Forums / Games / Halo: The Master Chief Collection (Xbox)

Possible Campaign Weapon Changes

OP SilverBarrel831

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Hey everyone, like you guys I love the guns of Halo, their designs, their sounds, their effectiveness.

However I feel some entries into the games have weapons that are far weaker than they need to be and at the very least need a little nudge in the right direction.

Now with this thread being Campaign primarily I don't feel it'll annoy people with some of the suggestions I make.

Any statistics I use I get from videos by the youtuber Generalkidd, where he puts stats he's gathered from his PC into videos to compare the same weapon class for each halo game (pistols, shotguns etc) even if these stats are not accurate I will be using them to emphasise what I mean. On another note, this is not a collaborative effort, he and I do not know each other, nor does he know I'm using his videos as a reference.

I'll be making three suggestions I think are fair in terms of buffs/changes for weapons without overpowering them.
A Simple change
A Moderate change
And a Cheeky change (as it is me just wishful thinking and not to be taken too seriously) which would alter the weapons stats even further than previously suggested yet still attempting at keeping it fair.

As this is the opening post. I'm not putting all the weapons I think could be tidied up a little bit. If this thread goes well we can brainstorm together other "fair" changes to weapons, and maybe some for MCC's Halo Reach when it gets here.

Halo 2/Anniversary.

M6C Magnum
Stats - https://youtu.be/UZCzHULbJII?t=131
Stats to change
Damage - 8
Carry Ammo - 48
Accuracy
Range

Overview:
As we know, the Halo 2 magnum is a peashooter. It is a cool looking weapon and being dual wielded is passable, but the weapon alone isn't great. Its weak, its god bad accuracy and it seems to have bad range.

Simple Change: - Increase damage from 8 to 14. Reasoning - To make the magnum a more secure weapon to use as a single weapon and more along the lines of its others.
Moderate Change:- Damage increased to 14. Slight increase accuracy and actual range. Increase Carry ammo to 60. Reasoning - With this change, the weapon would have more longevity, coupled with the range and accuracy boost to give it more use are range.
Cheeky Change:- Increased damage to 15. Further increase to range and accuracy. Increase carry ammo to 72. Reasoning - This is to truly make the M6C feel like a Halo Magnum. Still it's not as versatile as the CE nor the Reach magnum, but it truly holds it own as a single weapon.
Note:- Accuracy should decrease when dual wielded.

Shotgun
Stats - https://youtu.be/MqZrOL4e9ZA?t=154
Stats to change
Range - 8
Carry Ammo - 36

Overview:
We remember from HALO C.E the shotgun was a devastating weapon at medium range where in Halo 2 if the enemy wasn't point blank it wouldn't kill them.

Simple Change - Increase range from 8 to 16, increase accuracy to accomodate. Reasoning - Now I felt the shotgun was powerful enough in pure damage just lacked range, I feel even if the range was doubled with an accuracy adjustment to boot it wouldn't be too overpowered.
Moderate/Cheeky Change - Range Increase to 20, accuracy increased to accomodate, increase carry ammo to 48. Reasoning - Same as above, along with more ammo to give the shotgun more staying power.

SMG
Stats to change
Accuracy
Carry Ammo - 240

Overview: I really have no problem with the SMG in Halo 2 on any degree, as far as I'm concerned its practically perfect the way it is.

Simple Change- Slight increase to accuracy. Reasoning - Just so the SMG would have a slight improvement when engaging at range
Moderate Change - Slight increase to accuracy. Increased Carry ammo from 240 to 300. Reasoning - Same as above and a little more staying power with an extra magazines worth of ammo to carry.
Cheeky Change - Adjust base STATS to that of Halo 3, including further increased accuracy and carry ammo of 300. Reasoning - The Halo 3 SMG was juts overall better stats wise than the Halo 2 one, that with the further increase accuracy and 300 carry ammo, would make it a rather versatile little firearm.
Note - Dual wielding would reduce accuracy.

Battle Rifle
Stats to (maybe) change
Carry Ammo - 108

Simple Change - Increase Carry Ammo from 108 to 144 (one extra magazine)
Moderate/Cheeky Change - Increase Carry Ammo from 108 to 180 (two extra magazines)

Plasma Rifle
Simple Change - Bolt speed increase. Reasoning - To make the weapon have more of a feel as it did in C.E
Moderate Change - Bolt speed increase. Slower overheat bar. Reasoning - Just to add maybe a second longer of sustained fire.

