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Halo 5 retconning the lore (poorly)

OP Studiousdoosh

So there's a lot of issues i have with halo 5 overall, but in reality i don't have as much hate for it as a lot of people did, i played through it a couple of times and i (for the most part) had fun with what it was.

My ONLY issue, and it's probably already been discussed, is that why on earth would you guys at 343 (unless you wanna try to explain it in infinite) even think it was possible to change the lore so that it was never meant to be humans as the reclaimers but instead their AI?

Not ONCE in the first 3 games did either penitent tangent nor guilty spark refer to any AI in the story as a "reclaimer", and in halo 3 specifically, guilty spark directly addresses master chief (3 times in one scene) as the "reclaimer" and addressed cortana's recording as "your construct".

https://gyazo.com/3ccd14eeac217d33c82b6bb22d9072fc (reference to spark's terminology towards chief.)

Legitimately, aside from the rampancy or the logic plague (which in all friggin honesty cortana wouldn't have after her rebirth since she's technically no longer an AI) there's no reason for her heel turn at the end of halo 5 other than 343 simply just doesn't know anything about character development or who these characters have been built up to be over years of lore building in both the games and the books, and since now 343 wants to combine the books and the games lore wise they've no excuse for cortana's behavior nor the (LITERALLY IMPOSSIBLE) retcon of who the reclaimers are meant to be.

I know this post is pointless ranting and i apologize if this was a repeat post, but i was playing through halo 3 again and after the pointless changes done in halo 5 it's pretty frustrating.

If you wanted to change it and give the AI the power, all you literally had to do was have Warden Eternal, or another monitor use their protocol to strip humanity of their place among the forerunners and hand it over to the AI since the AI can be more trusted to do what is write for the universe over humanity. Aside from cortana the AI are all level headed logic driven programs who would of course if given the choice to safeguard all of the universe together would most likely choose to join the warden eternal, and instead of making cortana alive again and just be evil because you couldn't think of an antagonist, why not have had it so that the warden eternal brought her back and gave her a choice, allow life in the galaxy to continue to war until one side is wiped from existence, or give her the power to protect those she cares about and keep permanent peace among the beings in the universe.

She clearly has emotions beyond her programming due to her rampancy and rebirth (also possible logic plague) so she could easily be seen taking up that mantle from the one who gave her life again to protect the ones she cares about. So instead of her just making the choice to be dictator of the universe she's making a choice that she thinks is write to protect the ones she cares for. And i know that's ultimately her goal but without build up and without good reason her change of personality feels forced and is probably the second worse thing about the games story.

so instead of the end of the game feeling like "-Yoink- cortana betrayed humanity because she thinks she knows whats best." leading to humanity feeling like cortana is now the enemy (because she is) people would have seen her as someone to save, to bring back to the light and the end of halo 5 would have felt like it led into a redemption (rescue) story instead of a forced heel turn antagonist because they couldn't think of where to go next in the story.

Forget the poor marketing, forget the lazy exposition heavy (mindless) dialogue. The biggest issue with halo 5 is the inconsistency with the established universe as well as the (crazy) forced retcons to established lore.

I'm 24 years old. Halo 1 came out when i was seven years old and i knew no other universe as well as i did halo, it had one of the most consistent and believable sci-fi universes i'd come across in my life, but honestly if you're just going to toss that stuff to the wind in favor of just wheeling the story wherever you want it to go and forcing things that really wouldn't ever happen, you're massively disappointing the biggest fans of your franchise.
Lore is not being retconned,the smart a.i's specifically cortana are just interpreting it there own way
Something I'm disappointed in as well is the transformation of Cortana's role in the Haloverse. I'm hoping perhaps 343 is playing the long game and will turn it back on it's head for the finale. My disappointment lies in the "person" that Cortana has become. She's like a psycho, narcissistic, jealous ex-girlfriend toward chief.

When I read the first 3 Halo novels, it became apparent to me (at the time) that it wasn't Master Chief who was the true hero; it was in fact Cortana. She was knowingly sacrificing herself upon a short road to Rampancy via the multiple instances of replication and her valiant infiltration of The Covenant, The Halos (and Forerunners), as well as The Flood while probing Gravemind. Without her presence while working through John throughout both the games and the novels, humanity would've lost on all fronts. Now suddenly, a selfless AI develops a God Complex seemingly overnight? Out of hubris and jealousy? I'm not buying it. I am so eager to see what happens in Halo Infinite. I really want to see redemption for Cortana, or see her master stroke from a plan she hatched long ago to save humanity without enslaving them.
iviUi2D3i2 wrote:
Something I'm disappointed in as well is the transformation of Cortana's role in the Haloverse. I'm hoping perhaps 343 is playing the long game and will turn it back on it's head for the finale. My disappointment lies in the "person" that Cortana has become. She's like a psycho, narcissistic, jealous ex-girlfriend toward chief.

When I read the first 3 Halo novels, it became apparent to me (at the time) that it wasn't Master Chief who was the true hero; it was in fact Cortana. She was knowingly sacrificing herself upon a short road to Rampancy via the multiple instances of replication and her valiant infiltration of The Covenant, The Halos (and Forerunners), as well as The Flood while probing Gravemind. Without her presence while working through John throughout both the games and the novels, humanity would've lost on all fronts. Now suddenly, a selfless AI develops a God Complex seemingly overnight? Out of hubris and jealousy? I'm not buying it. I am so eager to see what happens in Halo Infinite. I really want to see redemption for Cortana, or see her master stroke from a plan she hatched long ago to save humanity without enslaving them.
It was pretty much confirmed in a comic that H5's Cortana is just the rampant fragments the original one freed from herself in Halo 4, AKA the worst aspects of her
So there's a lot of issues i have with halo 5 overall, but in reality i don't have as much hate for it as a lot of people did, i played through it a couple of times and i (for the most part) had fun with what it was.

