Forums / Games / Halo: The Master Chief Collection (PC)

[Locked] Flight 3: Controller Aim Assist should not go live

OP saw141

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It is necessary even if it is a PC title. The problem here is that both the aim assist and the bullet magnetism is way stronger than it was on the OG Halo Reach. On the OG Halo reach even with the existent aim assist you cant track invisible players.

The way the aim assist can get into Halo Reach PC is if it is moderate, not like the actual one, that, as i said, is way stronger than the original. Go and play Halo reach on the xbox 360 and then play the PC version with a controller: the PC aim assist is innecessary strong, even for the controller standards
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a CriminaI wrote:
a CriminaI wrote:
I've been banned from the forums multiple times, I don't report people.

You act like all controller players are equal thanks to aim assist but the skill difference is massive.

I can use a mouse and yes I know of overwatch, I'm top 500 on PS4, Xbox, AND PC. Controller is harder to use than mouse. Pharah vs pharah rocket battles are a struggle with the controller even with aim assist. On Mouse it is as easy as aiming at a folder icon on your desktop.

I know you advocated for nerfing aim assist instead of removing it but mouse is arguably already better than the controller in its current state so really you just want mouse players to have an advantage since that is your preferred input method.

Why on earth would you assume the steam input method will match the halo input method. Let's keep it real, the majority of people playing multiplayer will be halo veterans, people that have been playing it on console for years. We aren't going to be seeing a resurgence of new players, certainly not ones that will stick around for a long while. Some halo veterans will make the switch to mouse despite having years of controller muscle memory but an extremely high amount will be sticking with controller.

And like I said earlier if what you said was true, the majority are using a mouse, then what is your problem? You are good then because only a minority of people will have aim assist on their side. If what I assume is true, that it is closer to 50/50, Then how stupid would it be to ruin the experience of 50% of the playerbase just to please your cognitive bias that you have where you assume all your deaths are to controller users?

