, which means that a Smart AI could theoretically expand to the extent of the entire universe if put in the right circumstances.
Yes it does, I believe Halsey discusses it at some point in time during Onyx. If not then it's somewhere else. I know I have read it I just can't remember where...
Also how do you know Cortana is gone? She doesn't need a physical data storage, she has proved that in Halo 4.
If you read my other post you can see my understanding of how Cortana might have escaped the destruction of the Didact's ship.
And even if 343 did bring Cortana back, I will definitely not protest silently if they decided to go for such a cheap option after giving her closure.
Neither would I. But she is one of the most loved video game characters of all time, I doubt that she will be gone for more than one game, if that.
And you're basing this "most loved" statistic on what, exactly? Because my experience says otherwise. Characters die in stories, and Cortana got closure to her story arc in 'Halo 4'. There is literally no good reason for her to come back - even most people who like the character seem to agree on this (check any poll/forum thread on here on the subject).

Also I have most of the Halo novels in PDF form - after searching I can confirm the words "metastable/metastability" do not come up anywhere in 'Ghosts of Onyx'.

Also the problem isn't about data storage (though I think you're incorrect anyway, as her data does need to be housed in some kind of physical object or system for her to function - that's how human-made AIs work). It's about the fact that she purged all of her data within the Didact's ship's systems in an attempt to slow it down, and was stuck in the Mantle's Approach when it was obliterated by a nuclear bomb. She even says herself that she used the last of her power to save the Chief from the explosion. You can't get past that. There's no way for her to have survived or escaped. She's been confirmed dead in every single official source since 'Halo 4'. End of story.
I apologize, that was my own assumption and biased opinion. There is no statistic that says Cortana is one of the most loved characters of all time (though I do want to believe she is in the top 100, I am to lazy to go back that claim up).

I am also basing this on personal preference, not majority vote, and if you have seen my other, more expansive post on my views, then you should be able to understand how I think Cortana could come back.

Metastability does exist in the Halo Universe, because I know I have seen the word in one of the books or heard it in one of the live-action or animated productions.

Yes I do agree with you that my idea of not physical storage is, while not completely impossible in the Halo universe (as opposed to ours which all data is stored on some sort of drive), is 99.9...% improbable. Though if she was to transfer herself to another data storage cache, say through superluminal travel in slipspace, it might be possible that she could still be alive.

And to counter her argument that she used the last of her power, how do we know that wasn't just one of her innumerable clones she generated to disable the Didact's hardlight shield?

And through what official source has she been confirmed dead?
If it's through a wiki then I can also say that metastability is canon.

Smart AI's don't need a storage medium, they simply need a network in which to expand.

That network still functions as a storage medium. They can move around freely on it, yes, but the network is still storing them on it. If i were to say, blow up my house right now, my home network would be destroyed and any smart AI's on it.

Not to mention, if she was truely perfectly fine, nothing would have stopped her from just sending herself back to Earth via broadcast from the ship.

Smart AIs, by the very nature of what they do, would have to operate via quantum computation, which means that a Smart AI could theoretically expand to the extent of the entire universe if put in the right circumstances.
Is this stated anywhere within halo canon? I know there was some halsey stuff about doing stuf with slipspace, but even forerunner AI's did not work this way.


And through what official source has she been confirmed dead?
Halo 4's end cinematic description.
Halo 4's essential visual guide.
Cortana's official profile on this website.
PIX24 wrote:
Oh my God.
If that fero isn't Halsey, then this is big -Yoink-. Insurrection could raze, and ONI could fall! If ONI falls humanity is lost... more probably they aren't going to blame the bad parts of it, but will scapegoat Halsey, the Spartan II and Section three, exactly what both Parangosky and Osman wanted!
ONI should have assassinated our rogue journalist. Or do they want him to do this?

I don't care about the chief, are you seriously thinking he turned mad? There is obviously an explanation.
Margaret wanted the spartan program to be revealed to UEG, is she in some way behind this?
At the end of Spartan Ops Halsey was a prisoner to the elites and the UNSC attempted to execute her. Seems unlikely she has had a lot of time to work up an alternate identity as FERO.

