Forums / Community / Halo Universe

Cortana is not evil!!!!

OP Casityny

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Syc0 Santa wrote:
I do believe that is Cortana. She may be infected by whatever ,but this is who she is now
Finally, someone understands me!
Casityny wrote:
Cortana wants to do ''the right thing'' no matter what the cost. This pretty makes her a morally corrupt individual. Also, she sees herself as the uphelder of the Mantle of Responsibility, when it was never hers to uphold. This is the same belief the Ur-Didact had when he composed humanity against their wishes for his own version of a recompense for crimes that he believed humanity committed!
In core human belief, forcing your view point on some one is always a bad thing to do, and Cortana is doing exactly that. Cortana doesn't think she is doing an evil thing, but that's how she is showing herself to be to everyone else.
Humans weren't attacking them, as the Didact believed. They were really just running from the flood.
Exactly my point. The Didact believed humanity was attacking them and punished them for a sin they did not commit. Engaging without full knowledge caused the Didact to commit an atrocity, even though he thought he did the right thing. As the saying goes...The road to hell is paved with good intentions!
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
You're right, killing a ton of innocent people and threatening to kill others simply for not following her vision is not evil at all! You know who else threatened to kill everybody who was different and not a part of his vision? Hitler.

No, Cortana is evil, and it's a terrible plot point. It would be better if she was infected by the Logic Plague (and honestly, it's the only explanation that would help me restore a bit of faith in 343i), but judging by Frankie's comments about us "not understanding subtlety", I feel like that's not the case. I mean, it would make too much sense. And even if that is it, they built it up so horribly and made a disaster of her coming back to life that it will still feel really bad.
I used to think that too, until I started thinking of Mendicant Bias, and how he was corrupted by flood and resulted in the death of thousands of Forerunners.
Yeah, and he was evil as well. At least his goals were clearly aligned with the Flood though, and not "HUEHEUEHUHEUE I WILL KILL YOU INFINITY FOR NO REASON!!!! I FOUND YOU INIFNITY!!!" (No idea what she even has against the ship in particular), plus he wasn't revived by pure chance and space magic like Cortana. Mendicant Bias was handled very well, and his fall to the Flood was tragic. Cortana, on the other hand, just happened to survive the end of Halo 4, after dying, and just so happened to teleport to the planet where the Domain was found. Oh...wait... was the Domain a) not destroyed by the firing of the Halo rings? And b) actually in a location unknown to the Forerunners? Yeah... That makes sense.

The idea of Cortana falling to the Logic Plague is something I can get behind, sure. But the way it was handled... It was terrible. Especially now that Cortana is just a one-dimensional character who's got a grudge against the Infinity for no particular reason and wants everything to die. And what caused her to turn evil? She got cured from rampancy and decided "hey, I feel like conquering the galaxy now". At least Mendicant Bias had a good story behind his fall, being that he was communicating with the Gravemind to find weaknesses, fell to its control, then eventually realized his mistakes and tried to repent. It wasn't just "LULZ I WANT TO RAISE AN ARMY OF AI AND KILL EVERYTHING FOR NO REASON NOW AFTER COMING BACK TO LIFE!!!"
She didn't want to destroy Infinity, or anything in particular. She just wants peace, but the way she's trying to make the universe peaceful is bad, and she doesn't get it.
Casityny wrote:
Cortana wants to do ''the right thing'' no matter what the cost. This pretty makes her a morally corrupt individual. Also, she sees herself as the uphelder of the Mantle of Responsibility, when it was never hers to uphold. This is the same belief the Ur-Didact had when he composed humanity against their wishes for his own version of a recompense for crimes that he believed humanity committed!
In core human belief, forcing your view point on some one is always a bad thing to do, and Cortana is doing exactly that. Cortana doesn't think she is doing an evil thing, but that's how she is showing herself to be to everyone else.
Humans weren't attacking them, as the Didact believed. They were really just running from the flood.
Exactly my point. The Didact BELIEVED
I know right
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
You're right, killing a ton of innocent people and threatening to kill others simply for not following her vision is not evil at all! You know who else threatened to kill everybody who was different and not a part of his vision? Hitler.

No, Cortana is evil, and it's a terrible plot point. It would be better if she was infected by the Logic Plague (and honestly, it's the only explanation that would help me restore a bit of faith in 343i), but judging by Frankie's comments about us "not understanding subtlety", I feel like that's not the case. I mean, it would make too much sense. And even if that is it, they built it up so horribly and made a disaster of her coming back to life that it will still feel really bad.
I used to think that too, until I started thinking of Mendicant Bias, and how he was corrupted by flood and resulted in the death of thousands of Forerunners.
Yeah, and he was evil as well. At least his goals were clearly aligned with the Flood though, and not "HUEHEUEHUHEUE I WILL KILL YOU INFINITY FOR NO REASON!!!! I FOUND YOU INIFNITY!!!" (No idea what she even has against the ship in particular), plus he wasn't revived by pure chance and space magic like Cortana. Mendicant Bias was handled very well, and his fall to the Flood was tragic. Cortana, on the other hand, just happened to survive the end of Halo 4, after dying, and just so happened to teleport to the planet where the Domain was found. Oh...wait... was the Domain a) not destroyed by the firing of the Halo rings? And b) actually in a location unknown to the Forerunners? Yeah... That makes sense.