Lastly, you have lost. 343 has come out on my side and decided not to touch the aim assist. Too bad for you.
  1. You've been banned multiple times? I wonder why, attitude like that...
  2. Why are you comparing Overwatch to Halo? This isn't Overwatch so you can't say that because controllers are harder to use on Overwatch that Halo must therefore be the same. That's a phantom argument. They're entirely different games.
  3. You say mouse is arguably better in its present state, emphasis on 'arguably', yet you're in the absolute minority. Read this forum, watch youtube videos or check reddit -- even pro players agree -- that controller in Halo Reach MCC on PC is way way stronger. Hmmm... who to believe, the majority, or just you, one defensive sounding dude?
  4. Half your argument seems to be 'You just want your preferred input method to be stronger!' or 'You have cognitive bias issues!'. Sorry but assuming things like that about people just to try and suit your argument, without any proof of truth? That's douchey. Maybe you should, like, accept that some people actually have an argument to make rather than trying to close the case lazily by pinning it on them being bad or biased and seeking an advantage? "Git Gud" is not a suitable counter-argument to valid points, nor is assuming their motives based on what you think they must be, as opposed to what they actually are.
  5. It's also a complete stretch to assume the majority of players will be playing with a controller post-launch. I would expect more than half to be Halo veterans, yes, but the majority of which I'd expect to be people who last touched a console shooter years ago and have since switched to PC. Regardless of what happens (as neither of us possess a crystal ball so this is all moot) you need to remember this is the PC version we're talking about, therefore PC input methods need to feel viable, and with controllers currently overpowered, the native input method to Reach PC's own platform will feel like second class citizens (and this is assuming NO KB+M input lag or sluggishness)
  6. "If what you said was true, the majority are using a mouse, then what is your problem? You are good then because only a minority of people will have aim assist on their side." -- GREAT logic there mate. An aim hack is OK if only a handful of people are using it! GREAT logic... Hahaha.
  7. "Then how stupid would it be to ruin the experience of 50% of the playerbase just to please your cognitive bias that you have where you assume all your deaths are to controller users?" -- as I mentioned before, Ad hominem attacks are NOT cool and I'm beginning to understand why you get banned so much. You CANNOT try to invalidate the other person's argument in its entirety by passing them off as crybabies seeking an advantage, especially when you aren't them and you could have missed the mark by a million miles. To also assume that bringing controllers down to a balanced level would actually ruin the experience is highly presumptuous. On one hand you accuse him of cognitive bias for calling controllers overpowered, then on the other hand you claim nerfing controllers to fair and balanced levels would ruin the gameplay for controller users? Isn't that a case of you demonstrating the same cognitive bias you just condemned? Or is the term cognitive dissonance? I don't know. Irrelevant. The case is, you're being a hypocrite. It's the classic case of 'He's in the wrong for being upset that my controller input method is stronger, he's only complaining out of bias because he got pwned by controller players all day long.' Followed by 'If my controller input method isn't overpowered, and they dare to balance it to make it fair, it's going to ruin the game for me, so I'm going to complain!'
  8. "You have lost. 343 has come out on my side and decided not to touch the aim assist. Too bad for you." -- Oh here we go, your true colours at last. The snide "too bad for you" remark. Laughable and again with the douchey attacks. And sure, they've decided not to touch it (for now), but decisions can be changed. Minds can be changed. They didn't say they wouldn't ever reconsider. Hence why this thread is still going, despite the best efforts of people such as yourself. People who are in sheer denial that in Halo (not Overwatch, HALO) Reach on PC, controllers are currently overpowered. You can keep making excuses, or you can get over yourself and accept that you're in the minority here. I even see controller players come to this thread, Reddit, this forum and so on self-admitting that even THEY think controllers are way stronger RN.
1. It's not hard to get moderated on these forums.
2. He brought up overwatch.
3.They played a joke of a flight for a couple weeks. Give it time when the game actually comes out especially with the changes they have already done to the mouse since the flight.
4. I'm not assuming. I've read what he posted. He wants his input method to be objectively better. There is no point other than aim assist being removed that will make a whiner like him quit whining.
5. I said they need to buff mouse and keyboard but not touch the controller. That satisfies what you are saying.
6. I already told him but referring to aim assist as aimbot or aimhack automatically makes you look foolish and like a clown. Your controller gameplay would be a joke, please post it.
7. Cognitive dissonance is just a form of cognitive bias. I don't use ad hominems, I just insult people. There is a difference between the two. A lot of people don't know this lol
8. Controllers aren't overpowered, mouse is underpowered. Once they reduce the input lag and get raw input it will give mouse users even more of an advantage than they already have.
Yeah, I'm just going to play campaign and screw around in customs and firefight for a while after launch. I hope 343 learns it's lesson once all the M&K folks start emulating a controller out of protest for this stance and just for the lols.
Yeah you are probably going to be that guy that will tell every single person you can how to do that because you are so petty. Luckily anyone bad enough to do that would get slapped by good players and they would likely get caught by the anti cheat software if they are using a popular and known software for emulating a controller.

Gears 5 has controller aim assist and there is no known issue of people doing that in that game. I got to masters with a controller no problem, never felt like anyone's sniper aim was too good to deal with.
Aim assist doesn't feel any different to me than it did originally on the 360. The only reason I'm using a controller is because I've built up thousands of hours of muscle memory playing Halo and don't feel like "re-learning" it, which is probably the same for a lot of people. Also I've followed competitive Halo since H2 and never heard of this guy in my life so I don't think his opinion holds much weight.
"I don't know of this guy so his opinion is meaningless, but mine isn't" And you're right, aim assist is the same as the 360.
It is necessary even if it is a PC title. The problem here is that both the aim assist and the bullet magnetism is way stronger than it was on the OG Halo Reach.
It's not stronger. But it's still too strong. That's fine when the playing field is just controllers vs. controllers, though. But this isn't.
a CriminaI wrote:
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a CriminaI wrote:
a CriminaI wrote:
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1. It's not hard to get moderated on these forums.
2. He brought up overwatch.
3.They played a joke of a flight for a couple weeks. Give it time when the game actually comes out especially with the changes they have already done to the mouse since the flight.
4. I'm not assuming. I've read what he posted. He wants his input method to be objectively better. There is no point other than aim assist being removed that will make a whiner like him quit whining.
5. I said they need to buff mouse and keyboard but not touch the controller. That satisfies what you are saying.
6. I already told him but referring to aim assist as aimbot or aimhack automatically makes you look foolish and like a clown. Your controller gameplay would be a joke, please post it.
7. Cognitive dissonance is just a form of cognitive bias. I don't use ad hominems, I just insult people. There is a difference between the two. A lot of people don't know this lol
8. Controllers aren't overpowered, mouse is underpowered. Once they reduce the input lag and get raw input it will give mouse users even more of an advantage than they already have. -- Just bolding this part because it's laughable how deluded you are if you think this is the case. Have you really not been paying any attention to this thread? At all? Are you truly this deluded? Some kind of dream world going on in your head?
You know, I see this said all the time -- that mouse is underpowered because of the input problems during the flight, and controllers are fine. These people claim once mouse issues are addressed it'll be perfectly balanced.

