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cortana and chief

OP OptimumCactus73

I didn't find suitable place for this forum so halo 5 ,I guess,is ok so dont quote......ok do do you guys think(i mean really really)cortana and chief loves each other or it is just aquintice from work
Yes undoubtedly there is a love between the two. It's obviously not traditional. But the whole story arc of H4 that focuses on Chief trying to save her goes far deeper than a work acquaintance relationship. That's definitely how it started in CE and even the Fall of Reach before that, but their relationship developed quickly over the course of H2 through H4. If H5 had done a better job of continuing Chief's character development, his grief over the loss of the only thing that has ever come close to love would have been more prominent.
Their relationship will be more prominent for unsc as chief is the only key to stop cortana
The sequence is as follows: acquaintance from work > teammates > friends > pseudo-parent/child > enemies

As far as the Chief has been conscious, as of 2560 (if that is when the next game takes place) he has now known Cortana as his enemy more than 6 times as long as she was his friend. That is a straight-up canon fact. They literally were in contact with each other for less than 2 weeks total. And were only acquainted as allies for 3 months.

You do not outright lie to someone if you care about them. You do not manipulate and gaslight them in an effort to achieve your own ends if you care about them. You do not violate their mind, body, and trust by forcibly locking them up against their will if you care about them. And you certainly do not try to kill their only real friends and threaten those that try to help them with violence and suffering. Nothing Cortana did in 'Halo 5' was for the Chief's benefit or was remotely about what he wanted or what makes him happy. It was all just Cortana doing what she wanted and what makes her happy - which is having him in her "possession". That is an attitude shared by abusers all over the world in real life. And showing such a disposition in a fictional character is still exactly the same thing it is in reality: disgusting and wrong.

So no, Cortana doesn't "love" the Chief. She's OBSESSED with him. Big difference.

As for the Chief, of course he cared about the AI. They became good & trusted friends during thier period of alliance. Plus Cortana's connection to Dr. Halsey - the Spartan-IIs' best known "mother figure" - in terms of voice, appearance, and mannerisms (which the Chief has acknowledged) probably has something to do with his attachment to her as well. The Chief has always been shown to have strong sense of loyalty to and care for all the people he comes to accept into his inner circle. However anything more extreme than that is based largely in fan-sentiment only, coupled with years of widely-circulated misinformation, than actual canon facts.

It is worth noting that in the book 'First Strike' it shows that it wasn’t until just prior to 'Halo 2' that the Chief actually started to see Cortana as more of a teammate than simply UNSC equipment. It was not this cosmic-psychic-bond people often try to pretend it was. All of this is further supported by other Spartans' work with AIs in canon, such as Naomi with BB and Fred with Wendell & Damon. The Chief has a family and much closer close relationships with his Spartan-II peers thanks to the real human interactions he's had with them throughout his entire life, and one of 343i's writers (Morgan Lockhart) openly acknowledged this in the lead-up to 'Halo 5': "There is a unique understanding that the rest of Blue Team has that even Cortana really didn’t have."
But the whole story arc of H4 that focuses on Chief trying to save her goes far deeper than a work acquaintance relationship.
No it doesn't. The Chief going on an unsanctioned and dangerous rescue mission to save teammates he thought lost is also his motivation in the book 'First Strike' - when he returns to a Covenant-infested reach to seek out the surviving Spartan-IIs.

Also in H4, "save Cortana" wasn't the Chief's priority/focus - if it was then he would have gone back to Earth like Del Rio wanted and not continually put Cortana under more strain. His #1 priority was to stop the Didact, and he needed Cortana to help him do that even if it meant using her in her rampant state and abjectly making her condition worse.
Quote:
--but their relationship developed quickly over the course of H2 through H4.
And you're basing this statement off of what in those games exactly?
...Many deep and meaningful conversations? Oh wait, they never had any.
...Shared life experiences (aside from combat)? Oh wait, not only did they never have any, that's not even possible because Cortana is an AI.
...Years spent working together? Oh wait, Cortana wasn't even around for the majority of the time from the end of H2 to the end of H3 and the entirety of H4 takes place over 3-ish days.

