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[Locked] Weapon Tuning Test - Phase Two Feedback - 9/11

OP ske7ch

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So what is the main goal of weapons tuning? Is it to improve the accuracy? Power? which weapon beats other weapons if pitted against each other?
Goals mentioned here.
You know what I find funny/interesting about the BR is that I have heard many reviewers say that the old, untuned BR is so easy to use but, go into any warzone or BTB game and check the number of perfects at the end it's usually only 2 or 3 on a decent player and less on lower level players. So my question is if it's so easy to use why don't more people get perfects.
Instead of having a small amount of random bullet spray on the BR, I think it should have lower bullet magnification and a shorter red reticule range.
This could also be applied to the railgun rather than having a longer charge time.

Also, I believe that the classic motion detector works better because I find it too easy to sneak up behind someone with the updated MD.
You know what I find funny/interesting about the BR is that I have heard many reviewers say that the old, untuned BR is so easy to use but, go into any warzone or BTB game and check the number of perfects at the end it's usually only 2 or 3 on a decent player and less on lower level players. So my question is if it's so easy to use why don't more people get perfects.
People don't use the default BR for very long in warzone.
Engagements take place at significantly longer ranges.
There are 24 people on the map at a time, odds of being the only person to put damage into a player are low.

It's an apples to tea-kettle comparison.
Apples to tea-kettle?
Only issue I issue I have is the br spread when I shoot a target it throws me off.
Don't change everything it's ok
As i have played the test ore, I have came to the conclusion that the spread isn't a very good idea, they need to create a way to make it worse at long distance without spread, either make red reticle range less, or (i would be ok with) having bullet spread but only after a certain distance. im sure their are other ways but i cant think of anymore just dont do the bullet spread.
So personaly ive come to the conclusion that overall i prefer the changes. Prehaps its due to the BR being easier to use than the magnum or that the AR no longer dominates CQB. What ever it is ive found that for the first time in quite a while ive started to enjoy H5 again. Ive had some extremely close and thrilling CTF games and the ranking system seemes to be actualy working as intended for once.
All in all im happy with most of the changes, especially the radar that has for the most part ruined spartan charge which is the sweetest change of all.
Apples to tea-kettle?
LOL "apples to oranges" wasn't appropriate because at least both of those are still fruit. Comparing stats from 4v4 arena with equal spawns and a specific, limited set of weapons on the map to warzone with 12 v 12, giant maps, AI and a bajillion REQ variants in play at any time isn't really reasonable.
DaxSeven09 wrote:
I was really excited about this tuning test. I posted a lot in the pretest thread, and in the beginning of the test on this thread. I was really positvie in the beginning, and was pretty happy with how things were going. I had one of the best winning streaks in this playlist. I played 136 games, and have come to the conclusion that the BR tuning definitely isn't quite right.

I have kept up with this thread, and seen the videos. I have my own clips where I have analyzed in slow motion my own gameplay to try and figure out if this spread/accuracy is really random. How one can still argue that it is not is beyond me. I wonder how some can still think this, and then I look at how many games they have played in the playlist. Most of the time it is very little. How can you have an independent, informed opinion if you haven't even played enough to be ranked in the playlist. This applies to positive or negative feedback.I am going to keep playing. Mainly to give them more data for this test. Once again I am really trying to continue to be optimistic with how things will turn out. I hope they will listen. (I am a little disheartened that once again our Community Manager posts on Twitter or Reddit instead of here. Page 3 was the last time a 343 dev posted in this thread.) Please the BR cannot work in its current state. Please don't just return it to where it was. The random spread needs to go.

I was going to post a clip of one of my questionable kills. Either people aren't looking at the stuff that has already been shared, or they are just in random spread denial, I don't think it would matter.
I couldn't agree more about the BR with you. I haven't played as much as you (I'm around 60 games I think, don't recall...) but I have played enough.

Bold part - 100% agree! I actually can't stand how people play like 3 games and say "it's terrible!!! Or "it's amazing!!! Come on now.... I was bugging my friend about this very thing yesterday when he said he didn't like anything. I looked at his games played and he only played four games of it. I laughed at him and said "man, how can you have an informed opinion when you've only played four games... You need to play more then that bro" he was like, ya I guess your right that isn't very smart of me.

