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Read This if you're frustrated with MCC

OP Tyrael

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Tyrael wrote:
Porting games and remastering an engine is much more complicated than it sounds, honestly its probably even more complicated than making a game from scratch. Thats what most people dont understand, it is not just copy and paste of the code, its way, way, way more than that. Many of the problems revolving MCC stem from a lack of time, which 343 has absolutely no control over, that is the publisher's decision.
Building aircraft is hard, too. Perhaps we ought to apply your standards to those. See how that works out.
NNMS MXMS wrote:
Tyrael wrote:
Porting games and remastering an engine is much more complicated than it sounds, honestly its probably even more complicated than making a game from scratch. Thats what most people dont understand, it is not just copy and paste of the code, its way, way, way more than that. Many of the problems revolving MCC stem from a lack of time, which 343 has absolutely no control over, that is the publisher's decision.


Building aircraft is hard, too. Perhaps we ought to apply your standards to those. See how that works out.
Now you're pulling out your inner troll, you are trying to connect things that have no correlation. How many attempts at the first aircraft crashed and literally burned? much more than 1. And MCC is like giving a team a week to strip down 5 planes, and construct a plane using every part of the previous 5 and it has to work flawlessly the first time or it will crash. So we ought to apply your standards to that as well, which makes it seem even more complicated, which it is, so thanks for that.
My God. That is like saying you buy a car from a dealer and it doesn't have an engine...the dealer never explicitly stated he would sell you a car WITH an engine...just a car. That is the most idiotic argument I have ever heard in defense of this broken pile of crap. And if you really want to nitpick...the developer did EXPLICITLY state: "you will be able to play all multiplayers, EXACTLY as you remember them." I remember a matchmaking that worked, a hit detection that ACTUALLY detected and ranking system that was perfect. So yes, we entered into an agreement with the developer..aka I give them $60 and they give me what they said they would give me. 100+ days later, I'm still waiting for them to fulfill their promise/agreement/bargain.
A car isnt a car without an engine, so that point is completely thrown out the window.

Playing the games is pretty much exactly how they were, enough to say its exactly how it was, the 1-50 did have bugs, but is that really where you are going to base your argument?
TRAVES7Y wrote:
Maximus AB wrote:
I will agree with you on one thing, there really is nothing we can compare this to because there has been nothing attempted on this scale before. Comparing a single game to something which houses enough content for 5 is not really fair now is it.


I'm talking about games that work, not how ambitious a game is. You're either trying really hard to defend 343 at every corner, or aren't smart enough to understand what I'm saying when I compare it to BF4. BF4 was a huge failure, because the game was broken. The MCC is an even bigger failure, because the game is even more broken than BF4(hard to believe), and for much longer, too.

If my boss hands me a HUGE assignment that I say I can handle, and I fail the entire thing, I can't just look at him with puppy dog eyes and go, "but boss man, this was an incredibly big project that was way too ambitious for me....I'm so sawy, pwease forgive me". No, I would probably be fired, and rightfully so.
Thats not how the situation is at all. If your boss handed you a huge assignment and says you have no choice but to do it and get it done in a day when it will obviously take a minimum of two, would you be happy that all of your coworkers ridiculed you because you couldnt complete the task? That isn't even remotely fair
At this point anyone defending this game is someone to ignore at that moment.
At this point anyone defending this game is someone to ignore at that moment.
I'm not defending the game, people just dont understand the situation when they think they do. the game definately has faults, but all people want to do is place blame, thats what we do best.
Tyrael wrote:
NNMS MXMS wrote:
It had as much effect on me as pointing me to a video about how hard it is to make cars when my Envoy breaks down for the 7th time.

All that matters is:

1. What the devs promised the consumers; and,
2. What the devs delivered to consumers

It's the dev's responsibility to make sure the promises are commensurate with the difficulty of making the product.

They didn't promise you anything of the sort however, you are saying that they explicitly told you that the game will be 100% bug free and you will be able to play flawlessly day one. if they had more time the multiplayer wouldn't have been as broken I admit that, but that wouldn't have allowed the campaign to be released on the 10 year anniversary of H2. The only thing they promised was a culmination of the 4 Halo titles on Xbox one with a remastered Halo 2, and that is what was delivered, so I guess it fits your "things that matter" list.
LMFAO Really?? You really cannot believe this can you?
Tyrael wrote:
NNMS MXMS wrote:
It had as much effect on me as pointing me to a video about how hard it is to make cars when my Envoy breaks down for the 7th time.