Smart AI's don't need a storage medium, they simply need a network in which to expand.

That network still functions as a storage medium. They can move around freely on it, yes, but the network is still storing them on it. If i were to say, blow up my house right now, my home network would be destroyed and any smart AI's on it.

Not to mention, if she was truely perfectly fine, nothing would have stopped her from just sending herself back to Earth via broadcast from the ship.

Smart AIs, by the very nature of what they do, would have to operate via quantum computation, which means that a Smart AI could theoretically expand to the extent of the entire universe if put in the right circumstances.
Is this stated anywhere within halo canon? I know there was some halsey stuff about doing stuf with slipspace, but even forerunner AI's did not work this way.


And through what official source has she been confirmed dead?
Halo 4's end cinematic description.
Halo 4's essential visual guide.
Cortana's official profile on this website.
Yes it has actually. Halsey's Personal Journal in which she details possible cures for Rampancy, one of which involves a Smart AI to expand into slipstream space. The Assembly also contemplated this course of action during Halo: Reach.
Only possible female rebel leader I can think of is that woman from Cole's story in Halo Evolutions, Lyrenne Castilla.

That said, I don't get how halo 4 established she didn't need a storage medium. It was probably the most consistent game in emphasizing she did. You're always using her chip for things. Handing her chip over to Del Rio is involved with decommissioning her. And she claims she can't go with you when the ship she's currently in explodes.
I concede your point on data hardware.
Yes it does, I believe Halsey discusses it at some point in time during Onyx. If not then it's somewhere else. I know I have read it I just can't remember where...
Also how do you know Cortana is gone? She doesn't need a physical data storage, she has proved that in Halo 4.
If you read my other post you can see my understanding of how Cortana might have escaped the destruction of the Didact's ship.
And even if 343 did bring Cortana back, I will definitely not protest silently if they decided to go for such a cheap option after giving her closure.
Neither would I. But she is one of the most loved video game characters of all time, I doubt that she will be gone for more than one game, if that.
And you're basing this "most loved" statistic on what, exactly? Because my experience says otherwise. Characters die in stories, and Cortana got closure to her story arc in 'Halo 4'. There is literally no good reason for her to come back - even most people who like the character seem to agree on this (check any poll/forum thread on here on the subject).

Also I have most of the Halo novels in PDF form - after searching I can confirm the words "metastable/metastability" do not come up anywhere in 'Ghosts of Onyx'.

Also the problem isn't about data storage (though I think you're incorrect anyway, as her data does need to be housed in some kind of physical object or system for her to function - that's how human-made AIs work). It's about the fact that she purged all of her data within the Didact's ship's systems in an attempt to slow it down, and was stuck in the Mantle's Approach when it was obliterated by a nuclear bomb. She even says herself that she used the last of her power to save the Chief from the explosion. You can't get past that. There's no way for her to have survived or escaped. She's been confirmed dead in every single official source since 'Halo 4'. End of story.
I apologize, that was my own assumption and biased opinion. There is no statistic that says Cortana is one of the most loved characters of all time (though I do want to believe she is in the top 100, I am to lazy to go back that claim up).

I am also basing this on personal preference, not majority vote, and if you have seen my other, more expansive post on my views, then you should be able to understand how I think Cortana could come back.

Metastability does exist in the Halo Universe, because I know I have seen the word in one of the books or heard it in one of the live-action or animated productions. (And to use the same card you pulled on me, check any Halo wiki you can find and without fail there will be a section, if not an entire page, on metastability.)

Yes I do agree with you that my idea of not physical storage is, while not completely impossible in the Halo universe (as opposed to ours which all data is stored on some sort of drive), is 99.9...% improbable. Though if she was to transfer herself to another data storage cache, say through superluminal travel in slipspace, it might be possible that she could still be alive.