The idea of Cortana falling to the Logic Plague is something I can get behind, sure. But the way it was handled... It was terrible. Especially now that Cortana is just a one-dimensional character who's got a grudge against the Infinity for no particular reason and wants everything to die. And what caused her to turn evil? She got cured from rampancy and decided "hey, I feel like conquering the galaxy now". At least Mendicant Bias had a good story behind his fall, being that he was communicating with the Gravemind to find weaknesses, fell to its control, then eventually realized his mistakes and tried to repent. It wasn't just "LULZ I WANT TO RAISE AN ARMY OF AI AND KILL EVERYTHING FOR NO REASON NOW AFTER COMING BACK TO LIFE!!!"
She didn't want to destroy Infinity, or anything in particular. She just wants peace, but the way she's trying to make the universe peaceful is bad, and she doesn't get it.
In the last cutscene of the game, she literally shows up on the Infinity saying "I've found you Infinity!", then sends a Guardian to destroy them.

You know who else wanted peace? Any other cruel dictator from any country. I'm sure Hitler or Stalin wanted peace as well, as did Genghis Khan. But their means of wanting peace came to conquering all who were different. Have you ever heard of the phrase "the end does not justify the means"? If Cortana wants peace by killing everybody, that does not make her any less evil. If she truly wanted peace, she wouldn't have gone and killed a bunch of people for no reason without warning without any hesitation.
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
You're right, killing a ton of innocent people and threatening to kill others simply for not following her vision is not evil at all! You know who else threatened to kill everybody who was different and not a part of his vision? Hitler.

No, Cortana is evil, and it's a terrible plot point. It would be better if she was infected by the Logic Plague (and honestly, it's the only explanation that would help me restore a bit of faith in 343i), but judging by Frankie's comments about us "not understanding subtlety", I feel like that's not the case. I mean, it would make too much sense. And even if that is it, they built it up so horribly and made a disaster of her coming back to life that it will still feel really bad.
I used to think that too, until I started thinking of Mendicant Bias, and how he was corrupted by flood and resulted in the death of thousands of Forerunners.
Yeah, and he was evil as well. At least his goals were clearly aligned with the Flood though, and not "HUEHEUEHUHEUE I WILL KILL YOU INFINITY FOR NO REASON!!!! I FOUND YOU INIFNITY!!!" (No idea what she even has against the ship in particular), plus he wasn't revived by pure chance and space magic like Cortana. Mendicant Bias was handled very well, and his fall to the Flood was tragic. Cortana, on the other hand, just happened to survive the end of Halo 4, after dying, and just so happened to teleport to the planet where the Domain was found. Oh...wait... was the Domain a) not destroyed by the firing of the Halo rings? And b) actually in a location unknown to the Forerunners? Yeah... That makes sense.

The idea of Cortana falling to the Logic Plague is something I can get behind, sure. But the way it was handled... It was terrible. Especially now that Cortana is just a one-dimensional character who's got a grudge against the Infinity for no particular reason and wants everything to die. And what caused her to turn evil? She got cured from rampancy and decided "hey, I feel like conquering the galaxy now". At least Mendicant Bias had a good story behind his fall, being that he was communicating with the Gravemind to find weaknesses, fell to its control, then eventually realized his mistakes and tried to repent. It wasn't just "LULZ I WANT TO RAISE AN ARMY OF AI AND KILL EVERYTHING FOR NO REASON NOW AFTER COMING BACK TO LIFE!!!"
She didn't want to destroy Infinity, or anything in particular. She just wants peace, but the way she's trying to make the universe peaceful is bad, and she doesn't get it.
In the last cutscene of the game, she literally shows up on the Infinity saying "I've found you Infinity!", then sends a Guardian to destroy them.

You know who else wanted peace? Any other cruel dictator from any country. I'm sure Hitler or Stalin wanted peace as well, as did Genghis Khan. But their means of wanting peace came to conquering all who were different. Have you ever heard of the phrase "the end does not justify the means"? If Cortana wants peace by killing everybody, that does not make her any less evil. If she truly wanted peace, she wouldn't have gone and killed a bunch of people for no reason without warning without any hesitation.
You have a point, but the Guardian only released a SHOCKWAVE, not neccesarily trying to blow them up. Then she would just have sent a million Phaetons.
Casityny wrote:
Cortana is a Halsey clone more or less, and she's acting exactly like Halsey.
Halsey didn't outright murder millions of people and threaten death on anybody who opposed her.
Yeah, sorta, but she did on accident kill a bunch of SII Trainees.
1,000,000+ of deaths and continued threats for countless more by Cortana without remorse > 30+ deaths that were mitigated at every instance to keep it even at that level and yet Halsey still felt pains about it.