All that matters is:

1. What the devs promised the consumers; and,
2. What the devs delivered to consumers

It's the dev's responsibility to make sure the promises are commensurate with the difficulty of making the product.

They didn't promise you anything of the sort however, you are saying that they explicitly told you that the game will be 100% bug free and you will be able to play flawlessly day one. if they had more time the multiplayer wouldn't have been as broken I admit that, but that wouldn't have allowed the campaign to be released on the 10 year anniversary of H2. The only thing they promised was a culmination of the 4 Halo titles on Xbox one with a remastered Halo 2, and that is what was delivered, so I guess it fits your "things that matter" list.
This is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard anyone say.
Interesting read.

But as others have been saying, "making video games is hard" is not an excuse for the fact that they released an incomplete product. Everyone who is upset about the state of MCC and it's launch certainly has the right to
be.
Tyrael wrote:
At this point anyone defending this game is someone to ignore at that moment.

I'm not defending the game, people just dont understand the situation when they think they do. the game definately has faults, but all people want to do is place blame, thats what we do best.
We all know making a video game is hard you moron. BUT WE DIDNT SIGN UP FOR IT 343 DID and they couldnt do their damn job right it's that simple . You can't make pre-exisitng games work and want us to feel sorry? but yet you signed up for the job? go the fxxk home and hire someone else that can deliver. thats how stuff works in the real world bro anyone that has job knows this lol.
Tyrael wrote:
At this point anyone defending this game is someone to ignore at that moment.

I'm not defending the game, people just dont understand the situation when they think they do. the game definately has faults, but all people want to do is place blame, thats what we do best.
Tough cookies. I'm not a coworker I am a full retail adult paying customer. I understand creating video games is hard work. Getting the MCC ready is hard work. But do not take my money under the false pretense that the game is in a working as intended state. To release in even the CURRENT state feels like borderline fraud.
Tyrael wrote:
At this point anyone defending this game is someone to ignore at that moment.


I'm not defending the game, people just dont understand the situation when they think they do. the game definately has faults, but all people want to do is place blame, thats what we do best.
I won't pretend that I can make MCC work properly and so far 343 and MS have proved that they can't either. I accept blame for my part in this, as I will never pre-order/pre-download another game. I know I paid for a faulty product. Why can't this be handled the same way I deal with almost everything else that doesn't work correctly? If i can't refund it or get a working replacement I stop buying that damn product from that damn company.
My god I do wish this game worked properly. Sorry for back to back posts
Tyrael wrote:
READ ME
Regardless of the difficulty, they are still paid to create working games. I understand it takes time, and trial and error, but if anyone else messed up this badly at their jobs they would be gone in no time.

That is all.
AnonomissX wrote:
Tyrael wrote:
At this point anyone defending this game is someone to ignore at that moment.


I'm not defending the game, people just dont understand the situation when they think they do. the game definately has faults, but all people want to do is place blame, thats what we do best.

Tough cookies. I'm not a coworker I am a full retail adult paying customer. I understand creating video games is hard work. Getting the MCC ready is hard work. But do not take my money under the false pretense that the game is in a working as intended state. To release in even the CURRENT state feels like borderline fraud.
You're still not understanding that it is not 343's choice to release a game that doesnt completely work, they have to hand over the game to the publisher when the publisher wants it, not when its ready. It isnt right to release a game that doesnt completely work, but they really didnt have a choice, and apparently nobody on the forums can see that, they just want to point fingers. And I'm really tired of people using the thought of criminal acts (fraud, false advertising, etc.), these are for people who believe they are entitled, when in reality, they are not.
Permoxety wrote:
Tyrael wrote:
At this point anyone defending this game is someone to ignore at that moment.


I'm not defending the game, people just dont understand the situation when they think they do. the game definately has faults, but all people want to do is place blame, thats what we do best.