Yet I spend half this ***amn thread trying to point out to these same people that no, aim assist is brokenly strong to the point where:

- Even people who had ZERO mouse input issues STILL got destroyed by controllers, some of with extensive experience on some or both platforms.
- People with thousands of hours of experience on both input methods still said they felt far far stronger on controller
- People with limited controller experience but lots of MKB experience switched to controller and somehow performed better
- A large chunk of the thread are controller advocates themselves self-confessing they think the aim assist is too great an advantage

So what does this tell you, pray tell? That we just need to 'git gud'? Are the people posting across multimedia with insightful remarks on the subject, ranging from Reddit, Twitch/YouTube and here, all in general consensus that aim assist is overpowered, ranging from a healthy mix of all player types and backgrounds, are they ALL just complainers who are making excuses for their own inadequacies as you seem to think? Because so far from what I'VE seen by paying attention, the majority of feedback points a clear picture towards aim assist being overtuned, NOT towards PC players needing to stop QQing.

PS: for the record, you did use ad hominem. You accused him of making excuses to justify wanting his preferred input method to be dominant. By definition: "ad hominem, typically refers to a fallacious argumentative strategy whereby genuine discussion of the topic at hand is avoided by instead attacking the character, motive, or other attribute of the person making the argument". Seriously... You did that AND you also insulted them. You're a nasty piece of work.
Aim assist doesn't feel any different to me than it did originally on the 360. The only reason I'm using a controller is because I've built up thousands of hours of muscle memory playing Halo and don't feel like "re-learning" it, which is probably the same for a lot of people. Also I've followed competitive Halo since H2 and never heard of this guy in my life so I don't think his opinion holds much weight.
"I don't know of this guy so his opinion is meaningless, but mine isn't" And you're right, aim assist is the same as the 360.
It is necessary even if it is a PC title. The problem here is that both the aim assist and the bullet magnetism is way stronger than it was on the OG Halo Reach.
It's not stronger. But it's still too strong. That's fine when the playing field is just controllers vs. controllers, though. But this isn't.
So you are saying they need to get rid of the aim assist when you play on a controller so it can be "fair" and even 9 year old noobs on K&M can kill you with 50 rounds of their DMR?? A controller, doesnt matter if its agains other controller or K&M, needs aim assist on FPS games. Getting rid of it like some idiots say will basically make the controller useless on PC
Aim assist doesn't feel any different to me than it did originally on the 360. The only reason I'm using a controller is because I've built up thousands of hours of muscle memory playing Halo and don't feel like "re-learning" it, which is probably the same for a lot of people. Also I've followed competitive Halo since H2 and never heard of this guy in my life so I don't think his opinion holds much weight.
"I don't know of this guy so his opinion is meaningless, but mine isn't" And you're right, aim assist is the same as the 360.
It is necessary even if it is a PC title. The problem here is that both the aim assist and the bullet magnetism is way stronger than it was on the OG Halo Reach.
It's not stronger. But it's still too strong. That's fine when the playing field is just controllers vs. controllers, though. But this isn't.
So you are saying they need to get rid of the aim assist when you play on a controller so it can be "fair" and even 9 year old noobs on K&M can kill you with 50 rounds of their DMR?? A controller, doesnt matter if its agains other controller or K&M, needs aim assist on FPS games. Getting rid of it like some idiots say will basically make the controller useless on PC
Just read the thread please. This has been done to death. Controllers need a tune down, not even going to bother explaining it to you.
I've played Halo on console since Halo 1 in 2001 when it came out. I stopped playing Halo 5 after several months and moved to PC gaming. Despite being decent with a controller, I absolutely hate using them and would much rather use a mouse and keyboard. This is a PC release, not a console release. It should be designed primarily for keyboard and mouse, not a controller. Having SOME aim assist for controllers is fine, but again, this is a PC release. It should be treated as such.