The problem is the use of "exactly". These two aren't even on the same scale.
Casityny wrote:
Cortana is a Halsey clone more or less, and she's acting exactly like Halsey.
Halsey didn't outright murder millions of people and threaten death on anybody who opposed her.
Yeah, sorta, but she did on accident kill a bunch of SII Trainees.
1,000,000+ of deaths and continued threats for countless more by Cortana without remorse > 30+ deaths that were mitigated at every instance to keep it even at that level and yet Halsey still felt pains about it.

The problem is the use of "exactly". These two aren't even on the same scale.
In that case, theres a big difference between the two.
Casityny wrote:
Cortana was blasted to Genesis (or somewhere else). Do you know what plague the Flood inflicted Mendicant with? They infected Cortana w/ that. In my opinion, Cortana is good/bad. Really, the only thing she does is try to end all the wars. I agree w/ Fred and what he told Chief about his opinion. What do you think?
Bollocks.
Zak Ras 32 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Cortana was blasted to Genesis (or somewhere else). Do you know what plague the Flood inflicted Mendicant with? They infected Cortana w/ that. In my opinion, Cortana is good/bad. Really, the only thing she does is try to end all the wars. I agree w/ Fred and what he told Chief about his opinion. What do you think?
Bollocks.
What does that mean?
Casityny wrote:
Zak Ras 32 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Cortana was blasted to Genesis (or somewhere else). Do you know what plague the Flood inflicted Mendicant with? They infected Cortana w/ that. In my opinion, Cortana is good/bad. Really, the only thing she does is try to end all the wars. I agree w/ Fred and what he told Chief about his opinion. What do you think?
Bollocks.
What does that mean?
British slang for testicles. Serves the same purpose as "BS".
Zak Ras 32 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Zak Ras 32 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Cortana was blasted to Genesis (or somewhere else). Do you know what plague the Flood inflicted Mendicant with? They infected Cortana w/ that. In my opinion, Cortana is good/bad. Really, the only thing she does is try to end all the wars. I agree w/ Fred and what he told Chief about his opinion. What do you think?
Bollocks.
What does that mean?
British slang for testicles. Serves the same purpose as "BS".
Oh. Please don't use that language.
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
You're right, killing a ton of innocent people and threatening to kill others simply for not following her vision is not evil at all! You know who else threatened to kill everybody who was different and not a part of his vision? Hitler.
No, Cortana is evil, and it's a terrible plot point. It would be better if she was infected by the Logic Plague (and honestly, it's the only explanation that would help me restore a bit of faith in 343i), but judging by Frankie's comments about us "not understanding subtlety", I feel like that's not the case. I mean, it would make too much sense. And even if that is it, they built it up so horribly and made a disaster of her coming back to life that it will still feel really bad.
I used to think that too, until I started thinking of Mendicant Bias, and how he was corrupted by flood and resulted in the death of thousands of Forerunners.
Yeah, and he was evil as well. At least his goals were clearly aligned with the Flood though, and not "HUEHEUEHUHEUE I WILL KILL YOU INFINITY FOR NO REASON!!!! I FOUND YOU INIFNITY!!!" (No idea what she even has against the ship in particular), plus he wasn't revived by pure chance and space magic like Cortana. Mendicant Bias was handled very well, and his fall to the Flood was tragic. Cortana, on the other hand, just happened to survive the end of Halo 4, after dying, and just so happened to teleport to the planet where the Domain was found. Oh...wait... was the Domain a) not destroyed by the firing of the Halo rings? And b) actually in a location unknown to the Forerunners? Yeah... That makes sense.
The idea of Cortana falling to the Logic Plague is something I can get behind, sure. But the way it was handled... It was terrible. Especially now that Cortana is just a one-dimensional character who's got a grudge against the Infinity for no particular reason and wants everything to die. And what caused her to turn evil? She got cured from rampancy and decided "hey, I feel like conquering the galaxy now". At least Mendicant Bias had a good story behind his fall, being that he was communicating with the Gravemind to find weaknesses, fell to its control, then eventually realized his mistakes and tried to repent. It wasn't just "LULZ I WANT TO RAISE AN ARMY OF AI AND KILL EVERYTHING FOR NO REASON NOW AFTER COMING BACK TO LIFE!!!"
She didn't want to destroy Infinity, or anything in particular. She just wants peace, but the way she's trying to make the universe peaceful is bad, and she doesn't get it.
In the last cutscene of the game, she literally shows up on the Infinity saying "I've found you Infinity!", then sends a Guardian to destroy them.
You know who else wanted peace? Any other cruel dictator from any country. I'm sure Hitler or Stalin wanted peace as well, as did Genghis Khan. But their means of wanting peace came to conquering all who were different. Have you ever heard of the phrase "the end does not justify the means"? If Cortana wants peace by killing everybody, that does not make her any less evil. If she truly wanted peace, she wouldn't have gone and killed a bunch of people for no reason without warning without any hesitation.
You have a point, but the Guardian only released a SHOCKWAVE, not neccesarily trying to blow them up. Then she would just have sent a million Phaetons.
Which I'm sure she would have. The Guardian released a shockwave on Meridian, which destroyed buildings and killed people, all alongside all of the Prometheans she sent to kill everybody for no reason. And the other colonies where there were Guardians? Same deal. Remember the part of the mission where you're going up the space elevator on Meridian, and you hear the civilian who's all alone on the planet after everybody has been killed? Yeah, that happened everywhere. Not just with humans, but every other race. The attack on Sanghelios killed many members of every species, all because Cortana decided that it would be a good idea to kill everybody.

