Forums / Community / Halo Universe

Why do people hate Master Chief Having a Mech Suit

OP Snockooz

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Snockooz wrote:
Not true, I actually Like YapYap a lot...
Okay... Well, I said "except for the parts you like to consider canonical. It's important to read the whole sentence.

That's all I'm going to say on this Snock. We've been going around and around for months, and frankly I'm bored of it.
juhoxxx wrote:
Seems redundant. You can use mechs and whatever in Mjølnir. One of the important skillsof spartans is that they can move really fast and quietly. Something we don't get to see a lot in the games. He's "mech suit" now allows it. There's no reason to make it any bigger but of course there will be improvements to his suit.
Completely agree there isnt any need to make it any bigger just getting a bit ridiculous but obviously like you said there are going to be improvements and modifications to his armour but hopefully not size
If sergeant Johnson got a mantis esque 'bot and a prototype mjolnir then chief can have one too! The idea is awesome and personally, I would love to see the mjolnir MK I through III in gameplay and maybe even a variant based on the prototype from halo legends' "the prototype" (one of my fave stories from legends)! I mean seriously, have we ever seen the MK I, II, or III mjolnirs in gameplay? Mantises are just walking tanks (literally) and Cyclopes are similar but smaller, but both rely on controls within a cockpit. Chief's mech that we're talking about moves with him (don't ask, I don't wanna go into too much detail). And besides, who wouldn't want a game mode based around these suits? Maybe even a grifball variant involving them! I do also agree with treating the prototype suit as a vehicle, having chief wear one throughout a whole campaign would just get boring. Unless you were playing as sergeant Johnson giving out one liners as you smashed through covvie lines in a prototype.
xeosax wrote:
If sergeant Johnson got a mantis esque 'bot and a prototype mjolnir then chief can have one too!
1. John-117 has MJOLNIR, Johnson doesn't and can't.
2. John-117 did and can pilot Mantises.
xeosax wrote:
If sergeant Johnson got a mantis esque 'bot and a prototype mjolnir then chief can have one too!
1. John-117 has MJOLNIR, Johnson doesn't and can't.
2. John-117 did and can pilot Mantises.
Actually, Johnson CAN pilot a Mjolnir prototype seeing as the prototypes didn't require augmentations in order to function. The Mjolnir that we're used to (MK IV, V, and VI) connected to the wearer's neural lace and moved with their thoughts, but the response was so fast that during testing when an un-augmented marine was ordered to salute, his arm shot forward with sickly cracks as his bones were pulverized, and the marine was killed by his own pain induced spasms. The MK I to III mjolnirs however, were essentially similar to fallout power armour and DIDN'T require a link to the user's neural lace. In halo legends "the prototype" ghost, a regular, un-augmented, marine is seen piloting the prototype to protect his men. So long story short, you don't need to be a augmented Spartan to pilot a prototype. All you need is sheer badassery and occasional one liners like sgt Johnson. And besides, in the novel "the fall of reach" multiple of the old mjolnirs were used by the Spartan's handlers/trainers for their safety (not the Spartans), and the unarmoured Spartans managed to take them down with nothing but punches, kicks, and sheer strength. So yeah, Spartans don't need armour to beat the living crap out of a prototype.
As for number 2, the 'bot I was focusing on was the prototype, but the other I mentioned, the mantis esque mech Johnson used in HW2 wasn't a mantis, idk what it is.
xeosax wrote:
Actually, Johnson CAN pilot a Mjolnir prototype seeing as the prototypes didn't require augmentations in order to function.
I think you know very well what I meant.

The Prototype that we see in that godawful anime set is the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark I Prototype Armor Defense System. It is the exact same suit that we see Johnson using (noncanonically) in Halo Wars 2 multiplayer. The HRUNTING Mk III Cyclops is derived from the MJOLNIR Mk III suits, however it is different than the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL program, which culminated in Mk IX Mantis.

The Colossus (HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark II [J] Armor Defense System) is a continuation of the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark II [D] Armor Defense System "Mega Mantis" seen on the Halo 4 map Adrift. This would be built off the Mark I (what Johnson and Ghost piloted), eventually optimized into the Mk IX Mantis.

As the "prototype" - the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark I Prototype Armor Defense System - culminated in the H/Y Mk IX Mantis (which John-117 has piloted), having him pilot some "super MJOLNIR" looking Gundam mecha is redundant, unnecessary, and pointless Anime fanservice.
xeosax wrote:
Actually, Johnson CAN pilot a Mjolnir prototype seeing as the prototypes didn't require augmentations in order to function.
I think you know very well what I meant.

The Prototype that we see in that godawful anime set is the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark I Prototype Armor Defense System. It is the exact same suit that we see Johnson using (noncanonically) in Halo Wars 2 multiplayer. The HRUNTING Mk III Cyclops is derived from the MJOLNIR Mk III suits, however it is different than the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL program, which culminated in Mk IX Mantis.

