Forums / Games / Halo: The Master Chief Collection (Xbox)

At some point, social MM balance needs to be fixed

OP DankMemesTho

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I can't tell you the amount of times I go into social BTB and one team consists of incredibly skilled players working completely in sync, while the other team seems to have several people playing for the first time. When one team has several players with kills in the 20s while everybody on the opposing team has gone 1:3 or worse, we've got a systemic balance problem that needs more work.
I do wish there was some way that social matches could be balanced (to my knowledge, it doesn't appear that there is any balancing system in place for social matchmaking currently). Would be nice to have something like a hidden ELO value that the game engine could use under the hood to determine who should be placed on which teams. I guess balancing might get more complicated, though, if you have people joining matchmaking as a party of friends who would like to be on the same team. I know that social is intended to mostly be for having fun and not worrying about winning, but it definitely isn't as much fun when the teams are extremely unbalanced.
TomCat025 wrote:
Would be nice to have something like a hidden ELO value that the game engine could use under the hood to determine who should be placed on which teams.
I've heard for years that recent Halo games, including MCC, used something like this, but I don't know that for a fact. Could just be a rumor. Overwatch uses something like this, which is why you sometimes find people in competitive games who have much lower ranks but keep up with the higher ranked players in terms of skill. MCC might be more complicated considering there are multi-game playlists and someone who is great in H4 might be awful in H3. But it doesn't have to be perfect. Just something general which takes into account average K/D ratio, W/L ratio, and some other metrics like assists and objective points. These could all combine to create a hidden score which is considered in matchmaking.
MCC does have a basic balancing system in place, but the restrictions loosen the longer you're searching so you can find a game. The issue you're most likely describing is when you match a party, but there currently isn't any party restrictions in place or skill restrictions that would be able to make an even match with a bunch of higher skilled players on one team.

They're already experimenting with partial party matching in 4v4 so hopefully if that goes well they'll expand it to 8v8 as well.
LUKEPOWA wrote:
MCC does have a basic balancing system in place, but the restrictions loosen the longer you're searching so you can find a game. The issue you're most likely describing is when you match a party, but there currently isn't any party restrictions in place or skill restrictions that would be able to make an even match with a bunch of higher skilled players on one team.

They're already experimenting with partial party matching in 4v4 so hopefully if that goes well they'll expand it to 8v8 as well.
There’s no way it’ll work in BTB unless cross play is introduced between Xbox and PC.

I generally prefer 8 vs 8 in Customs since everyone knows what to do and has a mic, but if you don’t have enough people your stuck with Social BTB. A team of 5 or more people will never match up against another team of 5, especially in Halo CE, 2 or 4. Heck maybe not even in Halo 3 as well. If this is implemented people simply won’t play because they won’t be able to find a match. You can’t punish people that want to play in groups and then not match them with anyone because their isn’t another group to match them with.
Matchmaking will never solve your problem. 343 is testing party matching in the 4v4 playlists, but that is just another hack at attempting improving an inherently weak system of grouping players together.

We need to push for a Custom Game Browser so the People can make their own decisions, instead of relying on a machine to decide what is best. But internal company politics are against this.
TROPSTOP wrote:
Matchmaking will never solve your problem. 343 is testing party matching in the 4v4 playlists, but that is just another hack at attempting improving an inherently weak system of grouping players together.

We need to push for a Custom Game Browser so the People can make their own decisions, instead of relying on a machine to decide what is best. But internal company politics are against this.
A customs browser is already in development, it's just been pushed back due to the work being done to bring MCC to PC.
Probably has way most to do with population. When you have a all pool of players it has to make games one way or another. You aren't going to get balanced games to often this late in MCC life. Just be glad to get a game really. Last night at what should be a prime time for high population I checked Xbox live most played. MCC sat at #50, last place, so it's population must be pretty low despite that I saw there was over 800 players streaming on twitch compared to the just over 100 steaming H5. H5 was at #41 so it's population isn't doing much better.
TROPSTOP wrote:
Matchmaking will never solve your problem. 343 is testing party matching in the 4v4 playlists, but that is just another hack at attempting improving an inherently weak system of grouping players together.