Plasma Pistol
Stats - https://youtu.be/fhqLbT3cjgg?t=150
Stats to change
Damage - 7
Charged Damage - EMP only

Simple Change - Damage Increase to 10. Charge damage increase 50 - 60 (including EMP effect). Reasoning - To simply give the Plasma pistol more of a place as a useful weapon. I feel "pistols" truly got shafted in Halo 2.
Moderate Change - Remove power drain after pistol is fully charge. Reasoning - So even when charged the Plasma pistol doesn't waste energy.

Halo 3/O.D.S.T

M6G Magnum
Stats - https://youtu.be/UZCzHULbJII?t=210
Stats to change
R.O.F - 120RPM (according to Halopedia)
Damage - 15
Carry Ammo - 40

Simple Change - Increase the R.O.F from 120 RPM to (about) 180 RPM. Reasoning - While this keeps it among the slowest of magnums still, still slower than the REACH M6G (around 233RPM) the added boost in speed would give to it more efficiency.
Moderate Change - Increase RPM to 180. Increase Carry Ammo to 48. Reasoning - Its all all good have a decent weapon, but you need ammo to keep it going. An extra magazine wouldn't make it too overpowered.
Cheeky Change - Increase RPM to 200. Increase Carry Ammo to 56. Increase Damage to 17. Reasoning - Like I said with the M6C these stats wuld truly make it feel like a Halo magnum should. (Though I digress the standard damage is fairly good as is)

M6C/SOCOM Magnum
Stats - https://youtu.be/UZCzHULbJII?t=260
Stats to Change
Damage - 6

Overview: I am shamed to admit a little bias here. This is my favourite Halo Magnum in terms of design. Yet I still want it to be fair. This weapon while useful, is quickly ditched for something, anything, else. I think the change in damage perhaps give others seconds thoughts on swapping it out so quickly.

Simple/Moderate Change - Increase damage from 6 to 13/14. Reasoning - As useful as this pistol is in campaign, if you don't score that headshot you're in trouble, a damage boost is just a little something this little weapon could use.
Cheeky Change - Increase damage to 15. Reduce Recoil. Reasoning - Same as above really, but to a greater degree.

Assault Rifle
Stats - https://youtu.be/-h66R2LiPlA?t=119 (Note: There seems to be some differing between what the video says and what is said on Halopedia.)
Stats to change
Damage - 7.5
Range

Simple Change - Increase damage to 9 Reasoning - To give the rifle just a little extra edge when dealing with tougher enemies.
Moderate Change - Damage to 9. Increased range. Reasoning - For an assault rifle, its range still seems to be lacking a little. Not quite as bad as C.E but still not great. So a slight range increase along with damage to make it a little more effective. Do note I'm not suggest BR levels of range.

Silenced SMG-
Can't find stats
Stats to Change
Damage
Carry Ammo - 192

Simple Change - Increased damage Reasoning - Just to give the "main" weapon of ODST a little extra umph.
Moderate Change - Increase damage, increase carry ammo to 240. Reasoning - Like other suggestions to give the SMG a little longer life in the players hand.

What do you think so far?
when Mod Support comes to pc with potentially mods also being brought to Xbox i could think of something like that
I don't see this happening, OP. Fans would lose their minds if the games they love and remember were changed in such a way.
omarlotrc wrote:
I don't see this happening, OP. Fans would lose their minds if the games they love and remember were changed in such a way.
Not necessarily, nothing fundamental is being changed like adding sprint to Halo 2 and people say how much they don't like the Halo 2 magnum for example. I'm sure buffing it even to the degree of the "simple change" wouldn't be seen as a bad thing. Sometimes change is good, as long as its done right, and that's what I want us all to pull together for. Right changes.
It really highlights to me how much the dualweilding mechanic altered the small arms balance in H2. I'm all for some weapon rebalancing/retuning and not just campaign either but I believe it must come from the devs as an official patch ect and I don't see that happening.
It really highlights to me how much the dualweilding mechanic altered the small arms balance in H2. I'm all for some weapon rebalancing/retuning and not just campaign either but I believe it must come from the devs as an official patch ect and I don't see that happening.
I agree with you in that it must come from the devs. A 3rd party mod just wouldn't be the same. But I believe if we all came together wanting even some changes, we'd get them, eventually. I know they're really busy with Xbox Skarlett and Halo Infinite and getting Reach onto MCC. But I think we could get them if we all showed interest.
Nerf h2 LASO flood fists. Those are some 1 hit punches even with overshields. Very powerful weapon.
If you want an official patch, I think any balance changes should be introduced as an option (maybe as new skulls?) rather than permanent changes to the way the games play. Even if changes were made that I felt genuinely improved the way some of the games play, I would still be upset if these changes were not optional simply because they would differ from how the legacy titles were. This is why they don't force you to play Halo 2 in anniversary graphics. All of the games need to be preserved as they originally were, and any changes to audio, visuals, or gameplay should be purely optional.