The Colossus (HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark II [J] Armor Defense System) is a continuation of the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark II [D] Armor Defense System "Mega Mantis" seen on the Halo 4 map Adrift. This would be built off the Mark I (what Johnson and Ghost piloted), eventually optimized into the Mk IX Mantis.

As the "prototype" - the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark I Prototype Armor Defense System - culminated in the H/Y Mk IX Mantis (which John-117 has piloted), having him pilot some "super MJOLNIR" looking Gundam mecha is redundant, unnecessary, and pointless Anime fanservice.
Its funny how the person who clearly hates Gundam is literally the only person who beings it up... Another funny thing i was looking up Gundam and they seem to have more common with Gen 2 MJONLIR than the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark I. They don't really use any mounted weapons, they use hand held weapons. They use energy swords, granted they look more like lightsabers than halo energy swords. They aren't all the bulky relative to their size, excluding weird Robot angel wings. They can move around using numerous mounted thrusters both in space and in atmosphere. The only real difference is the overall size and that their piloted like Fighter jets.
Snockooz wrote:
Another funny thing i was looking up Gundam and they seem to have more common with Gen 2 MJONLIR than the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark I.
Sure, except for being 18 meters (60 ft) tall. Which you even mention. And that the Mark I used thrusters, was overly agile for it's size, etc... Yeah, no they're totally like the MJOLNIR [GEN2] armor. /sarcasm
Snockooz wrote:
Another funny thing i was looking up Gundam and they seem to have more common with Gen 2 MJONLIR than the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark I.
Sure, except for being 18 meters (60 ft) tall. Which you even mention. And that the Mark I used thrusters, was overly agile for it's size, etc... Yeah, no they're totally like the MJOLNIR [GEN2] armor. /sarcasm
Overly agile for its size? And Spartans Aren't?
Well lets see. who more similar
  • Gundam ------------------------------------------------------------------Prototype Suit---------------------------MJONLIR
  1. 60ft tall------------------------------------------------------------------------ No------------------------------------------ NO
  2. Is Faster than is should be for its size-----------------------------Yes-----------------------------------------Yes
  3. Unrealistically durable----------------------------------------------------Yes-----------------------------------------Yes
  4. Uses Hand Held weapons ---------------------------------------------NO----------------------------------------- YES
  5. Uses Energy Swords ----------------------------------------------------NO----------------------------------------- YES
  6. Uses Overly Large Melee weapons--------------------------------- No------------------------------------------ Yes
  7. Uses Overly Large weapons in general----------------------------Yes------------------------------------------ Yes
  8. Can Seemingly Fly with Thrusters-----------------------------------YES--------------------------------------- YES
  9. Is Piloted Like a Fighter JET------------------------------------------- NO------------------------------------------ NO
  10. HAS fought in Space using thrusters-------------------------------NO------------------------------------------ Yes
  11. Has Been shown doing absurd acts of destruction ----------YES -----------------------------------------Yes
  12. Have been use by overly edgy characters -----------------------YES -----------------------------------------YES
SO tell me how exactly is HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark 1 more like a Gundam than MJONLIR?
Snockooz wrote:
SO tell me how exactly is HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark 1 more like a Gundam than MJONLIR?
  1. The Mk I has an unclear height. However height is not the issue here; the Mk 1 (per the Anime) is piloted, MJOLNIR [GEN2] is not.
  2. The Mk I is definitely more agile than it's size would safely allow. MJOLNIR [GEN2] - considering for Spartan Augmentations - is not.
  3. These are both no. The Mk I was easily dismembered, and MJOLNIR armor is also canonically vulnerable to heavy plasma punishment. Most deflection of damage is granted from shields.
  4. The Mk I prototype has a functional hand, thus it can use handheld weapons like chainguns and the sort. Furthermore, we see it using a magnetic claymore. So... Yes, it uses handheld weapons, and is noted as including the hand for the purpose of using additional weapons and manipulating things.
  5. Ties in above, the Mk I Prototype can use energy swords.
  6. Ties in above.
  7. Yes across the board
  8. Yes, Yes, No. MJOLNIR [GEN2] cannot fly with the in-suit thrusters, not even with the S-12 SOLA Jetpack. A Spartan can achieve augmented vertical jump and/or lift with the S-12 SOLA, but this is not flight.
  9. Yes, the Mark I Prototpe (per the anime) is piloted like a larger mech. We've been over this a very long time ago; the measurements of the Prototype suit do not allow for biological conformity, and a marine would need to be seated in the chest-cavity of the suit to fit. This screenshot supports this, as well as a larger-than-human size, as the Prototype is towering over this Sangheili before Ghost kicks him in half.
  10. The MJOLNIR [GEN2] cannot operate long in space, and has never undergone combat in space using thrusters.
  11. MJOLNIR [GEN2] has not been shown doing absurd acts of destruction.
  12. This seems to have no point, really, and is far more opinion than any of the others. Omitting.
So we have, revised:
  1. YES | NO | NO
  2. YES | YES | NO
  3. YES | NO | NO
  4. YES | YES | YES
  5. YES | YES | YES
  6. YES | YES | YES
  7. YES | YES | YES
  8. YES | YES | NO
  9. YES | YES | NO
  10. YES | NO | NO
  11. YES | YES |NO
The Prototype: 8 Yes, 3 No
MJOLNIR [GEN2]: 4 Yes, 7 No.