If they release the game as is, I highly suggest everyone buys a XIM Apex and play using a controller emulator. If we abuse the hell out of the insane aim assist, they will have no choice but to change it.
I've played Halo on console since Halo 1 in 2001 when it came out. I stopped playing Halo 5 after several months and moved to PC gaming. Despite being decent with a controller, I absolutely hate using them and would much rather use a mouse and keyboard. This is a PC release, not a console release. It should be designed primarily for keyboard and mouse, not a controller. Having SOME aim assist for controllers is fine, but again, this is a PC release. It should be treated as such.

If they release the game as is, I highly suggest everyone buys a XIM Apex and play using a controller emulator. If we abuse the hell out of the insane aim assist, they will have no choice but to change it.
Honestly, there's probably open source software out there where you can easily do the exact same thing for free...
I've played Halo on console since Halo 1 in 2001 when it came out. I stopped playing Halo 5 after several months and moved to PC gaming. Despite being decent with a controller, I absolutely hate using them and would much rather use a mouse and keyboard. This is a PC release, not a console release. It should be designed primarily for keyboard and mouse, not a controller. Having SOME aim assist for controllers is fine, but again, this is a PC release. It should be treated as such.

If they release the game as is, I highly suggest everyone buys a XIM Apex and play using a controller emulator. If we abuse the hell out of the insane aim assist, they will have no choice but to change it.
Honestly, there's probably open source software out there where you can easily do the exact same thing for free...
Most likely can be emulated at a driver level, but that is much more detectable and bannable. I'd rather do it the undetectable way.
saw141 wrote:
Aim assist doesn't feel any different to me than it did originally on the 360. The only reason I'm using a controller is because I've built up thousands of hours of muscle memory playing Halo and don't feel like "re-learning" it, which is probably the same for a lot of people. Also I've followed competitive Halo since H2 and never heard of this guy in my life so I don't think his opinion holds much weight.
Yeah but this is a PC game, not a console game. It's not that it feels different, it's that it exists on PC. He peaked #2 on Halo 5 and played for a team, he's also a consistent top 10 Keyboard / Mouse sniper main on Overwatch, his opinion holds weight.
Who cares what a Halo 5 "pro" player has to say? Community consensus be damned, I guess. I understand Reach PC aim assist can TRACK INVISIBLE PLAYERS, as you've stated only four times, but your arguments for removing aim assist literally just boil down to "It's on PC now, screw every other input method" despite a huge portion of Halo fans still use controllers to play.
I’ve changed my stance on it. It’s still going to be a PC game though and the majority of Steam users use KB/M as steam reports show.
a CriminaI wrote:
1. It's not hard to get moderated on these forums.
2. He brought up overwatch.
3.They played a joke of a flight for a couple weeks. Give it time when the game actually comes out especially with the changes they have already done to the mouse since the flight.
4. I'm not assuming. I've read what he posted. He wants his input method to be objectively better. There is no point other than aim assist being removed that will make a whiner like him quit whining.
5. I said they need to buff mouse and keyboard but not touch the controller. That satisfies what you are saying.
6. I already told him but referring to aim assist as aimbot or aimhack automatically makes you look foolish and like a clown. Your controller gameplay would be a joke, please post it.
7. Cognitive dissonance is just a form of cognitive bias. I don't use ad hominems, I just insult people. There is a difference between the two. A lot of people don't know this lol
8. Controllers aren't overpowered, mouse is underpowered. Once they reduce the input lag and get raw input it will give mouse users even more of an advantage than they already have.
Oh boy, here we go again. You know, the other person IS right. You don't read anything before posting. I DID NOT, i repeat, DID NOT, advocate for the removal of aim assistance. In fact, If my memory serves, you admitted so yourself in a previous post of yours. I advocated for the balancing of existing levels of AA. Also, I brought up Overwatch NOT to compare their game-play, as you seem to be doing but to make an example out of what happened to their AA on controller mechanics on PC once the M+KB players started emulating it. You ARE assuming, since you have made a constant habit of ignoring what I write and pulling stuff out of thin air. I don't want mouse to be "objectively" better than the controller. I want them to be on an equal playing field. Should I start quoting each and every thread of mine for all to see? Should I start quoting each and every single thread of yours for all to see? One more thing, please don't use terms that you don't understand. You clearly have no idea what "cognitive dissonance" is so here, I will help you out. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance . You are welcome.

