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okay the quit penalty system needs some tweaking

OP pugwash1

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as in it needs to know what the cause of the quit was ie: if a game or console crash was the cause for quitting then there should be no penalty, not just a penalty regardless if it was a result of a crash or not isn't gonna help
I agree but I don't think they have the ability to do that. The ban just needs to go away. Most of us don't take the game that seriously anyway and banning people for disconnects just pushes the game's population even lower.
I agree but I don't think they have the ability to do that. The ban just needs to go away. Most of us don't take the game that seriously anyway and banning people for disconnects just pushes the game's population even lower.
I'm pretty sure not being able to play a single 4v4 is more damageable for the game than banning serial quitters, who basically don't play anyways.
pugwash1 wrote:
as in it needs to know what the cause of the quit was ie: if a game or console crash was the cause for quitting then there should be no penalty, not just a penalty regardless if it was a result of a crash or not isn't gonna help
It is impossible to make a system that can explicitly detect the reason for the disconnect and at the same time not be thwarted by people who want to quit and avoid a penalty.
It would be nice to have a system that could detect why some one "disconnected" but probably quite impossible. Or a system that gave you the option to rejoin the game if it was a legit disconnect. Maybe that is something they can work on. But I feel the system is pretty good. I still question whether players are disconnecting this often. As I can say I have only had two disconnects that was their side, and since turning off H3 skins I have had zero. That is also playing with a wifi connection thru my cell phone... I feel the bans are working as intended and players are now upset they can't quit with no real penalty like before.
I have experienced it way to many, but i also play a lot... I think in total about 2-3% of the matches or something like that.
But i also have seen multiple streamers who got that problem, even the grassroots streamers during a playdate (those are supposed to promote MCC...).

This week it happened to me in a Firefight game (never had that happen before..) and even that got me a ban, even though you can quit banfree from firefight....

Perhaps it also depends on where you live? People closer to the halo-servers have lower ping, so they have less chance of being kicked from entering a match? For what i see most people complaining from these bugs are non-US players, those live farther from the servers. Perhaps that's part of the issue?

And even if you live in your own tunnel and just put up strawmans that no-one would have those problems (enough evidence otherwise, but okay...): why hasn't the harsher bans worked? The number of quits is higher now, the number of AFK'ers is higher now and the playerbase is lower now. Why hasn't it worked?
The answer is very simple: for the people who do quit often (and of course those exist) there is a very simple way to get around bans. As long as you can create a smurfaccount in much less time than even the first ban is, it will not affect them. That is also why you see a lot of new accounts of experienced players. The problem is that that messes up the matchmaking system (because that still seems them as 'noobs') and create more one-sided matches.

And something else (if you guys are allowed to use strawman, so can we): i am curious how come you experience that much quitters to begin with? I see quitters very reguraly, but way not as often as you guys claim. Most of my matches don't have quitters. So how do you have them almost always as you claim? What makes it that people don't want to play with you guys, while others don't have that problem as often? Are you that toxic during matches?
I have experienced it way to many, but i also play a lot... I think in total about 2-3% of the matches or something like that.
But i also have seen multiple streamers who got that problem, even the grassroots streamers during a playdate (those are supposed to promote MCC...).

This week it happened to me in a Firefight game (never had that happen before..) and even that got me a ban, even though you can quit banfree from firefight....

Perhaps it also depends on where you live? People closer to the halo-servers have lower ping, so they have less chance of being kicked from entering a match? For what i see most people complaining from these bugs are non-US players, those live farther from the servers. Perhaps that's part of the issue?

And even if you live in your own tunnel and just put up strawmans that no-one would have those problems (enough evidence otherwise, but okay...): why hasn't the harsher bans worked? The number of quits is higher now, the number of AFK'ers is higher now and the playerbase is lower now. Why hasn't it worked?
The answer is very simple: for the people who do quit often (and of course those exist) there is a very simple way to get around bans. As long as you can create a smurfaccount in much less time than even the first ban is, it will not affect them. That is also why you see a lot of new accounts of experienced players. The problem is that that messes up the matchmaking system (because that still seems them as 'noobs') and create more one-sided matches.

