Skip to main content

Forums / Community / Halo Universe

The Didact's Speech- Catalog Confirms 100%

OP ran and shai

  1. 1
  2. ...
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. ...
  6. 11
So, I ain't usually the kind of person to say this but hell-it's just too much fun. Told you so!

Here's the quote from Catalog:

Query: Is there any information on the potential identity of those whom the UR-Didact was addressing "after" the events of the Requiem event?

Query Answer: Selected quote is part of [evidential] proceedings recorded in local [cache] prior to loss of Domain contact.

So the matter is settled- the Didact's testimony/speech in the Halo 4 Epilogue was taken from before the activation of the Halos.

EDIT: Catalog decided to heed our calls in page 8 and said this:

"Statement was not in error. However, Catalog does note difficulty in interpreting Shadow-of-Sundered-Star's commentary. Currently under review due to multiple sources of authority."

ALL HAIL CATALOG
I don't believe you Catalog. First the Palmer thing and now this. We're going to need to have a real talk with Catalog.
Quote:
I don't believe you Catalog. First the Palmer thing and now this. We're going to need to have a real talk with Catalog.
The Palmer thing is the only one so far that Catalog screwed up with, and to be fair he tried to settle two conflicting pieces of data (so it'd be hard to not screw up without calling one source or the other non-cannon). That is not the case here.

If you guys are up for it we can go over the speech piece by piece and try to understand what it's about with the now added context.
In this hour of victory, we taste only defeat. I ask why.
We are forerunners, gaurdians of all that exists. The roots of the galaxy have grown deep under our careful tending, were there is life the wisdom of our countless generations has saturated the soil, our strength is a luminous sun towards which all intelligence blossoms, and the improvious shelter, beneath which it has prospered.


this part is just a generic eulogy of the forerunners.

I stand before you, accused of the sin of ensuring forerunner ascendency, of attempting to save us from this fate where we are forced to... recede.

the "you" is translated in foreign languages as a singular form, so he is talking to one person or the translation is wrong.

Humanity stands as the greatest threat in the galaxy. Refusing to eradicate them is a fool's gambit. We squander eons in the darkness, while they seize our triumphs for their own. The Mantle of Responsibility, for all things, belongs to Forerunners alone!

Think of my acts as you will, but do not doubt the reality: the reclamation has already begun, and we are hopeless to stop it.

After halo 4 events yes, the reclamation had already begun, but before the loss of the domain? humans were indexed and just a tribal underdeveloped species.
Before we begin, I think we should consider one obvious fact: regardless of when this speech/testimony actually took place, 343i placed it at the end of Halo 4 because it made sense in that context- so even people that aren't aware of Forerunner history and that only played Halo 4 could understand its relevance. That said, nothing ever implied that the canonical timeframe of this speech has any significance, it's just the speech itself that is important. So I think it was basically a plot device written because it fit at the end of Halo 4- not because the Didact was taken captive by other Forerunners, not because this was a speech he said a hundred thousand years ago, but because its content is relevant to the end of Halo 4. With that said, let's move on.

Quote:
In this hour of victory, we taste only defeat. I ask why.
We are forerunners, gaurdians of all that exists. The roots of the galaxy have grown deep under our careful tending, were there is life the wisdom of our countless generations has saturated the soil, our strength is a luminous sun towards which all intelligence blossoms, and the improvious shelter, beneath which it has prospered.


this part is just a generic eulogy of the forerunners.
Agreed

Quote:
I stand before you, accused of the sin of ensuring forerunner ascendency, of attempting to save us from this fate where we are forced to... recede.

the "you" is translated in foreign languages as a singular form, so he is talking to one person or the translation is wrong.
"You" could also refer to a group of people. Also, I think this line can be used as evidence that the speech was said in the past- the Didact is trying to save the Forerunners from a fate where they are forced to recede, ergo that fate hasn't happened yet and is still salvageable. Also, the Didact wasn't aware that other Forerunners survived so he can't use that as an excuse for his actions throughout Halo 4.

Quote:
Humanity stands as the greatest threat in the galaxy. Refusing to eradicate them is a fool's gambit. We squander eons in the darkness, while they seize our triumphs for their own. The Mantle of Responsibility, for all things, belongs to Forerunners alone!