Bold part - I'm with you here big time!!! I have said this many times as I know others have as well, but I'm very disappointed in the lack of communication by 343I (though some are really good like ZaedynFel) on Halo Waypoint compared to other sites / social media outlets. Waypoint is THE OFFICIAL Halo site. Major topics and announcements should be made here first! Otherwise why am I coming here??? And topics like this one (Weapon tuning) should have fairly regular responses/communication from 343I...yet, we get next to nothing... But if I go to Twitter, Reddick, Team Beyond etc. I see responses quite regularly from them that isn't right. Waypoint needs a lot more love from 343I.
Apoll0 wrote:
Apples to tea-kettle?
LOL "apples to oranges" wasn't appropriate because at least both of those are still fruit. Comparing stats from 4v4 arena with equal spawns and a specific, limited set of weapons on the map to warzone with 12 v 12, giant maps, AI and a bajillion REQ variants in play at any time isn't really reasonable.
Fair point. :p I've just never heard that particular comparison. Nice job on it though - it's amusing! :p Now I want tea.
DaxSeven09 wrote:
I was really excited about this tuning test. I posted a lot in the pretest thread, and in the beginning of the test on this thread. I was really positvie in the beginning, and was pretty happy with how things were going. I had one of the best winning streaks in this playlist. I played 136 games, and have come to the conclusion that the BR tuning definitely isn't quite right.

I have kept up with this thread, and seen the videos. I have my own clips where I have analyzed in slow motion my own gameplay to try and figure out if this spread/accuracy is really random. How one can still argue that it is not is beyond me. I wonder how some can still think this, and then I look at how many games they have played in the playlist. Most of the time it is very little. How can you have an independent, informed opinion if you haven't even played enough to be ranked in the playlist. This applies to positive or negative feedback.I am going to keep playing. Mainly to give them more data for this test. Once again I am really trying to continue to be optimistic with how things will turn out. I hope they will listen. (I am a little disheartened that once again our Community Manager posts on Twitter or Reddit instead of here. Page 3 was the last time a 343 dev posted in this thread.) Please the BR cannot work in its current state. Please don't just return it to where it was. The random spread needs to go.

I was going to post a clip of one of my questionable kills. Either people aren't looking at the stuff that has already been shared, or they are just in random spread denial, I don't think it would matter.
I couldn't agree more about the BR with you. I haven't played as much as you (I'm around 60 games I think, don't recall...) but I have played enough.

Bold parts - 100% agree! I actually can't stand how people play like 3 games and say "it's terrible!!! Or "it's amazing!!! Come on now.... I was bugging my friend about this very thing yesterday when he said he didn't like anything. I looked at his games played and he only played four games of it. I laughed at him and said "man, how can you have an informed opinion when you've only played four games... You need to play more then that bro" he was like, ya I guess your right that isn't very smart of me.

Bold part - I'm with you here big time!!! I have said this many times as I know others have as well, but I'm very disappointed in the lack of communication by 343I (though some are really good like ZaedynFel) on Halo Waypoint compared to other sites / social media outlets. Waypoint is THE OFFICIAL Halo site. Major topics and announcements should be made here first! Otherwise why am I coming here??? And topics like this one (Weapon tuning) should have fairly regular responses/communication from 343I...yet, we get next to nothing... But if I go to Twitter, Reddick, Team Beyond etc. I see responses quite regularly from them that isn't right. Waypoint needs a lot more love from 343I.
Yeah, I've played over twenty games and still don't quite feel qualified to comment on certain weapons.
Bold part - I'm with you here big time!!! I have said this many times as I know others have as well, but I'm very disappointed in the lack of communication by 343I (though some are really good like ZaedynFel) on Halo Waypoint compared to other sites / social media outlets. Waypoint is THE OFFICIAL Halo site. Major topics and announcements should be made here first! Otherwise why am I coming here??? And topics like this one (Weapon tuning) should have fairly regular responses/communication from 343I...yet, we get next to nothing... But if I go to Twitter, Reddick, Team Beyond etc. I see responses quite regularly from them that isn't right. Waypoint needs a lot more love from 343I.
Yeah but have you noticed how Josh didn't mention anything about the tuning update in this week's post, and he has in every other one? I am slightly encouraged by the tweets by ske7ch, but I am still concerned that at the end they are going to do whatever they want despite the enormous amount of feedback to the contrary.