And something else (if you guys are allowed to use strawman, so can we): i am curious how come you experience that much quitters to begin with? I see quitters very reguraly, but way not as often as you guys claim. Most of my matches don't have quitters. So how do you have them almost always as you claim? What makes it that people don't want to play with you guys, while others don't have that problem as often? Are you that toxic during matches?
no I don t do anything to make them leave sometimes its because of a troll betraying others or afk player I move out of the lien of fire but some of the times I quit is mainly down to my system crashing or the game crashes
pugwash1 wrote:
as in it needs to know what the cause of the quit was ie: if a game or console crash was the cause for quitting then there should be no penalty, not just a penalty regardless if it was a result of a crash or not isn't gonna help
Oh good, I can hit Alt+f4 now to get out of games I don't enjoy playing to avoid being punished for it. I'll just tell them my game "crashed".
If one person on your yeam quits you should be allowed to quit. Winning a 3v4 is nearly impossible with how strict the sbmm can be
Alternatively they could allow players to drop in and replace missing players
I agree but I don't think they have the ability to do that. The ban just needs to go away. Most of us don't take the game that seriously anyway and banning people for disconnects just pushes the game's population even lower.
Having my Xbox crash because of the new skins and getting banned I have started to play less of MCC and went back to 5
The Halo 4 “red” server screen followed by a ban before the game “crashed”. Yeah, that’s a bit of a silly punishment.

As for games that have a team member or members quit. As soon as 25% of the team has left the match, the remaining team members should be able to quit without punishment.
pugwash1 wrote:
as in it needs to know what the cause of the quit was ie: if a game or console crash was the cause for quitting then there should be no penalty, not just a penalty regardless if it was a result of a crash or not isn't gonna help
It is impossible to make a system that can explicitly detect the reason for the disconnect and at the same time not be thwarted by people who want to quit and avoid a penalty.
Just pull a r6s, and have rejoinable matches.
X19Doug95 wrote:
I agree but I don't think they have the ability to do that. The ban just needs to go away. Most of us don't take the game that seriously anyway and banning people for disconnects just pushes the game's population even lower.
Having my Xbox crash because of the new skins and getting banned I have started to play less of MCC and went back to 5
I agree, I was at a friends house a few weeks back and our xbox crashed in a CE map and we got a 5 minute ban. The underlying issue of the game crashing should have been fixed before the ban times were tweaked. I do also agree though that quitting is a problem and needs to be addressed, sometimes things happen or come up that you can't avoid but it puts your teammates in a bad spot. I think a better compromise would have been having 1 lower quit ban time like 3 minutes before moving up to the 5 or 15 mark until the crashing issues are addressed.
pugwash1 wrote:
as in it needs to know what the cause of the quit was ie: if a game or console crash was the cause for quitting then there should be no penalty, not just a penalty regardless if it was a result of a crash or not isn't gonna help
It is impossible to make a system that can explicitly detect the reason for the disconnect and at the same time not be thwarted by people who want to quit and avoid a penalty.
Yeah i don’t think it’s possible
yeah my friends got disconnected from the match after their game crashed and got the penalty for quitting. We were lucky that it was only 5 minutes
M0xxiie wrote:
pugwash1 wrote:
as in it needs to know what the cause of the quit was ie: if a game or console crash was the cause for quitting then there should be no penalty, not just a penalty regardless if it was a result of a crash or not isn't gonna help
It is impossible to make a system that can explicitly detect the reason for the disconnect and at the same time not be thwarted by people who want to quit and avoid a penalty.
Just pull a r6s, and have rejoinable matches.
Disconnects and crashes can happen at any time during a match. What should we do if you disconnect but by the time you get back to matchmaking the game you disconnected from has ended? Should we give you a penalty?

I have expressed my opinions on rejoining in this separate thread. Ultimately I think the real solution here is to fix the crashes and disconnects. Allowing rejoining could still have a part, however.
M0xxiie wrote:
pugwash1 wrote:
as in it needs to know what the cause of the quit was ie: if a game or console crash was the cause for quitting then there should be no penalty, not just a penalty regardless if it was a result of a crash or not isn't gonna help
It is impossible to make a system that can explicitly detect the reason for the disconnect and at the same time not be thwarted by people who want to quit and avoid a penalty.
Just pull a r6s, and have rejoinable matches.
Disconnects and crashes can happen at any time during a match. What should we do if you disconnect but by the time you get back to matchmaking the game you disconnected from has ended? Should we give you a penalty?