Once again, at the end of this post of yours, you show everyone that you are not willing to have a civil discussion. You are not reading anything, only shouting without any actual basis for your words. OP mentioned it in his post and I will mention it for the second time. I will capitalize them in order to make it easier to read. EVERY ONE WAS NOT EXPERIENCING MOUSE AND KEYBOARD ISSUES. THE INPUT DELAY WAS NOT A GLOBAL ISSUE. HOWEVER, THE SENTIMENT THAT CONTROLLERS ARE OP IN THIS CURRENT ITERATION IS A SENTIMENT THAT IS SHARED GLOBALLY ACROSS ALL THE M+KB PLAYERS, AS WELL AS SOME OF THE CONTROLLER PLAYERS.There we go, does that make it any easier to read? Please, please read it before posting trash as always.
mouse players kind of on a handicap during fight 3; with all the input lag. I don't think it would be viable to base our view on controller aim assist on that flight. Better to compare when its launched
I repeat for the hundredth time since so many of you people aren't bothering to read the thread:

Some players were having mouse input issues. Not all. Some.
Mouse players who weren't having input issues still reported being at a significant disadvantage.

Controllers are so strong that an input-lag-free mouse experience still cannot compare. For those who had mouse issues it was even worse. So please stop trying to belittle our intelligence by claiming that none of us on this thread know what we're talking about. You'd maybe think we in this thread have the intelligence to have factored in mouse input issues, yes? Especially after multiple pages of discussion

a CriminaI wrote:
a CriminaI wrote:
I've been banned from the forums multiple times, I don't report people.

You act like all controller players are equal thanks to aim assist but the skill difference is massive.

I can use a mouse and yes I know of overwatch, I'm top 500 on PS4, Xbox, AND PC. Controller is harder to use than mouse. Pharah vs pharah rocket battles are a struggle with the controller even with aim assist. On Mouse it is as easy as aiming at a folder icon on your desktop.

I know you advocated for nerfing aim assist instead of removing it but mouse is arguably already better than the controller in its current state so really you just want mouse players to have an advantage since that is your preferred input method.

Why on earth would you assume the steam input method will match the halo input method. Let's keep it real, the majority of people playing multiplayer will be halo veterans, people that have been playing it on console for years. We aren't going to be seeing a resurgence of new players, certainly not ones that will stick around for a long while. Some halo veterans will make the switch to mouse despite having years of controller muscle memory but an extremely high amount will be sticking with controller.

And like I said earlier if what you said was true, the majority are using a mouse, then what is your problem? You are good then because only a minority of people will have aim assist on their side. If what I assume is true, that it is closer to 50/50, Then how stupid would it be to ruin the experience of 50% of the playerbase just to please your cognitive bias that you have where you assume all your deaths are to controller users?