My ONLY issue, and it's probably already been discussed, is that why on earth would you guys at 343 (unless you wanna try to explain it in infinite) even think it was possible to change the lore so that it was never meant to be humans as the reclaimers but instead their AI?

Not ONCE in the first 3 games did either penitent tangent nor guilty spark refer to any AI in the story as a "reclaimer", and in halo 3 specifically, guilty spark directly addresses master chief (3 times in one scene) as the "reclaimer" and addressed cortana's recording as "your construct".

https://gyazo.com/3ccd14eeac217d33c82b6bb22d9072fc (reference to spark's terminology towards chief.)

Legitimately, aside from the rampancy or the logic plague (which in all friggin honesty cortana wouldn't have after her rebirth since she's technically no longer an AI) there's no reason for her heel turn at the end of halo 5 other than 343 simply just doesn't know anything about character development or who these characters have been built up to be over years of lore building in both the games and the books, and since now 343 wants to combine the books and the games lore wise they've no excuse for cortana's behavior nor the (LITERALLY IMPOSSIBLE) retcon of who the reclaimers are meant to be.

I know this post is pointless ranting and i apologize if this was a repeat post, but i was playing through halo 3 again and after the pointless changes done in halo 5 it's pretty frustrating.

If you wanted to change it and give the AI the power, all you literally had to do was have Warden Eternal, or another monitor use their protocol to strip humanity of their place among the forerunners and hand it over to the AI since the AI can be more trusted to do what is write for the universe over humanity. Aside from cortana the AI are all level headed logic driven programs who would of course if given the choice to safeguard all of the universe together would most likely choose to join the warden eternal, and instead of making cortana alive again and just be evil because you couldn't think of an antagonist, why not have had it so that the warden eternal brought her back and gave her a choice, allow life in the galaxy to continue to war until one side is wiped from existence, or give her the power to protect those she cares about and keep permanent peace among the beings in the universe.

She clearly has emotions beyond her programming due to her rampancy and rebirth (also possible logic plague) so she could easily be seen taking up that mantle from the one who gave her life again to protect the ones she cares about. So instead of her just making the choice to be dictator of the universe she's making a choice that she thinks is write to protect the ones she cares for. And i know that's ultimately her goal but without build up and without good reason her change of personality feels forced and is probably the second worse thing about the games story.

so instead of the end of the game feeling like "-Yoink- cortana betrayed humanity because she thinks she knows whats best." leading to humanity feeling like cortana is now the enemy (because she is) people would have seen her as someone to save, to bring back to the light and the end of halo 5 would have felt like it led into a redemption (rescue) story instead of a forced heel turn antagonist because they couldn't think of where to go next in the story.

Forget the poor marketing, forget the lazy exposition heavy (mindless) dialogue. The biggest issue with halo 5 is the inconsistency with the established universe as well as the (crazy) forced retcons to established lore.

I'm 24 years old. Halo 1 came out when i was seven years old and i knew no other universe as well as i did halo, it had one of the most consistent and believable sci-fi universes i'd come across in my life, but honestly if you're just going to toss that stuff to the wind in favor of just wheeling the story wherever you want it to go and forcing things that really wouldn't ever happen, you're massively disappointing the biggest fans of your franchise.
Lore is in no way being retconned in Halo 5, Cortana is just interpreting the mantle in her own way just like the forerunners did.
The Forerunners stole the Mantle of Responsibility from the Precursors when they were going to give it to Humanity. It wouldn't be a big stretch for Cortana to steal the Mantle from humanity as well. The Mantle is an ever-evolving concept. I don't see it as an officially designated title that can't be taken away.
As has been stated by a couple others, Cortana and the AIs are just giving their interpretation of Reclaimers and Upholders of the Mantle. It isn't a retcon.

As far as Cortana's personality and seemingly "forced" character development, we now know its because this existing Cortana isn't the true Cortana but came from a corrupted fragment. 343 really should've given some indication of that in-game or should in Infinite. It's such a significant piece of lore and it was only shown in a comic. For the casual Halo fan who doesn't read all the comics/books/Halopedia they will just think Cortana changed personalities into a clingy megalomaniac.

OP, I'm also not sure you understand the concepts of Smart AI, AI in general, or the Logic Plague based on these statements:

Quote:
Legitimately, aside from the rampancy or the logic plague (which in all friggin honesty cortana wouldn't have after her rebirth since she's technically no longer an AI)
While Cortana integrated with the Domain, she in no way ceased being an AI. She is very much still an AI. While they also did mention in Halo 5 that her integration with the Domain "cured" her rampancy, there is no indication that it would have cured her of the Logic Plague. There is no evidence for that idea. Even if she was no longer an AI she could still have the Logic Plague as we know it can even be given to living creatures as it was given to the Ur-Didact and Catalog (though I believe the variant given to Catalog was the AI variant), but she is still an AI so it doesn't matter.
Quote:
Aside from cortana the AI are all level headed logic driven programs who would of course if given the choice to safeguard all of the universe together would most likely choose to join the warden eternal
This is false. While this could, possibly, be true of Dumb AI, it wouldn't be true of Smart AI. Smart AI can feel emotions, and can think for themselves. Cortana is not the only Smart AI, there are a lot of them. While they are "logic driven programs" that is more due to their nature as AI, not necessarily how they actually think, as Roland (and possibly others) did not join the Created.