I have expressed my opinions on rejoining in this separate thread. Ultimately I think the real solution here is to fix the crashes and disconnects. Allowing rejoining could still have a part, however.
I agree with you as well, theres a number of issues contributing to the quitting problem, I think fixing the disconnects and crashes would help but something also has to be done about afking as well. The game should have some sort of auto kick feature if you are stationary for a set period of time, IE 2, 3 minutes, etc. I had a H3 4v4 match this past week where one guy quit and another teammate was afk and I had to stay in a non winnable match because I didn't want to take a 5 minute quit ban. I'm not bringing this up to say quitting is the norm and I personally only use it as a last resort but there are bad situations in matches with griefers, afkers etc, where you get in a spawn trap and have no other option. Since the new quit ban times were adjusted I have only quit out of 1 match and that was a 2v4 so I didn't have a quit penalty ban.
M0xxiie wrote:
pugwash1 wrote:
as in it needs to know what the cause of the quit was ie: if a game or console crash was the cause for quitting then there should be no penalty, not just a penalty regardless if it was a result of a crash or not isn't gonna help
It is impossible to make a system that can explicitly detect the reason for the disconnect and at the same time not be thwarted by people who want to quit and avoid a penalty.
Just pull a r6s, and have rejoinable matches.
Disconnects and crashes can happen at any time during a match. What should we do if you disconnect but by the time you get back to matchmaking the game you disconnected from has ended? Should we give you a penalty?

I have expressed my opinions on rejoining in this separate thread. Ultimately I think the real solution here is to fix the crashes and disconnects. Allowing rejoining could still have a part, however.
I agree with you as well, theres a number of issues contributing to the quitting problem, I think fixing the disconnects and crashes would help but something also has to be done about afking as well. The game should have some sort of auto kick feature if you are stationary for a set period of time, IE 2, 3 minutes, etc. I had a H3 4v4 match this past week where one guy quit and another teammate was afk and I had to stay in a non winnable match because I didn't want to take a 5 minute quit ban. I'm not bringing this up to say quitting is the norm and I personally only use it as a last resort but there are bad situations in matches with griefers, afkers etc, where you get in a spawn trap and have no other option. Since the new quit ban times were adjusted I have only quit out of 1 match and that was a 2v4 so I didn't have a quit penalty ban.
I don't like griefers any more than the next guy. I hate people who ruin games by going afk the whole game, quitting, etc... Sadly, it is either really hard or impossible to develop automated systems that can accurately detect and punish these behaviors. The AFK system you described could easily be thwarted by someone wrapping a rubber band around their controller/ joystick. If you're on PC you could macro keypresses or put weights on the keys on your keyboard.
M0xxiie wrote:
pugwash1 wrote:
as in it needs to know what the cause of the quit was ie: if a game or console crash was the cause for quitting then there should be no penalty, not just a penalty regardless if it was a result of a crash or not isn't gonna help
It is impossible to make a system that can explicitly detect the reason for the disconnect and at the same time not be thwarted by people who want to quit and avoid a penalty.
Just pull a r6s, and have rejoinable matches.
Disconnects and crashes can happen at any time during a match. What should we do if you disconnect but by the time you get back to matchmaking the game you disconnected from has ended? Should we give you a penalty?

I have expressed my opinions on rejoining in this separate thread. Ultimately I think the real solution here is to fix the crashes and disconnects. Allowing rejoining could still have a part, however.
I agree with you as well, theres a number of issues contributing to the quitting problem, I think fixing the disconnects and crashes would help but something also has to be done about afking as well. The game should have some sort of auto kick feature if you are stationary for a set period of time, IE 2, 3 minutes, etc. I had a H3 4v4 match this past week where one guy quit and another teammate was afk and I had to stay in a non winnable match because I didn't want to take a 5 minute quit ban. I'm not bringing this up to say quitting is the norm and I personally only use it as a last resort but there are bad situations in matches with griefers, afkers etc, where you get in a spawn trap and have no other option. Since the new quit ban times were adjusted I have only quit out of 1 match and that was a 2v4 so I didn't have a quit penalty ban.
I don't like griefers any more than the next guy. I hate people who ruin games by going afk the whole game, quitting, etc... Sadly, it is either really hard or impossible to develop automated systems that can accurately detect and punish these behaviors. The AFK system you described could easily be thwarted by someone wrapping a rubber band around their controller/ joystick. If you're on PC you could macro keypresses or put weights on the keys on your keyboard.
Right that's a good point as well, that would be a problem. I have seen people also doing the spins, etc. I guess I'll never understand why people do that either especially when it happens in ranked, but it would have to be a stationary detecting system plus what you just described.
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