The Prototype is much more like a gundam than MJOLNIR armor. But this is all really beside the point, as you're wanting a suit to go on top of the MJOLNIR suit. Which would need to be larger, especially to keep up with and match the MJOLNIR's augmentation of a Spartan's strength and speed, and would be - as stated so many times I forgot about this until you dug it back up - horribly redundant.
Snockooz wrote:
SO tell me how exactly is HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark 1 more like a Gundam than MJONLIR?
  1. The Mk I has an unclear height. However height is not the issue here; the Mk 1 (per the Anime) is piloted, MJOLNIR [GEN2] is not.
  2. The Mk I is definitely more agile than it's size would safely allow. MJOLNIR [GEN2] - considering for Spartan Augmentations - is not.
  3. These are both no. The Mk I was easily dismembered, and MJOLNIR armor is also canonically vulnerable to heavy plasma punishment. Most deflection of damage is granted from shields.
  4. The Mk I prototype has a functional hand, thus it can use handheld weapons like chainguns and the sort. Furthermore, we see it using a magnetic claymore. So... Yes, it uses handheld weapons, and is noted as including the hand for the purpose of using additional weapons and manipulating things.
  5. Ties in above, the Mk I Prototype can use energy swords.
  6. Ties in above.
  7. Yes across the board
  8. Yes, Yes, No. MJOLNIR [GEN2] cannot fly with the in-suit thrusters, not even with the S-12 SOLA Jetpack. A Spartan can achieve augmented vertical jump and/or lift with the S-12 SOLA, but this is not flight.
  9. Yes, the Mark I Prototpe (per the anime) is piloted like a larger mech. We've been over this a very long time ago; the measurements of the Prototype suit do not allow for biological conformity, and a marine would need to be seated in the chest-cavity of the suit to fit. This screenshot supports this, as well as a larger-than-human size, as the Prototype is towering over this Sangheili before Ghost kicks him in half.
  10. The MJOLNIR [GEN2] cannot operate long in space, and has never undergone combat in space using thrusters.
  11. MJOLNIR [GEN2] has not been shown doing absurd acts of destruction.
  12. This seems to have no point, really, and is far more opinion than any of the others. Omitting.
So we have, revised:
  1. YES | NO | NO
  2. YES | YES | NO
  3. YES | NO | NO
  4. YES | YES | YES
  5. YES | YES | YES
  6. YES | YES | YES
  7. YES | YES | YES
  8. YES | YES | NO
  9. YES | YES | NO
  10. YES | NO | NO
  11. YES | YES |NO
The Prototype: 8 Yes, 3 No
MJOLNIR [GEN2]: 4 Yes, 7 No.