Think of my acts as you will, but do not doubt the reality: the reclamation has already begun, and we are hopeless to stop it.

After halo 4 events yes, the reclamation had already begun, but before the loss of the domain? humans were indexed and just a tribal underdeveloped species.
I think the line is more of a rhetoric question:
"We squander eons in the darkness, while they seize our triumphs for their own?! No we shouldn't, we're the Forerunners! Yadda yadda"

As for the reclamation beginning... Well, the Didact at that point is completely mad. Maybe he's getting flashbacks to the Human-Forerunner war and the death of his children (remember, the humans held off for quite a while before losing), where one could say the reclamation "begun". Also, the Forerunners planning to give everything for humanity and calling them reclaimers is something.
My analysis, reposted from another forum I frequent:

I was committed to it being in modern times because of references to things that have basically happened, but it could have certainly been in the past, simply because the forerunners planned for these things to happen. They had received an ultimatum from the primordial, and while they certainly wanted to fight off the flood, they planned for and probably expected the worse. With the denial of his shield world plan and soon to come exile, perhaps Didact predicted that them firing the halo rings was inevitable. With that came the reseeding of humanity and leaving behind our stuff for them to reclaim. It was all part of the plan the forerunners agreed upon after all (why else would the rest of them be so happy to fund the ark, etc, and make it so only humans and forerunner could use them, unless humans were the intended reclaimers from the moment these things were built?). Didacts complete opposition to this idea (as displayed through his speech) could have contributed to his first exile.

So it probably happened after the human-forerunner war, shortly before his first exile, after his plans to use the shield worlds was shot down, and the master builders/librarians plans were chosen. At this point, Didact has virtually eradicated humanity following their war; all are obliterated, but the last remnants are under the Librarians care.

"In this hour of victory, we taste only defeat" - There really was no victory for the forerunners at the end of halo 4. At the end of the human-forerunner war, there certainly was. The defeat part would be a reference of course to the fact that they had to virtually eradicate a species...for reasons that were shown to be wrong. Didact himself feels he did them a service, whereas the Librarian and the others just feel it was completely unfortunate - a defeat. They decided to obliterate a species, completely missing the real threat and losing "the cure" in the process.

"accused of the sin of ensuring forerunner ascendancy" - basically, after what humanity did, Didact is more or less committed to the idea of beating down other races so they may never threaten forerunners again.

"we squander eons in the darkness" - This hasn't happened yet, but with the librarians plans soon to be enacted, it would seem like the forerunners are pretty much planning on it. Didact seems to be the only one who thinks they can still defeat the flood at this point, using the shield worlds. Basically, he's speculating.

"Think of my acts as you will" - His acts being his vehement, almost violent disapproval of the Halo rings/reseeding humanity. Likely contributed to his first exile. Though he obviously hadn't acted upon his feelings yet, this shows that he ALWAYS desired to violently defend the forerunners using his shield worlds. The forerunners saw this anger and had him sentenced to a thousand years of meditation. It would appear that in Halo: Cryptum, the meditation did help a fair bit, but the gravemind just reawoke those feelings ten fold. This makes the librarians decision to lock him up again rather than eliminate him more sensible; it worked once, let's try it again. His character has always been consistently anti-human, and it's only the time in the cryptum that tempered his rage.

And we all know how that turned out.
Quote:
Quote:
I stand before you, accused of the sin of ensuring forerunner ascendency, of attempting to save us from this fate where we are forced to... recede.

