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SMG starts make the match feel so good

OP Mihael Langley

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Everyone is struggling for power weapons, everyone is moving around the map, the whole dynamic shifts and there are no campers. Close encounters feel much more intense and it feels thrilling when you take risks to pursue that better weapon.

In contrast on every BR start people just stay in a closed perimeter, they don't search for better weapons since the BR is more than enough, everyone is shooting from a far and in a predictable pattern, there is no tension or improvise and the whole match feels static. BR starts goes against what Halo should be, it promotes stagnation instead of risk takig and power weapon struggles.
Hopefully when matchmaking is fixed, they bring back the SMG starts. Would kill for some Halo 2 SMG starts on Ivory Tower
People camp harder with SMG start, especially after a team has secured power weapons. Most players wont risk giving up their Rocket & Sniper, or the precious few BRs that spawn on map. Especially because their opponents are easy pickings with worthless SMGs. Most SMG start are determined in the first minute. The team that wins the opening weapon battle gets to dominate.

BR start is an action packed FPS, where everyone is trying to maintain line of sight control and flank their opponent. Power weapons are still critical to success, but just like in Halo CE, they do not dictate who wins. Rather, they are additive elements which can tip the game in your favor. A BR start allows every player to engage in meaningful combat for the duration of the entire game.
DcIhNaGv3z wrote:
People camp harder with SMG start, especially after a team has secured power weapons. Most players wont risk giving up their Rocket & Sniper, or the precious few BRs that spawn on map. Especially because their opponents are easy pickings with worthless SMGs. Most SMG start are determined in the first minute. The team that wins the opening weapon battle gets to dominate.

BR start is an action packed FPS, where everyone is trying to maintain line of sight control and flank their opponent. Power weapons are still critical to success, but just like in Halo CE, they do not dictate who wins. Rather, they are additive elements which can tip the game in your favor. A BR start allows every player to engage in meaningful combat for the duration of the entire game.
umm no...what game are you playing? OP is correct. I love the original formula and that excitement trying to go get a power weapon. always playing with BR is extremely boring
DcIhNaGv3z wrote:
People camp harder with SMG start, especially after a team has secured power weapons. Most players wont risk giving up their Rocket & Sniper, or the precious few BRs that spawn on map. Especially because their opponents are easy pickings with worthless SMGs. Most SMG start are determined in the first minute. The team that wins the opening weapon battle gets to dominate.

BR start is an action packed FPS, where everyone is trying to maintain line of sight control and flank their opponent. Power weapons are still critical to success, but just like in Halo CE, they do not dictate who wins. Rather, they are additive elements which can tip the game in your favor. A BR start allows every player to engage in meaningful combat for the duration of the entire game.
This, for the umpteenth time Bungie even said SMG starts were a mistake. SMG is just awful and inaccurate and involves too much luck.
Everyone is struggling to survive for more than 5 seconds off spawn, the team with BRs is always moving to spawn trap, the whole dynamic shifts and the game ends 50-10 because one team got the BRs first.
FTFY.

Even Bungie admitted SMG starts was a mistake. There is no redeeming value to it over BR starts.
DcIhNaGv3z wrote:
People camp harder with SMG start, especially after a team has secured power weapons. Most players wont risk giving up their Rocket & Sniper, or the precious few BRs that spawn on map. Especially because their opponents are easy pickings with worthless SMGs. Most SMG start are determined in the first minute. The team that wins the opening weapon battle gets to dominate.

BR start is an action packed FPS, where everyone is trying to maintain line of sight control and flank their opponent. Power weapons are still critical to success, but just like in Halo CE, they do not dictate who wins. Rather, they are additive elements which can tip the game in your favor. A BR start allows every player to engage in meaningful combat for the duration of the entire game.

umm no...what game are you playing? OP is correct. I love the original formula and that excitement trying to go get a power weapon. always playing with BR is extremely boring
I always go for a secondary when I have a br start. Shotgun, Sword, Sniper, Beam, PP, More grenades, PR, Brute Shot, Brute Spikers, etc. BR gives you a fighting chance to actually move around the map.
I had a game on Ascension and after 1 minute, due to a bad spawn and bad start lost map control and got spawn camped for the rest of the game.