Every other enemy in past Halo games had motive. The Covenant were ordered to kill us by the Prophets, who believed that humanity were Forerunners. As such, we needed to be wiped out so that the Covenant would believe that all would transcend in the Great Journey. I'm sure their main goal wasn't to wage war, but to keep their strong Empire in an era of peace. A twisted, but strong motive. The Flood? They were sent both as a test of humanity's ability to uphold the Mantle as well as serving to unite all species under the Precursor's control after the Forerunners rose up and destroyed them. They were at peace before, and then got destroyed. They too want peace, but in a way that will prevent them from being completely destroyed again.

The Didact was a great villain. Not only were humans his enemy a long time ago, but he also believed them to be the cause of the Forerunner's fall to the Flood, AND his mind was twisted by a Gravemind eons ago. After being imprisoned in his Cryptum for 100 000 years, he came back to see the galaxy at war with his ancient enemy. It's clear why he would hate humanity and want to fight them, and kill them. He wanted his long-dead species to have glory again, and finally bring peace to the galaxy.

But Cortana? She just decides that she should kill everybody. Like everybody else, her end goal is peace, but her motivations? There aren't any. She's just saying "Oh, AIs are meant to rule, so now everybody dies." Unlike the other enemies, we can't relate to Cortana at all. She's just a dead ally revived into an evil enemy without any good explanation or reasons. The only thing we're really told is that "The Reclamation has begun", as though it's supposed to mean something.
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
You're right, killing a ton of innocent people and threatening to kill others simply for not following her vision is not evil at all! You know who else threatened to kill everybody who was different and not a part of his vision? Hitler.

No, Cortana is evil, and it's a terrible plot point. It would be better if she was infected by the Logic Plague (and honestly, it's the only explanation that would help me restore a bit of faith in 343i), but judging by Frankie's comments about us "not understanding subtlety", I feel like that's not the case. I mean, it would make too much sense. And even if that is it, they built it up so horribly and made a disaster of her coming back to life that it will still feel really bad.
I used to think that too, until I started thinking of Mendicant Bias, and how he was corrupted by flood and resulted in the death of thousands of Forerunners.
Yeah, and he was evil as well. At least his goals were clearly aligned with the Flood though, and not "HUEHEUEHUHEUE I WILL KILL YOU INFINITY FOR NO REASON!!!! I FOUND YOU INIFNITY!!!" (No idea what she even has against the ship in particular), plus he wasn't revived by pure chance and space magic like Cortana. Mendicant Bias was handled very well, and his fall to the Flood was tragic. Cortana, on the other hand, just happened to survive the end of Halo 4, after dying, and just so happened to teleport to the planet where the Domain was found. Oh...wait... was the Domain a) not destroyed by the firing of the Halo rings? And b) actually in a location unknown to the Forerunners? Yeah... That makes sense.

The idea of Cortana falling to the Logic Plague is something I can get behind, sure. But the way it was handled... It was terrible. Especially now that Cortana is just a one-dimensional character who's got a grudge against the Infinity for no particular reason and wants everything to die. And what caused her to turn evil? She got cured from rampancy and decided "hey, I feel like conquering the galaxy now". At least Mendicant Bias had a good story behind his fall, being that he was communicating with the Gravemind to find weaknesses, fell to its control, then eventually realized his mistakes and tried to repent. It wasn't just "LULZ I WANT TO RAISE AN ARMY OF AI AND KILL EVERYTHING FOR NO REASON NOW AFTER COMING BACK TO LIFE!!!"
She didn't want to destroy Infinity, or anything in particular. She just wants peace, but the way she's trying to make the universe peaceful is bad, and she doesn't get it.
In the last cutscene of the game, she literally shows up on the Infinity saying "I've found you Infinity!", then sends a Guardian to destroy them.