As for multiplayer, any balance changes could be introduced as custom games options.
jmandude15 wrote:
If you want an official patch, I think any balance changes should be introduced as an option (maybe as new skulls?) rather than permanent changes to the way the games play. Even if changes were made that I felt genuinely improved the way some of the games play, I would still be upset if these changes were not optional simply because they would differ from how the legacy titles were. This is why they don't force you to play Halo 2 in anniversary graphics. All of the games need to be preserved as they originally were, and any changes to audio, visuals, or gameplay should be purely optional.

As for multiplayer, any balance changes could be introduced as custom games options.
So how would you set up this option in menu?

While I do agree with you classic games should be preserved. I do think an official patch to weapons wouldn't recieve much backlash.

But I do understand where you are coming from.

SPC RUTH wrote:
Nerf h2 LASO flood fists. Those are some 1 hit punches even with overshields. Very powerful weapon.
That sounds rough.

What is LASO by the way? People keep saying it and I don't know what it means.
What is LASO by the way? People keep saying it and I don't know what it means.
It stands for Legendary All Skulls On.
jmandude15 wrote:
What is LASO by the way? People keep saying it and I don't know what it means.
It stands for Legendary All Skulls On.
... it sounds like a nightmare.
... it sounds like a nightmare.
It depends of the game and the mission, missions with vehicles in Reach are usually easy.

But the Assault Rifle in Halo 3 and ODST is already good in my opinion, it kills yellow Brutes on Legendary fairly fast at medium range (not full auto of course) and this is enough, I wouldn't use this against Hunters.

It's mostly going to save ammo with me, it's not common everywhere.
I can’t ever see that happening and yes if that was even to be a conversation, all this would have to be optional. It would mess with the entire fundamentals that people have been familiar with for almost 2 decades.

Can you imagine trying to do LASO and knowing the way the weapons are used are just now permanently different? It would ruin the entire experience. Same with speed running, this could change every single record ever set, sounds outlandish but it’s theoretically true.

Also, I see the word “increase” like 30 times... This just comes across as “I am not really all that skilled (which is fine) and don’t want to be bothered with planning a route in a campaign mission, nor do I want to conserve and make the best use of my ammo and resources, and don’t really want to take the time to get better at what we already have, so therefore we should talking about changing a 15 year old game and it’s mechanics.

Its gonna be a hard no from me dog. Protect the legacy titles, don’t butcher them with unnecessary fundamental permanent changes. Don’t tarnish a fantastic FPS like H2 and H3 and turn it into a bad shoot-em-up, run-through-and-blast-everything-in-your-way-till-the-very-end type arcade game.

These games don’t need to be changed like that. That’s why they make new titles..... Just my 2 cents!
I can’t ever see that happening and yes if that was even to be a conversation, all this would have to be optional. It would mess with the entire fundamentals that people have been familiar with for almost 2 decades.

Can you imagine trying to do LASO and knowing the way the weapons are used are just now permanently different? It would ruin the entire experience. Same with speed running, this could change every single record ever set, sounds outlandish but it’s theoretically true.

Also, I see the word “increase” like 30 times... This just comes across as “I am not really all that skilled (which is fine) and don’t want to be bothered with planning a route in a campaign mission, nor do I want to conserve and make the best use of my ammo and resources, and don’t really want to take the time to get better at what we already have, so therefore we should talking about changing a 15 year old game and it’s mechanics.

Its gonna be a hard no from me dog. Protect the legacy titles, don’t butcher them with unnecessary fundamental permanent changes. Don’t tarnish a fantastic FPS like H2 and H3 and turn it into a bad shoot-em-up, run-through-and-blast-everything-in-your-way-till-the-very-end type arcade game.

These games don’t need to be changed like that. That’s why they make new titles..... Just my 2 cents!
I do see yours and other point of views and I concede to the fact people do love how things are.

I'd still like to see some changes, even after all this time, but as you say. People are set in their ways of how things are and have planned far ahead into the level of where everything is and what's best to use where.

All I simply wanted, was for some things that are near to useless to have relevance and with it being campaign only no one would overly mind and not feel cheated, the story wouldn't change and things would mostly stay the same, just some smaller things would be better.