The SMG start is terribad.
Oh my god you must be terrible at H2, because you think it's ok to start with a smg. Elite players only use BR, sniper, and childish insults to get kills. BR starts weren't the norm last and I even got to play a little objective. In most of the lobbies I was in players were talking about the game being a bit stale already. Since most of us haven't been able to play with any regularity we wondered how this could be, and we came to the conclusion that players are soooo happy to get a game that they go with BR starts because that's what was keeping others from quitting. Now that the game is working better I'll vote something and if people quit, oh well. I'll be able to find another match in a few minutes.
Everyone is struggling to survive for more than 5 seconds off spawn, the team with BRs is always moving to spawn trap, the whole dynamic shifts and the game ends 50-10 because one team got the BRs first.

FTFY.

Even Bungie admitted SMG starts was a mistake. There is no redeeming value to it over BR starts.
well I 100% agree with br start....except for 5v5 br start on that warlock remake. Dear god that is just a yoink fest of "dead 3 feet from your spawn point"
Everyone is struggling to survive for more than 5 seconds off spawn, the team with BRs is always moving to spawn trap, the whole dynamic shifts and the game ends 50-10 because one team got the BRs first.


FTFY.

Even Bungie admitted SMG starts was a mistake. There is no redeeming value to it over BR starts.

well I 100% agree with br start....except for 5v5 br start on that warlock remake. Dear god that is just a yoink fest of "dead 3 feet from your spawn point"
5v5 just doesn't work on warlock, with or without BR starts. It's a better doubles map than 4v4 or 5v5.
Everyone is struggling to survive for more than 5 seconds off spawn, the team with BRs is always moving to spawn trap, the whole dynamic shifts and the game ends 50-10 because one team got the BRs first.


FTFY.

Even Bungie admitted SMG starts was a mistake. There is no redeeming value to it over BR starts.
You just described an impossible scenario. In your logic all the enemy players got BR's while none of your team mates did? lol what? More so when there are so little BR's scattered around maps... You guys are delusional. You're trying to justify your laziness with fake scenarios. If you want to spawn with power weapons go play team snipers, or CoD.

Halo is about fighting for power weapons, and that premise gets destroyed when you already spawn with the second most powerful precision weapon in the game. What happens instead is people shooting at each other from a far, often hiding behind formations since they can't afford to get closer to the enemy.

Take Lockout for instance, perhaps the best traditional 4v4 Halo map... they have a BR tower, because players race to grab that BR and fight to dominate the enemy team-. With everyone starting with BR's there is no BR tower, there is no chase for the weapon.
Everyone is struggling to survive for more than 5 seconds off spawn, the team with BRs is always moving to spawn trap, the whole dynamic shifts and the game ends 50-10 because one team got the BRs first.


FTFY.

Even Bungie admitted SMG starts was a mistake. There is no redeeming value to it over BR starts.


You just described an impossible scenario. In your logic all the enemy players got BR's while none of your team mates did? lol what? More so when there are so little BR's scattered around maps... You guys are delusional. You're trying to justify your laziness with fake scenarios. If you want to spawn with power weapons go play team snipers, or CoD.

Halo is about fighting for power weapons, and that premise gets destroyed when you already spawn with the second most powerful precision weapon in the game. What happens instead is people shooting at each other from a far, often hiding behind formations since they can't afford to get closer to the enemy.
I'm sorry, but I can't take arguments for no-BR starts seriously from someone with a sub-1.0 K/D in Halo. You are not a good player, and so when everyone starts with BRs it just means you die every 3 seconds because other players are better than you. There's nothing wrong with being a player of below average skill; but don't kid yourself - your problem with BR starts is your own skill, not the mechanics of how BR starts work vs SMG starts.

The solution is to improve your own play, not try and make fallacious arguments about how starting with a pea shooter is better than starting with a utility weapon. I suggest you learn about real power weapons: Sniper/Sword/Rockets/Shotgun and then come back to see me. Because those weapons DOMINATE the BR and must be fought over in BR starts.
Also, this myth where BR starts limits weapon pick ups is complete nonsense perpetuated by nitwits.

I've melted and been melted by users with a multitude of weaponry in BR starts.

Its just laziness at this point.
Everyone is struggling to survive for more than 5 seconds off spawn, the team with BRs is always moving to spawn trap, the whole dynamic shifts and the game ends 50-10 because one team got the BRs first.