We all know making a video game is hard you moron. BUT WE DIDNT SIGN UP FOR IT 343 DID and they couldnt do their damn job right it's that simple . You can't make pre-exisitng games work and want us to feel sorry? but yet you signed up for the job? go the fxxk home and hire someone else that can deliver. thats how stuff works in the real world bro anyone that has job knows this lol.
Obviously you havent read any of the posts on this thread, 343 did not really have any say in the matter. You can say as much as you want that they shipped a broken game and that they failed as a developer, but is it their fault or the publisher for making them release it in the first place when it wasnt ready. 343 could have proposed the idea and microsoft could have easily said "ok youre going to make it and we arent going to give you the necessary time to do it. read before you jump to conclusions.
Tyrael wrote:
NNMS MXMS wrote:
It had as much effect on me as pointing me to a video about how hard it is to make cars when my Envoy breaks down for the 7th time.

All that matters is:

1. What the devs promised the consumers; and,
2. What the devs delivered to consumers

It's the dev's responsibility to make sure the promises are commensurate with the difficulty of making the product.

They didn't promise you anything of the sort however, you are saying that they explicitly told you that the game will be 100% bug free and you will be able to play flawlessly day one. if they had more time the multiplayer wouldn't have been as broken I admit that, but that wouldn't have allowed the campaign to be released on the 10 year anniversary of H2. The only thing they promised was a culmination of the 4 Halo titles on Xbox one with a remastered Halo 2, and that is what was delivered, so I guess it fits your "things that matter" list.
quote from a 343 developer " Additionally, we've also modified matchmaking to use skill detection, which will put players into the fairest matches faster than any Halo game to date" This was obviously a statement of purported function of matchmaking and it was also obviously a lie as this interview was done one week before release. I want to emphasize "put players into the fairest matches faster than any halo game to date" this statement is a joke.

http://www.gamereactor.eu/news/270254/Halo%3A+MCC+ranking+explained/
Tyrael wrote:
AnonomissX wrote:
Tyrael wrote:
At this point anyone defending this game is someone to ignore at that moment.


I'm not defending the game, people just dont understand the situation when they think they do. the game definately has faults, but all people want to do is place blame, thats what we do best.


Tough cookies. I'm not a coworker I am a full retail adult paying customer. I understand creating video games is hard work. Getting the MCC ready is hard work. But do not take my money under the false pretense that the game is in a working as intended state. To release in even the CURRENT state feels like borderline fraud.

You're still not understanding that it is not 343's choice to release a game that doesnt completely work, they have to hand over the game to the publisher when the publisher wants it, not when its ready. It isnt right to release a game that doesnt completely work, but they really didnt have a choice, and apparently nobody on the forums can see that, they just want to point fingers. And I'm really tired of people using the thought of criminal acts (fraud, false advertising, etc.), these are for people who believe they are entitled, when in reality, they are not.
343i is a wholly-owned subsidiary of Microsoft. Blaming 343i is the same thing as blaming Microsoft. They are not separate entities.

And there is that entitlement word again, thrown around by someone who does not know what it means.
Tyrael wrote:
CoD has nothing to do with this for starters, it had no relevence to the date of release for MCC. MCC was released for the 10 year anniversary of Halo 2

The game was not ready upon release, but when it comes down to it it's not even 343's decision on when the game is released, they are given the date and they did the best they could with it in the time allotted.

343 was not looking to cash in for MCC, they did it because they actually have a passion for Halo, unlike you who is bashing because you don't have a clue what you're talking about.
343i employees hate Halo. http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/191234/making_halo_4_a_story_about_.php?page=3

Stop being a fanboy.
Tyrael wrote:

Now you're pulling out your inner troll, you are trying to connect things that have no correlation. How many attempts at the first aircraft crashed and literally burned? much more than 1. And MCC is like giving a team a week to strip down 5 planes, and construct a plane using every part of the previous 5 and it has to work flawlessly the first time or it will crash. So we ought to apply your standards to that as well, which makes it seem even more complicated, which it is, so thanks for that.
Lots of planes crashed during development. They also weren't marketed to anyone.

And your MCC analogy is far more laughable than mine. The game engines weren't the broken part. The matchmaking process occurs entirely outside of the game engines and is universal for all the games in the MCC. It is a single entity. Moreover, it's not the first time they've done it.

Let me ask you a question: How does your post - and more generally the position you are taking - help ensure that consumers actually get what they pay for? What benefit to anyone does this line of thinking have?
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