the "you" is translated in foreign languages as a singular form, so he is talking to one person or the translation is wrong.
"You" could also refer to a group of people. Also, I think this line can be used as evidence that the speech was said in the past- the Didact is trying to save the Forerunners from a fate where they are forced to recede, ergo that fate hasn't happened yet and is still salvageable. Also, the Didact wasn't aware that other Forerunners survived so he can't use that as an excuse for his actions throughout Halo 4.
I think he meant that in the non English versions of the game, the singular version of "you" is used, since the English version could be either in this context.
Quote:
I don't believe you Catalog. First the Palmer thing and now this. We're going to need to have a real talk with Catalog.
Palmer thing?
Quote:
the "you" is translated in foreign languages as a singular form, so he is talking to one person or the translation is wrong.
Then the translation is inconsistent. In the Chinese version he says 我站在你们面前. 你们 is plural while 你 is singular.
Quote:
Quote:
I don't believe you Catalog. First the Palmer thing and now this. We're going to need to have a real talk with Catalog.
Palmer thing?
He's talking about her rank. The Catalog stated she was an E-4 (Corporal) and considered for a accelerated track to E-5(Sergeant) when she was being transfered to the Spartan Program; which this follow Halo: Initiation. Though the Halo 4: Essential Visual guide stated that she was a Lieutenant in Halo 4. Though Spartan's don't have any ranking only titles.
Quote:
Quote:
the "you" is translated in foreign languages as a singular form, so he is talking to one person or the translation is wrong.
Then the translation is inconsistent. In the Chinese version he says 我站在你们面前. 你们 is plural while 你 is singular.
Ah. Brings me back to when I struggled with trying to comprehend that the Chinese essentially used "You" and "Yous".
So ive just gotta say this, youre welcome for the question, and thanks catalog for answering it. I didnt think he would when I posted it haha

But yeah, idk if im happy or not knowing it was before all this. Atleast we know now.
Well this, I'm afraid, is EXTREMELY disappointing. And worse, the Halo 4 speech only makes sense POST-HALO 4.

Seriously?
I still don't believe that. The speech only makes sense post-Halo 4.

After the Human-Forerunner War, the Forerunners won. They weren't "tasting defeat". After the Forerunner-Flood War, all the Forerunner were tasting was defeat, no one in their right mind thought they were going to win.
Halo 4? The Didact had a major chance of victory. He had the Composer, smashed through Earth defenses, and even had John in his grasp hovering off the bridge. What he didn't take into account was Cortana coming up from within the bridge. That fits perfectly wth the Didact's opening line.

Then the Didact starts talking as if he was on trial, trying to convince those around him that what he did was right. He wouldn't be on trial for the war with Humanity. There was no time for a trial in the war with the Flood.
The Forerunners weren't squandering eons in darkness any time before Halo 4. And he had no idea what survivors planned to do after the Array, so it can't quite be rhetorical.
Humanity was a primitive tribal species at the time of the war with the Flood, so he wouldn't quite be justified in saying they are a threat to the galaxy.
Humans certainly weren't taking Forerunner triumphs for their own until Infinity slapped a Forerunner engine onto it.
And there was no way the Didact would know the Librarian's plan for Humanity, so it doesn't make sense for him to say the reclamation has begun.

I don't like it.
I appreciate the response, but I'm going to ask for clarification on when exactly before Domain contact was lost this happened.
Knew it :D Now it cant be used as proof that the Ur-Didact is still alive, however Im sure he is somewhere out there, plotting revenge
I'm with JSA on this.

I'm literally having a hard time comprehending how the speech fits into before the Halos were fired.

This is seriously bothering me.
Makes more sense post Halo 4. He's alive, sure other Forerunners are, and the slipspace portal prob took him there.
Quote:
I still don't believe that. The speech only makes sense post-Halo 4.

After the Human-Forerunner War, the Forerunners won. They weren't "tasting defeat". After the Forerunner-Flood War, all the Forerunner were tasting was defeat, no one in their right mind thought they were going to win.
Halo 4? The Didact had a major chance of victory. He had the Composer, smashed through Earth defenses, and even had John in his grasp hovering off the bridge. What he didn't take into account was Cortana coming up from within the bridge. That fits perfectly wth the Didact's opening line.

Then the Didact starts talking as if he was on trial, trying to convince those around him that what he did was right. He wouldn't be on trial for the war with Humanity. There was no time for a trial in the war with the Flood.
The Forerunners weren't squandering eons in darkness any time before Halo 4. And he had no idea what survivors planned to do after the Array, so it can't quite be rhetorical.
Humanity was a primitive tribal species at the time of the war with the Flood, so he wouldn't quite be justified in saying they are a threat to the galaxy.
Humans certainly weren't taking Forerunner triumphs for their own until Infinity slapped a Forerunner engine onto it.
And there was no way the Didact would know the Librarian's plan for Humanity, so it doesn't make sense for him to say the reclamation has begun.