Lastly, you have lost. 343 has come out on my side and decided not to touch the aim assist. Too bad for you.
  1. You've been banned multiple times? I wonder why, attitude like that...
  2. Why are you comparing Overwatch to Halo? This isn't Overwatch so you can't say that because controllers are harder to use on Overwatch that Halo must therefore be the same. That's a phantom argument. They're entirely different games.
  3. You say mouse is arguably better in its present state, emphasis on 'arguably', yet you're in the absolute minority. Read this forum, watch youtube videos or check reddit -- even pro players agree -- that controller in Halo Reach MCC on PC is way way stronger. Hmmm... who to believe, the majority, or just you, one defensive sounding dude?
  4. Half your argument seems to be 'You just want your preferred input method to be stronger!' or 'You have cognitive bias issues!'. Sorry but assuming things like that about people just to try and suit your argument, without any proof of truth? That's douchey. Maybe you should, like, accept that some people actually have an argument to make rather than trying to close the case lazily by pinning it on them being bad or biased and seeking an advantage? "Git Gud" is not a suitable counter-argument to valid points, nor is assuming their motives based on what you think they must be, as opposed to what they actually are.
  5. It's also a complete stretch to assume the majority of players will be playing with a controller post-launch. I would expect more than half to be Halo veterans, yes, but the majority of which I'd expect to be people who last touched a console shooter years ago and have since switched to PC. Regardless of what happens (as neither of us possess a crystal ball so this is all moot) you need to remember this is the PC version we're talking about, therefore PC input methods need to feel viable, and with controllers currently overpowered, the native input method to Reach PC's own platform will feel like second class citizens (and this is assuming NO KB+M input lag or sluggishness)
  6. "If what you said was true, the majority are using a mouse, then what is your problem? You are good then because only a minority of people will have aim assist on their side." -- GREAT logic there mate. An aim hack is OK if only a handful of people are using it! GREAT logic... Hahaha.
  7. "Then how stupid would it be to ruin the experience of 50% of the playerbase just to please your cognitive bias that you have where you assume all your deaths are to controller users?" -- as I mentioned before, Ad hominem attacks are NOT cool and I'm beginning to understand why you get banned so much. You CANNOT try to invalidate the other person's argument in its entirety by passing them off as crybabies seeking an advantage, especially when you aren't them and you could have missed the mark by a million miles. To also assume that bringing controllers down to a balanced level would actually ruin the experience is highly presumptuous. On one hand you accuse him of cognitive bias for calling controllers overpowered, then on the other hand you claim nerfing controllers to fair and balanced levels would ruin the gameplay for controller users? Isn't that a case of you demonstrating the same cognitive bias you just condemned? Or is the term cognitive dissonance? I don't know. Irrelevant. The case is, you're being a hypocrite. It's the classic case of 'He's in the wrong for being upset that my controller input method is stronger, he's only complaining out of bias because he got pwned by controller players all day long.' Followed by 'If my controller input method isn't overpowered, and they dare to balance it to make it fair, it's going to ruin the game for me, so I'm going to complain!'
  8. "You have lost. 343 has come out on my side and decided not to touch the aim assist. Too bad for you." -- Oh here we go, your true colours at last. The snide "too bad for you" remark. Laughable and again with the douchey attacks. And sure, they've decided not to touch it (for now), but decisions can be changed. Minds can be changed. They didn't say they wouldn't ever reconsider. Hence why this thread is still going, despite the best efforts of people such as yourself. People who are in sheer denial that in Halo (not Overwatch, HALO) Reach on PC, controllers are currently overpowered. You can keep making excuses, or you can get over yourself and accept that you're in the minority here. I even see controller players come to this thread, Reddit, this forum and so on self-admitting that even THEY think controllers are way stronger RN.
Ignore him, man. He has been adamant on being ignorant. My entire thread with him revolved around a single topic and the dude simply refuses to listen. If anything, it is very likely that he is trolling at this point.
I think anyone who has this idea of "this is a PC release, keyboard and mouse should be priority, in fact, you should be essentially punished for even thinking about using a controller" should never work for a game company lmao. Look at it from a dev point of view. These guys love making games, and if it wasn't for the money they get from exclusivity deals, being owned by another parent company that dictates where their games go etc etc, these devs given the time and dedication would try and put Halo on every platform you could think of. Creating something and having it be limited to a certain audience sucks as a dev when all you want is for EVERYONE who enjoys games to be able to play the game you've made.

