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[Locked] The sprint discussion thread

OP Gandalfur

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ZuuluuZ wrote:
They made the Warzone maps stretched out so you would have to use sprint. Not having sprint would basically make Warzone a broken gamemode since the maps were built for it. You nostalgic Halo fans need to suck it up.
...

They could just not stretch the maps. Then you know, they wouldn't be plagued by people sitting a mile away with rifles and snipers picking you off as you try to cross the mile of no man's land between every part of the map.
If you want smaller maps play Arena. Problem solved.
Play Midship and then play Truth. Problem not solved.
ZuuluuZ wrote:
They made the Warzone maps stretched out so you would have to use sprint. Not having sprint would basically make Warzone a broken gamemode since the maps were built for it. You nostalgic Halo fans need to suck it up.
...
They could just not stretch the maps. Then you know, they wouldn't be plagued by people sitting a mile away with rifles and snipers picking you off as you try to cross the mile of no man's land between every part of the map.
If you want smaller maps play Arena. Problem solved.
But arena has sprint...
So take it out, no bad maps, skillful gameplay, everybody wins!
You don't HAVE to sprint. Just because you don't want sprint doesn't mean everybody else doesn't want it.
Yes you do, otherwise you're at a severe disadvantage, for a lot of reasons.
I think have new a controller option in H6 for all the old school players that they can switch off sprint anytime they want - and we will see how many do this when everybody else is sprinting around the WZ maps!
If sprint wasn't a thing in Arena, then we probably wouldn't be having this conversation.
Naqser wrote:
I think have new a controller option in H6 for all the old school players that they can switch off sprint anytime they want - and we will see how many do this when everybody else is sprinting around the WZ maps!
Irrelevant post is irrelevant, unless that control scheme gives you a 120 BMS, then your see who is still using sprint after a few weeks.
Yes maybe but playing without the sprint would be such a slow game. I played some multiplayer on MCC this past weekend it was just slow! Sprinting is a basic human movement it needs to be in the game, period!
You already played Halo 6?
There are many more basic human movement actions we're missing at the moment, following that, those too need to be in the game.
Never said I've played H6 (i wish however)
So name some off those other basic human movements that are still missing!
thanks ...
Really? You sounded quite positive that Halo 6 would play so slow without sprint.

My pleasure:
-Prone. Bonus.
-Corner Leaning.
-Evade roll. Bonus.
-Blind firing.
-Dual wielding. Bonus.
-Kick / martial arts.
-Block and counter block melee hits.
-Grab an opponent.
-Wall run and jump.
Naqser wrote:
Naqser wrote:
I think have new a controller option in H6 for all the old school players that they can switch off sprint anytime they want - and we will see how many do this when everybody else is sprinting around the WZ maps!
Irrelevant post is irrelevant, unless that control scheme gives you a 120 BMS, then your see who is still using sprint after a few weeks.
Yes maybe but playing without the sprint would be such a slow game. I played some multiplayer on MCC this past weekend it was just slow! Sprinting is a basic human movement it needs to be in the game, period!
You already played Halo 6?
There are many more basic human movement actions we're missing at the moment, following that, those too need to be in the game.
Never said I've played H6 (i wish however)
So name some off those other basic human movements that are still missing!
thanks ...
Really? You sounded quite positive that Halo 6 would play so slow without sprint.

My pleasure:
-Prone. Bonus.
-Corner Leaning.
-Evade roll. Bonus.
-Blind firing.
-Dual wielding. Bonus.
-Kick / martial arts.
-Block and counter block melee hits.
-Grab an opponent. -Wall run and jump.
awesome thanks!
Naqser wrote:
Naqser wrote:
I think have new a controller option in H6 for all the old school players that they can switch off sprint anytime they want - and we will see how many do this when everybody else is sprinting around the WZ maps!
Irrelevant post is irrelevant, unless that control scheme gives you a 120 BMS, then your see who is still using sprint after a few weeks.
Yes maybe but playing without the sprint would be such a slow game. I played some multiplayer on MCC this past weekend it was just slow! Sprinting is a basic human movement it needs to be in the game, period!
You already played Halo 6?
There are many more basic human movement actions we're missing at the moment, following that, those too need to be in the game.
Never said I've played H6 (i wish however)
So name some off those other basic human movements that are still missing!
thanks ...
Really? You sounded quite positive that Halo 6 would play so slow without sprint.