We have their track record to go by, meaning: the enormous amount of requests for no Sprint since Reach (there is still Sprint), no split-screen even though it was a huge request and backlash when it was discovered H5 wouldn't have it, the call from HCS pros to no have a motion sensor at all (Ability Tracker instead), playable Elites....I don't know I could go on, but this thread is about the weapon tuning.

Halo 5 Weapon Tuning Test
Quote:
Following a great deal of internal playtesting and iteration, we’re now readying to release these re-tuned weapons to the wild to get game data and player feedback to determine the final results.
The fact that they have had "...a great deal of internal playtesting...", and still thought the BR was a good idea is a little worrisome. There will inevitably be very little AR data due to it not being a loadout, and I haven't seen hardly anyone picking it up. I don't even understand why there are still untuned weapons on the maps like the Storm Rifle, Boltshot, and Needler. Vetoed has already showed us that there are going to be times when someone picks up one of these uncontested weapons and wrecks the game with it.

Quote:
While we genuinely hope and believe that these changes are all for the best and will ultimately make the game better, we also realize that not everything may work out as we intended or garner the type of player response we’re hoping for. As such, it’s important to us that this plan allows for iteration so the team can react to feedback and make adjustments. The team can have all the data and best intentions in the world, but if a change ends up not working out as we’d hoped, it’s not getting shipped, plain and simple.
This is a little more positive, but I am concerned that if the change doesn't work out then we are right back where we started. That doesn't seem like a good idea either. What about the, "...react to feedback and make adjustments..."? Why not make those adjustments now and give us a chance to play those? Give us different loadouts. Let us use the AR more. There is still so much they could be doing, and so far it looks like all that is going to happen is, "Oh well guys we got your feedback, and you don't like the changes so we won't change anything. We tried though!" If this happens...I just don't know. I haven't been one to say I won't play and/or stop playing Halo completely, but this definitely won't encourage me to play more.
Oh boy! I love how Halo 5 is the perpetual Beta-game!

I realise this is a test, but I don't get the train of thought here. This is Halo, not Pea-shooter-the-simulator. I want my weapons to be consistent, I want my shots to end up where I aim. I don't want to randomly miss shots because you (343i) decided that random spread on precision weapons was a good idea. It is not.
The youtuber Vetoed sums up a lot of points I wholehearted agree to:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gs1u5MtR5gI

If you want weapons to be harder to use, make them harder to use, not more inconsistent!
Reduce aim assist and the red-reticle-range. In the case of the BR if you want it to be less effective in long range encounters increase the vertical spread.
It gets harder to control the bursts, but not impossible. I don't really care about the "competitive" standpoint Vetoed makes (though I agree to them).
I'm a very casual player, but I still want to be rewarded when my aiming is crisp. Not randomly get my Perfect medals stolen because my gun suddenly decides to become anything but a PRECISION weapon!

P.S. I hate what you've done to the Railgun! It charges WAY to slow now! Also, stop trying to make the Gunfighter magnum happen, it is a bad gun with horribly annoying recoil. Dump it already!
DaxSeven09 wrote:
Following a great deal of internal playtesting and iteration, we’re now readying to release these re-tuned weapons to the wild to get game data and player feedback to determine the final results.
The fact that they have had "...a great deal of internal playtesting...", and still thought the BR was a good idea is a little worrisome. There will inevitably be very little AR data due to it not being a loadout, and I haven't seen hardly anyone picking it up. I don't even understand why there are still untuned weapons on the maps like the Storm Rifle, Boltshot, and Needler. Vetoed has already showed us that there are going to be times when someone picks up one of these uncontested weapons and wrecks the game with it.

I've been picking up the AR sometimes in strongholds, it doesn't seem different.
This post has been edited by a moderator. Please refrain from making non-constructive posts.