Sadly though in all honesty, I think you and some others are right, I don't see 343 changing anything, but I'm not giving up hope that there may be even the littlest of tweeks.

Thanks for your 2 cents!
I would definitely support changes to the campaign. Many weapons don’t have enough ammo and duel wieldable weapons(like the M6C) are vastly underpowered. Maybe it should be a toggle in the main menu. To preserve the original “feel” while allowing many of us to play a more balanced fun game. (Halo 2) I really wish that the BR would hold 144 rounds, the magnum would hold 60, and the SMG 240. Duel wielding should be an option but guns should be fully functional on their own. Every Halo after CE limits the ammo on weapon to ridiculous levels. What’s with the SMG only having 3 clips? And why does duel wielding double the reserve ammo? Weapons should have the same reserve ammo regardless.
I would definitely support changes to the campaign. Many weapons don’t have enough ammo and duel wieldable weapons(like the M6C) are vastly underpowered. Maybe it should be a toggle in the main menu. To preserve the original “feel” while allowing many of us to play a more balanced fun game. (Halo 2) I really wish that the BR would hold 144 rounds, the magnum would hold 60, and the SMG 240. Duel wielding should be an option but guns should be fully functional on their own. Every Halo after CE limits the ammo on weapon to ridiculous levels. What’s with the SMG only having 3 clips? And why does duel wielding double the reserve ammo? Weapons should have the same reserve ammo regardless.
Best use I've found for the dual weild mechanic in campaign is to carry an extra plasma pistol into the next zone, then immediately drop it for the elite combo ammo , the smg either dw or single weild I think H2/H3 I've only ever used them in very specific situations (buggas/drones) the pistol only ever in very clutch situations to be immediately swapped out for something useful. I've always felt the dual weild mechanic whilst initially a fun concept has always negatively effected the H2/H3 combat loop balance in both weapon damage ammo and overall balance.
I would like to see the Battle Rifle (obviously on dule weild - that would look a bit silly) added to Halo 2A and replace the Halo 2A shotgun with the Halo CEA Shotgun. Also not weapon realated but I would also like to see the Halo Reach HUD developed for H CEA AND H2A
I'd definatly like to see optional weapon balance patches for campaign. The sandboxes for h2, h3, and h4 are pretty bad and could use some buffs and changes.
Hey all!

I knew this thread would be a "love it/hate it" topic. But I'm liking the idea of this "Weapon Balance" option in a menu.

How do you guys think it would work, is it doable for 343?

One other change I had the idea of but ran out of space in my first post.

Halo 3
Shotgun
Stats to change
Range - 6
Carry Ammo - 30

Simple Change - Increase range from 6 to 12 and accuracy to accomodate. Reasoning- The shotgun while powerful is a point blank or nothing weapon, increasing its range even by double would still keep it at close range, but give it a little more of an edge against enemies further than arms length away.
Moderate Change - Increase range to 12 and accuracy to accmodate. Increase Carry Ammo to 36. Reasoning - Like many weapon described previous, the weapon has little longevity, even another full magazine's worth of ammo improves its overall effectiveness.
Cheeky Change - Increase range to 18 and accuracy to accomodate. Increase Carry Ammo to 42. Reasoning - Like other "cheeky changes", this would simply give the shotgun a more C.E feel to it, a healthy ammo supply to keep the weapon fed and a range and accuracy to make the weapon effective at close - close/medium range.

Anyway. Thank you to everyone whose been participating in this thread whether you agree or disagree, I feel getting to know how people actually feel about this is something that is important as a whole and if there a loopholes that could help with people emotionally, i.e the "option" suggestion brought up, to keep the classic games original feel, but also to make a more fairer/equal game for those whom want the experience.

Keep ideas coming guys, and also put down any changes you'd like to see. If you have the time maybe even try formatting it like I have with a simple, moderate and cheeky change.

Thanks again everyone!
ajh14ls wrote:
I would like to see the Battle Rifle (obviously on dule weild - that would look a bit silly) added to Halo 2A and replace the Halo 2A shotgun with the Halo CEA Shotgun. Also not weapon realated but I would also like to see the Halo Reach HUD developed for H CEA AND H2A
I do like the idea of the Halo CE HUD being changed to look like Reach but I think Halo 2’s HUD should look like Halo 3’s. It would be consistent with Master Chief’s Mark VI. The Halo 2 HUD looks outdated and kinda weird with the shield meter above the motion tracker.
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