I don't like it.
I appreciate the response, but I'm going to ask for clarification on when exactly before Domain contact was lost this happened.
Actually his speech makes no sense after Halo 4. "In this hour of victory we taste only defeat". There was no victory. His ship and composer were both destroyed in he was thrown into a portal. In halo 4 the Librarian tells Chief He would have encrypted your entire race had WE not removed the composer from his care So obviously the Foreunners had decided as a whole to take the composer from him. This speech is likely him talking to some council or jury during that time after he had encrypted those humans on the Halo ring. The hour of victory was probably him referencing his sense of impending victory against the Flood with his new promethean army. But the other Forerunners disagreed and refused to let him use them, so it tasted only of defeat. He was describing the humans as they were, and what he knew they would become again. The reclamation has ALREADY begun. . . He is saying even though the humans are de-evolved that they will evolve to be what they once were since the Librarian told the Didact herself that "their gene plan could have surpassed our own".
Quote:
Quote:
I still don't believe that. The speech only makes sense post-Halo 4.

After the Human-Forerunner War, the Forerunners won. They weren't "tasting defeat". After the Forerunner-Flood War, all the Forerunner were tasting was defeat, no one in their right mind thought they were going to win.
Halo 4? The Didact had a major chance of victory. He had the Composer, smashed through Earth defenses, and even had John in his grasp hovering off the bridge. What he didn't take into account was Cortana coming up from within the bridge. That fits perfectly wth the Didact's opening line.

Then the Didact starts talking as if he was on trial, trying to convince those around him that what he did was right. He wouldn't be on trial for the war with Humanity. There was no time for a trial in the war with the Flood.
The Forerunners weren't squandering eons in darkness any time before Halo 4. And he had no idea what survivors planned to do after the Array, so it can't quite be rhetorical.
Humanity was a primitive tribal species at the time of the war with the Flood, so he wouldn't quite be justified in saying they are a threat to the galaxy.
Humans certainly weren't taking Forerunner triumphs for their own until Infinity slapped a Forerunner engine onto it.
And there was no way the Didact would know the Librarian's plan for Humanity, so it doesn't make sense for him to say the reclamation has begun.

I don't like it.
I appreciate the response, but I'm going to ask for clarification on when exactly before Domain contact was lost this happened.
Actually his speech makes no sense after Halo 4. "In this hour of victory we taste only defeat". There was no victory. His ship and composer were both destroyed in he was thrown into a portal. In halo 4 the Librarian tells Chief He would have encrypted your entire race had WE not removed the composer from his care So obviously the Foreunners had decided as a whole to take the composer from him. This speech is likely him talking to some council or jury during that time after he had encrypted those humans on the Halo ring. The hour of victory was probably him referencing his sense of impending victory against the Flood with his new promethean army. But the other Forerunners disagreed and refused to let him use them, so it tasted only of defeat. He was describing the humans as they were, and what he knew they would become again. The reclamation has ALREADY begun. . . He is saying even though the humans are de-evolved that they will evolve to be what they once were since the Librarian told the Didact herself that "their gene plan could have surpassed our own".
He didn't say he won, in fact he said he was defeated.

"In this hour of victory, we taste only defeat. I ask why."
That means that this was an hour of victory, victory was supposed to happen. He thought he would win, but instead he tastes only defeat. And he is confused.

There was no trial. He composed the humans on Omega Halo and then immediately fled to Requiem, as Star Roads were converging on the Greater Ark. The Librarian was the only one able to follow him, and when she found him, she shot him. There was no trial.

Reclamation means that they are taking over everything, holding the Mantle and finding all of the Forerunners' achievements. The Didact had no idea the Librarian set those seeds for Humanity that would propel them towards the Mantle and Forerunner technology. To him, even if the Halos were fired, he expected the Forerunners to return and take over. It makes no sense for him to believe Humanity was in the process of reclamation.
  1. 1
  2. ...
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. ...
  6. 11