The Prototype is much more like a gundam than MJOLNIR armor. But this is all really beside the point, as you're wanting a suit to go on top of the MJOLNIR suit. Which would need to be larger, especially to keep up with and match the MJOLNIR's augmentation of a Spartan's strength and speed, and would be - as stated so many times I forgot about this until you dug it back up - horribly redundant.
1. Nope. Its not Piloted as the Chest part is no where near large enough to hold a entire human body inside. You yourself also stated the HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark I [J] is likely the visual retcon of the suit(something I still disagree with) and that is most differently not piloted.
2. Based on what? What is the speed it was going? It doesn't matter that the Spartans are augmented, I'm sure Gundam also has reasons for why they can more at the speeds they do. Coming up with reasons why doesn't change the fact they are still moving a speeds that are impossible given their size. The Prototype suit would likely have its reasons as well.
3. Chief Survived a Plasma Torpedo in Mark 5 and the Prototype Suit is shown tanking Fuel rod shots...
4. Grenades are equipment I wasn't talking about them I was talking about Guns. So yes they can both use grenades. However it has never been shown using Hand held guns and until it does it doesn't couldn't.
5. It doesn't matter that it is possible it could use one it never has. MJONLIR could be equipped with mounted weapons, it could be equipped with Big Metal Shields, and it could be equipped with a flight pack allowing them to fly like banshees. But that has yet to happen an until it does it doesn't couldn't.
6.Same as above
7. Agreed
8. A spartan with a Jet Pack can Fly just as good as the Prototype Suit can. Even without the Jetpack the thrusters allow them to say in the air for a while. Unless you are saying it can fly continuously? You need proof of that as if it could there would be no reason for it to ever be on the ground. Also, I could be wrong, but I don't think Gundams can fly continuously either Just like the Prototype Suit and MJOLNIR they can only stay in the air for so long.
9. The Size isn't big enough for an entire Human Body to fit it the Chest. HRUNTING/YGGDRASIL Mark I [J] is most defiantly not piloted. Awe. I see you are using the point where the elite is further away from the Suit to make it look bigger instead of the point where they are literally touching. Oh yes but that one cant be use as evidence in your opinion as it goes against your narrative. Also notice the size of the Jet pack. It takes up well over half the chest size. Yeah an entire human body and a cockpit isn't going to fit in that. Also Where is that Blood coming from? Does the Suit Bleed? If the Human is all in the Torso than the suit most be what's bleeding.
10. I'm sure gundams have a set amount of time as well. Yes they have..
11. Are you Sure about that? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtxS2DIYMDQ--https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44oJi5w2Wjc.
12. Fair enough
SO lets see
  1. YES | NO | NO
  2. YES | YES | Yes
  3. YES | YES| YES
  4. YES | NO | YES
  5. YES | NO | YES
  6. YES | NO | YES
  7. YES | YES | YES
  8. YES | YES | YES
  9. YES | NO | NO
  10. YES | NO | YES
  11. YES | YES | YES
Prototype 5 Yes, 6 No
MJONLIR 9 yes, 2 no

"As stated so many times I forgot about this until you dug it back up - horribly redundant." I believe you are the one that Decided to reply to this thread again Though I only notice recently as i was taking a break from this forum. Also it being "horribly redundant" Is your opinion and is by no means fact just as me thinking this suit should be in Infinite is my opinion.
Okay, well I'm going to end it again. I truly, fully, do not care and it's probably never going to happen because as said many times, we already have the Mantis. This is just going round and round, we've arrived full circle back to bickering about the Prototype's specifications based on a terrible anime so... Laters. Take it how you will.
I think it would be fun to use it for a mission or two, but I would rather they not keep it permanently. Just a mission or two.
It looks a lot like Master Chief's armor from Halo Legends (the episode where Blue Team rescues Halsey)
I think in theory putting the Chief in a mech suit wouldn’t make much sense in a way since he is supposed to be powerful enough to handle anyThing with just the normal spartan armor plus just give the mechs to the other Spartans as a reinforcement crew or team becomes master chief has handled bigger without a mech suit just with mark 2s armor and those armor variants aren’t very strong compared to the new models
I am confused...is Chief getting a mech suit or something? Where is this "people hate it" coming from?
Fun fact, the original Spartan design was based on the design of a mobile suit from the Gundam series, the GM Spartan.
I don't see why people are peeved about the idea of getting more vehicles, or the logic behind another mech vehicle making the Mantis "redundant".
Did the Falcon in Reach make the Hornet redundant? What about the Wasp in 5? Does the Assault Rifle make the SMG redundant? Does the Gravity Hammer make the Energy Sword redundant? No, because they all have differences that make them unique and fun to play with.The same would apply to any other kind of mech vehicle 343 decides to introduce.

Maybe have this hypothetical machine be based on the Mk I with across the board improvements to bring it in line with current technology. Give it a unique role as a mobile Anti-vehicle assault platform, arm it with a Gauss cannon or some type of single shot high velocity weapon (railgun, spartan laser, cannon, etc.), and give it jump jets so it can evade fire, or get a better firing position on larger vehicle targets like Scorpions and Wraiths. So essentially it becomes a single person Gausshog or Revenant, but with vertical mobility to set it apart from the other vehicles. Make the jump jets awkward to use, like press the button and it jumps a certain distance (Remember the Dark Troopers from Star Wars Battlefront?) letting you move around while in the air to climb over walls/cliffs and on top of buildings, before the thrusters have to cool down and refuel. The jets could also burn people underneath you as they're firing, giving it a close combat attack like the Mantis stomp.

Would be fun to use something like this in an urban, or rugged environment, using its jump jets to scale buildings/cliffs and its gun to destroy other vehicles or important machines. You could have different variants available, too, like trade its Gauss Cannon for a heavy machine gun, or mount MLRS rocket pods to its back.

There's really so much you can do with this kind of vehicle.

Quote:
The Mantis? The Mantis isn't 10 feet tall. Its 19 feet tall.
Yes, you are correct. However, the Prototype suit is about that height as well, it seems. In that shot, it towers over those two Marines, far above 9 feet.
Which is funky because shortly after that shot, it hunches underneath the height of the Wraith it plants a claymore on. I'm pretty sure its scale just varies within the animation because drawing robots is hard.
I'm not coming back to this ridiculous argument for a third time after this long.
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