Nothing really developed aside from fan-sentiment for the characters as a duo.
Quote:
--his grief over the loss of the only thing that has ever come close to love--
That's not true. The Chief loves his fellow S-IIs. It's very likely he loved Mendez & Johnson as mentors/pseudo-father figures. You could even say he loves Dr. Halsey in an unfortunately twisted & childlike way because of how she's put herself into the Spartan's lives as the only "mother" they can relate to. Cortana was probably counted among the Chief's family once too - like Johnson or Halsey, but her not-death at the end of H4 was definitely not the "only" time the Chief lost someone he cared about. Just look up Sam-034 for a prime example.
H4 was all about the relationship of chief and cortana and the way in which cortana talked to him in the end when she died,that showed she loved him
H4 was all about the relationship of chief and cortana and the way in which cortana talked to him in the end when she died,that showed she loved him
No it wasn't. It was half about Cortana accepting her own mortality & bowing-out on her own terms and how that lesson could be imparted on the Chief going forward to improve his life (which ultimately didn't pan out b/c 343i retconned her death anyway), while the other half was about fighting the Didact and trying to get a grasp on his origins and motives (which didn't pan out either since H5 scrapped that development also). Maybe if the AI character had actually stayed dead then your assessment would have some merit, but as it stands all the end of H4 shows now is an obsessive & abusive predator sizing up their future victim.
You can be close to someone without it being romantic love
GreenleafCM:
I'm a tad confused here. You say that they only interacted with each other over the course of couple months, which is true. But you make the argument that that is not enough time to develop feelings of love while simultaneously saying their relationship developed to the point of a parent/child relationship over that same period of time.

But to respond to the rest of your post: You have a fair point about Cortana being obsessed, and I think that better encapsulates how Cortana views her relationship with the Chief. So I agree with you there. But being obsessed doesn't automatically negate that there is a love of some kind there. It's a creepy and possessive form of love, but still love. But even still, I'd say she became more possessive in her rampant state, not before then.

I don't tend to see their relationship as some cosmic/psychic bond. I just see it as a relationship developing at an accelerated rate because of shared combat experience and trauma. Cortana is an AI yes, but AIs in the UNSC have the ability to enter a person's mind and experience the world in many ways akin to how humans experience it. BB pretty much expressed this same sentiment in the Kilo-Five trilogy when explaining what it feels like to be in Naomi's head. Not to mention, if she's in the Chief's head ("hey watch it! There's two of us in here now") then if he dies, she dies. So she is just as susceptible to combat as the Chief is.

To focus on the length of time a bit here... my parents met and got engaged inside of four months and are still together and very much in love, and neither of them have experienced combat, let along experienced it together. Time is a big factor in developing feelings of love, but there's no set amount of time for it to develop. Some people just fit together. And Cortana "did [her] research" and knew that they were a perfect fit.

As for Chief's focus in H4. Saving Cortana was his primary focus until he encountered the Didact. Up until that point, he was trying to find the UNSC so he could get her back to Earth. Then when the Didact became a problem only he could solve, he changed his focus and went after him instead, in keeping with the Chief's and Cortana's sense of duty over self.

As for losing the only thing close to love... he loves his S-II family very much of course. But that is a familial love, which would be different than a more romantic love. I probably should have clarified in my original post that that was the kind of love I was referring to.

Sorry if I didn't address all your points, but I hope this clarifies my opinion better.