My pleasure:
-Prone. Bonus.
-Corner Leaning.
-Evade roll. Bonus.
-Blind firing.
-Dual wielding. Bonus.
-Kick / martial arts.
-Block and counter block melee hits.
-Grab an opponent. -Wall run and jump.
tons of battle movements - some of these would be super cool in H6
check out the new news on 9/8 DLC release Anvils Legacy!
https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/news/announcing-anvil-s-legacy
I dont think so sprint makes the game more fun and realistic. If they removed sprint i would be very mad.
Yes I agree. The current "Spartan Movement" is ok, and attracts players. However, if you want to maintain the respected hardcore fans of the series, "veterans" as you can say, then yes, a separate "classic style" playlist should be in Halo 6.
rabedeath wrote:
I think sprint is important part of the game now and should stay. I dont know why it really matters in campaign. It allows you to escape easier for one so i dont know why you would want it removed. Kinda why its essential in the game now. Being able to get around faster and having the choice of sprinting around and running around factor a ton into if you run into a fight. For example most time if im running around a corner and a guy is right in my face and he was not sprinting i will likely die since you cant fire from hip while running. So it matters in a game-play what you choose to do. Think it should stay.
I dont think so sprint makes the game more fun and realistic. If they removed sprint i would be very mad.
pajama dad wrote:
pajama dad wrote:
pajama dad wrote:
pajama dad wrote:
pajama dad wrote:
pajama dad wrote:
pajama dad wrote:
didn't even bother reading it because it is the dumbest topic out there right now. Just because it has sprint doesn't mean its not Halo. It's one whole mechanic, that's it. If you don't like sprint, don't sprint. Problem solved.
When sprinting, you cannot fire. This disrupts the Golden Triangle of weapons, grenades, and melees: the idea that Halo's gameplay was originally founded upon. Halo is Halo CE, Halo 2, Halo 3, and Halo 3: ODST. Reach really pushed it, and Halo 4 was simply a sin. Balancing sprint has made it bearable, but it has completely changed the map design in Halo 5, and the gameplay is nothing like it once was. If these gameplay changes were implemented in a different title, then I wouldn't care. They could actually be really awesome with more fine tuning. However, this is Halo, and as a vet, that means that there's no easy way out when I overextend. That means that I'm punished for not thinking twice about my position. It means that I can accurately predict my opponents movement when I lose sight of them.

So yeah, the problem isn't solved by not sprinting, it's solved by not designing the rest of the game around such a game mechanic. Why is it that the vets have to make their own maps and game variants in order to enjoy what Halo (god forbid) was? How can it not be the other way around? The only answer that I can think of, is that 343i doesn't care about the core Halo vets, but maybe it's really MS sticking their nose where it doesn't belong. Either way, Halo 5, is not Halo. It's closer than Halo 4 in that there are actually weapon pickups, and no loadouts, but Halo's gameplay was supposed to be simple. That was the point, it was an even playing field.
does halo ce stop being halo when I get into a warthog? Or, if I forge a map in h3 that doesn't adhere to some theory of map design have I stopped playing halo?

I call bs.
Oh? See for yourself.

No, Warthogs are Halo. Thruster Packs, aren't. Warthogs and other vehicles were part of the maps that were designed for multiplayer. Sprint has changed that design.

No, making fun, original content was one of the best things about Halo 3, but it had a plethora of playlists with classic Halo multiplayer gameplay. Anything else?
but I cant shoot in a warthog... golden triangle!

I dont care what your video says, your opinion doesnt amount to proof.
If you wish to be pedantic, then that is your prerogative.

The video has one of the multiplayer designers for Halo talking about the concept of weapons, grenades, and melees.
just sayin'

you snarkily link a youtube video after touting some nonsense about the golden triangle and I'm being called out as a pedant. Good job making me want to see your side.
Most of the time in this thread were referring to infantry combat, many people on both sides either use the vehicles argument against it or treat it as a god that can't be broken for it, but the people that understand what they are talking about mean infantry combat.
but if one thing can take me out of infrantry combat, why cant another?

The notion that the golden triangle is the end all of halo design is false to begin with. Yes it might have been bungie's design mantra for achieving a goal, but halo was such a diverse game to single out one part and say, "This is what it means to be halo." is the largest load of crap I've seen in a while.
That should be very self explanatory, but because vehicle combat and infantry combat are separate things, sprint is not vehicle combat, therefore the golden traingle of infantry combat still applies.
why? Why should it still apply? because Bungie did it once a long time ago? If they are so separate why am I getting gunned down by warthogs? Why am I able to melee as a passenger? Why is an infantry guy climbing into my vehicular combat?