And to counter her argument that she used the last of her power, how do we know that wasn't just one of her innumerable clones she generated to disable the Didact's hardlight shield?
Unless you can provide me with a concrete source, I will argue that metastability does not exist in canon in the Halo Universe. That section on metastability in the Halo Wiki is also completely unsourced, by the way - it's simply a vague theoretical concept that people have carried over from Bungie's ideas in 'Marathon'. Also the information in those wikis is logged by fans and is not approved by Microsoft/343 Industries.

Why then would they even bother giving Cortana an entire character arc in 'Halo 4' about her accepting her "mortality"? Why even bother giving her a goodbye scene and then solidly confirming her death in every single piece of media since 'Halo 4' if, "Psyche, that was just a clone!" And how could an incomplete, rampant clone of Cortana possibly survive such an instance? They can't just regenerate their source code like some kind of digital-amoeba. Human-made AI's in Halo cannot simply recover from rampancy - this is stated flat-out in the game and in the books. Why break all those rules now? There's no reason for it. She was a character with a set expriation date from the beginning, and she went out in a worthy fashion. There's nothing more for her to do in the story that can't be done by characters who are not dead.

Yes it has actually. Halsey's Personal Journal in which she details possible cures for Rampancy, one of which involves a Smart AI to expand into slipstream space. The Assembly also contemplated this course of action during Halo: Reach.
Tests in that direction failed. Somehow I don't think heavily fragmented rampancy accompanied by a nuclear explosion was the missing piece, and would counteract all the more controlled conditions that experiment held.
Yes it does, I believe Halsey discusses it at some point in time during Onyx. If not then it's somewhere else. I know I have read it I just can't remember where...
Also how do you know Cortana is gone? She doesn't need a physical data storage, she has proved that in Halo 4.
If you read my other post you can see my understanding of how Cortana might have escaped the destruction of the Didact's ship.
And even if 343 did bring Cortana back, I will definitely not protest silently if they decided to go for such a cheap option after giving her closure.
Neither would I. But she is one of the most loved video game characters of all time, I doubt that she will be gone for more than one game, if that.
And you're basing this "most loved" statistic on what, exactly? Because my experience says otherwise. Characters die in stories, and Cortana got closure to her story arc in 'Halo 4'. There is literally no good reason for her to come back - even most people who like the character seem to agree on this (check any poll/forum thread on here on the subject).

Also I have most of the Halo novels in PDF form - after searching I can confirm the words "metastable/metastability" do not come up anywhere in 'Ghosts of Onyx'.

Also the problem isn't about data storage (though I think you're incorrect anyway, as her data does need to be housed in some kind of physical object or system for her to function - that's how human-made AIs work). It's about the fact that she purged all of her data within the Didact's ship's systems in an attempt to slow it down, and was stuck in the Mantle's Approach when it was obliterated by a nuclear bomb. She even says herself that she used the last of her power to save the Chief from the explosion. You can't get past that. There's no way for her to have survived or escaped. She's been confirmed dead in every single official source since 'Halo 4'. End of story.
I apologize, that was my own assumption and biased opinion. There is no statistic that says Cortana is one of the most loved characters of all time (though I do want to believe she is in the top 100, I am to lazy to go back that claim up).

I am also basing this on personal preference, not majority vote, and if you have seen my other, more expansive post on my views, then you should be able to understand how I think Cortana could come back.

Metastability does exist in the Halo Universe, because I know I have seen the word in one of the books or heard it in one of the live-action or animated productions. (And to use the same card you pulled on me, check any Halo wiki you can find and without fail there will be a section, if not an entire page, on metastability.)

Yes I do agree with you that my idea of not physical storage is, while not completely impossible in the Halo universe (as opposed to ours which all data is stored on some sort of drive), is 99.9...% improbable. Though if she was to transfer herself to another data storage cache, say through superluminal travel in slipspace, it might be possible that she could still be alive.