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DaxSeven09 wrote:
Following a great deal of internal playtesting and iteration, we’re now readying to release these re-tuned weapons to the wild to get game data and player feedback to determine the final results.
The fact that they have had "...a great deal of internal playtesting...", and still thought the BR was a good idea is a little worrisome. There will inevitably be very little AR data due to it not being a loadout, and I haven't seen hardly anyone picking it up. I don't even understand why there are still untuned weapons on the maps like the Storm Rifle, Boltshot, and Needler. Vetoed has already showed us that there are going to be times when someone picks up one of these uncontested weapons and wrecks the game with it.
I've been picking up the AR sometimes in strongholds, it doesn't seem different.
I have been picking it up too, and from what I can tell is the spread is a lot bigger. I have had a couple of games where most of the other team has quit, and it has given me a chance to look at the weapons a little closer. The AR has changed with the spread, and seems to require more controlled pulse shot than before. I like it actually. I just wish it was more available than one pick up on a map here or there.

I could be wrong here but this is what I can remember at this time. AR spawns (and these are with the Silencer)

Fathom: 2 both Treehouses
Regret: 1 Bottom MId
Coliseum: 1 Bottom Mid
Truth: None
Stasis: Stongholds only, AR Bottom orange elevaor
Torque: 2 Not sure what it's called but the Hallways on either side
The Rig: None
Eden: 1 Camo spawn
Empire: 1 Bottom mid
Plaza: None
Edit: added AR on Stasis after RollCats posted.That's it I think. If I am right that is 4 out of 10 maps without an AR. How will this be a comprehensive test of the AR a weapon that it still a loadout weapon in most playlists. It just seems like it was overlooked or was purposefully left out.
Feedback? How bout you FIX your crappy game by getting rid of glitches for once and release the rail gun in warzone. No wonder this game has crappy reviews.
Here come the babies
No, not babies just people who love Halo and hope for more constructive feedback. This type doesn't help and only ends up getting moderated here.
DaxSeven09 wrote:
I was really excited about this tuning test. I posted a lot in the pretest thread, and in the beginning of the test on this thread. I was really positvie in the beginning, and was pretty happy with how things were going. I had one of the best winning streaks in this playlist. I played 136 games, and have come to the conclusion that the BR tuning definitely isn't quite right.

I have kept up with this thread, and seen the videos. I have my own clips where I have analyzed in slow motion my own gameplay to try and figure out if this spread/accuracy is really random. How one can still argue that it is not is beyond me. I wonder how some can still think this, and then I look at how many games they have played in the playlist. Most of the time it is very little. How can you have an independent, informed opinion if you haven't even played enough to be ranked in the playlist. This applies to positive or negative feedback.I am going to keep playing. Mainly to give them more data for this test. Once again I am really trying to continue to be optimistic with how things will turn out. I hope they will listen. (I am a little disheartened that once again our Community Manager posts on Twitter or Reddit instead of here. Page 3 was the last time a 343 dev posted in this thread.) Please the BR cannot work in its current state. Please don't just return it to where it was. The random spread needs to go.

I was going to post a clip of one of my questionable kills. Either people aren't looking at the stuff that has already been shared, or they are just in random spread denial, I don't think it would matter.
I couldn't agree more about the BR with you. I haven't played as much as you (I'm around 60 games I think, don't recall...) but I have played enough.

Bold parts - 100% agree! I actually can't stand how people play like 3 games and say "it's terrible!!! Or "it's amazing!!! Come on now.... I was bugging my friend about this very thing yesterday when he said he didn't like anything. I looked at his games played and he only played four games of it. I laughed at him and said "man, how can you have an informed opinion when you've only played four games... You need to play more then that bro" he was like, ya I guess your right that isn't very smart of me.

Bold part - I'm with you here big time!!! I have said this many times as I know others have as well, but I'm very disappointed in the lack of communication by 343I (though some are really good like ZaedynFel) on Halo Waypoint compared to other sites / social media outlets. Waypoint is THE OFFICIAL Halo site. Major topics and announcements should be made here first! Otherwise why am I coming here??? And topics like this one (Weapon tuning) should have fairly regular responses/communication from 343I...yet, we get next to nothing... But if I go to Twitter, Reddick, Team Beyond etc. I see responses quite regularly from them that isn't right. Waypoint needs a lot more love from 343I.
Yeah, I've played over twenty games and still don't quite feel qualified to comment on certain weapons.
That's how I feel as well. I think the majority of opinions are just going off of what other people said instead of thinking for themselves.

I played more last night and the game feels much more competitive. You have to work harder for kills because the weapons are not as versatile. It's thrilling!

But I still need more time because I haven't even been able to play with certain weapons much.
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