You know who else wanted peace? Any other cruel dictator from any country. I'm sure Hitler or Stalin wanted peace as well, as did Genghis Khan. But their means of wanting peace came to conquering all who were different. Have you ever heard of the phrase "the end does not justify the means"? If Cortana wants peace by killing everybody, that does not make her any less evil. If she truly wanted peace, she wouldn't have gone and killed a bunch of people for no reason without warning without any hesitation.
You have a point, but the Guardian only released a SHOCKWAVE, not neccesarily trying to blow them up. Then she would just have sent a million Phaetons.
Which I'm sure she would have. The Guardian released a shockwave on Meridian, which destroyed buildings and killed people, all alongside all of the Prometheans she sent to kill everybody for no reason. And the other colonies where there were Guardians? Same deal. Remember the part of the mission where you're going up the space elevator on Meridian, and you hear the civilian who's all alone on the planet after everybody has been killed? Yeah, that happened everywhere. Not just with humans, but every other race. The attack on Sanghelios killed many members of every species, all because Cortana decided that it would be a good idea to kill everybody.

Every other enemy in past Halo games had motive. The Covenant were ordered to kill us by the Prophets, who believed that humanity were Forerunners. As such, we needed to be wiped out so that the Covenant would believe that all would transcend in the Great Journey. I'm sure their main goal wasn't to wage war, but to keep their strong Empire in an era of peace. A twisted, but strong motive. The Flood? They were sent both as a test of humanity's ability to uphold the Mantle as well as serving to unite all species under the Precursor's control after the Forerunners rose up and destroyed them. They were at peace before, and then got destroyed. They too want peace, but in a way that will prevent them from being completely destroyed again.

The Didact was a great villain. Not only were humans his enemy a long time ago, but he also believed them to be the cause of the Forerunner's fall to the Flood, AND his mind was twisted by a Gravemind eons ago. After being imprisoned in his Cryptum for 100 000 years, he came back to see the galaxy at war with his ancient enemy. It's clear why he would hate humanity and want to fight them, and kill them. He wanted his long-dead species to have glory again, and finally bring peace to the galaxy.

But Cortana? She just decides that she should kill everybody. Like everybody else, her end goal is peace, but her motivations? There aren't any. She's just saying "Oh, AIs are meant to rule, so now everybody dies." Unlike the other enemies, we can't relate to Cortana at all. She's just a dead ally revived into an evil enemy without any good explanation or reasons.
I don't know why, but there's something in there I don't believe.
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
You're right, killing a ton of innocent people and threatening to kill others simply for not following her vision is not evil at all! You know who else threatened to kill everybody who was different and not a part of his vision? Hitler.

No, Cortana is evil, and it's a terrible plot point. It would be better if she was infected by the Logic Plague (and honestly, it's the only explanation that would help me restore a bit of faith in 343i), but judging by Frankie's comments about us "not understanding subtlety", I feel like that's not the case. I mean, it would make too much sense. And even if that is it, they built it up so horribly and made a disaster of her coming back to life that it will still feel really bad.
I used to think that too, until I started thinking of Mendicant Bias, and how he was corrupted by flood and resulted in the death of thousands of Forerunners.
Yeah, and he was evil as well. At least his goals were clearly aligned with the Flood though, and not "HUEHEUEHUHEUE I WILL KILL YOU INFINITY FOR NO REASON!!!! I FOUND YOU INIFNITY!!!" (No idea what she even has against the ship in particular), plus he wasn't revived by pure chance and space magic like Cortana. Mendicant Bias was handled very well, and his fall to the Flood was tragic. Cortana, on the other hand, just happened to survive the end of Halo 4, after dying, and just so happened to teleport to the planet where the Domain was found. Oh...wait... was the Domain a) not destroyed by the firing of the Halo rings? And b) actually in a location unknown to the Forerunners? Yeah... That makes sense.

The idea of Cortana falling to the Logic Plague is something I can get behind, sure. But the way it was handled... It was terrible. Especially now that Cortana is just a one-dimensional character who's got a grudge against the Infinity for no particular reason and wants everything to die. And what caused her to turn evil? She got cured from rampancy and decided "hey, I feel like conquering the galaxy now". At least Mendicant Bias had a good story behind his fall, being that he was communicating with the Gravemind to find weaknesses, fell to its control, then eventually realized his mistakes and tried to repent. It wasn't just "LULZ I WANT TO RAISE AN ARMY OF AI AND KILL EVERYTHING FOR NO REASON NOW AFTER COMING BACK TO LIFE!!!"
She didn't want to destroy Infinity, or anything in particular. She just wants peace, but the way she's trying to make the universe peaceful is bad, and she doesn't get it.
In the last cutscene of the game, she literally shows up on the Infinity saying "I've found you Infinity!", then sends a Guardian to destroy them.