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That was very well put, and challenged some of my notions as well, but you are correct. However, I do think there is a deeper connection between Chief and Cortana than most might think, even given their limited time "together". The only sort of human interaction Chief ever had growing up was of Military doctrine, and a heavy military influence even during down time from his real friends, his Spartans. Their was never really a time where he felt anything other than what you would consider family, and that matters. You don't feel towards one of your friends the same way you do with your cousins, or siblings(at least I hope not), but that is the type of bond that is formed, a family bond, be it in Military, LE, or Fire Fighters(I need to stress again, I am only referring to Chief, I don't know how the other Spartans formed bonds). So you go from a very Militaristic interactions, and family orientated bonds, to one day having a Smart A.I being put in your head that is modeled off of a civilians brain. Chief had a hard time acclimating to Cortana's demeanor; he did not like it. But, just lie anything new that is a positive change of pace(even if it is jarring) you get use to it, and start to like that interaction, but only with that person. IS Chief in love with an A.I? No. But he has a deep connection with her due to the fact that she was in his head, which will likely have a more profound affect than just having conversation. Cortana brought out the "human" in John. She was his "escape", his conduit if you will, to bringing out feelings and emotions outside of how he would interact with others, because of her personality, because she has a civilian mind, and therefore can express things more freely, something John is not use to. Think of your own group of friends, you got some guys and some gals. You are all really close, like a family, and all act with each other in certain ways. Then one day, you meet this person. Not in real life, let's just say for our argument, xbox live. This person is not like the family of friends you have, but something about them struck a chord in you, a feeling of freedom, of emotion, or the ability to express yourself in a way you never could with your friends in the same way. In the relatively shot amount of time you have known this person, you grow a string bond with them. Not necessarily love though. That is the sort of connection I believe Chief has with Cortana. He does not love her. They just have this relationship that most can't understand, because it is different from even what we can understand; she was in his head, and was the freedom to Chiefs order. His mental and emotional liberation that only she could unlock, and not even Linda, or Kelly would have come close to doing, even if they were not seen as family with no possibility of developing a romantic relationship.

As far as not being enough time to form a bond. Not true. It took me no more than two months to be head over heels for her, and that was with someone 3,000 miles away. We are have been living together now for 7 years, and are engaged to be married. Chief on the other hand, as I said not only had a human personality in his head, but combat situations only make those bonds stronger. So a few weeks would suffice.
I'm sorry but the "Love-relationship" between Chief and Cortana is what makes Halo tick, atleast for me and probably a lot of other people. In the end it's human nature. We all look for some sort of love or affection subconsciously. The interaction with Chief and Cortana starts in Halo 1 has a friend/first date kind of relationship if you will with the "is he your pal? your chum?" and "You did that on purpose" kinds of exchanges. That relationship just grows with Halo 2 as the never leave your side and always there for you kind. We all know the "Damsel in distress" situations and how well they work to engage people in stories/movies with one hero and the other vulnerable friend/love. That is very expertly done in Halo 3, setting the mood with the nostalgic music and the start with Cortana's voice and Johnson asking "Where is Cortana?" Kinda reminding you that remember she is waiting for you. FIND HER!

The mission "Cortana" where you find her is very difficult. No matter how many times I play it, it makes me feel like I fought to find her! She wasn't just handed back to me. These things make the relationship deeper. You need to FEEL the story and their relation. Just because they don't kiss or say I love you doesn't mean nothings there lol. I'm just stating some of the things which make them click, there are tons of others. At the end of Halo3, Chief says "Wake me when YOU NEED ME". Not wake me when someone gets our distress signal or anything like that. They continue with the "Damsel in distress" thing in Halo 4 with the rampancy. And how can anyone forget that epic scene with the "NO SIR" when Chief flat out refuses to hand out Cortana??? To hell with being a soldier and taking orders, you touch her you deal with me! That shows their feelings towards each other is above all else. Cortana makes the Ultimate Sacrifice at the end of Halo4 because she loves the Chief! The words "I've been waiting for so long to do that" has real depth to them (Kudos to the voice actor). The whole game I was waiting to finding a way to save her and the failure stuck to me after she "dies" because for me I AM THE CHIEF. That's called engagement!