And to counter her argument that she used the last of her power, how do we know that wasn't just one of her innumerable clones she generated to disable the Didact's hardlight shield?
Unless you can provide me with a concrete source, I will argue that metastability does not exist in canon in the Halo Universe. That section on metastability in the Halo Wiki is also completely unsourced, by the way - it's simply a vague theoretical concept that people have carried over from Bungie's ideas in 'Marathon'.

Why then would they even bother giving Cortana an entire character arc in 'Halo 4' about her accepting her "mortality"? Why even bother giving her a goodbye scene and then solidly confirming her death in every single piece of media since 'Halo 4' if, "Psyche, that was just a clone!" And how could an incomplete, rampant clone of Cortana possibly survive such an instance? They can't just regenerate their source code like some kind of digital-amoeba. Human-made AI's in Halo cannot simply recover from rampancy - this is stated flat-out in the game and in the books. Why break all those rules now? There's no reason for it. She was a character with a set expriation date from the beginning, and she went out in a wothy fashion. There's nothing more for her to do in the story that can't be done by characters who are not dead.
I would suggest you re-read Halsey's Personal Journal. Metastability may not exist as a concrete state, but it certainly exists as an abstract, theoretical idea. Dr. Halsey theorized at least two ways that an AI could reach Metastability. Even if she did not specifically use the word, the idea still remains.

Yes it has actually. Halsey's Personal Journal in which she details possible cures for Rampancy, one of which involves a Smart AI to expand into slipstream space. The Assembly also contemplated this course of action during Halo: Reach.
Tests in that direction failed. Somehow I don't think heavily fragmented rampancy accompanied by a nuclear explosion was the missing piece, and would counteract all the more controlled conditions that experiment held.
I have yet to hear of any nuclear explosion which could undo quantum particles (ie: particles smaller than a proton)
Yes, the experiment failed, but the idea still remains.
Yes it does, I believe Halsey discusses it at some point in time during Onyx. If not then it's somewhere else. I know I have read it I just can't remember where...
Also how do you know Cortana is gone? She doesn't need a physical data storage, she has proved that in Halo 4.
If you read my other post you can see my understanding of how Cortana might have escaped the destruction of the Didact's ship.
And even if 343 did bring Cortana back, I will definitely not protest silently if they decided to go for such a cheap option after giving her closure.
Neither would I. But she is one of the most loved video game characters of all time, I doubt that she will be gone for more than one game, if that.
And you're basing this "most loved" statistic on what, exactly? Because my experience says otherwise. Characters die in stories, and Cortana got closure to her story arc in 'Halo 4'. There is literally no good reason for her to come back - even most people who like the character seem to agree on this (check any poll/forum thread on here on the subject), yourself included I might add.

Also I have most of the Halo novels in PDF form - after searching I can confirm the words "metastable/metastability" do not come up anywhere in 'Ghosts of Onyx'.

Also the problem isn't about data storage (though I think you're incorrect anyway, as her data does need to be housed in some kind of physical object or system for her to function - that's how human-made AIs work). It's about the fact that she purged all of her data within the Didact's ship's systems in an attempt to slow it down, and was stuck in the Mantle's Approach when it was obliterated by a nuclear bomb. She even says herself that she used the last of her power to save the Chief from the explosion. You can't get past that. There's no way for her to have survived or escaped. She's been confirmed dead in every single official source since 'Halo 4'. End of story.
Yeah, but since she was visited by the Librarian, I think just about anything is possible.
You know, I completely forgot about that... The Librarian was the master of the genetic code, and in a sense fate. Just look at her imposed geas on Bornstellar, Chakas and Morning Riser. Maybe she was able to manipulate Cortana's "genetic code," or scanned neurotransmitters from Halsey's cloned brain, in such a way to enable metastability... Interesting...
Does this mean we get to kill humans now?
Does this mean we get to kill humans now?
Yes, yes it does.