You know who else wanted peace? Any other cruel dictator from any country. I'm sure Hitler or Stalin wanted peace as well, as did Genghis Khan. But their means of wanting peace came to conquering all who were different. Have you ever heard of the phrase "the end does not justify the means"? If Cortana wants peace by killing everybody, that does not make her any less evil. If she truly wanted peace, she wouldn't have gone and killed a bunch of people for no reason without warning without any hesitation.
You have a point, but the Guardian only released a SHOCKWAVE, not neccesarily trying to blow them up. Then she would just have sent a million Phaetons.
Which I'm sure she would have. The Guardian released a shockwave on Meridian, which destroyed buildings and killed people, all alongside all of the Prometheans she sent to kill everybody for no reason. And the other colonies where there were Guardians? Same deal. Remember the part of the mission where you're going up the space elevator on Meridian, and you hear the civilian who's all alone on the planet after everybody has been killed? Yeah, that happened everywhere. Not just with humans, but every other race. The attack on Sanghelios killed many members of every species, all because Cortana decided that it would be a good idea to kill everybody.

Every other enemy in past Halo games had motive. The Covenant were ordered to kill us by the Prophets, who believed that humanity were Forerunners. As such, we needed to be wiped out so that the Covenant would believe that all would transcend in the Great Journey. I'm sure their main goal wasn't to wage war, but to keep their strong Empire in an era of peace. A twisted, but strong motive. The Flood? They were sent both as a test of humanity's ability to uphold the Mantle as well as serving to unite all species under the Precursor's control after the Forerunners rose up and destroyed them. They were at peace before, and then got destroyed. They too want peace, but in a way that will prevent them from being completely destroyed again.

The Didact was a great villain. Not only were humans his enemy a long time ago, but he also believed them to be the cause of the Forerunner's fall to the Flood, AND his mind was twisted by a Gravemind eons ago. After being imprisoned in his Cryptum for 100 000 years, he came back to see the galaxy at war with his ancient enemy. It's clear why he would hate humanity and want to fight them, and kill them. He wanted his long-dead species to have glory again, and finally bring peace to the galaxy.

But Cortana? She just decides that she should kill everybody. Like everybody else, her end goal is peace, but her motivations? There aren't any. She's just saying "Oh, AIs are meant to rule, so now everybody dies." Unlike the other enemies, we can't relate to Cortana at all. She's just a dead ally revived into an evil enemy without any good explanation or reasons.
I don't know why, but there's something in there I don't believe.
Care to specify what it is?
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
You're right, killing a ton of innocent people and threatening to kill others simply for not following her vision is not evil at all! You know who else threatened to kill everybody who was different and not a part of his vision? Hitler.

No, Cortana is evil, and it's a terrible plot point. It would be better if she was infected by the Logic Plague (and honestly, it's the only explanation that would help me restore a bit of faith in 343i), but judging by Frankie's comments about us "not understanding subtlety", I feel like that's not the case. I mean, it would make too much sense. And even if that is it, they built it up so horribly and made a disaster of her coming back to life that it will still feel really bad.
I used to think that too, until I started thinking of Mendicant Bias, and how he was corrupted by flood and resulted in the death of thousands of Forerunners.
Yeah, and he was evil as well. At least his goals were clearly aligned with the Flood though, and not "HUEHEUEHUHEUE I WILL KILL YOU INFINITY FOR NO REASON!!!! I FOUND YOU INIFNITY!!!" (No idea what she even has against the ship in particular), plus he wasn't revived by pure chance and space magic like Cortana. Mendicant Bias was handled very well, and his fall to the Flood was tragic. Cortana, on the other hand, just happened to survive the end of Halo 4, after dying, and just so happened to teleport to the planet where the Domain was found. Oh...wait... was the Domain a) not destroyed by the firing of the Halo rings? And b) actually in a location unknown to the Forerunners? Yeah... That makes sense.

The idea of Cortana falling to the Logic Plague is something I can get behind, sure. But the way it was handled... It was terrible. Especially now that Cortana is just a one-dimensional character who's got a grudge against the Infinity for no particular reason and wants everything to die. And what caused her to turn evil? She got cured from rampancy and decided "hey, I feel like conquering the galaxy now". At least Mendicant Bias had a good story behind his fall, being that he was communicating with the Gravemind to find weaknesses, fell to its control, then eventually realized his mistakes and tried to repent. It wasn't just "LULZ I WANT TO RAISE AN ARMY OF AI AND KILL EVERYTHING FOR NO REASON NOW AFTER COMING BACK TO LIFE!!!"
She didn't want to destroy Infinity, or anything in particular. She just wants peace, but the way she's trying to make the universe peaceful is bad, and she doesn't get it.
In the last cutscene of the game, she literally shows up on the Infinity saying "I've found you Infinity!", then sends a Guardian to destroy them.