Now comes the part "if she loved him why did she betray him?" Well till today I believe in the Logic Plague. I believe she being controlled or being used to be a leader figure for the created. If this is not the case, the scene is Halo 2 of her being left behind makes no sense. The remake of the scene at the end with Cortana and the Gravemind with Blur Studios cost money and is completely unnecessary if the Logic Plague plot doesn't exist. 343 Industries even released the Interrogation Loot Crate or something (sorry I'm not a Lore expert, but I'm sure you guys will know what I'm talking about). That explicitly says about the Logic Plague. This whole thing is completely unnecessary if the Logic Plague isn't affecting Cortana. This makes the perfect setup for the Return of the Gravemind and Flood in Halo Infinite (it's about damn time!).

In my mind, this is how it might go. Cortana has taken over the galaxy. AIs or the Created is all under her control and she finds a way to trap all of them. Without them humanity is very weak and defenseless. Cortana is shown to be giving a message galaxy wide when suddenly there is a glitch (aka like Halo 4 rampancy) and she starts rambling random sentences said by the Gravemind in Halo 3. Then we see her figure disappear and the laugh of the Gravemind come up (like in Halo 3 when the final prophet is killed by the Arbiter). Infected flood ships suddenly storm in to the galaxy escorted by the Guardians on their side and the real war starts. Cortana somehow gives a message to Chief (via visions or anything!) that she's still alive and a prisoner in the Domain and that the Halo 5 Cortana wasn't her at all. She has something with her which will stop this war once and for all. Chief is torn between believing her and thinking it's a trap but goes to pursue her ALONE because no one would believe him that Cortana still might be good. He leaves and Halsey being the motherly figure of Chief becomes protective and sends Locke to "save" him and bring him back. That will setup for the Epic fight and Epic -Yoink- kicking of Locke by Chief which all Halo fans deserved in Halo 5. Chief warns Locke not to get between him and Cortana and then destroys his cocky ***. He finds Cortana and the rest is upto 343. Maybe a line by Chief "Don't worry I'll be more careful ... since there's two of us in here now". This gives 343 to play around with the Human-AI-machine thing with Cortana's guilt for all that has happened in Halo 5 (even though she wasn't directly responsible) making her more human.

If 343 wants to go back to the Halo roots and do what made Halo 1,2 and 3 click, they need to bring back Cortana to Chief and make the two again fight together side by side! This is one of the main charms of the first trilogy! Having Cortana with you gives the opportunity to build tension with Chief going to war alone but doesn't make you feel lonely in long campaigns and their conversation keeps things fresh (MUCH BETTER than having 3 AI squadmates all the time). Halo Infinte Trailer "Discover Hope" makes sense to me with Chief finding the real Cortana and her saying that they're perfect together and she was right with the nostalgic music. For me it's just the perfect setting. Everyone likes happy endings! Killing Cortana, bringing her back, turning her evil and having to kill her again just will leave a bad taste in my mouth when I will think of Halo. And I sure as hell will deactivate Cortana from Windows lol. There has to be a plot twist to Halo 5! It can't be all straightforward. Somethings up with Cortana in Halo 5. She looks and feels different (maybe it was intentional by 343).