We need to push for a Custom Game Browser so the People can make their own decisions, instead of relying on a machine to decide what is best. But internal company politics are against this.
I see no reason why these two features are at odds. Assuming the resources can/will be allocated to do it, there is no downside to having better MM balance and a customs browser.
Assuming the resources can/will be allocated to do it
That's a big assumption at this point. It has been a top feature request since launch, and instead 343 has responded with the Match Composer and continuously tweaking these knobs trying to find the magic formula. There is no magic formula. We simply need visibility to organize our own lobbies.
every game I play, one side is really bad the other is really good or half of one team leve. I know its social but its got to be playable for both sides. a suggest I have would be to find the lobby fast with out considering of blanching then sort the teams out to be the most belched for that lobby.
every game I play one side is really bad the other is really good or halo of one team leve. I know its social but its got to be playable for both sides. a suggest I have would be to find the lobby fast with out considering of blanching then sort the teams out to be the most belched for that lobby.
That doesn't work when people are organized in lobbies. You can't split up a group between two teams just so the game can have balance. Also, not to be rude, but I didn't understand your first sentence at all.

TROPSTOP wrote:
Assuming the resources can/will be allocated to do it
That's a big assumption at this point. It has been a top feature request since launch, and instead 343 has responded with the Match Composer and continuously tweaking these knobs trying to find the magic formula. There is no magic formula. We simply need visibility to organize our own lobbies.
There is no substitute for custom lobby browsing. There is also no substitute for a great MM system. These systems have some overlap but largely serve different roles, and both are necessary. 343 did the right thing by doing match composer before customs browser, because MM is simply going to be much more widely used population wise. It was a smart triage, and once they finally do get to the customs browser, everything will be peachy.
every game I play one side is really bad the other is really good or halo of one team leve. I know its social but its got to be playable for both sides. a suggest I have would be to find the lobby fast with out considering of blanching then sort the teams out to be the most belched for that lobby.
That doesn't work when people are organized in lobbies. You can't split up a group between two teams just so the game can have balance. Also, not to be rude, but I didn't understand your first sentence at all.

TROPSTOP wrote:
Assuming the resources can/will be allocated to do it
That's a big assumption at this point. It has been a top feature request since launch, and instead 343 has responded with the Match Composer and continuously tweaking these knobs trying to find the magic formula. There is no magic formula. We simply need visibility to organize our own lobbies.
There is no substitute for custom lobby browsing. There is also no substitute for a great MM system. These systems have some overlap but largely serve different roles, and both are necessary. 343 did the right thing by doing match composer before customs browser, because MM is simply going to be much more widely used population wise. It was a smart triage, and once they finally do get to the customs browser, everything will be peachy.
you don't need to split up the group as it would do it the best of what it has as its social and most likely there will be two groups
To me social is social. You get what you get and that’s it. No need for balancing true skills. That’s what competitive matchmaking is for.
They could implement the TrueSkill 2 system, but expect to have a lot longer wait times.
Mr Vacha wrote:
To me social is social. You get what you get and that’s it. No need for balancing true skills. That’s what competitive matchmaking is for.
Social is ment for fun you can't have fun if one teme is miles worse than the other. Neither team can have fun. it doesn't need to Be fully balance but it has to be fun
MCC and those Halos in general have been around for a long while. The reason you’re paired up with bad teammates is bc you’re going in solo. Practically everyone that still plays is well versed in MCC so you’re either going to have to get a good team to link up with or continue carrying others.
Mr Vacha wrote:
MCC and those Halos in general have been around for a long while. The reason you’re paired up with bad teammates is bc you’re going in solo. Practically everyone that still plays is well versed in MCC so you’re either going to have to get a good team to link up with or continue carrying others.
Why should you have to get a team to play the game and it's still not fun with a team as you destroy the other teame and that Lev
should be players with similiar skill matched together ? no ( increase wait time )
should the players wich are found to form a game be balanced ? absolutely with the exception of groups.
In social other aspects then balance are important / for balance there are ranked games
Honestly I agree, half of my matches are one sided & half the times I get a team that are AFK or they leave and I’m Last man standing, it’s unbelievable and makes it worse when I’m AUS and I get put in US West and I get Lag
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