This is an arbitrary line you've drawn. If the golden triangle can be bypassed it can be bypassed. Dual wielding managed that rather well in 2 out of 3 of the classic halos... or was that not infantry combat?
Your just being super pediantric, if you can't understand the difference between infantry and vehicle combat then that's on you. But again, golden traingle says that at any time in infantry you should be able to shoot, melee, or throw grenades, you can shoot while dual wielding, and saying you can melee or shoot while in vehicles only proves the golden traingle to be more true.
no... it blurs what is and isnt infantry combat. It means that the triangle is flexible and not an unbreakable rule. Claiming I dont understand something doesnt make it true.

pediantric? did you mean pedantic or pediatric? pedantic is rich given how youre trying to define infantry combat. pediatric is kinda funny... assuming it could be used that way to call someone childish (protip: thats not how its used).
I was trying to use pedantic, and either of those words are unrelated to being childish, the point is your problem in understanding the difference between being on foot and in vehicles is your problem, most of the community can understand that without it being explained
pediatric is related to children. Its also an adjective... So its an adjective related to children, just as childish is an adjective related to children. So...? I guess you're wrong there.

I completely understand the difference between being on foot and in a vehicle. Your making the mistake of thinking that because I don't agree with what you're saying I must not understand your words. Thats ridiculous. Now, those differences are only partially related to the golden triangle, as in each case the abilities of the spartans are not fundamental. On foot it is common that a spartan can melee, shoot and throw grenades. But dual wielding impedes this... while on foot. In a vehicle I cannot always shoot, but as a passenger I have access to shooting and melee... why not grenades (at least until recently in h5 I suppose on the back of a Gungoose)? What is so special about being on foot that means I must be at all times be able to access these three offensive actions, especially when we already have an exception to it in H2 and H3... and then again in Bungie's own game in Reach?

I would argue that the Golden Triangle is the basis for halo's combat, not the end goal. These actions should be made available whenever possible- hence we see shooting and melee in passenger seats and all other instances of attacking in the games, really. Under this comprehensive model Sprint fits rather nicely if the goal is to give every chance for spartans to attack, while allowing for times when some actions exclude another. In the same way one cannot throw grenades and melee whilst dual wielding (depends on your control layout) due to having arms being used for other things, Sprinting uses up a spartans arms for the purpose of moving faster (as it is fact that the human body requires the use of arms to achieve maximum speeds while running despite what some may argue). yeah... thats not cannon... but y'know, gameplay trumps cannon right? This would also explain why spartan charge fits. Yes, sprinting removes the ability to shoot or drop a nade, but we can sure melee.

See how that works? It isn't hard to come up with a BS use of the Golden Triangle to justify an opinion.
I don't think that sprint has improved Halo's gameplay. Why? Because it has ruined map design. The Golden Triangle was what a lot of maps were designed around, and they had great gameplay.
pajama dad wrote:
Me Bot Bot wrote:
then no one would be able to spartan charge or slide
Sliding might be harder to accomplish in an intuitive fashion, but charging could be accomplished by thrusting followed by an immediate melee attack. Slide could be done similarly, duck right after a thrust but I think that might feel weird... at least it would to me.
That's all I do on large maps when changing positions out in the open, it's the quickest way to get from point A to point B.
Phantom046 wrote:
This subject is rather touchy, and highly subjective. Others view sprinting as a detriment to an otherwise optimal system, and others thing contrary. However, in Halo 5 they implemented further use for sprint (Spartan charge, that is). Although traditionally Halo did not have sprint, it is a feature that they have placed in the game and there is a place for it in the more modern games. Looking back at halo 3, it was rather slow paced. You had your Primary weapon, secondary weapon, a wide verity of grenades, and a large selection of equipment (e.x Bubble shield, Regeneration field, ect.) And the combination of those features made the game play interesting. But the game does need to evolve, and what better way to do that then implementing small and convenient features that keep the game play interesting. However displeasing my opinion may be to some, just hold on for a moment. Sprinting speeds up a traditionally rather sluggish game play (And that is not bad.) into a very fast paced game. But the sprint and thrust pack does add more options when it comes to tactical maneuvers. It makes it easier to flank enemies, and retreat when necessary. Another note; Sprinting in a slayer match will decrease your performance, as it does take time for you to stop and raise your weapon. But that is just my opinion. Further thoughts?
wait, so you either like sprint/hate it/or just don't really want to involve hate or likes about it?
I dont mind sprint. It does have its uses
Would you mind if we allowed everyone to spawn with a rocket launcher? Because it does have its uses. Sprint takes away skill and doesn't add any actual depth to the game. Why don't you mind it?
If you havent noticed, it is not as overpowered as you think. it is well balanced, and does not remove any skill required to play saying as the good players will adjust to this fact. I have noted my reasons why i dont mind it in my first post. And regarding your rocket launcher comment, it is not relevant as sprinting is not akin to blowing someones face off with high explosives. And this is a perfect example of how i said everyone has their own opinion, which is not bad at all. It can just create some contention which is a minor inconvenience, but its bearable. Now would you mind explaining how it removes any application of skill?
Would you mind explaining how it adds any application of skill?
I think have new a controller option in H6 for all the old school players that they can switch off sprint anytime they want - and we will see how many do this when everybody else is sprinting around the WZ maps!
Irrelevant post is irrelevant, unless that control scheme gives you a 120 BMS, then your see who is still using sprint after a few weeks.
Yes maybe but playing without the sprint would be such a slow game. I played some multiplayer on MCC this past weekend it was just slow! Sprinting is a basic human movement it needs to be in the game, period!
FFS, Spartans are always sprinting.