Well here's to hoping. Just laying down my opinion.
Yes undoubtedly there is a love between the two. It's obviously not traditional. But the whole story arc of H4 that focuses on Chief trying to save her goes far deeper than a work acquaintance relationship. That's definitely how it started in CE and even the Fall of Reach before that, but their relationship developed quickly over the course of H2 through H4. If H5 had done a better job of continuing Chief's character development, his grief over the loss of the only thing that has ever come close to love would have been more prominent.
Yh I just wish they spent a little more time with H5 Campaign and story just felt rushed. However I enjoyed it but they could have done a little bit more.
I didn't find suitable place for this forum so halo 5 ,I guess,is ok so dont quote......ok do do you guys think(i mean really really)cortana and chief loves each other or it is just aquintice from work
Chief definitely has love for cortana despite all the trouble she's out him through lol
BORO 12345 wrote:
I didn't find suitable place for this forum so halo 5 ,I guess,is ok so dont quote......ok do do you guys think(i mean really really)cortana and chief loves each other or it is just aquintice from work
Chief definitely has love for cortana despite all the trouble she's out him through lol
A thought came to me that...what if the cortana we saw in h5 is just a clone or with more accuracy:a disguise. That's why chief affection on cortana in h5 doesnt worked out well in the game
BORO 12345 wrote:
I didn't find suitable place for this forum so halo 5 ,I guess,is ok so dont quote......ok do do you guys think(i mean really really)cortana and chief loves each other or it is just aquintice from work
Chief definitely has love for cortana despite all the trouble she's out him through lol
A thought came to me that...what if the cortana we saw in h5 is just a clone or with more accuracy:a disguise. That's why chief affection on cortana in h5 doesnt worked out well in the game
Tales from Slipspace shows us it isn't.
DC 409871 wrote:
BORO 12345 wrote:
I didn't find suitable place for this forum so halo 5 ,I guess,is ok so dont quote......ok do do you guys think(i mean really really)cortana and chief loves each other or it is just aquintice from work
Chief definitely has love for cortana despite all the trouble she's out him through lol
A thought came to me that...what if the cortana we saw in h5 is just a clone or with more accuracy:a disguise. That's why chief affection on cortana in h5 doesnt worked out well in the game
Tales from Slipspace shows us it isn't.
I thought tales from slipspace showed us that halo 5 Cortana was a fragment of the original
DC 409871 wrote:
BORO 12345 wrote:
I didn't find suitable place for this forum so halo 5 ,I guess,is ok so dont quote......ok do do you guys think(i mean really really)cortana and chief loves each other or it is just aquintice from work
Chief definitely has love for cortana despite all the trouble she's out him through lol
A thought came to me that...what if the cortana we saw in h5 is just a clone or with more accuracy:a disguise. That's why chief affection on cortana in h5 doesnt worked out well in the game
Tales from Slipspace shows us it isn't.
I thought tales from slipspace showed us that halo 5 Cortana was a fragment of the original
Still not really a clone of disguise. She says she is a fragment, yes, but given how other fragments just show up and overwhelm the Warden I wonder if she was lying. She lied plenty in Halo 5.
DC 409871 wrote:
DC 409871 wrote:
BORO 12345 wrote:
I didn't find suitable place for this forum so halo 5 ,I guess,is ok so dont quote......ok do do you guys think(i mean really really)cortana and chief loves each other or it is just aquintice from work
Chief definitely has love for cortana despite all the trouble she's out him through lol
A thought came to me that...what if the cortana we saw in h5 is just a clone or with more accuracy:a disguise. That's why chief affection on cortana in h5 doesnt worked out well in the game
Tales from Slipspace shows us it isn't.
I thought tales from slipspace showed us that halo 5 Cortana was a fragment of the original
Still not really a clone of disguise. She says she is a fragment, yes, but given how other fragments just show up and overwhelm the Warden I wonder if she was lying. She lied plenty in Halo 5.
That is whats i am saying that cortana is lying....anyway infinite will be all chief so maybe we dont get to see much of warden/forerunners or infinity....rather infinity ,it would be more of unsc. But what i think is chief would kill cortana in the end of day . Its kinda obvious that killing her is his jib to protect human race
There are different types of "love". There could possibly have been, at one point, a tiny bit of platonic love as between friends, maybe. I don't see any conclusive proof there has ever been romantic attraction between the two. Especially since as mentioned, they only actually knew each other in real time for a matter of weeks in the canon, not years as it feels to us IRL playing the games.

And if there ever was any romantic love, it most certainly should no longer be reciprocated by John, since Cortana has lied to him, manipulated him, tried to imprison him, and tried to kill his best friends.