You know who else wanted peace? Any other cruel dictator from any country. I'm sure Hitler or Stalin wanted peace as well, as did Genghis Khan. But their means of wanting peace came to conquering all who were different. Have you ever heard of the phrase "the end does not justify the means"? If Cortana wants peace by killing everybody, that does not make her any less evil. If she truly wanted peace, she wouldn't have gone and killed a bunch of people for no reason without warning without any hesitation.
You have a point, but the Guardian only released a SHOCKWAVE, not neccesarily trying to blow them up. Then she would just have sent a million Phaetons.
Which I'm sure she would have. The Guardian released a shockwave on Meridian, which destroyed buildings and killed people, all alongside all of the Prometheans she sent to kill everybody for no reason. And the other colonies where there were Guardians? Same deal. Remember the part of the mission where you're going up the space elevator on Meridian, and you hear the civilian who's all alone on the planet after everybody has been killed? Yeah, that happened everywhere. Not just with humans, but every other race. The attack on Sanghelios killed many members of every species, all because Cortana decided that it would be a good idea to kill everybody.

Every other enemy in past Halo games had motive. The Covenant were ordered to kill us by the Prophets, who believed that humanity were Forerunners. As such, we needed to be wiped out so that the Covenant would believe that all would transcend in the Great Journey. I'm sure their main goal wasn't to wage war, but to keep their strong Empire in an era of peace. A twisted, but strong motive. The Flood? They were sent both as a test of humanity's ability to uphold the Mantle as well as serving to unite all species under the Precursor's control after the Forerunners rose up and destroyed them. They were at peace before, and then got destroyed. They too want peace, but in a way that will prevent them from being completely destroyed again.

The Didact was a great villain. Not only were humans his enemy a long time ago, but he also believed them to be the cause of the Forerunner's fall to the Flood, AND his mind was twisted by a Gravemind eons ago. After being imprisoned in his Cryptum for 100 000 years, he came back to see the galaxy at war with his ancient enemy. It's clear why he would hate humanity and want to fight them, and kill them. He wanted his long-dead species to have glory again, and finally bring peace to the galaxy.