FTFY.

Even Bungie admitted SMG starts was a mistake. There is no redeeming value to it over BR starts.


You just described an impossible scenario. In your logic all the enemy players got BR's while none of your team mates did? lol what? More so when there are so little BR's scattered around maps... You guys are delusional. You're trying to justify your laziness with fake scenarios. If you want to spawn with power weapons go play team snipers, or CoD.

Halo is about fighting for power weapons, and that premise gets destroyed when you already spawn with the second most powerful precision weapon in the game. What happens instead is people shooting at each other from a far, often hiding behind formations since they can't afford to get closer to the enemy.

I'm sorry, but I can't take arguments for no-BR starts seriously from someone with a sub-1.0 K/D in Halo. You are not a good player, and so when everyone starts with BRs it just means you die every 3 seconds because other players are better than you. There's nothing wrong with being a player of below average skill; but don't kid yourself - your problem with BR starts is your own skill, not the mechanics of how BR starts work vs SMG starts.

The solution is to improve your own play, not try and make fallacious arguments about how starting with a pea shooter is better than starting with a utility weapon. I suggest you learn about real power weapons: Sniper/Sword/Rockets/Shotgun and then come back to see me. Because those weapons DOMINATE the BR and must be fought over in BR starts.
so you assume since his k/d is some number that its solely related to his skill set? So say he or she lets friends of family play their game and thus brings down this KD number people are so fixated on these days, and yet that shows that persons true skills?

as for the non BR start, i see more action and strategy and sometimes amazing chaotic encounters when its a race for power weapons...when its BR start, it doesn't feel like old school halo, everyone kinda just camps out and plays a far...some maps thats fine, smaller maps, its not that much fun
I don't know about halo 2 as I am primarily a halo 3 player but I definitely prefer the AR starts in halo 3. I don't know how the AR compares to the SMG, but I always hate how when you grab a sniper or splaser in Halo 3 br starts you cant kill someone before they descope you unless you take them by surprise because they have the long range of the Br to rely on.
I don't know about halo 2 as I am primarily a halo 3 player but I definitely prefer the AR starts in halo 3. I don't know how the AR compares to the SMG, but I always hate how when you grab a sniper or splaser in Halo 3 br starts you cant kill someone before they descope you unless you take them by surprise because they have the long range of the Br to rely on.
I've never had that problem. If you were better than the person with the BR you wouldn't have that problem either.
All these threads do is convince me further people who want AR/SMG starts want their hands to be held because they get demolished in BR starts.
Some players don't want variety at all. It's kind of like when I play Battlefield, but I don't use vehicles. Most of the people I know won't play without them, but they aren't what I'm into. I get that some players don't want to play H2 like it was 10 years ago, instead they just want to spawn with a gun that is the best overall in the game. Screw getting one or a Carbine, I'd rather spawn with mine is the mentality nowadays.
Quote:
The Ownage wrote:

I'm sorry, but I can't take arguments for no-BR starts seriously from someone with a sub-1.0 K/D in Halo. You are not a good player
Lol seriously? Let me tell you about KD ratios in Halo... if you play objective modes well you will get negative ratios all the time specially when you're swimming against the tide. I've been down to as much as -32 deaths on CTF because i was the only guy going after the flag, and i captured it twice and my team won the match, i was MVP. With -32 of KD ratio.

Everything you say points to the possibility that you're new to Halo, you're used to CoD or similar shooters where there is no fighting for power weapons and KD is the most important stat.
After a certain skill level you will favor BR starts.

The point is when you're facing players at level where once they've achieved weapon/map control it's an extreme uphill battle to gain back control with SMG start. So of course if you're not at that level you've never experienced that and wont understand how helpless you are without BR start.
Done DL wrote:
After a certain skill level you will favor BR starts.

The point is when you're facing players at level where one they've achieved weapon/map control it's an extreme uphill battle to gain back control with SMG start. So of course if you're not at that level you've never experienced that and wont understand how helpless you are without BR start.
So you're arguing against skill gaps? lets get one thing straight, every map has normally 2 BR's scattered around for each team to grab, a team doesn't simply get their hands on a BR while the other sits idly by. There are moments in these matches where no one has a BR, there are moments when 2 people have. Its never enough to sway the tide in any direction.
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