Try crouching after jumping onto a slanted surface, you'll find out just how slow classic Halo was.

EDIT: To hell with it, check this out.

While you're at it, try doing this on Viking.
Sprint makes Halo better. Period.
Sprint makes Halo better. Period.
To some, not others.
pajama dad wrote:
No.No it won't. They should fix their selling system. Instead of having to sell one item at a time they should let you choose an amount.
exactly... the real problem with halo 5- I cant sell more than 1 req at a time.
Well it's definitely not sprinting...
JSYSJ wrote:
They have to incorporate a change into halo somehow.
LOL wut. Why. It was a beautiful, skillful game. Why would you change chess just because you can or you think people will get "bored with it"?

the gameplay feels the same as all the others.
You can't be serious. You just invalidated your entire post.
No I did not. I said I do like sprint in halo and was giving an example of what would happen if they didn't. It was a change to the gameplay that was needed to prevent from the gameplay feeling stale from game to game.
But way you move in Halo 5 is very similar to other games.
So? The concept of sprint doesn't belong to one game, it's a universal movement system. Plus, in terms of lore, wouldn't it make sense that over the years in the halo universe, wouldn't it make sense to further improve the spartan armor by giving spartans the ability to move around faster making them even more dangerous than they already were?
Lore should not always dictate gameplay, especially multiplayer wise. Halo has already shown 3 times now, that sprint isn't working, the devs obviously know or they wouldn't keep adding panalties to them to "try" and comprimise those who don't like sprint.

@ those saying how halo is copying other games movements, so did CE......and 2........and 3. You peope ever played quake? Unreal? Seriously, halos movements have never been a unique innovation that was never done before. It's perfectly fine to dislike halos new movements, but don't just say that it's now copying other games when that's how halo was made up to begin with lol. Halo gained traction because on the console itself, it was different but also perfected used mechanics better than others. But the original concept of its movement, was not different nor unheard of.
Except Halo's gameplay isn't like Quake or UT. Loadouts and perks weren't perfected in Halo 4. Movement in Halo 5 is unbalanced, even with sprint providing certain limitations. Classic Halo had solid gameplay.
Never said they play the same, I said they're based off one another. Halo doesn't play like CoD does it? Cuz I'll fight that one all the way depending on how you're wanting to go.

Anything post hCE is irrelevant as I'm not talking about it, HCE is based off arena games before it like I've already listed. It's a bad arguement to me when people say halo is copying other games when it's design is based off other games in the first place. quake and unreal didn't use sprint, they had fast paced BMS. Halo designed it's movement off that. Then there's the shields and health, which many arena games before halo had the same concept: you run around picking up health but halo changed it up to having a recharge to it as well (FYI 1984 was first game to have a regenerating health system). Then there's the on map pickups. Essentially what I'm saying is halos design is based of other games, what made it unique was it mixed and matched them while also perfecting them. So the arguement of "it's now copying others" is pretty lame to me, the real issue is it's simply doing the wrong changes, not that it's copying which the entire industry does to begin with.
Halo 4 felt a lot like CoD. I wonder why 343i made such a design choice, hmm. Anyway, I'm pretty sure that people still play Quack, Unreal, and Halo CE. How many people still play Halo 4? I haven't even finished my first specialization, and what I played the most was Spartan Ops. What do I play the most in Halo 5? Firefight, Warzone Assault, and Big Team Battle (I wish that there was an Assault playlist). Even then, some of the BTB maps just feel lackluster. Overall, the gameplay doesn't feel like Halo, mostly because the map design has changed.

Being based off of a design and attempting to appeal to a broader, casual audience are two different things, though. The popularity of games like Call of Duty and Battlefield had an impact on the design decisions that 343i made, which has ruined Halo's solid gameplay and map design. If the gameplay was perfected, then why would it need to be fundamentally changed?
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