That being said, I don't see the controller hate being necessary at all. It should be a discussion of balance as apposed to favoring one or the other. At its core, Halo is a console game. Wether you played CE on your highschool computer back in the day or not is irrelevant. Most of us I without a doubt that played Halo since the beginning, or even Halo 2, hell, even the more recent Halo's, are used to playing on a controller. Someone mentioned it before but, a lot of us have literally hundreds if not thousands of hours logged, some people with most of those hours being high competitive play (I'm one of those), with a controller. Playing with it is muscle memory at this point, its like riding a bike, or driving a car. Why the hell would the devs want to punish those dedicated players by indirectly punishing them for using the peripheral they have been accustomed to for over a decade.. That's insane and would backfire.

At the same time though, they want players who are either new to Halo and played shooters exclusively on PC, or players who moved to PC (Like I did over 6 years ago after being primarily a console player) to have a good experience with at its core a console game, with a keyboard and mouse. It's something I'm sure they'll iron out over time as this type of game isn't a "If i see you first you die" shooter, which is partly why I love it competitively so much because I can turn around and out BR them if I'm on my game, my strafe was good etc etc. Both options should be viable with their advantages and disadvantages. I know for a fact I wont be able to snap around 180 as fast as a keyboard and mouse, or having the sniping precision of one as well, and I'm okay with that because there is nothing the devs can do about something like that to my knowledge. I'll still be playing on my controller as I have for many hours before. Maybe I'll switch it up once in awhile for fun. As far as competitive play, idk what the pro circuits and leagues are going to do with the PC releases. That's up for debate. I don't think having a KB+M league and a controller league is a smart idea though, as that will just split the community in most likely a negative way.
iPrimal wrote:
I think anyone who has this idea of "this is a PC release, keyboard and mouse should be priority, in fact, you should be essentially punished for even thinking about using a controller"
OH dear god does nobody on this forum pay attention and READ?

We NEVER SAID you should be PUNISHED for using a controller.

We said you shouldn't have AN ADVANTAGE for using one.

It needs to be BALANCED. Controllers are currently OVER TUNED.
They need to be TUNED DOWN until they are EVEN with mouse and keyboard.
If they are UNDER TUNED, they can be BUFFED. The point is, the playing field needs to be even if you're going to allow multiple input methods in the same game.
343i's statement that they outright have no plans to make changes is sheer madness and it's going to bite them so hard in the bum. It's all well and good saying "oh that's how it was on the Xbox 360" but, back then, everyone was using controllers, so, sorry Postums, but that logic does not fly now that you are allowing crossplay.

I don't know how much more of this I can take before the message starts getting across to you people! You read messages from Mouse and Keyboard advocates and somehow assume they are telling you controllers should be made worthless? Wtf? How do you even READ this from what people are saying? Dear Controller users, stop reading what you're expecting to read, and start reading what's actually being said.
It needs to be BALANCED.
Here is the problem... you cannot balance it. They are two completely different forms of input. It is not possible to perfectly balance one or the other. Advocating for balanced controller support is trying to bring a croquet mallet to a hockey match and insisting on special advantages so you can compete at the level of the players using hockey sticks. They are two completely different forms of input and can NOT be balanced. One MUST and WILL be superior to the other, period. It is best to allow that to be the mouse and keyboard on PC, and controller on console. I'm not saying to remove aim assist, I am saying to nerf it.