Oh wait... you meant in the game didn't you?...
Has anyone thought FERO is actually an acronym? For some other character? And for female insurrectionists there's Ilsa Zane, the former Spartan-IV...
For me it seems that it's actually an insurrectionist tactic to bring humans to war, to get independence from Earth. I mean Mshak and Ben talk how "unfair" Earth is with her colonies and how unequal the selection of Spartans-II was made among outer colonies and how those children would have to go and kill their people instead of defending them. This could only rock the boat out there and spark a galaxy wide and justified insurrection
My guesses are that the Spartan shown on the footage was someone wearing a similar armor or the chief doing the greater good. In the ending of Halo 4 he talks about how its the duty of soldiers to protect mankind no matter the cost
Has anyone thought FERO is actually an acronym? For some other character? And for female insurrectionists there's Ilsa Zane, the former Spartan-IV...
For me it seems that it's actually an insurrectionist tactic to bring humans to war, to get independence from Earth. I mean Mshak and Ben talk how "unfair" Earth is with her colonies and how unequal the selection of Spartans-II was made among outer colonies and how those children would have to go and kill their people instead of defending them. This could only rock the boat out there and spark a galaxy wide and justified insurrection
My guesses are that the Spartan shown on the footage was someone wearing a similar armor or the chief doing the greater good. In the ending of Halo 4 he talks about how its the duty of soldiers to protect mankind no matter the cost
I think the real question you have to ask yourself is, who is the Master Chief more loyal to? Humanity, or the UNSC? I for one believe it is completely possible for MC to have committed that attack.
Has anyone thought FERO is actually an acronym? For some other character? And for female insurrectionists there's Ilsa Zane, the former Spartan-IV...
For me it seems that it's actually an insurrectionist tactic to bring humans to war, to get independence from Earth. I mean Mshak and Ben talk how "unfair" Earth is with her colonies and how unequal the selection of Spartans-II was made among outer colonies and how those children would have to go and kill their people instead of defending them. This could only rock the boat out there and spark a galaxy wide and justified insurrection
My guesses are that the Spartan shown on the footage was someone wearing a similar armor or the chief doing the greater good. In the ending of Halo 4 he talks about how its the duty of soldiers to protect mankind no matter the cost
Ilsa Zane is definitely a loose thread I wouldn't rule out yet...

And I agree, this whole situation just stinks of a set-up to take down ONI. There's a lot of holes in what we know about the validity of the video footage, and even these supposed "peace talks". Wether the Chief actually did this or not, something about this incident is definitely not in congruence with how it's been portrayed thus far.
Has anyone thought FERO is actually an acronym? For some other character? And for female insurrectionists there's Ilsa Zane, the former Spartan-IV...
For me it seems that it's actually an insurrectionist tactic to bring humans to war, to get independence from Earth. I mean Mshak and Ben talk how "unfair" Earth is with her colonies and how unequal the selection of Spartans-II was made among outer colonies and how those children would have to go and kill their people instead of defending them. This could only rock the boat out there and spark a galaxy wide and justified insurrection
My guesses are that the Spartan shown on the footage was someone wearing a similar armor or the chief doing the greater good. In the ending of Halo 4 he talks about how its the duty of soldiers to protect mankind no matter the cost
I don't think FERO is only being selfish, of course she wants to take down ONI and start a movement, but we can't forget about the deep space anomalies.. We have to remember that during the world the outer colonies took the worst part we hear it again during the episode, and maybe elimining ONI It's what It is necessary to protect mankind, maybe even John thinks that. ONI just seems to be en route to a war with the sangheilis and It's possible that we can't afford that with what It's coming.
Kilo Five is involved I'd bet my bottom dollar.
All I know is 1) The Chief's gotta have a reason unless losing Cortana scrambled him and most importantly 2) Cortana "definitely" dead or not, that's her speech pattern. Even with the similarities between her and Halseys voice, the emphasis, tone, and cadence is different enough to tell them apart and that's friggin Cortana....unless the filter to throw off pursuit does just that....343....grrrr

Ps. Fero in Latin means wild....rampant maybe? Also often used regarding things involving Iron...which resets you to the beginning of a level as a Skull...double meaning maybe?
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