But Cortana? She just decides that she should kill everybody. Like everybody else, her end goal is peace, but her motivations? There aren't any. She's just saying "Oh, AIs are meant to rule, so now everybody dies." Unlike the other enemies, we can't relate to Cortana at all. She's just a dead ally revived into an evil enemy without any good explanation or reasons.
I don't know why, but there's something in there I don't believe.
Care to specify what it is?
Maybe it's just I was so used to her being a friend instead of foe...
Casityny wrote:
Casityny wrote:
The Ur-Didact suffers from mental corruption brought on by exposure to the Gravemind and yet 343 still billed him as an ancient evil. Halsey arguably has a more morally conflicted background yet that didn't stop Brian Reed from calling her a monster and 343 approving a trilogy of books effectively calling her a Nazi. Why should Cortana be seen through a different lens? Hell, she's pretty evil in my book for the mass murder she's committed, betrayal and deception towards Chief in order to imprison him, continued threats of death and simply hearing the Galaxy for an all new war with at least the Grunts on her side and an army of robots and humans forcibly composed into AIs. She's not brining any real change to the Galaxy.
I guess, but, like Fred said, "Sounds pretty good. Why would anyone rebel?"
Note he said this before Cortana talked about punishing those who go against her. It's easy to say how good your system will theoretically be, but when you get into the nasty details to get there...one must ask if it's worth it. Sure, the Grunts joined up, but you think the resentment they felt in the Covenant days is gone? Now they have mechs and whatever else Cortana gives them. What's stopping them from undergoing a genocidal retribution against the Jackals for their attempts at sterilizing the Grunts all with Cortana's approval because the Jackals are not likely to join her because of their independent ways?
OMG if cortana uses that, frick this poop im out.
She murdered millions of people without any remorse, you think she'd really care about a subject species of her punishing a rebellious species in her name? Heck, what would rebellion even look like? What if simply politely refusing her offer for rule is enough for her to attack? Lives don't matter to her.
"Frick this poop I am out" hahahahahah
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
Casityny wrote:
Hotrod192 wrote:
You're right, killing a ton of innocent people and threatening to kill others simply for not following her vision is not evil at all! You know who else threatened to kill everybody who was different and not a part of his vision? Hitler.
No, Cortana is evil, and it's a terrible plot point. It would be better if she was infected by the Logic Plague (and honestly, it's the only explanation that would help me restore a bit of faith in 343i), but judging by Frankie's comments about us "not understanding subtlety", I feel like that's not the case. I mean, it would make too much sense. And even if that is it, they built it up so horribly and made a disaster of her coming back to life that it will still feel really bad.
I used to think that too, until I started thinking of Mendicant Bias, and how he was corrupted by flood and resulted in the death of thousands of Forerunners.
Yeah, and he was evil as well. At least his goals were clearly aligned with the Flood though, and not "HUEHEUEHUHEUE I WILL KILL YOU INFINITY FOR NO REASON!!!! I FOUND YOU INIFNITY!!!" (No idea what she even has against the ship in particular), plus he wasn't revived by pure chance and space magic like Cortana. Mendicant Bias was handled very well, and his fall to the Flood was tragic. Cortana, on the other hand, just happened to survive the end of Halo 4, after dying, and just so happened to teleport to the planet where the Domain was found. Oh...wait... was the Domain a) not destroyed by the firing of the Halo rings? And b) actually in a location unknown to the Forerunners? Yeah... That makes sense.
The idea of Cortana falling to the Logic Plague is something I can get behind, sure. But the way it was handled... It was terrible. Especially now that Cortana is just a one-dimensional character who's got a grudge against the Infinity for no particular reason and wants everything to die. And what caused her to turn evil? She got cured from rampancy and decided "hey, I feel like conquering the galaxy now". At least Mendicant Bias had a good story behind his fall, being that he was communicating with the Gravemind to find weaknesses, fell to its control, then eventually realized his mistakes and tried to repent. It wasn't just "LULZ I WANT TO RAISE AN ARMY OF AI AND KILL EVERYTHING FOR NO REASON NOW AFTER COMING BACK TO LIFE!!!"
She didn't want to destroy Infinity, or anything in particular. She just wants peace, but the way she's trying to make the universe peaceful is bad, and she doesn't get it.
In the last cutscene of the game, she literally shows up on the Infinity saying "I've found you Infinity!", then sends a Guardian to destroy them.
You know who else wanted peace? Any other cruel dictator from any country. I'm sure Hitler or Stalin wanted peace as well, as did Genghis Khan. But their means of wanting peace came to conquering all who were different. Have you ever heard of the phrase "the end does not justify the means"? If Cortana wants peace by killing everybody, that does not make her any less evil. If she truly wanted peace, she wouldn't have gone and killed a bunch of people for no reason without warning without any hesitation.
You have a point, but the Guardian only released a SHOCKWAVE, not neccesarily trying to blow them up. Then she would just have sent a million Phaetons.
Which I'm sure she would have. The Guardian released a shockwave on Meridian, which destroyed buildings and killed people, all alongside all of the Prometheans she sent to kill everybody for no reason. And the other colonies where there were Guardians? Same deal. Remember the part of the mission where you're going up the space elevator on Meridian, and you hear the civilian who's all alone on the planet after everybody has been killed? Yeah, that happened everywhere. Not just with humans, but every other race. The attack on Sanghelios killed many members of every species, all because Cortana decided that it would be a good idea to kill everybody.
Every other enemy in past Halo games had motive. The Covenant were ordered to kill us by the Prophets, who believed that humanity were Forerunners. As such, we needed to be wiped out so that the Covenant would believe that all would transcend in the Great Journey. I'm sure their main goal wasn't to wage war, but to keep their strong Empire in an era of peace. A twisted, but strong motive. The Flood? They were sent both as a test of humanity's ability to uphold the Mantle as well as serving to unite all species under the Precursor's control after the Forerunners rose up and destroyed them. They were at peace before, and then got destroyed. They too want peace, but in a way that will prevent them from being completely destroyed again.
The Didact was a great villain. Not only were humans his enemy a long time ago, but he also believed them to be the cause of the Forerunner's fall to the Flood, AND his mind was twisted by a Gravemind eons ago. After being imprisoned in his Cryptum for 100 000 years, he came back to see the galaxy at war with his ancient enemy. It's clear why he would hate humanity and want to fight them, and kill them. He wanted his long-dead species to have glory again, and finally bring peace to the galaxy.
But Cortana? She just decides that she should kill everybody. Like everybody else, her end goal is peace, but her motivations? There aren't any. She's just saying "Oh, AIs are meant to rule, so now everybody dies." Unlike the other enemies, we can't relate to Cortana at all. She's just a dead ally revived into an evil enemy without any good explanation or reasons.
I don't know why, but there's something in there I don't believe.
Care to specify what it is?
Maybe it's just I was so used to her being a friend instead of foe...
And that's what makes Halo 5's plot even worse. Cortana was our ally and helped us save the galaxy, there is absolutely no reason for her to suddenly turn evil and want to become a tyrant of the universe.

The logic plague is a good explanation, and I could see them using that to lead towards the return of the Flood. However, that is nothing more than a theory. If that was the direction that 343i wanted to take with Halo 5 and Cortana, they should have put in some hints or explanations about it. Hell, they could have at least had somebody like Halsey mention something about her spending so much time with the Gravemind might have affected her. But no, they probably expected us to become all heartbroken over Cortana suddenly being alive and a villain that they didn't even bother coming up with a reason for her to be that way. As it stands, all of our theories are worth nothing, since I'm willing to bet that Halo 6 will have as little to do with Halo 5 as Halo 5 did with Halo 4.

Maybe they were trying to give us the same shock that we got when we saw the Arbiter and Elites turn against the Covenant and ally with humanity. But again, that was built up throughout Halo 2 and was given a lot of great explanation. This, again, just popped out of nowhere.
Ya ill just wait for Halo 6 or some more lore on the topic. To find the answerrrrrr.
The Dnend Legion
It's not the real cortana. It's a fake, made by 343 guilty spark to trick chief and ruin him.
Because 343 guilty spark is working with the brutes to get his revenge on chief.
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