In any other competitive PC FPS, it is not feasible to use a controller at high levels of play. There is not enough aim assist, so controllers simply cannot compete. If Halo is coming to the PC as a PC FPS, it should act as such. Otherwise no serious PC gamer will ever touch it and Halo will once again come to PC in a half-baked form. If you want to use a controller, why not just play it on the Xbox? If aim assist stays in any semblance of its current form, it will kill the game. I will absolutely use a XIM and take advantage of the free and legal aimbot provided so kindly by 343. If everyone else does the same, they will have no choice but to change it.
Trying to balance these inputs is a fool's errand. Even if they got it 100% right, which there is no reason to assume they can or will, people would still complain due to perceived unfairness. Just split the lobbies and let everybody play on a truly even playing field.
Aim assist isn't really that bad...I didn't notice it being too prevalent. You still have to track the target with the analog stick...The game isn't going to track the targets for you. Gears 5 has pretty high aim assist...And yet still, I play FAR, FAR better on mouse/keyboard. Thing is, all 343 has to do is fix the mouse movement/input delays, and these "controller advantage" complaints will vanish. Basically, the controller aim assist is only superior because mouse aim was broken in the flight.

If there's going to be cross platform PVP, you're going to want balance between mouse and controller, and controller CANNOT compete without a decent amount of aim assist. (All console shooters and many PC shooters have aim assist BTW. It's not exclusive to Halo Reach.)
saw141 wrote:
saw141 wrote:
Aim assist doesn't feel any different to me than it did originally on the 360. The only reason I'm using a controller is because I've built up thousands of hours of muscle memory playing Halo and don't feel like "re-learning" it, which is probably the same for a lot of people. Also I've followed competitive Halo since H2 and never heard of this guy in my life so I don't think his opinion holds much weight.
Yeah but this is a PC game, not a console game. It's not that it feels different, it's that it exists on PC. He peaked #2 on Halo 5 and played for a team, he's also a consistent top 10 Keyboard / Mouse sniper main on Overwatch, his opinion holds weight.
Who cares what a Halo 5 "pro" player has to say? Community consensus be damned, I guess. I understand Reach PC aim assist can TRACK INVISIBLE PLAYERS, as you've stated only four times, but your arguments for removing aim assist literally just boil down to "It's on PC now, screw every other input method" despite a huge portion of Halo fans still use controllers to play.
I’ve changed my stance on it. It’s still going to be a PC game though and the majority of Steam users use KB/M as steam reports show.
Part of the reason PC games are the best is because they allow a plethora of input methods. I have a pretty tall desk and it's difficult to use my keyboard and mouse for extended periods of time without my wrists cramping up, plus I enjoy reclining in my chair and playing shooters with controllers regardless. The answer here isn't to make controllers non-viable by nixing aim assist; if that's what happens then it would be a obvious handicap to use a controller. Either aim assist magnetism needs to be reduced or KBM needs to have a little more magnetism to even the playing field.
saw141 wrote:
The current build of Reach on the MCC PC Flight #3, has unbelievably strong controller aim assist. This is a PC port of a console series, that does not mean controller should even get aim assist at all...this IS a PC title now. Controllers originally got aim assist because they weren't mice, joysticks are hard to aim with precisely but what is the point of playing on PC if you're using a controller because it's better? The aim assist can TRACK INVISIBLE PLAYERS....???????????

I've been watching the former Halo 5 pro player " Kephrii " who is a top 100 Overwatch Widowmaker (Sniper) main; he has been streaming this final Flight. Here is a clip [ https://clips.twitch.tv/RoughClumsyPassionfruitSMOrc ] of him stating that he feels that the controller aim assist is "the strongest aim assist of any aim assist I've ever seen on a controller, of any game ever". This former Halo 5 pro player...is opting to use the controller over Keyboard and Mouse on PC, despite being a consistent, top 100, high tier mouse sniper on Overwatch. He even goes as far as to say "you shouldn't use a mouse and keyboard, controller is superior in every way." Is this a PC launch? This should not go live in this state...please reconsider this functionality. The aim assist can TRACK INVISIBLE PLAYERS....???????????

Also I've heard a couple people say that the Keyboard and Mouse movement in general feels clunky compared to the controller and that is another reason they think the controller is better.

I think if they keep this then they have to have input based matchmaking where controller users can not play with KB/M users.

Potentially the most important part of what I've said here is..."The aim assist can TRACK INVISIBLE PLAYERS....???????????"
I can guarantee my mouse aim is better than any controller aim with any level of aim assist. TBH if they added aimbot for controller users they'd STILL be at a disadvantage.
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